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YoungPUP
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« on: July 22, 2012, 05:54:37 PM » |
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I went and put new front wheel bearings in over the winter to replace the ones that were there that had a notch in them. Now they are moaning/creaking like an old haunted house door. I used good bearings (SKF). They seemed to fit tight with little to no play between the sleeve and the bearings.
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Yea though I ride through the valley of the Shadow of Death I shall fear no evil. For I ride the Baddest Mother F$#^er In that valley!
99 STD (Under construction)
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Madmike
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« Reply #1 on: July 22, 2012, 08:20:54 PM » |
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I would say something ain't right. Any chance the noise is in the brakes and not the bearings?? Maybe try lifting the front end, spin the wheel and see if you still have the noise. You could then pull the pads one side at a time and see if it changes - watch you don't blow the pistons out. If you still have it try loosening the axle and see what happens. May help isolate where its coming from.
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Rio Wil
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« Reply #2 on: July 22, 2012, 09:55:52 PM » |
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I am beginning to think that Honda used a tool to seat the outer bearing races to a specific dimension and not necessarily the usual method of fully seating the outer race in the bottom of the boss. It seems that many bearing replacements result in the inner races (and bearings) pressing to the outside of the outer races and I think this is causing early failure of replacement bearings. If the inner races are bound up by pressure from the spacer, then they are too tight. Ricvky D. alluded to the need to add a shim between the outer race and the bottom of the bearing seat to insure proper spacing and no side pressure on these bearings.
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YoungPUP
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« Reply #3 on: July 23, 2012, 02:40:33 AM » |
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Its up on jackstands now. I pulled the calipers and have them hanging,( part of another repair) and when you spin the wheel by hand it makes a creaking noise.
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Yea though I ride through the valley of the Shadow of Death I shall fear no evil. For I ride the Baddest Mother F$#^er In that valley!
99 STD (Under construction)
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Gryphon Rider
Member
Posts: 5227
2000 Tourer
Calgary, Alberta
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« Reply #4 on: July 23, 2012, 07:18:16 AM » |
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I don't know if you have a Std/Tourer with a cable speedo, but could the speedo gearbox be the issue?
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steve 3054
Member
Posts: 672
VRCC # 34853
Sanford,Fl. 352-267-1553
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« Reply #5 on: July 23, 2012, 07:40:39 AM » |
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When we rebuilt the rears on mine the spacer was to long...causing both inner races to bind on the other....you may want to pull the wheel and see if the spacer is tights or is there alittle play???
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Be polite. Be professional. But, have a plan to kill everyone you
meet.
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Ricky-D
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« Reply #6 on: July 23, 2012, 10:03:33 AM » |
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You cannot determine anything about the spacer length without knowing the distance between the lands of the bearings.
You can't go blindly into changes and adjustments.
The outcome could be damage to the wheel and bearings.
There is a proper way to do this.
***
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2000_Valkyrie_Interstate
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Brian
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« Reply #7 on: July 23, 2012, 05:30:57 PM » |
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Won't the bearings and the spacer be drawn together by the torque put on the axle bolt? I don't see where having the inner spacer tight against the inner race will cause damage. I believe they should be tight fitting to keep them in place allowing the wheel to spin freely by means of the bearings. Not the bearings and spacer turning on the shaft. Correct?
If the bearings are smooth turning by hand I would look to the speedo gear as the culprit and to double check that it too is installed properly. Follow the manual for the correct axle installation procedure.
If this doesn't work you could try the old bearings that did not make noise before you stared this. One of your new bearings could have been shipped dry. Did you turn these by hand before installing them?
Good luck. Keep us informed.
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YoungPUP
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« Reply #8 on: July 23, 2012, 05:47:19 PM » |
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The new bearings turned great. The old ones would only turn about half way (ish) before catching. You could turn them past the catch point but needed a bit more force.
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Yea though I ride through the valley of the Shadow of Death I shall fear no evil. For I ride the Baddest Mother F$#^er In that valley!
99 STD (Under construction)
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Madmike
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« Reply #9 on: July 23, 2012, 06:30:44 PM » |
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Did you loosen off the axle nut to see if the noise goes away??? Speedo drive is also a valid (IMHO) potential.
If you had it apart you could measure the distance between the bearing seats in the hub and then compare this to the length of the spacer.
I trust that you have the bearings fully seated in the hub so that there is no side load on the bearings when the wheel is mounted on the bike. Along these lines a problem that I have seen with Timkens in wheel hubs is that the edge of the seat gets beaten up when the old parts are driven out and the resulting burrs hold the outer race from being fully seated when it is installed. If this was the case here it could result in the spacer being short for the installed position of the bearings which would side load the bearings and may produce the type of noise you are hearing.
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« Last Edit: July 23, 2012, 06:32:37 PM by Madmike »
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Ricky-D
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« Reply #10 on: July 24, 2012, 07:18:14 AM » |
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From Brian: Won't the bearings and the spacer be drawn together by the torque put on the axle bolt? I don't see where having the inner spacer tight against the inner race will cause damage. I believe they should be tight fitting to keep them in place allowing the wheel to spin freely by means of the bearings. Not the bearings and spacer turning on the shaft. From Madmike: I trust that you have the bearings fully seated in the hub so that there is no side load on the bearings when the wheel is mounted on the bike. Along these lines a problem that I have seen with Timkens in wheel hubs is that the edge of the seat gets beaten up when the old parts are driven out and the resulting burrs hold the outer race from being fully seated when it is installed. If this was the case here it could result in the spacer being short for the installed position of the bearings which would side load the bearings and may produce the type of noise you are hearing. Both very good points! *** |
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2000_Valkyrie_Interstate
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Brian
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« Reply #11 on: July 26, 2012, 05:06:26 PM » |
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Hey young pup, you are leaving us hanging here. What did you find out? Thanks,
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YoungPUP
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« Reply #12 on: July 26, 2012, 05:20:38 PM » |
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Unfortunately I've had a few snags with work, family etc. and she remains on stands and will probably be that way for a few more days/weeks....  |
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Yea though I ride through the valley of the Shadow of Death I shall fear no evil. For I ride the Baddest Mother F$#^er In that valley!
99 STD (Under construction)
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Brian
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« Reply #13 on: July 27, 2012, 03:10:20 AM » |
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Unfortunately I've had a few snags with work, family etc. and she remains on stands and will probably be that way for a few more days/weeks.... Sorry man. I thought maybe you forgot about us. Take care of the important things. I hope everything works out. |
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Chrisj CMA
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« Reply #14 on: July 27, 2012, 05:37:36 AM » |
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Dont know if this will help.........but, EVERY time I have seen a wheel come back from a Honda Dealership after bearing replacement you could see that the bearings were pressed in flush with the OUTER edge of the wheel....(like if you used a piece of wood to tap it in.......then when you go to mount the wheel it was a very tight fit the first time. And, YES< that poor method relies on the spacers and torque of the axle nut to finish seating the bearings.
If the wheel was harder to get mounted between the forks than before the bearing R/R then that could be your problem.
What is really scary is I believe this is why a few members had messed up wheels. (Usually the left rear one) but when its not pressed in good and straight all the way then you have to force it into its positon for mounting, this can cause a bearing to be pushed out of square and then when you torque the axle it galls the bearing seat and then no bearing will never be true again in that seat.
Are you sure the axle was torqued to its full 67ft lbs? If not maybe its just not tight enought to fully seat a partially seated bearing...also, if (by chance) the right side pinch bolt is tightened before the axle nut, it will interfere with the torque and be a binding because the pinch bolt tightened causes the fork to grab the axle and then the bolt is trying to compress the fork (slide) it a tad on the axle
I would also retorque all the bolts you had to remove......especially the pinch bolts and caliper bolts
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« Last Edit: July 27, 2012, 05:43:55 AM by Chrisj CMA »
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YoungPUP
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« Reply #15 on: August 01, 2012, 05:41:03 PM » |
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Ok. Finally got my !@%^ straight and dug into the mess. It seems that the front wheel bearings are ok. Pulled the whole front wheel apart bearings seals and all trying to find the noise. Put it back together and Voila' Gone! Now the firkin left caliper is dragging on reinstall (yes the axle is in all the way) and won't compress by hand. I'm kinda hesitant to use the auto brake caliper compressor/ screw plate thingy. May just rebuild the damn things. seems to be the pattern with this bike....
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Yea though I ride through the valley of the Shadow of Death I shall fear no evil. For I ride the Baddest Mother F$#^er In that valley!
99 STD (Under construction)
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Chrisj CMA
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« Reply #16 on: August 01, 2012, 06:41:20 PM » |
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Ok. Finally got my !@%^ straight and dug into the mess. It seems that the front wheel bearings are ok. Pulled the whole front wheel apart bearings seals and all trying to find the noise. Put it back together and Voila' Gone! Now the firkin left caliper is dragging on reinstall (yes the axle is in all the way) and won't compress by hand. I'm kinda hesitant to use the auto brake caliper compressor/ screw plate thingy. May just rebuild the damn things. seems to be the pattern with this bike....
Hate it when you have to buy two sets of bearings to get it to work.....bu tflad you figured it out |
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UskCoastie
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« Reply #17 on: August 01, 2012, 09:03:14 PM » |
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Is it the caliper that is draging or is it one of the caliper bolts hitting the rotor? I did my front wheel bearing check to make sure they were good. Upon reassembly the left lower caliper mount bolt drags on the brake rotor. I shimmed it with one flat washer and that provided enough clearance. Tomorrow I'm going to loosen everything back up and follow the instructions again. I think the left lower fork may be tweaked enough to cause the contact by not fully seating the axle prior to tightening the pinch bolts prior to torquing the axle nut. I'm going to try pulling a torque on the axle nut, backing it off , and tightening the pinch bolts then proceeding with tightening the axle per the manual.
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YoungPUP
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« Reply #18 on: August 02, 2012, 02:22:41 AM » |
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unfortunately its definately dragging. The rotor bolts are all clear.
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Yea though I ride through the valley of the Shadow of Death I shall fear no evil. For I ride the Baddest Mother F$#^er In that valley!
99 STD (Under construction)
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Chrisj CMA
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« Reply #19 on: August 02, 2012, 05:27:08 AM » |
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Is it the caliper that is draging or is it one of the caliper bolts hitting the rotor? I did my front wheel bearing check to make sure they were good. Upon reassembly the left lower caliper mount bolt drags on the brake rotor. I shimmed it with one flat washer and that provided enough clearance. Tomorrow I'm going to loosen everything back up and follow the instructions again. I think the left lower fork may be tweaked enough to cause the contact by not fully seating the axle prior to tightening the pinch bolts prior to torquing the axle nut. I'm going to try pulling a torque on the axle nut, backing it off , and tightening the pinch bolts then proceeding with tightening the axle per the manual.
Really the problem is the axle is not all the way in. This can be caused by simply not putting it in all the way, or on some valkyries the fork seems to want to jump away from the axle head right before you can get the left pinch bolt tightened. Either way I can almost guarantee you that you have the left fork bottom and the head of the axle not seated properly........ I would remove that shim and make sure you loosen all the pinch bolts before you mess with the axle... Then as you follow the steps in the book, make darned sure the lower left fork doesnt move away from the axle head and that axle head is flush with the fork body when you tighten them left side pinch bolts |
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Rio Wil
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« Reply #20 on: August 02, 2012, 07:57:29 PM » |
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UskCoastie
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« Reply #21 on: August 02, 2012, 09:13:18 PM » |
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I did what I said I'd do and got to watch the axle move as the Lt pinch bolts were loosened. Tightened everything back up by the book and no noise. Now to tackle the fuel flow problem that has showed up. Put on a Red Eye hose quick disconnect fitting to the existing set up, fire up the bike after changing oil, bike ran out of fuel with run selected on the petcock. Yes I did install the vacuum line from cyl #6 to the petcock.
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YoungPUP
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« Reply #22 on: August 15, 2012, 05:28:36 PM » |
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Well.....Its making noise again. Took it all apart about 2 weeks ago, and put it all back together, (didn't replace anything, just cleaned and inspected) Put it all back together and the noise was gone.
Now the right side is squealing (sounds like a rubber noise). I'm getting really tired of working on this thing. its getting stupid.
Between rebuilding the calipers and disassembling/reassembling the bearings, trying to find the bearing noise, and the hissing brakes that hiss all the time(the rebuild didnt help that either) I;m probably going to scrap the season and start rebuilding the WHOLE front end. Bearings, brakes calipers and rotors. Insert smiley beating head on wall.....
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Yea though I ride through the valley of the Shadow of Death I shall fear no evil. For I ride the Baddest Mother F$#^er In that valley!
99 STD (Under construction)
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valky1500
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« Reply #23 on: August 15, 2012, 06:31:36 PM » |
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When buying your own bearings, it also pays to be aware of that no matter what size and type of bearing you select, they also come as sheilded or sealed. But not both. That selection of course is up to you.  |
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'98 Standard '01 IS Yes I pull a trailer I have taken notice to those who use that word (Precautionary) and abide by it are not only very happy in life... but they also live long and prosper.  |
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Ricky-D
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« Reply #24 on: August 17, 2012, 08:00:24 AM » |
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There's a moral to this story if you can find it!
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2000_Valkyrie_Interstate
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YoungPUP
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« Reply #25 on: August 17, 2012, 08:36:57 PM » |
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Enlighten me. I see no moral here....Just a PITA at this point.
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Yea though I ride through the valley of the Shadow of Death I shall fear no evil. For I ride the Baddest Mother F$#^er In that valley!
99 STD (Under construction)
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