Maintenance time..Melted main fuse.

[DeathWishBikerDude]

I've recently found my main fuse melted.
It did this a few days in a row,but not while riding the bike.
After a long ride,I parked the bike while having a few beers with friends.
When I went to leave a few hours later,no lights,nothing has power.
This happened two days in a row.

I inspected My electrical system and noticed some corrosion on all the electrical contacts.
I'm planning on lubricating all my connections tomorrow and hoping my troubles go away.
I have another main harness If I cannot remedy the problem.

Any other thoughts?

[junior]

i really hate the way honda does thier main fuse, so when mine went south right along with the starter selnoid. i replace the main fuse with a weather proof inline fuse if you want i can get pics
 

[DeathWishBikerDude]

What symtoms were you having with the starter selenoid?
The main handles the starter,alternator,and front headlight.
I should only have to trouble shoot these three circuits.

I did notice when testing the headlight circuit,with a test light,that there was still power when cranking the engine.
Not enough current to illuminate the headlight,but enough to keep the test light partially lit while cranking the engine.

[Bone]

Have you checked the starter button ?

[DeathWishBikerDude]

Replaced the starter button already.
Although I replaced it with a newer used part.
Part looks new as button is practically red,while my original is nearly yellow.
I guess they could both be bad.
I will lubricate the connections and take the headlight out of the circuit,next.
it is supposed to be raining for the next few days.
When the start switch gets corroded the higher resistance usually causes the switch to melt.
Using the same theory, a melted main fuse should seem to indicate corrosion at the fuse,which is apparent.
Electrical gremlins are the worst.

[Madmike]

 

What symtoms were you having with the starter selenoid?
The main handles the starter,alternator,and front headlight.
I should only have to trouble shoot these three circuits.

I did notice when testing the headlight circuit,with a test light,that there was still power when cranking the engine.
Not enough current to illuminate the headlight,but enough to keep the test light partially lit while cranking the engine.

There are two separate main fuses, a 30 Amp and a 55 Amp.

The alternator output goes through the 55 Amp to the positive post of the battery.

The starters motor circuit is separate from either main fuse.

The 30 Amp main feeds the ignition switch which in turn feeds all of the fuse panel  circuits including the 10 amp ignition fuse which supplies power to the alternator regulator.

The start relay control circuit is dependent on the 30 Amp  main being intact in order to supply power to the start control system via the closed engine top switch.  The ground side of the control circuit can be completed in several ways:

- through closed neutral switch

- if the neutral switch is open (in gear) then the clutch switch must be closed and the sidestand up.

If it is the 30 Amp that is blowing it supplies the Ignition switch.  When the switch is in the off position all of the circuits that it feeds are supposed to be open (there should be no power at the fuse panel ).

Do you have a clamp on ammeter?  If so then put the clamp on over the red wire that goes from the 30 Amp fuse to the Ignition switch. You should get a reading of whatever your lights etc are drawing.  Now turn the key to the off position, there should be no current draw showing on the meter with the switch in the off position.  If there is, put the clamp on over the ground strap and  separate the 4 pin connector for the ignition switch and there should be no current flow showing, if there  is then the red wire is grounded between the 30 Amp and the connector.  If there is no current flow with the connector pulled apart then the problem is between the connector and switch.  If there is power at the fuse panel with the switch in the off position then the contacts in the ignition switch are not opening.

If I understand what you have said then you have more than 30 Amps going to ground only when the switch in the off position, you could isolate the switch at the 4 pin and  pull all the fuses from the fuse panel and the 30 amp.  Check the resistance between each of the wires and ground, it should be infinite.  If the resistance is low then you have a grounded circuit.   This will verify the power wire feeding the switch, the switch wiring and the wiring from the switch to the fuse panel - the fuses have to be pulled to isolate the wiring and make sure that  you don't feed voltage to your Ohmmeter.

[DeathWishBikerDude]

Thanks for the reply.
The 30 amp fuse isn't tripping,it's melting in the harness.
I replaced the fuse with a smaller 20 amp to get me home,and the problem went away for today.
I want to find the real reason as soon as the rain clears.

[Madmike]

Thanks for the reply.
The 30 amp fuse isn't tripping,it's melting in the harness.
I replaced the fuse with a smaller 20 amp to get me home,and the problem went away for today.
I want to find the real reason as soon as the rain clears.

To clarify please..... So the fuse itself is OK (not blown??) but where it plugs into is melted???  If this is so it has to be high resistance at the connection that is causing the heat, and if the fuse is intact then the load is OK.

[DeathWishBikerDude]

The 30 amp fuse plugs into the start selenoid,and is ok for the moment.
The fuse melts,and eventually is no good as the heat eventually gets to the thin center electrode.
Actually,looking at the fuse,the blades become covered in melted plastic,insulating the connection.
If I sand off the melted plastic,the fuse is still good.
Probably some left in the selenoid,causing the high resistance.
Any good tools for cleaning such a small area?

[junior]

that is from heat form a poor contact i have seen this before.  and what i did was get a starter relay #21-2994 ( thats a k&l for an 84 goldwing) eliminated the main fuse in the sel and installed a grote inline fuse# 82-2209 and replace the 20 amp with a 30 amp conected it to the pos post if the sel to the wire that feeds the ing switch. and hooked the 2 remaining wires (one is ground and the other is to engadge the sel) to the 2 spade con on the sel the inline fuse is weather tight.

like i said if you want i'll get pics

[fudgie]

that is from heat form a poor contact i have seen this before.  and what i did was get a starter relay #21-2994 ( thats a k&l for an 84 goldwing) eliminated the main fuse in the sel and installed a grote inline fuse# 82-2209 and replace the 20 amp with a 30 amp conected it to the pos post if the sel to the wire that feeds the ing switch. and hooked the 2 remaining wires (one is ground and the other is to engadge the sel) to the 2 spade con on the sel the inline fuse is weather tight.

like i said if you want i'll get pics

Send some pix please.

[junior]

here are the pics i posted them in my last post

[roboto65]

I have been maybe thinking too much but have you had any problems starting the bike I mean does she start right up or do you had to hold the starter button for more than a few seconds if so this will heat this relay up quick and melt things !

[Madmike]

I totally agree with Juniors diagnosis.  If you have corrosion in a connection it will generate heat.  This is because the corrosion creates resistance to flow and so you need higher amperage at a given voltage to overcome the resistance.

You could try to clean the terminals in the relay base with contact cleaner and a small screwdriver and then tighten up the slots with some needlenose pliers to make sure that the connection is good.  You could check the integrity of the circuit after repairs by pulling the red cable off of the battery, separate the 4 pin for the ignition switch and measuring the resistance with your Ohm meter - resistance should be low.

Junior has shown a good alternative for rewiring the fuse into a fuse holder, you can do this with or without replacing the start relay (solenoid).  If parts are a problem the relay could easily be replaced by an aftermarket (i.e. Cole-Hersee, NAPA, Grote) intermittent duty start relay from any auto supply.  Ensure that you get a relay of adequate capacity to handle the load of  the starting motor when cranking.  Downside is that he relay will not likely be as compact as the OEM install.

The green/red and yellow/red wires are the control circuit for the start relay.  There should be a red wire that comes from the battery and a black wire that goes to the starter, these are the load circuit for the start relay.  The other red wire that goes up to the ignition switch can be connected to the same terminal as the red wire from the battery, put a 30 Amp inline fuse holder in this wire to replace the fuse that is in the start relay now and that you are having problems with.

If you just want to replace the 30 Amp fuse holder and leave the start relay intact you could:

- cut the red wire that runs up to the ignition switch off where it comes out of the start relay, insulate the end of the wire that is sticking out of the start relay.
- connect an inline fuseholder to the wire that runs up to the ignition switch
-connect the supply side of the new 30 amp inline fuse holder to the bottom screw (battery side) on the 50 Amp main fuse holder
 

[Madmike]

I have been maybe thinking too much but have you had any problems starting the bike I mean does she start right up or do you had to hold the starter button for more than a few seconds if so this will heat this relay up quick and melt things !

Just so you know the 30 Amp fuse is mounted in the base of the relay holder but is not in the load circuit of the start relay - basically they share a power source.

[roboto65]

Got ya  just figured the starter draws the most amps and the fuse protects that circut too have seen alot of different bikes do this and most are old LOL I have afew of them had this problem one was a V30 Magna did the same thing !! I am no electrical engineer by anymeans !!! Just thinking and well thats a danger in it's self 

[DeathWishBikerDude]

Thanks for the pics and suggestions.
The starter relay/selenoid is around $70,If they are still available.
I will clean up the connections and see what happens.
If I'm going to spend the money on a selenoid,might as well get the correct one.
Wonder why honda doesn't lube the things from the factory.
Maybe more people will think about lube after reading this thread.

[junior]

ventco wings has the k&l starter relay

[Haulin2]

A few beers, and you're getting on a Valkyrie?  Sounds like your guardian angel is telling you not to drink and drive!

[Robert]

If you really want to improve the reliability of the main fuse/running then take off all the extras wired into the on off switch of the ignition put in a separate relay and fuse and you will never have a problem with the main relay. When I did a few things to my bike one was put in a separate relay for the driving lights and headlight with a separate power connection to the battery. Also Not because of power consumption but it was a side benefit I switched all my turn run lights to led. With a smaller fuse and less power through the relay and connections the electrics work better and last longer. My lights still operate the same way they are just wired differently. I have increased the wattage of my headlight to 100/80 and its really nice and bright now. You cannot pull all that power through that relay and expect it to live. Like all have been finding out the first to go is the connection. The heat generated by the connection/load makes the connection loosen more and accelerates the breakdown. If you take the major sources of power consumption put them on separate relay and fuse then the problems are eliminated because it doesn't draw as much through one circuit. Not to mention the starter switch will also live  longer. If you get a power plate run it off of the battery with a rely in the circuit then all that is powered off that plate will switch on and off with the key and yet will not draw through the main relay. I would say that if there is a consistant draw of more than 10 to 20 amps through those small connections then they will heat up regardless of how clean they are.

[DeathWishBikerDude]

http://www.rattlebars.com/mtz/starter.html --->

Valkyrie starter "relay" problem

http://archive1.gwrra.org/discus4/messages/3747/28183.html?1057685207-->

Starter Relay Switch 84 gl1200a

Relay Repair Kit.  Part# 32110-ML8-305

I guess  I'll need to order the switch and repair kit.
Seems I've dug up an old problem from the gl 1200 days.

[trantony]

DWBD,
Not an electrical engineer, however, I did have a very similar problem with a previous GoldWing. I did something that all bikers are told to never do. Charge a battery in the circuit at more than a 2 amp rate. And of course I paid the price for not listening  . Seems the 6 amps blew a diode in the alternator and after riding a bit it started melting wiring and connections together. Don't know if this could be your issue or not, but you may want to have the alternator circuit checked out at local stealer. Just my 2 cents, hope this helps!

[DeathWishBikerDude]

Thanks for the reply.

I thought about that,I'm running my original alternator,12 years old,but...

The fuse doesnt blow,and the heat is coming from the switch.
I cleaned the connections,took a ride,came back,and the bike was dead again.
Tapping on the switch with a screw driver,brought the bike back to life.

I will probably buy a used alternator as a spare,but I do believe I've found the problem.
I'll know in a few days.

[DeathWishBikerDude]

Replaced the starter relay/magnetic switch.
Problem solved.