valk wont start

[R J]

While you are under the right sidecover looking at that connection, check the fuse to make sure it isn't blown.

Red wire should be your hot wire.

[zzed28]

Quoted
While you are under the right sidecover looking at that connection, check the fuse to make sure it isn't blown.

Response
I have looked at the wiring system and it seems to be fine, there is a bit of white residue on the outside of the female multi connector, but I would think that is dried dielectric grease. There is no sign of burning at all, or melting of the plastic as if its gotten hot.  I pulled all the fuses, including the 55amp one,, everything looks fine, and they all have 1.6 ohms resistance or a bit less.  I also took the ninjas battery out, its been starting and running just fine all winter, in the ninja, when the starter is being run, it drops as low as 11.8 in the ninja then the engine fires perfectly. Just as before. It is exactly the same battery,, yxt14 bs.  I put it in the valk, no deal, I charged it fully, its at 12.8 volts after charge, ran the starter in the valk, this is after I spray cleaned all the fuses and connections, and the voltage dropped to 9.8v and the valk did not start or even try.  So it appears that the valk has some serious resistance issues somewhere along the line but it sure doesnt appear to be in the connector.  The next thing I will do, unless someone says different, is to pull all the plugs and test fire them to make sure I have full fire, yesterday I only pulled number six to test.  I am also going to pull the tank and test the petcock for fuel delivery.

So I assume that larger red wire in the four way connector, is always hot on the battery side when the key is on?  And that wire, does it deliver 12 volts to the ignition, if so, I am wondering if I find that thing running low voltage, can I insert a jumper wire  carrying a separate 12v from a separate battery and see if that makes  a  difference. If I can do that, what about potential damage to ,,,,,stuff..............

Red wire should be your hot wire.


[/quote]

[R J]

Where is home for you?

Town & State.

[Chrisj CMA]

I had the same problem with a VTX 1800 a couple weeks ago.  I did the starter button maintenance.  Got them contacts all clean and free to insure contact...it still wouldn't start until I sprayed contact cleaner or WD40 up inside the kill switch mechanism from the inside of the open switch box...then all worked perfect.

[zzed28]

Where is home for you?

Town & State.

 Midland Mi,,,, look at your right hand, its right on the map,  in the crotch between your thumb and forefinger. in the crotch of your hand so to speak.



I can sure clean that switch stuff, got lots of contact cleaner to spray.
[/quote]

[R J]

You have 644 miles from Midland to DSM, IA,

If you want to load your bike up and haul it down here, I promise you we will get it running.

[zzed28]

Love that, but I have a few more things to check before I come out there, gawd,,,13 hours of hammering it on the road before I get there.

We have a cold snap going here so I guess I have some time before the riding fun begins.


You have 644 miles from Midland to DSM, IA,

If you want to load your bike up and haul it down here, I promise you we will get it running.
[/quote]

[Ricky-D]

Draining the fuel from the float bowls is the smartest chore presented on this whole thread.

You have no electrical problem and are wasting time fooling with this.

Boost the battery if it is necessary.

I can't imagine anyone thinking old gas in the float bowl would be good with no prior preventive measure being utilized.

Not to mention the very real possibility of water in the bottom of each bowl.

I doubt they will readily drain. A vacuum may be necessary to get the crud starting to evacuate.

First things first. Skipping this first basic step makes no sense.

***

[zzed28]

Crestview (Panhandle) Florida


Quote
I had the same problem with a VTX 1800 a couple weeks ago.  I did the starter button maintenance.  Got them contacts all clean and free to insure contact...it still wouldn't start until I sprayed contact cleaner or WD40 up inside the kill switch mechanism from the inside of the open switch box...then all worked perfect.
ANSWER

Doing the above did not help with this at all.  I will try the volts test trick on whatever wire it is that needs to be hot at that emergency shutoff switch, and blow it out with my can o air too.


Draining the fuel from the float bowls is the smartest chore presented on this whole thread.

You have no electrical problem and are wasting time fooling with this.  SEE BELOW

Boost the battery if it is necessary.

I can't imagine anyone thinking old gas in the float bowl would be good with no prior preventive measure being utilized.  

Forgive the caps please.

THIS GAS WAS RUNNING THE BIKE FINE JUST ONE WEEK AGO, BUT IT IS ABOUT THREE MONTHS IN A CAN FROM THE PUMP,, AND SINCE ITS SPECIAL PURE GASOLINE, WHO KNOWS HOW MUCH OF THAT THEY SELL, NOT MUCH ME THINKS.  IT MAY BE OLDER THAN I THOUGHT WHEN YOU TAKE THAT INTO ACCOUNT, BUT IT JUST ABRUPTLY QUIT RUNNING  AFTER STARTING WELL ALL WINTER.

Not to mention the very real possibility of water in the bottom of each bowl.

I doubt they will readily drain. A vacuum may be necessary to get the crud starting to evacuate.

UPDATE

I now do have an electrical problem, no fire at the plugs now after a few days of having spark. And the weather is dry and windy.   I checked into the juice in the big red wire, what is going there is identical to what is going in the battery at the same time, so thats precisely the same.  But in checking 1,,3,,and cyl 5 for spark, I now have no spark on those now.  I did pull apart the start button switch, sprayed everything with cleaner, before I checked the spark, so maybe its me that killed the spark, hopefully when its all dry, it will start sparking again.   I did not change plugs yet, nor did I drain any carbs but will be doing that tomorrow.  I am thinking that those small flat screwdriver plugs are what drains gas, is that correct, and should I assume that it will drain out some fuel overflow line, or is it gonna end up on the engine, if I have to apply vac, is the vac to go just on the petcock or do these drain lines, if they exist have to be vacced too.  I hope someone still cares after all this, but if you can inform me it would be appreciated.



First things first. Skipping this first basic step makes no sense.

***
[/quote]

[desertrefugee]

I would respectfully refer you back to my very first response to your original post.

Near as I can tell, neither of those things has been done - including draining the bowls as was just wisely suggested.    Until you have done BOTH, and are certain that grounds are solid between battery/frame/engine, you will not have shown due diligence and covered the most basic of needs of fire and fuel.

[Chrisj CMA]

I did pull apart the start button switch, sprayed everything with cleaner

BUT...was the contact jammed in its little slot?  I know I keep harping but cleaning isn't enough, they need to be capable of making contact.

Also I may have missed it but I didn't see where you jumped the bike with a known good battery like from your car.  a weak battery will turn the engine over but fail to power the ignition.

[R J]

He jumped it twice from his running truck.

Drain the firkin carbs.

Do the items Ricky-D at least tells ya.

Do the items that Attic Rat suggests.

Ya haven't listened to me yet so we will ignore me for now.

You only need 2 things to make a 4 cycle engine run.

Juice & gas.............     You have sufficient of those and all fuses and ground wire are in good shape it should start, might not run very good, but it should as least idle. 

OH a reminder, keep your damn meat hooks off that throttle when you are trying to start the engine.  The carbs DO NOT have accelerator pumps in them so messing with the throttle is a waste of your time and battery juice.

[zzed28]

He jumped it twice from his running truck.

Drain the firkin carbs.

Do the items Ricky-D at least tells ya.

Do the items that Attic Rat suggests.

Ya haven't listened to me yet so we will ignore me for now.  SIR, I HAVE LISTENED TO YOU AND EVERYONE, I HAVE NOT HAD ENOUGH TIME TO GO DO WHAT EVERYONE HAS SAID, SORRY, IT TAKES ME A LONG TIME

You only need 2 things to make a 4 cycle engine run.

Juice & gas.............     You have sufficient of those and all fuses and ground wire are in good shape it should start, might not run very good, but it should as least idle.  

BELOW IS MY RESPONSE

THERE IS NO PROVEN GAS, NOR IS THERE PROVEN FIRE AT THE PLUGS AT THIS TIME, THE PLUGS ARE NOT SPARKING NOW.

OK,,,,   I have kept my meat hooks off the throttle,,I have tons of juice, remember the truck battery is ALWAYS available and I have used it and checked volts every day at least once.


RJ, I dont know who  this Attic Rat is, does he go by that moniker here?  Or is he using another name, I have read enough to know he is very respected, so where ever he is  posting to me, if he can identify himself, I will be happy to follow along.  I know I am not moving at the pace that you guys can, even though I am retired , I can only be on my feet about two hours a day.  

ALSO, I know very much what is required for a four stroke, you may be questioning that, but I do know,, something new today is,,, now I have NO SPARK.

I am going to do the best to get the yami venture off my workstand and get the valk on it by tomorrow night. I am hoping that the drains are as shown in my manual, but I doubt it, I have looked directly at that area, and see nothing except some screws behind the carbs.  But I will sure as heck look again, and if they are there, that will get drained asap. NO problem with that, sorry I am just slow.  Basically , I am quite physically disabled, I cant bend, have heart trouble etc, and really can only be on my feet two hours a day. I am NOT looking for sympathy or someone to take this on for me, I have a dealer, and will use him when and if I and or you run out of ideas.

[zzed28]

I did pull apart the start button switch, sprayed everything with cleaner that is CRC brand of contact cleaner. NO DICE, made no difference. I did not totally dis assemble that switch, just hosed it with CRC.

YOUR QUESTION
BUT...was the contact jammed in its little slot?  I know I keep harping but cleaning isn't enough, they need to be capable of making contact.

MY ANSWER
I am not going to completely tear that switch down, I am afraid of losing those tiny parts.  Youve warned of many tiny parts, if that ends up being the problem, the dealer will have to fix it.

YOUR QUESTION
Also I may have missed it but I didn't see where you jumped the bike with a known good battery like from your car.  a weak battery will turn the engine over but fail to power the ignition.

     
MY ANSWER,
I have posted multiple times that I have a perfectly good battery, in fact I have two, both yxt14 BS, neither one of them show a full 13.2 v after a full charge, but they do show 12.8v, after a full charge, but the valks batt, drops into the 9.5 v while cranking, and the Ninja yxt14bs, drops into the 10 volts area when cranking this valk.   This NINJA battery cranks the ninja just fine, starts it, and the ninja cranking only drops that batt into the mid elevens, and fires up instantly.   I def believe that I have extreme resistance somewhere in the valks elec system, the obvious thing to me, is it may be in the starter, but I dont know.   I have a nearly new batt in my truck, and have repeatedly jumped the valk with the truck, and the voltage only drops to the mid elevens then, but the valk never has started in the last seven or eight days, even when hooked to the truck. It ran perfectly all winter, then failed on me when it warmed up to thirty degrees last week.

A question I would like to ask whoever is, how low does your valks voltage fall during cranking, and I assume that your bike starts, does anyone have an actual answer for that question please??

[R J]

Attic Rat is the name he goes by here on the board.   He is from Oklahoma City, OK.

I'm going to send him a PM and see if I can get him involved.

Also Ricky-D is a good one for solutions.

I'd sure like to  get someone involved that lives within running distance to help you out.     But we will do the best we can to get you up and running.

I'd love to get that bike to my son's shop.    But since we can't, lets try this next.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Start with the ground cable at the battery.

Follow it to where it makes a connection to the frame, engine or whatever in its hearts desire.
    Remove the end from whatever it connects to and clean it up nice and neat.   Especially the aluminum one where it connects to the engine.   It should go from there to the frame.

It has been too long since I have had my fingers and eyeballs on this part of the engine.

    We are looking for green goop, crud or whatever will grow on the connection.
     This could be your reason for no sparkie at the sparklers.

Now, do the same thing with the positive cable.   

  PS:     CLEAN both ends of the battery cables, that includes the cable end to the battery.

The carb drain is on the bottom of the carb.    I'd send you a picture of it but my repair manual is with the Trike at my son's house.  It is his ride now.

The Chevy Trike is my daughter's.     I gave up ownership last month, well actually it was in March.   

JUST BARE WITH US, WE WILL GET YOU UP AND RUNNING.

You did say you looked inside of the black rubber cover under the right side cover and all looked good.

You did say the fuse in that red connector was good, right?
Did you remove it to check the fuse?     Check it with your meter for best results.

Take your time, I know the 2 hour deal on your feet.

I'm going on 83 years young, retired, and can get ouchy periodically.   So if I bounce off your head, just take a big breath and reply OK Chief, what next.

[zzed28]

OK, RJ, glad to hear that someone else is in the seriously mastered part of life and can appreciate the difficulty I am physically having with doing some of this.   I am going to answer each of your points below.

RJ STATES
Attic Rat is the name he goes by here on the board.   He is from Oklahoma City, OK.

I'm going to send him a PM and see if I can get him involved.


TOMS ANSWER,,  I have since looked him up and reread all the posts to my thread, he has not answered on my thread at all, and I dont see anywhere that he has answered on anything to deal with this , although i do see that he would have fantastic input, just by what you all seem to think of his work.

RJ s COMMENT
Also Ricky-D is a good one for solutions.

TOMs  RESPONSE
I see that he has had some great input so far, and really appreciate that, thanks Ricky

RJ s  COMMENT
I'd sure like to  get someone involved that lives within running distance to help you out.     But we will do the best we can to get you up and running.

TOM s  RESPONSE,
If there is someone in the tri cities, I will be happy to pay you to help, whatever your going rate is.

RJs COMMENT
I'd love to get that bike to my son's shop.    But since we can't, lets try this next.

TOM s RESPONSE

Amen to that.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
YOUR COMMENT
Start with the ground cable at the battery.

MY RESPONSE
I know this, since my truck had this very issue two years ago, and my first response was to have my hired help crawl under it, pull the wires off the starter, and polish them up with steel wool, my intuition was right, it started and ran very nicely after that. And this was after a so called master  mechanic told me to change the ignition lock.


YOUR COMMENT
Follow it to where it makes a connection to the frame, engine or whatever in its hearts desire.  

MY RESPONSE,
I have already checked out this, but did not pull every connection from the frame and polish it up, this will be done pronto, but just this is prolly gonna take me two days since it looks like I am gonna have to jack the bike up to get at stuff, I am presently checking both my manuals to find out this.  I do have clymer and the electronic version of the honda manual.

YOUR COMMENT
    Remove the end from whatever it connects to and clean it up nice and neat.   Especially the aluminum one where it connects to the engine.   It should go from there to the frame.

MY RESPONSE

Will get this done the hour after I get the thing jacked up so I can see something in that dark space.

RJ s COMMENT
It has been too long since I have had my fingers and eyeballs on this part of the engine.

TOM s RESPONSE,   Understood.

YOUR COMMENT
    We are looking for green goop, crud or whatever will grow on the connection.
     This could be your reason for no sparkie at the sparklers.

Now, do the same thing with the positive cable.  

MY RESPONSE
Consider this done, but give me two or three days to get it done since the jacking it up onto stand has to be done first. I have to do this, more or less without help, so its gonna take time, I have to get the venture de jacked off the stand first, that will take a day minimum. The venture also has to be moved, and now its thru fresh snow to another building.

YOUR COMMENT
  PS:     CLEAN both ends of the battery cables, that includes the cable end to the battery.

MY RESPONSE
The battery ends of the cables have already been polished up with steel wool, the other ends are not, and I will get that done asap but it may be after I get it onto the work stand.

YOUR COMMENT
The carb drain is on the bottom of the carb.    I'd send you a picture of it but my repair manual is with the Trike at my son's house.  It is his ride now.

MY RESPONSE,
I see what is pictured in my clymers manual, if mine is what is pictured, that will be easy,  I am going to confirm that right off today, and if those drains can be reached, that will be an easy job, although I want to get the tank off first so that I can check vac lines and fuel line setups .  This will be after I get it on the workstand.



YOUR COMMENTS
The Chevy Trike is my daughter's.     I gave up ownership last month, well actually it was in March.  

JUST BARE WITH US, WE WILL GET YOU UP AND RUNNING.

MY RESPONSE
I will bear with you all, its gonna take to the end of the week to get to what the first priorities are, and get them done,,,, that is,,,, get the tank off, drain the carbs, check all the so far unpolished ends of the cables that run the starter, grounds etc since I have to get it onto the work stand to do the other wise stoop work

YOUR COMMENT
You did say you looked inside of the black rubber cover under the right side cover and all looked good.
 
MY RESPONSE
I have had the sidecover off, tested every stankin thing under there with the ohm meter and found that all fuses, and every connection, appears good, there is absolutely no appearance of getting heated up on that connector, all connection points have been CRC contact cleaner sprayed. The only thing at all suspicious is there is a bit of white on the female side of the reddish connector that appears to be dried out di electric grease.  I have checked voltage at the large red wire with a needle probe, it is carrying exactly what the battery is putting out, at the moment of checking, in other words, in a fresh batt situation, it carries 12.6 volts, in cranking, it can get as low as the mid nine volts, just like the battery.

YOUR COMMENT
You did say the fuse in that red connector was good, right?
Did you remove it to check the fuse?     Check it with your meter for best results.

MY RESPONSE,
Every fuse has been pulled, from the 55 amp down thru to the 5 amp, been polished and every fuse has equal to or less than 1.6 ohms resistance when measure with the dvm.   All fuses appearance wise are fine and intact. I do question this, since I know that fuses can look good and be bad.   All connections within the  fuse area have been hosed down with CRC contact cleaner.

YOUR COMMENT
Take your time, I know the 2 hour deal on your feet.

I'm going on 83 years young, retired, and can get ouchy periodically.   So if I bounce off your head, just take a big breath and reply OK Chief, what next.

MY RESPONSE,  
I am gonna be 65 next month, but have much more than the average wear and tear on my bones etc, no sympathy please. I did it to myself with working 70 hours a week doing fairly physical work before I retired. The money was good, but I question the wisdom of doing that now. Again, no drama please, Ive been dealing with it a long time, and am totally used to my limits.  I just dont tell peops that Ive just met what the limits  are of course, since what the heck do they want to know for, we all have got our limits, and I am very glad I still have plenty of smarts to read and learn from the likes of you all.  

I also have three inches of fresh snow here today, hahaa, this will slow down some of what I am doing as per getting the venture into another storage area since it will have to be pushed thru the snow to another parking area.  Unless someone else chimes in with more input, I am only going to post here, as I get each item successfully finished.

[R J]

You did say you looked inside of the black rubber cover under the right side cover and all looked good.

You did say the fuse in that red connector was good, right?
Did you push it back to check the fuse?     Check it with your meter for best results.

I hope I'm reading this wrong.

So for clarification.

Right side cover:        There is a large BLACK rubber cover under there with this red connector I'm referring to.

You did pull that cover back and expose the red connector, right?

If NOT, please do so before you do anything else.   If there is any corrosion or melted connectors, you will not run or have any spark at the plugs.

[zzed28]

RJ ASKS,
You did say you looked inside of the black rubber cover under the right side cover and all looked good.

You did say the fuse in that red connector was good, right?
Did you push it back to check the fuse?     Check it with your meter for best results.

TOMS RESPONSE,

THE short answer is, every fuse has been removed and checked with the ohmeter, every one is looking very good and checks to at or less than 1.6 ohms resistance. That reddish connector  that covers the 30 amp fuse is in good condition from what I can see, Ive had it apart twice, and the large red  wire on the back, carries exactly the same voltage as the battery under the same circumstances.  All fuses had their spades polished and are clean.



I hope I'm reading this wrong.

So for clarification.

Right side cover:        There is a large BLACK rubber cover under there with this red connector I'm referring to.

You did pull that cover back and expose the red connector, right?

If NOT, please do so before you do anything else.   If there is any corrosion or melted connectors, you will not run or have any spark at the plugs

THIS IS A QUOTE FROM MY POST NUMBER 55

YOUR COMMENT
You did say you looked inside of the black rubber cover under the right side cover and all looked good.
 
MY RESPONSE
I have had the sidecover off, tested every stankin thing under there with the ohm meter and found that all fuses, and every connection, appears good, there is absolutely no appearance of getting heated up on that connector, all connection points have been CRC contact cleaner sprayed. The only thing at all suspicious is there is a bit of white on the female side of the reddish connector that appears to be dried out di electric grease.  I have checked voltage at the large red wire with a needle probe, it is carrying exactly what the battery is putting out, at the moment of checking, in other words, in a fresh batt situation, it carries 12.6 volts, in cranking, it can get as low as the mid nine volts, just like the battery.

YOUR COMMENT
You did say the fuse in that red connector was good, right?
Did you remove it to check the fuse?     Check it with your meter for best results.

MY RESPONSE,
Every fuse has been pulled, from the 55 amp down thru to the 5 amp, been polished and every fuse has equal to or less than 1.6 ohms resistance when measure with the dvm.   All fuses appearance wise are fine and intact. I do question this, since I know that fuses can look good and be bad.   All connections within the  fuse area have been hosed down with CRC contact cleaner.

[dpcarson]

Curiosity question.  Have you checked the plug wires and ignition coil wires to make sure everything is tight.  Making sure plug wire is seated properly into ignition coil?  Sorry.  really don't have time to read everything that has been posted in last two days.

[R J]

You have not answered my one specific question.

So here it is again.

Under right side cover, black rubber boot, is where the red connector is located.  It has a fuse on the side.

Now the question.    Did you peel this boot back and check these 2 items.   1.   Red connector,     2.  Fuse in this connector.

That is the only fuse I'm interested in right at the moment and also that red connector.

If you have a camera, take a picture of this connector peeled back exposing the connector.      If you know how to post it here, please do so, otherwise send it to me in an email.        Address is:   RJB1448@mchsi.com

Thank you.    Now set down and relax for a few hours.  RJ. 

[zzed28]

You have not answered my one specific question.

So here it is again.

Under right side cover, black rubber boot, is where the red connector is located.  It has a fuse on the side.

Now the question.    Did you peel this boot back and check these 2 items.   1.   Red connector,     2.  Fuse in this connector.

That is the only fuse I'm interested in right at the moment and also that red connector.

If you have a camera, take a picture of this connector peeled back exposing the connector.      If you know how to post it here, please do so, otherwise send it to me in an email.        Address is:   RJB1448@mchsi.com

Thank you.    Now set down and relax for a few hours.  RJ. 

 HI RJ, ONCE AGAIN,,

 I peeled the red thing apart two days ago, and checked every fuse, that also includes the 30 amp that is under that red cover.  After Julie and I get the bike up on the workstand, I will have her take a pic , and send it to your email or post it.  Just in case, I have previously requested as to where I can get one of those connectors, some one posted that they are online for six bux, for the sake of perfection, I will be happy to change that out for a new one, just so I know its perfect, the connector that is there, looks fine, there is no blackening anywhere, there is a bit of white material near the female connector side. I think that is di electric grease.  There is no melt looking thing going on that connector, it does NOT look overheated at all.

[R J]

Before you go changing out parts, lets determine that it is defective 1st.

Otherwise you are just pissing $$$$ down the drain.

[zzed28]

Before you go changing out parts, lets determine that it is defective 1st.

Otherwise you are just pissing $$$$ down the drain.

Ok,,, but it was listed at only six bux.  The red wire on the old one, carries voltage just fine, it had the same volts in it as the battery.  Julie is gonna be here in fifteen mins, so we will get the valk on the stand, and she will get a pic of the connector with her diggie camera and send it to you so you can decide, but it looks fine to me

[zzed28]

RJ,  Your email is rejecting my emailed pix, or so says daemon.

[zzed28]

Hi RJ,
  I tried that email again, it is sending it back from daemon.  It apparently is not existing or working for some reason.  If you know how to post pix here, it would help.

[R J]

I just sent one to me and it worked.

Is this what you are using?

rjb4481@mchsi.com    << just click on this link and it will create a new email for you addressed to me.

To post a picture on here, the picture has to be on the Internet somewhere.

right above the icons on this panel is a series of boxes.

Bottom row, 1st panel, is the one for pictures.

Ya press the box and you get someting similiar to this.

 [ img ] 'picture link here' [ /img ]        Pay attention to the following line of instructions.

the spaces after the [, and before the (img or /img) have to be removed.   I had to add them so it would post a readable picture information.

Paste the picture link over the 'picture link here'.

[zzed28]

Hi RJ ,

Why dont you send me an email, and I will reply with the pix, that might work. My email is zzed28 at yahoo.

I believe that we have incompatible email systems, I do not use the windows email client on my puter, I only use yahoo.  I cannot send an email to your address that you have given me. If you want to set up a yahoo email on the quick, go ahead and let me know what it is.  I am certain that the connector is going to be fine, the pix dont show up well, a bit bleary, but the connector again, shows absolutely no sign of excess heat, or blackening like that other one has. If you want to set up a yahoo account, I will try again to send the pix to you, but that email you have is not working, Ive tried it multiple ways, six times. They are being rejected by daemon.

The good news is, we got the bike up on the stand so it will be much easier for me to do things.

[R J]

Try this email address.

rjb448@gmail.com

[R J]

Starting procedure for now.

Turn gas to the ON position, only use RESERVE if you are very low on fuel.
If reserve is needed, get gas immediately.
Try to park the bike with a full tank of fuel at the end of your ride.   This helps stop RUST in the tank.
I think you said you had a temporary fuel tank if needed.      Well, right now use it.   Hook it up to function.

Engage the enrichener (choke).
When ya hit resistance on the choke, press it down another ½”.
The black knob for the choke should be pointing straight across to the starter button.    If it partially pointing up, PRESS it on down.     You only get the choke in this last ½”.    YES, I know it is HARD to push, but push it anyway till it is pointing straight across.

Hand OFF of the throttle.

When it starts give it 5 seconds and start pushing the choke off.

You refer to a bad petcock.

Fix it if it doesn’t start and then we will proceed on further.

I have the feeling we are just butting up against a brick wall.

[zzed28]

RJ comments,,,
Starting procedure for now.

Turn gas to the ON position, only use RESERVE if you are very low on fuel.
If reserve is needed, get gas immediately.
Try to park the bike with a full tank of fuel at the end of your ride.   This helps stop RUST in the tank.
I think you said you had a temporary fuel tank if needed.      Well, right now use it.   Hook it up to function.

TOMS reply,
I will be hooking the tuning tank up, today or tomorrow, I want to be sure every electric connector is clean first.  I havnt been able to check the grounds at the bottom of the engine til now, since the bike was not on the stand until last night.

RJ states,

Engage the enrichener (choke).
When ya hit resistance on the choke, press it down another ½”.
The black knob for the choke should be pointing straight across to the starter button.    If it partially pointing up, PRESS it on down.     You only get the choke in this last ½”.    YES, I know it is HARD to push, but push it anyway till it is pointing straight across.

TOMS reply,,

Ok, this is what I have been doing, the choke is pointing properly straight across when I try to start, just like all winter. Yes there is resistance in the last half inch, I always push it as far as it can go. I am actually afraid of breaking something its pushed so hard.

RJ states,

Hand OFF of the throttle.

When it starts give it 5 seconds and start pushing the choke off.

TOM s reply,

I keep my hands off the throttle, just like all winter, only after it started do I move the throttle to keep it running.  However, during the winter, this bike will NOT keep running if the choke is shut off that early, basically, if idling or under two thou rpm, it needs to be choked for fifteen mins, when on the road, it runs fine after a couple of mins. Keep in mind that yesterday, I discovered all the intake rubber screws were fairly loose, I think there were vac leaks there which may explain this ornery cold idle situation.

RJ states,

You refer to a bad petcock.

Fix it if it doesn’t start and then we will proceed on further.

I have the feeling we are just butting up against a brick wall.

TOM responds,
I know we are gonna get this, I can now feel it in my bones do not be dismayed.
Like I said in the email, the PO trained me wrong on what the petcock positions were sposed to be, I  took the cover off the petcock when I pulled the gas tank, and he had told me , that straight down, is ON, the petcock cover says ON is 45 degrees counterclockwise from reserve as looked at from the left side of the bike.  The petcock did work with the mity vac pump last night on reserve, I will try it on ,,,ON ,,,,today when I drain the rest of that old gas from the gas tank. I think I am good now with the petcock, but just in case, I ordered a K n L repair kit last night for the petcock.

[indybobm]

I am sure that others will chime in here but if the petcock knob is installed correctly, on is straight down, reserve is straight up.

Comparing it to a clock from the left side of the bike:

Reserve = 12:00
Off       =   9:00
On       =   6:00

The knob can be installed wrong. It fits onto a square shaft from the petcock.

[Hook#3287]

Like I said in the email, the PO trained me wrong on what the petcock positions were sposed to be, I  took the cover off the petcock when I pulled the gas tank, and he had told me , that straight down, is ON, the petcock cover says ON is 45 degrees counterclockwise from reserve as looked at from the left side of the bike.

Tom,  your petcock should be positioned this way.  If it'd not, it's installed wrong.

[R J]

Like I said in the email, the PO trained me wrong on what the petcock positions were sposed to be, I  took the cover off the petcock when I pulled the gas tank, and he had told me , that straight down, is ON, the petcock cover says ON is 45 degrees counterclockwise from reserve as looked at from the left side of the bike.

Tom,  your petcock should be positioned this way.  If it'd not, it's installed wrong.

Good point Hook.    Appreciate that notification.   I couldn't say one way or another on the petcock.

Mine has been replaced with an after market petcock many moons ago.    I have a Pingle with a Dan Marc electric cut off.

[Chrisj CMA]

Most bikes will not start if the petcock is in the off position once you use up the gas in the carb bowls.  If not riding and only starting the bike it should take a couple days of such behavior to get the bowls empty.  Once the bowls are empty of gas you have a "weak battery"

[Rio Wil]

the petcock cover says ON is 45 degrees counterclockwise from reserve

I am confused as to what you are calling "ON"....if you are pointing the petcock to the word "fuel" (45 degrees counterclockwise from directly up) , you have probably been drawing fuel from both main and reserve ports and are  simply out of fuel....put some gas in and set the petcock pointing straight down.

[desertrefugee]

I am confused as to what you are calling "ON"....if you are pointing the petcock to the word "fuel" (45 degrees counterclockwise from directly up) , you have probably been drawing fuel from both main and reserve ports and are  simply out of fuel....put some gas in and set the petcock pointing straight down.

Oh, man, I hope this isn't it.  If so, poor zzed (Tom) will slink away in shame and never post here again!   

But...even if this IS the problem, it'll be fixed.   And we MIGHT even let Tom live it down.

Maybe.

...nah.

[Willow]

Truly if you suspect a fuel arrival issue and you know where reserve is, charge the battery, set the petcock on reserve and try to start the bike.  If the tank is low on fuel on is the same as off.  There is, in fact, no reserve tank, but the reserve setting flows from a lower level.

If you have the OEM petcock a vacuum leak from cylinder six could cause the fuel flow to stop.  If you turn open one of the carb drain screws it will tell you whether you have fuel in the bowls.

[zzed28]

Much to my chagrin, you guys AINT right ,,things sure would have been easy around here if you were.  I took another look at the cover for the petcock, turns out , I didnt look real close before, the cover is marked correctly as per youz, and reserve IS at 12 oclock, off is at 9 oclock, and ON is at six oclock, just like you said. 

I ran the mity vac on that petcock yesterday, it works perfectly, so there is no easy answer yet here.  I also checked spark today on all six, they are all sparking apparently fine, this is a change from the last couple days. I checked primary voltage at all the coils and de ox ed them, voltage is fine, and grounds are fine on the coils.

So my latest theory is,, I have to absolutely certain that the grounds to the engine are good, I cant reach them with a tool to pull and polish them, but they check fine with the voltmeter, at 1.6 ohms. And full voltage is running to them from hot.  After I figure out a way to perfect those engine grounds, and make sure there are nothing corroded anywhere else, I suspect maybe the red connector, kuzz RJ thinks it doesnt look right even though, it looks nothing like the melted one on this thread.  There is full batt voltage on each side of the connector on the red wire when the switch is on.  OR,, maybe the starter switch is a problem and will have to be redone, I havnt done that yet kuzz I was skeered of losing some small parts like the man warned me of.  So, no I am embarrassed by the petcock at all, I wish it would have been that it would have been a whole lot easier.  TomSmith, no relation to the famous Bob, that I know of anyway.

[R J]

Okay partner, make sure we got enough gas in the tank to run to #6 carb.

Like Willow said, open a carb drain screw and see if we got gas.

You said we had spark, so if we are getting gas to the carbs that dirty rotten feller ought to as least fire once in awhile, or best of all RUN.

Keep tryin Bro, we will get it going yet.  I hope.

[zzed28]

Hi guys,

 Well the latest chapter in the saga is,,, now the engine will not turn over with the starter, this morning when it was still turning over, I had spark at all the plugs.  So here is what I think may have caused this, I did spray de ox  it at the grounds on the engine block, at the rear of the engine. I am thinking that may have affected the grounds, although, no way it should have.   I also have discovered another ground, that is at the very front top of the engine, near the water pipe exit from the top of the block, this ground is buried so deep, that minimum, the radiator has to come off to test it and clean it up if it needs it.  I think I read on a gold wing list, that this thing can be a problem,,,aaaarrrgggghh.  Its called a mid harness ground in the Honda manual.  So at this point, I am further behind on progress than I was this am.  I dont know what to think, except, I want some time off this job,,hahaa.   

So, my next thing is, does anyone know of a way to actually check with a dvm,, that those grounds are effectively working, since I cant seem to get to them, if there is a way, that would be a boon thats for sure.