Need some extra cash? Union dues refund?

[Jeff K]

http://www.unionrefund.org/

[bigfish_Oh]

the hospital my wife works at just voted down the union, I am still laughing about the $100 a month average union dues they were expected to pay. It's bad enough the admin. is paid big$$ but they at least care a little about the hospital.

[Varmintmist]

http://www.unionrefund.org/

Good luck.

Just because its the law doesn't mean they comply.

[Walküre]

the hospital my wife works at just voted down the union, I am still laughing about the $100 a month average union dues they were expected to pay. It's bad enough the admin. is paid big$$ but they at least care a little about the hospital.

yeah, it would really be a shame, for the WORKERS to get big $$'s, eh??

I never cease to be amazed at the people who criticize unions. Unions would like EVERY person to make a decent wage. Those wages are fought for by the union, and that costs money. $100 a month? I'd like to see where THAT figure came from - 98% of the time, it's the management figures, trying to persuade people NOT to unionize. It's money out of THEIR pocket - of course, they "DESERVE" their money, by screwing workers out of theirs. Where do you think those bonuses come from?? the unions STILL have a place in this country. Unfortunately, there's WAY too many people convinced otherwise. Of course, those are the same people that think there shouldn't be a minimum wage, either. EVERYONE should live below the poverty level...

Geez...

[Smokinjoe-VRCCDS#0005]

I've been a union worker for 24 years it's been very good to me and my family. My dues are my hourly wage doubled and I damn sure wish mine was $100.00 a month.

[Gear Jammer]

I've been a union worker for 24 years it's been very good to me and my family. My dues are my hourly wage doubled and I damn sure wish mine was $100.00 a month.

What Joe said +1

[gregc]

Sorry can't agree that unions are good for the working man anymore, they have driven many a company out of business. Besides sticking up for jerks at work, that should have been fired along time ago. They have done nothing for the hard working good employee, except take money out of his pay check.   Years ago they served a purpose, but not now.

[daytona]

Sorry can't agree that unions are good for the working man anymore, they have driven many a company out of business. Besides sticking up for jerks at work, that should have been fired along time ago. They have done nothing for the hard working good employee, except take money out of his pay check.   Years ago they served a purpose, but not now.

+1

[bigfish_Oh]

I've been a union worker for 24 years it's been very good to me and my family. My dues are my hourly wage doubled and I damn sure wish mine was $100.00 a month.

that's exactly where that figure came from. I (many of us) are ready for the union to come to us again(honeywell 600 employees,aerospace), they must have given up after 30 years of no success.)I did email them on their homepage) They have never had a better chance to get in than now. My self and many others that are the most diehard non union are ready to vote for it, we have had enough mostly just because of one person even though we believe it's about a 75% chance they would close and relocate to another plant if unionized.
   skipping a meal out would pay my dues.

I do not see more money coming to me from union membership (net result)
I do see rules being followed and not changed on a whim

[JerryB]

Do you honestly think that if a company pays a worker $10 an hour here in the USA and finds a country that will make the same product and pays workers $2 an hour would not close up shop and move the work Greg?Unions have stopped more work going out of the country than the average person realizes......JB.

[ricoman]

Gotta agree, unions are great.
After all, if they weren't we'd be keeping more jobs here instead of sending them overseas!
Gotta love the heads of the unions, earning wages no better than the members, right? Or do they make really big bucks? Where exactly does the money collected in dues really go? No, really, where does it go-not just the propaganda you are given. How many extremely well off lobbyists are funded by unions? How many?
If I were a member, I'd sure want/demand an itemized explanation without smoke and mirrors.
What about making your employer completely pay or pay more than half for what you should be taking care of at least? (retirement & health care). I've seen jobs shut down because a shovel 2" too wide was used on a union job-what the heck is that about? The goal was to dig a hole. Why is the size of the hole digger so important? Too fast to get the job done?
It is a job you accepted responsibility for and commited to perform-you did not sign on to have another set of parents take care of you for life, or did you?
Shouldn't you be responsible for yourself and your family? Why should the cost of any good or service include money paid by me the consumer to help you retire at quadruple the minimum wage without substantial direct involvement/contribution by you the worker? If I work for myself, where do I get that same benefit? You wanna slip me a 50 every once in a while?
This whole thing is really no different than being a federal employee-wah, wah, wah-somebody take care of me for the rest of my life!
Oh wait, maybe that's what it's all about.

[threevalks]

              I've been a UNION CARPENTER for 34 years. My dues are more than $100 a month, my wages are 40 to 70 % more than NON UNION wages. If not for THE UNIONS everyone would be making far less than mininum wage.

[Smokinjoe-VRCCDS#0005]

Do you honestly think that if a company pays a worker $10 an hour here in the USA and finds a country that will make the same product and pays workers $2 an hour would not close up shop and move the work Greg?Unions have stopped more work going out of the country than the average person realizes......JB.

My wife worked at Levi's ( non-union ) for 15 years she averaged between $14.00 and $15.00 a hour working production pay. They shut Levi's  down and moved it to Mexico taking well over 2500 jobs from the area. I heard the Mexican's make .86 cents a hour at Levi's. When my wife worked there my 502's was around $35.00 a pair...My 502's are still around $35.00 a pair. ...You union haters stand tall and proud when your grand-kids are making 50 cents a hour.

[Walküre]

Do you honestly think that if a company pays a worker $10 an hour here in the USA and finds a country that will make the same product and pays workers $2 an hour would not close up shop and move the work Greg?Unions have stopped more work going out of the country than the average person realizes......JB.

They are going to move it, anyway. If you were making $3 an hour, and they thought they could save a few bucks, BAMMM, there they go!! At least with a union, you have a fighting chance, contrary to what the non-union believers WANT you to believe.

No amount of yelling, screaming, rationalizing, etc, etc, will change the facts. nor will the facts change a (currently) large amount of dpeople who believe the unions are somehow "bad".

The unions have NOT made a company close it's doors. the company has decided to close the doors, regardless. Of all those that "claim" to be closed because of the union, they'd close, anyway - often because of poor management, and often because the outsourcing of labor and goods going out of this country.

Union people have a tendency to buy American WHENEVER POSSIBLE!! You won't catch them in WalMart, sending their cash to China, nor will you find them driving Honda's and Kia's.

Sure, there's one in a thousand, in the Union, that's protected. Often, the union people will try to convince that person that they aren't doing their job. But it's that one, that everyone hears about. There are less violent attacks in the Postal Service, PER CAPITA, than MANY other companies, but you always hear about "going postal". But, it has been my vast experience, that poor management, however deep it goes in the company, is protected - they "take care of their own". An example is the Postal Service - it is in the worst financial straits it has ever been in, due to declining revenue. People don't send in their payments any more. Don't send in their taxes. Everything is done on line. Management didn't see this going, yet the outgoing Postmaster General, made a BIG chunk of money, $135,000 of it on incentives and bonuses. for what???

Despite possible service cuts and raises in rates, the post office’s top official made more than $800 thousand last year.

According to a regulatory notice filed in December, Postmaster General John Potter’s total compensation and retirement benefits amounted to more than $800 thousand in 2008.

That includes a $135 thousand dollar and other perks paid out to the Postmaster.

That means he took home more than twice what president Barack Obama will make this year.

yet, sadly, they attack the negotiated pay of the workers. And are attempting to close as many offices that they can, and reduce the workforce.

Once people realize that union's primarily protect the GOOD worker, perhaps they'll look at it in a different light...

[Jeff K]

Union people have a tendency to buy American WHENEVER POSSIBLE!! You won't catch them in WalMart, sending their cash to China, nor will you find them driving Honda's and Kia's.

Sure, there's one in a thousand

That is complete BS

[Buda]

yeah, it would really be a shame, for the WORKERS to get big $$'s, eh??

I never cease to be amazed at the people who criticize unions. Unions would like EVERY person to make a decent wage. Those wages are fought for by the union, and that costs money. $100 a month? I'd like to see where THAT figure came from - 98% of the time, it's the management figures, trying to persuade people NOT to unionize. It's money out of THEIR pocket - of course, they "DESERVE" their money, by screwing workers out of theirs. Where do you think those bonuses come from?? the unions STILL have a place in this country. Unfortunately, there's WAY too many people convinced otherwise. Of course, those are the same people that think there shouldn't be a minimum wage, either. EVERYONE should live below the poverty level...

Geez...

+1 Proud member UAW

[Walküre]

Union people have a tendency to buy American WHENEVER POSSIBLE!! You won't catch them in WalMart, sending their cash to China, nor will you find them driving Honda's and Kia's.

Sure, there's one in a thousand

That is complete BS

Spoken like a true union-hater. Wrong, but who cares...

[bigvalkriefan]

             I've been a UNION CARPENTER for 34 years. My dues are more than $100 a month, my wages are 40 to 70 % more than NON UNION wages. If not for THE UNIONS everyone would be making far less than minimum wage.

I have to totally disagree with you one this.
First off you can't make less than minimum wage, it's the law.
Second there was a time when the unions were very much needed to be a voice for the worker. But power got the best of the union bosses and they became corrupt, just like the politicians. They protect people who should be out of a job because of their ineptness and they bully people into joining them.
They are not about the worker anymore they are about power. I believe they are a big part of the reason that much of our manufacturing industry is now overseas.
And the pensions, holy crap.    Don't get me started on that. They are wanting the government (us) to bail them out of that mess. I DON'T THINK SO!  

[bigvalkriefan]

Union people have a tendency to buy American WHENEVER POSSIBLE!! You won't catch them in WalMart, sending their cash to China, nor will you find them driving Honda's and Kia's.

Sure, there's one in a thousand

That is complete BS

Agreed. That is the biggest load of crap I've heard yet! I was born during the day but it wasn't yesterday.

[Jeff K]

Union people have a tendency to buy American WHENEVER POSSIBLE!! You won't catch them in WalMart, sending their cash to China, nor will you find them driving Honda's and Kia's.

Sure, there's one in a thousand

That is complete BS

Spoken like a true union-hater. Wrong, but who cares...

I have been managing people in a union environment for decades. I have told my employees on numerous occasions  that they were all hypocrites because they want top wage but run to Wal-mart to find the cheapest thing they could find. They drove Toyota's and Honda's...
Complete BS

[threevalks]

I have to totally disagree with you one this.
First off you can't make less than minimum wage, it's the law.
Second there was a time when the unions were very much needed to be a voice for the worker. But power got the best of the union bosses and they became corrupt, just like the politicians. They protect people who should be out of a job because of their ineptness and they bully people into joining them.
They are not about the worker anymore they are about power. I believe they are a big part of the reason that much of our manufacturing industry is now overseas.
And the pensions, holy crap.    Don't get me started on that. They are wanting the government (us) to bail them out of that mess. I DON'T THINK SO! 

[/quote]




I'm not getting into a pissing match here, so this will be my last post on it.
What I meant by wages would be less than mininum wage , mininum wage would never have reached where it is now. (Also I believe ther are several jobs out there today that pay less than mininum wage , ask a waitress)
As far as pension. I pay $7.35 per hour into my pension. At age 61 I will receive 3% per month of what I have paid in over th last 34 years. Will your pension or 401K beat that? If so, I'm happy for you.

[Walküre]

I have to totally disagree with you one this.
First off you can't make less than minimum wage, it's the law.
Second there was a time when the unions were very much needed to be a voice for the worker. But power got the best of the union bosses and they became corrupt, just like the politicians. They protect people who should be out of a job because of their ineptness and they bully people into joining them.
They are not about the worker anymore they are about power. I believe they are a big part of the reason that much of our manufacturing industry is now overseas.
And the pensions, holy crap.    Don't get me started on that. They are wanting the government (us) to bail them out of that mess. I DON'T THINK SO!  

What a crock!! The unions LED the fight for minimum wage, and constantly fight to keep it. The politicians would MORE than happily get rid of it. They use the lame reasoning, that since no one MAKES minimum, it shouldn't be in place. However, people DO make minimum. And if the company had their way, MANY more would. After all, they are happy paying way below poverty level, in overseas countries, basically taking advantage of an already depressed country.

And, as for "I believe they are a big part of the reason that much of our manufacturing industry is now overseas." You gotta be kidding me! It's greed. Unadulterated, blatant greed. And as for pensions?? These people worked their entire lives, knowing the pension was there at the end. And because of corrupt Wall Street practices, many have been, in essence, stolen from. But, when a CEO leaves, and has a sevarance package of many millions, that's ok?

Still, the analysts argue that much of what is generally called a “severance package” often consists of stock and options that the executive already earned.

Mr. Prince, for example, did not get any severance pay. But he left Citigroup with nearly $61 million in Citi shares, which is more than half of his $104.7 million exit package. Mr. O’Neal walked away from Merrill with $131.4 million in equity, including unvested stock and unexercised options. That comprised the bulk of his $161.5 million exit package.

Who's worth $161 million, TO LEAVE???? And a person making a $50,000 pension, would have to live 3220 years, to receive $161M...

[JimC]

I am not going to get into the union pro or con debate. I see both sides of that one.

BUT

We started seeing the manufacturing base leave this country after the North American Free Trade Act (NAFTA) was passed, after that companies could leave the country and import their product with no penalty, they just blamed the unions and used them as an excuse.

NAFTA was the beginning stage of the NEW WORLD ORDER they are wanting for all of us.

Jim

[Buda]

I have been managing people in a union environment for decades. I have told my employees on numerous occasions  that they were all hypocrites because they want top wage but run to Wal-mart to find the cheapest thing they could find. They drove Toyota's and Honda's...
Complete BS

Sounds like your great to work for   thats what we are all looking for in a manager I'm sure, someone to tell us how to live out lives.  Guys like you are the reason we need unions.
Tom

[musclehead]

I'm going to be the devils advocate for a minute, say I'm a  business, even a BIG business.  whats my goal? to stay in business and that means I MAKE A PROFIT, not provide health care and benes and showers and private feeding rooms for nursing moms and landscaping. all that other junk is being required by big brother, the cost of doing business is going through the roof, I can't stay profitable with all the extra expenses. I need to cut the fat somewhere or take operations where I can turn a buck (mexico, china, tiawan,.....) whats a business to do?  those of you that want higher and higher wages need to look at the business side of things before ALL manufacturing is gone in this country.

I've been union, i worked at the post office for 8 years. I've heard them crowing about cutting 40,000 jobs, big wup. theres like 3 million letter carriers. all they've done so far is let jobs fall off by attrition and not replaced the worker.

I can see both sides, can you?

more importantly how do we bring maufacturing BACK to this side of the border? don't tell me it can't be done, we put a man on the moon we can rebuild a manufacturing base.

[Walküre]

I have been managing people in a union environment for decades. I have told my employees on numerous occasions  that they were all hypocrites because they want top wage but run to Wal-mart to find the cheapest thing they could find. They drove Toyota's and Honda's...
Complete BS

Yup, sounds like typical management - the all-knowing...
MOST union workers, dedicated UNION workers, abhor WalMart, and try to steer clear. do you PAY your union workers "top wage", or do you try to pay them as little as you can? Is your pay based on paying the workers less, or working them harder? Is your CBA negotiated locally, or on a national level? Do you sit down with union officials, and work through disagreements, or are they all settled under the grievance procedure, or arbitration? Tells a LOT about a person...
Or is your pay based upon the respect you show your workers? That would be very rare...

[musclehead]

and the reason theres less violence at the post office is because the vietnam vets have pretty much retired. now you vets don't get your dander up, you know I love ya but some of them were a lil twitchy.  we had one guy that was E.O.D. in 'nam, he was extremely twitchy 

[Walküre]

I've been union, i worked at the post office for 8 years. I've heard them crowing about cutting 40,000 jobs, big wup. theres like 3 million letter carriers. all they've done so far is let jobs fall off by attrition and not replaced the worker.

The U.S. Postal Service employed 343,300 mail carriers in 2008. The majority of mail carriers work in cities and suburbs, while the rest work in rural areas. - quote from http://www.bls.gov/oco/ocos345.htm

That's a FAR cry from "like 3 million letter carriers". And 40,000 is "like 10+%", for the math-impaired. Pretty substantial, considering EVERY house is STILL delivered to, and the weather is still the same. There is NO LESS WORK for letter carriers, just 10% more OF it!! How many times have YOU not received your mail?

[Walküre]

and the reason theres less violence at the post office is because the vietnam vets have pretty much retired. now you vets don't get your dander up, you know I love ya but some of them were a lil twitchy.  we had one guy that was E.O.D. in 'nam, he was extremely twitchy  

Actually, no...

From NY Times opinion  http://www.nytimes.com/1993/05/19/opinion/violence-in-the-post-office.html:

Violence in the Post Office
Published: May 19, 1993

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The United States Postal Service has developed a reputation for violence. Over the last decade 10 rampaging workers have killed 34 co-workers and supervisors at post offices in seven different states.

The most recent episodes -- two on the same day -- occurred earlier this month. A former postal worker in California and a worker in Michigan each killed a colleague; they wounded three others between them.

No reasonable person would blame the Postal Service for murder. With 700,000 workers, the largest civilian work force in the nation, episodes of violence and mental instability are impossible to avoid.

But it's also clear that the Postal Service's management style aggravates the problem. Angry critics have called the Postal Service a treadmill of angry monotony . . . a minefield of festering grievances . . . a boot camp, where supervisors behave like drill sergeants.

Earlier this week, Peter T. Kilborn of The Times described a pathologically overmanaged system that in some cases assigns one manager to every 10 employees. Those employees endure what Mr. Kilborn described as "an archaic, Army-like environment in which many top managers communicate by directive and front-line supervisors often hover over their charges, waiting for a mistake and timing workers' trips to the bathroom."

And, from Wikipedia:

Analysis

Researchers have found that the homicide rates per 100,000 workers at postal facilities were lower than at other workplaces. In major industries, the highest rate of 2.1 homicides per 100,000 workers was in retail. The next highest rate of 1.66 was in public administration, which includes police officers. The homicide rate for postal workers was 0.26 per 100,000.[14]

However, not all murders on the job are directly comparable to "going postal". Taxi drivers, for example, are much more likely to be murdered by passengers than by their peers. Working in retail means one is exposed to store robberies. In a 1993 joint hearing of the United States Congress in its review of violence in the U.S. Postal Service, NIOSH estimates were cited as part of the record for the 1980s where it is noted that during this timeframe 13% of the employee-directed homicides occurred at postal facilities by current or former employees, where less than 0.75% of the total full-time civilian labor force was employed.[15]

[Jeff K]

I have been managing people in a union environment for decades. I have told my employees on numerous occasions  that they were all hypocrites because they want top wage but run to Wal-mart to find the cheapest thing they could find. They drove Toyota's and Honda's...
Complete BS

Yup, sounds like typical management - the all-knowing...
MOST union workers, dedicated UNION workers, abhor WalMart, and try to steer clear. do you PAY your union workers "top wage", or do you try to pay them as little as you can? Is your pay based on paying the workers less, or working them harder? Is your CBA negotiated locally, or on a national level? Do you sit down with union officials, and work through disagreements, or are they all settled under the grievance procedure, or arbitration? Tells a LOT about a person...
Or is your pay based upon the respect you show your workers? That would be very rare...

My people make top wage for the industry in this area. And we are a non union shop.
I'm about $2 over all other companies (union) in this industry in this city. And I'm working on a new classification to make a new position that will be $6  over, based on skill level. I got approval to create the job description last week.  I'm such an ass, I guess.

I love my job. 

[Buda]

I have been managing people in a union environment for decades. I have told my employees on numerous occasions  that they were all hypocrites because they want top wage but run to Wal-mart to find the cheapest thing they could find. They drove Toyota's and Honda's...
Complete BS

My people make top wage for the industry in this area. And we are a non union shop.
I'm about $2 over all other companies (union) in this industry in this city. And I'm working on a new classification to make a new position that will be $6  over, based on skill level. I got approval to create the job description last week.  I'm such an ass, I guess.

I love my job. 
[/quote]

Which is it union or non union?   ??? Havin a hard time keepin your story straight?

[Jess Tolbirt]

lets see now,
I need a house built,, nothing fancy just 900 sq. feet one bedroom one kitchen and living room and bath room,,,

union workers will build it for 100,000 dollars,,,
non union  will build it for 55,000 dollars,,,,
whom should i choose?

[Jeff K]

I have been managing people in a union environment for decades. I have told my employees on numerous occasions  that they were all hypocrites because they want top wage but run to Wal-mart to find the cheapest thing they could find. They drove Toyota's and Honda's...
Complete BS

My people make top wage for the industry in this area. And we are a non union shop.
I'm about $2 over all other companies (union) in this industry in this city. And I'm working on a new classification to make a new position that will be $6  over, based on skill level. I got approval to create the job description last week.  I'm such an ass, I guess.

I love my job. 

Which is it union or non union?   ??? Havin a hard time keepin your story straight?
[/quote]

Oh, for crying out loud. I've worked in 6 different plants in my 34 years. Most of them were union. This last one is not.
Drowning men grabbing at straws
I get it... Employers are bad... Employees can do no wrong and are taken advantage of by EVERY company. Got it.

[Buda]

Nope both can do wrong but for the most part only one is punished

[Jeff K]

lets see now,
I need a house built,, nothing fancy just 900 sq. feet one bedroom one kitchen and living room and bath room,,,

union workers will build it for 100,000 dollars,,,
non union  will build it for 55,000 dollars,,,,
whom should i choose?

I can help you out with that! I can set you up with the guys that built my shop. They came in at $15,000 less than the builders quoted. Just doing my part to keep Florida working.

[Jeff K]

Nope both can do wrong but for the most part only one is punished

We really need to work harder to shut down those evil employers!!

[gregc]

Living right outside of Philla Pa. a huge union city.  If I want to work in the city limits, I HAVE TO BE UNION, OR PAY UNION WAGE.   Explain that to me, why do I as a private business owner ,non union have to answer to the union?  If I don't comply ,the union will shut my job down,  why don't I have a right to earn a living? Why doesn't the person I am working for have a right to hire me at a lower rate to keep their expense lower?  Don't the union members understand I chose to be non union, just like they chose to be union. The extra costs from union jobs just get passsed along to the end user, so everybody pays in the end.

[f6john]

    Let's see now if I got this right, If'n your in a union and it benefits you, your fer it, and if'n you ain't in a union and overall it costs ya, your agin it. Does that about cover it?? Or did I miss something?

[Bama Red]

and the reason theres less violence at the post office is because the vietnam vets have pretty much retired. now you vets don't get your dander up, you know I love ya but some of them were a lil twitchy.  we had one guy that was E.O.D. in 'nam, he was extremely twitchy 

I have never seen such blatant libel committed against a group. You can take any group, whether it be a church, the local garden club or the Young Republicans/Democrats and find those that are a "little twitchy".

I aim to find out if this board has an "Ignore" feature and put you smack dab at the top of it. I guess you could say this post has made me "a little twitchy" and got "my dander up".+

[Jabba]

Fair Tax would bring MANY production jobs to the USA.  When polled 200 overseas manufacturers said, that if the US went to the FairTax, they would build a plant here.  Right away.

I have been in the Teamsters, IBEW, and the UAW.  All 3 did nothing for me but take my $ and tell me to slow down, I was making others look bad.

We're in a global economy.  Period.  Our government taxes us out of prosperity.  We ARE the most productive people on earth, and if we could get the government out of the way, companies would flock here. So, production goes to places where workers get $2/hr, are willing to work in dangerous conditions, and are HAPPY for the opportunity.

If you don't KNOW about the FairTax, do a little reading.

www.fairtax.org

It'll surprise you.

Jabba