Front Forks and Progressive Springs

[Steve K (IA)]

Been trying to figure out why my I/S has ridden like a lumber truck ever since having these things installed.  I think I had them installed in 2001 at less than 5000 miles.  When I picked up the bike after the install I noticed the front was close to 2 inches taller. 
I replaced the seals and bushings 6 years ago and with all this in mind, I went with a lighter oil and 1oz less per side.  Still rides worse than my 4x4 truck.
Just throwing this out there as I have no idea.  Could there be too much air trapped in the forks.  When I done the seals, I tightened the top caps when the tubes were fully extended.  Looked in the manual and it's not clear on this...a least I haven't seen it addressed.
I'm wondering if I put the jack under it and jack it up just to the point where the bike is sitting straight and crack open the top caps letting any excess air out and then re-tighten.
I also had a '97 from 2004 until last year.  It rode like a Cadillac.  And as far as I knew, the front end hadn't been messed with.

Anyone have an idea?

[hubcapsc]

Anyone have an idea?

I'm starting to get an idea that there's people out there
taking money for working on forks that should really
have a different job... I've heard stories like yours from
more than one person. I'm no mechanical whiz, but using
the factory service manual I've had my forks apart a
couple of times. After I put in my progressive springs
my bike was anything but a log truck... don't give up,
find a better installer or a factory service manual...

-Mike

[Alberta Patriot]

Race Tech Gold Valve Emulators. Springs alone is not the entire cure.
A 2006 GL1800 Goldwing Rider that I know installed the Emulators and said that the difference was amazing.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j3QYZEQoN_M
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BD6IOJZhP08

[Bagger John - #3785]

Springs
Dampers (Race Tech, Traxxion Dynamics for optimal rebound action)
Proper fork oil weight and volume (per bike and rider weight)
Proper assembly and alignment

These things in the above order all determine overall fork performance.

[h13man]

I used Progressives on a 06' VT1100C Shadow and they started getting soft after 30,000 mi. riding two up 80% of the mileage. As far as oil volume I weighed the both sets of springs and determine the percentage of weight difference and added/subtract oil accordingly. I always use Belray 10w as different brands have different "actual" viscosity rates. I've have Racetech #80 springs in the Valk and they  were a little harsh at first but broke in and have been excellent for a 400 lb. + "payload" riding for 25,000 mi. By my self @ 165 lbs. they seem firm but our Indiana secondary highways are in need of repair but on the IS slabs, awesome. Racetechs are single rate wound springs.

[Gryphon Rider]

Steve K, I think releasing the air with the front end loaded might have the effect of lowering the ride height and softening the suspension a bit, but at the expense of suspension travel.  I think h13man is on the right track to determine how much oil should be used based on comparing the volume of the new spring vs. the old.  In your situation, I wouldn't want to go through all that trouble, but would rather just remove an ounce (or maybe 1/2 oz.) of oil from each side until I got the ride I wanted.

[Steve K (IA)]

Anyone have an idea?

I'm starting to get an idea that there's people out there
taking money for working on forks that should really
have a different job... I've heard stories like yours from
more than one person. I'm no mechanical whiz, but using
the factory service manual I've had my forks apart a
couple of times. After I put in my progressive springs
my bike was anything but a log truck... don't give up,
find a better installer or a factory service manual...

-Mike

Mike,
I've had a Honda Valkyrie Service manual forever.  Just went through the fork section again.  They tell you to screw the cap on and tighten before putting the leg into the tree.  So I'm assuming they have the leg upright on a bench and the assembly would be collapsed.  I know that when I replaced the seals and bushings,  I didn't tighten the caps until the tubes were in the trees and I could use the lower pinch bolts to secure the tubes so I could tighten the caps.  I did this because when I initially slipped the legs out of the tree, I couldn't get the top caps loose because I had no way to hold onto them tight enough, so I put them back into the tree and used the lower pinch bolts to hold the tubes so I could loosen the caps.  So, my fork legs would have been fully extended when I finally tightened the caps.  I'm wondering if that's where I messed up but didn't think I would get the caps tight enough without using the lower tree clamps to hold the tubes tight.
Do you remember when you tightened the caps?  Were the legs compressed or extended? 
Thanks for your help,  Steve

[hubcapsc]

I know that when I replaced the seals and bushings

I apologize for my poor reading skillz..  ... I noticed that you had
the springs installed, but not that you, yourself, replaced the seals and
bushings later...

You mention air... there's a thing I did because I remembered doing it
with the cartridge forks on my motocross bikes in the 80s... I would
fill the cartridge by pumping it until it seemed full of fluid... I wish
I remembered the exact detail now, but with the Valkyrie I think
that after I filled the forks, springs out, until the fluid reached the
specified distance from the tops of the fork legs - I could reach in
there and extend and compress the cartridge. Not violently, such
that fork fluid would squirt out of the orifices like a squirt gun,
but slowly, until the fluid would just come out of the orifices and
drizzle back down into the fork leg, at that point you don't want to
lose any fluid since it is measured already. However I exactly did it, I
filled the cartridge with fluid, and then kept on assembling the
forks as per the manual.

Besides screwing the caps on by hand, I don't remember there
being any way to do the final tightening other than how you did it.
That is, I would assemble the forks all the way before putting them
back in the triple trees, but I wouldn't fully tighten the caps
until I could tighten the bottom fork clamp to hold the forks for me.

I did all this in my plush well-lit workshop using my special tools  ...



Stanley Steamer's Interstate was like a log truck after he got his
Progressive springs, and then he and a buddy redid them and it
was great... so don't give up or submit to harsh forks... Progressive
springs shouldn't make them at all any worse than OEM harshness-wise,
and they should remove unwanted OEM braking dive and acceleration over
extension...

-Mike

[Steve K (IA)]

I know that when I replaced the seals and bushings

I apologize for my poor reading skillz..  ... I noticed that you had
the springs installed, but not that you, yourself, replaced the seals and
bushings later...

You mention air... there's a thing I did because I remembered doing it
with the cartridge forks on my motocross bikes in the 80s... I would
fill the cartridge by pumping it until it seemed full of fluid... I wish
I remembered the exact detail now, but with the Valkyrie I think
that after I filled the forks, springs out, until the fluid reached the
specified distance from the tops of the fork legs - I could reach in
there and extend and compress the cartridge. Not violently, such
that fork fluid would squirt out of the orifices like a squirt gun,
but slowly, until the fluid would just come out of the orifices and
drizzle back down into the fork leg, at that point you don't want to
lose any fluid since it is measured already. However I exactly did it, I
filled the cartridge with fluid, and then kept on assembling the
forks as per the manual.

Besides screwing the caps on by hand, I don't remember there
being any way to do the final tightening other than how you did it.
That is, I would assemble the forks all the way before putting them
back in the triple trees, but I wouldn't fully tighten the caps
until I could tighten the bottom fork clamp to hold the forks for me.

I did all this in my plush well-lit workshop using my special tools  ...



Stanley Steamer's Interstate was like a log truck after he got his
Progressive springs, and then he and a buddy redid them and it
was great... so don't give up or submit to harsh forks... Progressive
springs shouldn't make them at all any worse than OEM harshness-wise,
and they should remove unwanted OEM braking dive and acceleration over
extension...

-Mike

Thanks for sharing.  Yes, the local Honda shop installed the springs.  First, they under bid the job at $80 labor.  Didn't take into account they would have to remove the fairing.  Then during the job, they put a dime size chip in the paint on the fender and had to repaint it.  They were a little agitated, but that was their fault.
I'll be doing this in a 1 stall storage garage with no electricity.  Have to do it on a sunny day.  Summer is slow coming here this year.