Now it is the alternator: Fixed.

[98valk]

. . . he said old batteries can make the alternator work harder and that could be one factor. . . .

Once again, I'm calling BS on this theory. If someone can provide me some mathematical explanation or study, I might reconsider. I might also accept that a defective battery might cause damage to the alternator. I fail to see how the age of a battery can lead to premature failure of an alternator or the alternator brushes.

that is correct. older batteries cause the alternator to work harder more often. a battery on the way out can cause the alt to run hard all of the time during vehicle operation. this is for all vehicle charging systems.

[Harryc]

What defines a battery as being too old to run in a Valkyrie? Assuming a battery is otherwise working fine, when should it be replaced?

[hubcapsc]

What defines a battery as being too old to run in a Valkyrie? Assuming a battery is otherwise working fine, when should it be replaced?

Getting your battery load tested might give an indication. I've read
that a battery should be thought of as an "energy bank", a weakened
or failing battery becomes a load, instead.

-Mike

[98valk]

What defines a battery as being too old to run in a Valkyrie? Assuming a battery is otherwise working fine, when should it be replaced?

just had to change my walmart AGM battery after 8 yrs of use. read 12.5-.7 which indicates still good. when trying to start the voltage would drop to 8.5 volts. engine didn't turn over slow either, just had been hard starting for two wks and then no start. ignition needs minimum 10.5 volts to start and even then it will be hard starting.  I put a bikemaster lith battery in, engine turned over 2 times and immediately started right up. The oem Yuasa didn't act like the walmart battery. started to be hard starting for a few months then just one day it dropped a cell and that was it.

[Jess from VA]

Just for comparison:  I keep my OE Yuasas on Battery Tenders 24/7/365 except while riding.  They last about 8-10 years this way.  As a result, unless particularly cold or after sitting a month or more, my bikes very consistently start (always choked, warm or cold) in one button push.... like one second.  

Now after about 8 years, one bike started taking about three seconds to start (always still on the charger), and a couple times, after 3-5 seconds, you release the starter button and THEN it fires (interstates).  This tells me that battery needs replaced (or will in short order).  I don't have a load tester and don't remove them to get them tested.  After 8 years (or so) I feel like I've gotten my money's worth, and I order another.  (Actually, with two bikes, I always have a new one on hand, with the acid on the side, so there's no shelf life worry)

Even with constant battery tender hookup, you cannot expect one to last forever.  But I figure my system doubles the average battery life.  But I never want to have to pull an alternator (or have a failure out on the road).  So as soon as starting starts taking noticeably longer, even on a green led battery tender 24/7, I replace the battery.  

Now my first bike, with I'm pretty sure the original battery, I immediately started my 24/7 charging and years later, when it started taking longer to start, I wanted to see just how long I could make it last.  It went 11 years, but when I discovered this inevitably leads to alternator overwork, I quit that foolishness.

And here's another telltale sign of a weakening battery.  When you go riding all day, with only short stops for food, pee or leg stretch, most valks should fire right up with a quick button push.  But if after only a 20 minute break, the bike needs to turn over several times before starting...... there's your sign.     (Bad gas, failing petcock, poor tune, vacuum or other issues aside)         

[Harryc]

I like your system Jess (I do basically the same). I have a 3 year old Yuasa on the bike now so we'll see how it goes.

[Savago]

Received the alternator today, it looks good:
https://goo.gl/photos/j4WukKDz3daZGqzc9

I searched on GW forums and people recommend to replace the o-ring by the one from the original alternator.

Anyone here with a LActrical alternator could comment?

[The emperor has no clothes]

Received the alternator today, it looks good:
https://goo.gl/photos/j4WukKDz3daZGqzc9

I searched on GW forums and people recommend to replace the o-ring by the one from the original alternator.

Anyone here with a LActrical alternator could comment?

I'm no expert . But I would go with the one already on it or a new one. I wouldn't put the old one back on. Check the drive nut for proper tightness .

[Chrisj CMA]

What defines a battery as being too old to run in a Valkyrie? Assuming a battery is otherwise working fine, when should it be replaced?

Change every 3-4 years

[Harryc]

What defines a battery as being too old to run in a Valkyrie? Assuming a battery is otherwise working fine, when should it be replaced?

Change every 3-4 years

Sounds like a pretty safe/conservative maintenance plan. Mine is 3 years old and was thinking of getting a replacement after next season.

[98valk]

Wow! since AGM batteries are known to last 8 yrs, because they are designed to last that long, if u two send your 3-4 yr old batteries to me I will never have to buy another battery ever. 

[Harryc]

Wow! since AGM batteries are known to last 8 yrs, because they are designed to last that long, if u two send your 3-4 yr old batteries to me I will never have to buy another battery ever. 

Done. You buy lunch on the next ride though. Lol

[john]

if I may gents ...
a bad battery ground will cause alternator  to fail along
 with the battery and will fry a starter relay..   
 remove and clean both ends of both battery cables
access battery ground (left side
bottom of engine block)up  over the swing arm with 1/4 inch socket and long extension  ...   
is a pain but doable .. do not remove screw .. turn it out but not all the way out  ..
get to the end and turn back to hold cable and spray CRC
this will cost you nothing but a little time
corrosion and crud act as insulators and will not allow
the charging system to function ... a new alternator will not fix this problem
every thing under the right cover should be removed and cleaned also
a visual is not enough .. take it all out .. I use CRC electronic cleaner
I suggest a little dielectric grease on every thing before replacement

[Hook#3287]

Good procedure, product suggestion and advice.

[Hooter]

Bad or dirty connections may cause alternator issues.

[hubcapsc]

Bad or dirty connections may cause alternator issues.

Dielectric grease is a great insulator. It is good for keeping water out
of connections, but bad to put directly on the metal-to-metal business
end of the connection. A dielectric coated connector is a "bad or dirty"
connector.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Silicone_grease#Dielectric_grease

-Mike

[Savago]

Got the job started today, have the older alternator out (it is a Hitachi made in Japan, must assume it is the original):
https://goo.gl/photos/sHSh9jBxVjVjAryc8

Tomorrow I'm planning to have the job completed.

The damage so far:

a) Thanks to my gorilla hands, I was forced to remove the coolant reservoir as also a plate that stays in the middle of the frame (the one that the key will unlock the seat).

b) Managed to crack 2 of the 3 bolts that mount the alternator. I had no idea that they will get stuck in the engine block (only after the fact I searched the forum). I will try an 'easy out' to remove the broken bolts (and for sure will use anti-seize on the new bolts).

[hubcapsc]

a) Thanks to my gorilla hands, I was forced to remove the coolant reservoir as also a plate that stays in the middle of the frame (the one that the key will unlock the seat).


I think the center cover (I guess that is the plate you mention) is
hard to get back in place without scratching or breaking, be careful.

It has the tip-over sensor on the back of it, if you don't put that back
right, your bike will think it is upside down in a ditch and it won't
turn on...

-Mike

[Hook#3287]

a) Thanks to my gorilla hands, I was forced to remove the coolant reservoir as also a plate that stays in the middle of the frame (the one that the key will unlock the seat).


I think the center cover (I guess that is the plate you mention) is
hard to get back in place without scratching or breaking, be careful.

It has the tip-over sensor on the back of it, if you don't put that back
right, your bike will think it is upside down in a ditch and it won't
turn on...

-Mike
 

that sensor has a arrow or the word " up" on it.

[Chrisj CMA]

Got the job started today, have the older alternator out (it is a Hitachi made in Japan, must assume it is the original):
https://goo.gl/photos/sHSh9jBxVjVjAryc8

Tomorrow I'm planning to have the job completed.

The damage so far:

a) Thanks to my gorilla hands, I was forced to remove the coolant reservoir as also a plate that stays in the middle of the frame (the one that the key will unlock the seat).

b) Managed to crack 2 of the 3 bolts that mount the alternator. I had no idea that they will get stuck in the engine block (only after the fact I searched the forum). I will try an 'easy out' to remove the broken bolts (and for sure will use anti-seize on the new bolts).

Wow two out of three broken. Did you warm up the engine before attacking them bolts?  Also, tapping on the socket/extension helps break things free when you have dissimilar metals.

[Savago]

Just to complete the story (and have some sense of closure): I tried to use a dremel, made some progress but couldn't get the the broken bolts free using an easy out.

After the bike was collecting dust for 1 year, I sent it to a Honda Goldwing specialized shop in Fairfield (CA) - Wingnut.

They drilled the two top broken bolts and installed a collar, replacing the alternator. It initially leaked (LActrical alternator has a bad o-ring), but using an original Honda o-ring fixed the leak.

I guess my old lady is back to action.
 

[hoosier jaybird]

I have a high output alternator that MARS sent me. Is it normal for the alternator to put out low voltage at less than about 1500 RPM. At 1000 RPMs about 11 volts. Not till the RPMs get to 1800 will the voltage get to 13 volts. I've had this for a couple years and  don't get into trouble unless getting caught in stop and go traffic and running in a parade is a no-no. When I talked to Ken at MARS it sounded like that may be normal? Next question, the Gold Wing alternator that interchanges with the Valkyrie alternator needs to be "reclocked" but the generic list also said the plastic connection port is different. So what needs to be done with that? Thanks.

[Savago]

My understanding is that the original I/S will start to put out voltage at 900RPM (12.7V).

I'm using a LActrical one ATM and it starts to put out voltage at 1200RPM.

I lack any experience with MARS, but 1800RPM seems a bit too high for me.

How are you measuring the voltage?

[Hef]

My 2000 Standard has 127K miles and I have never had any alternator problems yet. Probably won't touch it until it goes down. I put 186K miles on an 83 Goldwing and never replaced the alternator. Maybe I have just been lucky, don't know.

[hoosier jaybird]

Thanks Savago, I measure voltage across the top of the battery with a voltmeter. One probe on the positive and the other on the negative terminal. My standard alternator that I kept as a spare puts out 13 volt at 1000 RPM and 14.4 at 2000. My question is, do all High Output alternators wait till 12-1500 Rpm to reach at least 12 volts? Is your Lactiral a High output and have you had any issues with it? Also was it a GW 1500 alternator that you put on your Valkyrie? 

[Savago]

@jaybird: initially I had a LActrical, that leaked oil and was replaced by a rebuilt I/S alternator (that then stopped putting out power). Swapped again for the LActrical but this time with a new Honda o-ring and so far it is not leaking (fingers crossed).

Answering the question: yes, it is a HO alternator (85 Amps).

That being said, I'm unsure if all HOs will only kick in with a higher RPM. Anyone else with a HO alternator could comment?

Given all the reports of early failure in LActrical alternators, I think probably the best approach is to buy a Goldwing OEM *new* alternator (350 bucks?) and clock it.

[hoosier jaybird]

Ok thanks Savago, now will anyone have any input about low voltage at under1200 RPM for high output alternators? Also the generic listing for a GW alternator says the plastic connection port is different than for the Valk. Any comment on that? I am aware that the case needs to be rotated for the unit to bolt up. Thanks for your info. Jaybird. 

[98valk]

Ok thanks Savago, now will anyone have any input about low voltage at under1200 RPM for high output alternators? Also the generic listing for a GW alternator says the plastic connection port is different than for the Valk. Any comment on that? I am aware that the case needs to be rotated for the unit to bolt up. Thanks for your info. Jaybird.  

common issue with any HO alt. should always ask to see the alternator output dyno curve chart. for cars/trucks the low voltage is usually compensated by the maker by using a different ratio pulley to increase Alt RPMs at idle speeds. This is what I did when updating the alt. for my F250 7.3L.
 this cannot be done for GL1500s.
don't really see a need for HO as the regulator will only allow what the electrical system needs.

this company is using a different design http://www.ecotechalternators.com/faqs/
Q: Why are most alternators rated at full rather than idle output?

A: Eco-Tech alternators employ new, proprietary, permanent magnet technology to generate 80% of rated output at idle. Most conventional alternators generate only one third of rated output at idle. High idle systems that increase engine RPM solely to increase alternator output have been the common solution to claw pole alternators’ inability to generate needed electrical power at idle.

[98valk]

more info

http://nationsautoelectric.com/highampinfo.html

[hoosier jaybird]

Thanks Vaquero, interesting reading. I may just stick with the standard 40 amp alternator. It would have been nice to know those high outputs would act that way. Puts you into a panic when the voltmeter keeps dropping down. Running through a GWRRA parking lot training course at slow speeds the girl pooped out. Irritating it was. I had to get a jump then run fast laps off to the side to build her back up. Parades are impossible. Jaybird.   

[98valk]

Thanks Vaquero, interesting reading. I may just stick with the standard 40 amp alternator. It would have been nice to know those high outputs would act that way. Puts you into a panic when the voltmeter keeps dropping down. Running through a GWRRA parking lot training course at slow speeds the girl pooped out. Irritating it was. I had to get a jump then run fast laps off to the side to build her back up. Parades are impossible. Jaybird.   

in case u haven't seen this http://www.rattlebars.com/valkfaq/#ELECTRICS

and was talking to a local alt rebuilder, he's been doing it for 40 yrs, he told just about all stators are wound overseas now. very, very few guys left in the USA who do it.