Pulsing front brakes.....

[sawdustar]

Greetings,
I'm new here but I'm not new to riding. I've been riding motorcycle since I was 6 years old. That equates to riding off and on for over 45 years. I've recently been given a 1997 Valkyrie Touring bike in near mint condition. I love this bike, but the front brakes pulse when stopping like a rotor is warped or something and needs turning. Can these be turned or am I stuck at buying 2 new rotors for $185 each?
Please advise.
BTW, my real name is Dennis.

Thank You,
Dennis (sawdustar)

[Michvalk]

There is a marking on the rotor for min thickness, but if there is a warped rotor, there probably isn't enough room to cut out the warp. Just figure out which one is warped, and replace that one. On a standard you should be able to see which one is warped as your riding(slowly)

[R J]

They are  probably both warped.

Buy 2 new ones from EBC.

Best  $$$$ I ever spent on MGM.

I'm heavy on the front brake.

I warped the 1st, EOM, set at 39K+.

Google EBC, they are from across the pond
but they have dealers here in the states.

I've had these EBC rotors for close to 200K, and not a problem with them.
I did use EBC front pads also.

[R J]

Go to this link, and enter your zip code.

It will bring up dealers for you to choose from.

http://www.ebcbrakes.com/asplocator/uslocator.asp?zip=50320&radius=100

[sawdustar]

Thanks for the info guys. I'm so new with this bike that I'm trying to figure out how to take the seat off of it.

I have oil and filter to change, air filter to change, final drive oil to change, new tires to buy, mount, and balance, change brake fluid, clutch fluid, and maybe even brake pads. I sure what a lot of expense to get this bike to where it needs to be. Sheesh.!!!! At least I can still ride my VTX1300 when my youngest son isn't riding it or my other son's VT1100.

No owners manual, no service manual.....so I'm searching all over the place for info and how-to stuff. 

[Denny47]

Go to ebay, search    Honda Valkyrie parts    . lots of Valkyrie items, saw an owners manual the other day on there. Even once in awhile an OEM service manual

[old2soon]

Thanks for the info guys. I'm so new with this bike that I'm trying to figure out how to take the seat off of it.

I have oil and filter to change, air filter to change, final drive oil to change, new tires to buy, mount, and balance, change brake fluid, clutch fluid, and maybe even brake pads. I sure what a lot of expense to get this bike to where it needs to be. Sheesh.!!!! At least I can still ride my VTX1300 when my youngest son isn't riding it or my other son's VT1100.

No owners manual, no service manual.....so I'm searching all over the place for info and how-to stuff. 

   Front center section between side covers-look for and find the keyhole. Keyhole is closer to the left as you sit on the bike. Insert key and release seat lock pull up on front of seat. RIDE SAFE.

[DenverDave]

Start here, lots of good info 



http://www.valkyrieriders.com/shoptalk/


Update your location in your profile, you may be near someone who can lend a hand and knowledge, if needed.


Dave

[salty1]

Good morning Dennis! If you need a service manual you can download it here:
http://www.valkyrienorway.com/download.html

If the rotors are wrapped, they are to thin to turn down. A cutter will just chatter as they spin on a lathe. As was said previously, purchase new ones or find a good used pair.

Lastly, welcome to the insanity. 

[sawdustar]

Profile updated. Thanks for reminding me.

Thanks for the info on getting my drivers seat off. Much appreciated. 

[sawdustar]

Good morning Dennis! If you need a service manual you can download it here:
http://www.valkyrienorway.com/download.html

If the rotors are wrapped, they are to thin to turn down. A cutter will just chatter as they spin on a lathe. As was said previously, purchase new ones or find a good used pair.

Lastly, welcome to the insanity. 

Hey....thanks Salty1..!!! Good info right there. Thank You.!!!!

[Gryphon Rider]

Do a search on this board for GoldWing rotors. I think it's the 1500 GW rotors that will bolt on and are a fair bit cheaper, but fit fine.

[Chrisj CMA]

Sometimes the brake handle will make the braking jerky if its dirty or the foot that depresses the pushrod of the master cylinder isint smooth.  A friend of mine thought  he needed a caliper rebuild because of pulsing brakes, turns out 5 minutes to clean smooth with emory cloth and lube the brake handle was all that was needed.

One way to check it is to slowly squeeze the brake handle while the bike is parked.  Squeeze it all the way, if its jerky while not moving it cant be the rotors.  His did it worst while backing the bike and lightly using the front brakes to stop the bike

[sawdustar]

Sometimes the brake handle will make the braking jerky if its dirty or the foot that depresses the pushrod of the master cylinder isint smooth.  A friend of mine thought  he needed a caliper rebuild because of pulsing brakes, turns out 5 minutes to clean smooth with emory cloth and lube the brake handle was all that was needed.

One way to check it is to slowly squeeze the brake handle while the bike is parked.  Squeeze it all the way, if its jerky while not moving it cant be the rotors.  His did it worst while backing the bike and lightly using the front brakes to stop the bike

I'll be sure to check this out. Thank you for the tip.!!!

[da prez]

Sawduster , used pair on E-bay for $39.95. I do not remember what page .

                        da prez

[HayHauler]

Do a search on this board for GoldWing rotors. I think it's the 1500 GW rotors that will bolt on and are a fair bit cheaper, but fit fine.

GR, that used to be the case, but Honda reduced the price on the Valk rotors to now be cheaper than the GL1800's I have on my bike.  The GL1800's work fine and at the time they were lots cheaper.
Prices from HDLParts.com
GL1800 = 247.00
Valk = 172.00

Man, I might have to buy a set of Valks just to put on the shelf!

Hay 
Jimmyt

[salty1]

Sawduster take your rotors into a brake shop and ask that they spin them to see if they are true. At least then you will have a starting point to determine where you go from there. FWIW   

[sawdustar]

OK...here's the deal with my front brakes. Due to the day job and family, I haven't had time to figure out the lifting process for the valk on my MC jack yet. But...I can tell you that when I apply the front brakes at higher speeds than 20 MPH, I can't feel any jerkiness in the brakes....but as the bike slows down, I can even feel it in the brake handle as the bike slows and the slower it gets....the more drastic the jerkiness is of the front brake. I rely heavily on the front brakes but I also use some rear brake and I also vary what brakes I use based on the type of road I'm riding on....like...I have a gravel driveway at my house....so No Front Brakes are used on my driveway....Rear brakes only.

Salty1......I live outside of a small city with a Suzuki dealership and a Harley dealership. There is a local mom-n-pop atv/mc repair shop....but what kind of brake shop can spin my rotors? Do I need to remove them from the front wheel.?

Sorry for so many questions....I am mechanically inclined and can do a lot of the work myself....It's just I'm trying to figure out the issue with my front brakes so I can rest easier when riding in traffic on my commutes to/from work.

[salty1]

Sawduster the rotors will need to be removed. Any shop or friend that has a bench lathe can spin your rotors so you see if there is pronounced wobble. What does the surface of the rotors look like? Are they grooved badly?

[sawdustar]

Sawduster the rotors will need to be removed. Any shop or friend that has a bench lathe can spin your rotors so you see if there is pronounced wobble. What does the surface of the rotors look like? Are they grooved badly?

No...No grooves at all. I have a woodworking lathe. Does that count? 

I'm an old time woodworker. www.beautifulwood.net is my personal web site. No commerce there, just how-to stuff and my shop tour.

[Ricky-D]

Because the rotors are composed two pieces you cannot depend on a true result from turning.

If you lift the front tire off the floor and turn the wheel you can easily see any "wobble" when looking at the rotor where it enters/leaves the caliper while you turn the wheel.

A slight wobble does not make the rotor unusable, and this is due to the characteristics of the floating caliper.

It is not difficult to true a rotor to remove any wobble although a good degree of mechanical ability is necessary to get an acceptable result.

***

[salty1]

Sawduster the rotors will need to be removed. Any shop or friend that has a bench lathe can spin your rotors so you see if there is pronounced wobble. What does the surface of the rotors look like? Are they grooved badly?

No...No grooves at all. I have a woodworking lathe. Does that count? 

I'm an old time woodworker. www.beautifulwood.net is my personal web site. No commerce there, just how-to stuff and my shop tour.

Your lathe should work fine. Just chuck it good and solid. If you got a machinist chuck, that should grab it well. Always glad to meet another sawdust maker. 

[salty1]

....
It is not difficult to true a rotor to remove any wobble although a good degree of mechanical ability is necessary to get an acceptable result.

***

How do you think one would go about trying to true a rotor.  ???  The front rotors are so thin that a cutting tool will just chatter on the face. Grinding them true is very expensive. Been there done both. The rear rotor is thick enough to turn but care is required.  

[Chrisj CMA]

It's just I'm trying to figure out the issue with my front brakes so I can rest easier when riding in traffic on my commutes to/from work.

Did you rule out it just being the handle?

[sawdustar]

It's just I'm trying to figure out the issue with my front brakes so I can rest easier when riding in traffic on my commutes to/from work.

Did you rule out it just being the handle?

Yes I did. It's not the handle. I can feel the brake fluid pressure pushing back on the master cylinder/handle when applying front brake and slowing to a stop behind a cage or at a stop light. I'm really trying to analyze the behavior so I can better determine what needs to be done.

[Ricky-D]

You cannot do anything to the rotor itself, it's just too hard.

But you can adjust the carrier because it is malleable.

If the rotor is not running true, it's probably because the carrier out of line.

Use a disc lock on your front wheel and forget about it being there!!!

Surely will bend something.

***

[Chrisj CMA]

It's just I'm trying to figure out the issue with my front brakes so I can rest easier when riding in traffic on my commutes to/from work.

Did you rule out it just being the handle?

Yes I did. It's not the handle. I can feel the brake fluid pressure pushing back on the master cylinder/handle when applying front brake and slowing to a stop behind a cage or at a stop light. I'm really trying to analyze the behavior so I can better determine what needs to be done.

thats not ruling anything out..........keep analyzing.........good luck

[Ricky-D]

Attempting to do anything with the front end is futile with no jack.

The first tool necessary to work on the Valkyrie would be a bike jack and an adapter.

Lift the bike off the ground and spin the wheel.

That's the first thing to do.

Spin and observe.

Sheesh!

***

[sawdustar]

I have a bike jack. I am just now finding out that I need an adapter to lift the Valk with. I can tell you that I'm not like many of you...I'm not made of money...so I have to sort through and learn stuff first, figure out what I can get by without, figure out what needs fixin' and then see what I got money to buy for fixin'. Sorry that you feel I should know all this stuff already (as implied by your ending "Sheesh!" statement). I will get to this....I just have a job or two that I have to work before I have free time to work on the bike.

Thanks for your advice and tips though. Much appreciated. 

[Chrisj CMA]

You do not need an adapter to lift the front of the Valkyrie.  Just position the bike lift under the forward portion of the engine and lift.

Second.  It doesnt cost a dime to remove the brake handle and feel the foot that actuates the pushrod.  If its not baby butt smooth, then sand it with some emory and put a light coat of grease on it.  Also, grease the pivot point and put it all back together.  If that dont fix it, THEN you have ruled out the handle as the problem.

Chill out man.  People are trying to help you but you seem to be the obstrucion

PS....I dont care how much money you have.  You cant "get by" with funky front brakes.  Well, not for long anyways...

[Chrisj CMA]

Sawduster...from one woodworker to another,you are a craftsman.  Beautiful work my friend!

[sawdustar]

Sawduster...from one woodworker to another,you are a craftsman.  Beautiful work my friend!

Thank you sir. Much appreciated.

I'm NOT trying to be short with anyone. I'm in a steep learning curve about the valk and it's needs. I want a bike that is safe to ride and I need good front brakes.

Please accept my most sincere apologies for coming across wrong. 

[custom1]

I can't believe no one posted this yet.


You can make a lift adapter out of.........




Wait for it.........











WOOD !!   

http://www.herberts.org/wayne/valk/lowtechlift.htm

[The emperor has no clothes]

I can't believe no one posted this yet.


You can make a lift adapter out of.........




Wait for it.........











WOOD !!   

http://www.herberts.org/wayne/valk/lowtechlift.htm

Good one!

[sawdustar]

I can't believe no one posted this yet.

You can make a lift adapter out of.........

Wait for it.........

WOOD !!   

http://www.herberts.org/wayne/valk/lowtechlift.htm

Ah.!!! Now THAT I can do.!!!!! Printing that off now to take to the shop. 

[sawdustar]

Ok...been working on the bike today.
Fluid looks fairly new. Really clean and all parts are there. Pads look good on both sides.
I broke out my dial indicator and put that on both rotors.
Clutch side rotor show to be Eleven Thousandths out of flat. So upon rotation of the tire by hand, the dial would vary from 20 to 31 and back to 20....for a difference of 11 thousandths.

Throttle side rotor showed to be 5 thousandths out...varied from 20 to 25 and back to 20 thousandths.

Other than that, the brake lever moves as smoothly as the one on my VTX1300. So...nothing there to give a pulsing brake.

From my poking around today....it appears that I need to replace the clutch side rotor??

What do you experienced folks say about this.??

[pancho]

Hey sawdustar,, glad to see someone pointed you towards the wooden jack adapter, can't get along without one.  And also, don't be thinking any of us have a ton of money,, none of us would be riding these old bikes if we were rich...... some just get a bit twisted up at times,,,, you'll get used to to it in time and see who is likely to get their panties in a wad,,, we're all just trying to help.  The service runout for the rotors is 12 thou. You have that downloaded manual now, the info on the brakes is section 15. You may want check the thickness of the rotors also to see if you need to get one or two.  There are used ones on eBay. You need a 1 inch micrometer to read the thickness of the rotors, as a caliper will read the ridge on the edge,, if you only have a caliper, you can use it with two flat washers, one on each side, and subtract the thickness of the washers from your total reading.

[salty1]

Sawduster look what I just came across.

http://www.truedisk.net/

[Ricky-D]

Well, if you're going to replace it,

Why not just give it a whack or two with a rubber hammer.

If you hit it at the correct spot, it may surprise you.

That is, after you employ the dial indicator again.

***

[sawdustar]

I ran a micrometer on both front rotors. Both have proven to be about 4.67mm thick. Tolerance is a minimum service of 4.0mm thick. I know that the total warp on one rotor equates to about 0.279mm out of "flat" and true. According to the manual, acceptable tolerance is up to 0.012" or about 0.280mm of out of true/flat.

I can ride the bike as is....stopping can get tricky when the front brakes are really grabbing/letting go/grabbing/letting go......but I'm getting to where I can stop the bike safely enough while I sort all this out. The LOML and I want to just buy new EBC rotor and pads for the front and go with that, but I've got to come up with the coin before I can do that....then I've got to start saving up for tires come early spring.

None-the-less.......I still really love this bike.