Share your wisdom to my first semi teardown of a 2003.

[The emperor has no clothes]

Being as you know your way around machines and equipment. If you can locate a 1500 wing pumpkin (usually from a trike shop) you can press out the center and press it back onto your ring gear. Would likely save you hundreds. You would need a new flange.

[Moofner]

Being as you know your way around machines and equipment. If you can locate a 1500 wing pumpkin (usually from a trike shop) you can press out the center and press it back onto your ring gear. Would likely save you hundreds. You would need a new flange.

I'll try that. Bikebandit is showing a final gear set for $247.95. I can go that route if I don't find a setup from a shop. A new flange also costs $170. The service manual does say the bearings are reusable as long as they pass inspection and aren't loose.

I'm also going to scratch my previous statement on the wheel dampeners. They all look good, but I think it is cheap insurance to replace them if I'm going this far with the rear drive rebuild. $40 dollars at this point to feel a little better about the wheel is worth it.

[..]

Being as you know your way around machines and equipment. If you can locate a 1500 wing pumpkin (usually from a trike shop) you can press out the center and press it back onto your ring gear. Would likely save you hundreds. You would need a new flange.

I'll try that. Bikebandit is showing a final gear set for $247.95. I can go that route if I don't find a setup from a shop. A new flange also costs $170. The service manual does say the bearings are reusable as long as they pass inspection and aren't loose.

I'm also going to scratch my previous statement on the wheel dampeners. They all look good, but I think it is cheap insurance to replace them if I'm going this far with the rear drive rebuild. $40 dollars at this point to feel a little better about the wheel is worth it.

You know to buy the I/S dampeners?

[Jess from VA]

I don't think they've even sold the two-part dampners for a number of years.

[JimC]

I have been watching your thread, and I looked back through it and I did not see any mention of the left side rear bearing mod for the rear wheel?

file:///C:/Users/ooooo/AppData/Local/Temp/5204_bearing_mod.pdf                 (You will have to copy and paste link)

It is common practice to replace the left side rear bearing with the same one used for the right side, because for some reason Honda used a larger bearing on the right. The left bearing is one of the weak spots on a Valkyrie. At the very least, I would replace them with new original style just because you do not know the history of the bike, and you are doing so much work.
It is cheap insurance.

Jim

[Jess from VA]

The good one is double row, and the weak one is single row, and is well documented to fail at a much higher rate than the double row.

Mine did, in Nowhere West Virginia, and caused an entire day of unwanted excitement and adventure.

[Moofner]

I can't find any parts sites showing two part dampeners. I'll also look into the rear bearing mod.

I also purchased a 20 ton press today. I have a feeling I'm going to need it for my baja and future work on vehicles.

Would the rear flange to a 1995 Goldwing work? They look to share the same part number flange from various online parts website schematics.

[gordonv]

Would the rear flange to a 1995 Goldwing work? They look to share the same part number flange from various online parts website schematics.

Yes, 1990-2000 are (should be) the same. Do like you did, and check the fiche.

Pictures are allowed, and welcomed by most, make it easier to follow. A used GW drive could be had for very little $ (I think I paid $30 for my spare).

[Pluggy]

Your 2003 is special.  A GL1500CD has polished wheels and rear drive.  "Good used" rear drive components may not be any better than what you have now.  Also, take a look at the wiring harness.  It is a tight fit, and complicated.  If it ain't broke, leave it alone.  I have had shaft drive Hondas with disc brakes since 1981.  The fluid in the rear master can get gummy and lock up the brake.   Synthetic brake fluid, changed every two years is prevention.

[Jess from VA]

I can't find any parts sites showing two part dampeners. I'll also look into the rear bearing mod.

The two-part (separate rubbers & grommets) were the original parts for 97-8 Valk dampeners.  The '99 Interstate came out with the grommets already secured in the rubbers, and both setups (all three parts) were carried for many years.  [It's probable that all valks sold (regardless of model) in in or after '99 came with the one-parts installed, but I'm not sure.] The one-part dampeners were/are better parts (less susceptible to wear), and cheaper than buying the two-parts setup, and everyone who new this only ever ordered the one-parts.  So the two-part dampeners disappeared as available parts a few years ago.

You don't want them, and you can't get them.   (except maybe used)

The history lessen is complete.  
 

The rear wheel double row bearing mod is on Shoptalk.  All you need is another right side double row bearing, and get your brake side axe spacer machined down shorter to the spec given in the article.

It is my understanding that all brake fluid is synthetic.  But you want Dot 3-4, not 5. 

[The emperor has no clothes]

As to the double row bearing mod. I know many have done it with good reason and results. I've got a total of 200k on two bikes. Both have original bearings. I've been carrying around extra bearings forever. Something to keep in mind , with the double row mod you will not be able to use a seal on that side.

[Forge]

It would be cheap insurance to change the timing belts at this time and inspect the idler pulleys. My 99 Interstate only had 10,700 miles on it when I bought it a year ago and both idler pulleys were slinging grease out the backsides.

I found the belts to be the cheapest on Amazon. You need 2.
Gates T275 Timing Belt https://www.amazon.com/dp/B000CRDMS8/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_i_nYdxCbZYDN4ZY

[98valk]

Your 2003 is special.  A GL1500CD has polished wheels and rear drive.  "Good used" rear drive components may not be any better than what you have now.  Also, take a look at the wiring harness.  It is a tight fit, and complicated.  If it ain't broke, leave it alone.  I have had shaft drive Hondas with disc brakes since 1981.  The fluid in the rear master can get gummy and lock up the brake.   Synthetic brake fluid, changed every two years is prevention.

ALL brake fluid is synthetic.  Use one with the highest wet boiling point.  Dot 4 LV is higher which allows a safe replacement btwn 3-4 yrs, and provides a more constant firm brake feel through a wider range of temps. There are others with even higher WBP but cost goes up.

[indybobm]

I can't find any parts sites showing two part dampeners. I'll also look into the rear bearing mod.

I also purchased a 20 ton press today. I have a feeling I'm going to need it for my baja and future work on vehicles.

Would the rear flange to a 1995 Goldwing work? They look to share the same part number flange from various online parts website schematics.

Yes it will work. Try to find a Goldwing GW1500 Final Drive with the e matching Drive Flange that has been run with it. It will have a matching wear pattern. Can usually pick up the set for $50.00 to $100.00.
Early Goldwings used a 6 finger flange, later ones use a 5 finger flange like the Valkyrie.

[98valk]

Your 2003 is special.  A GL1500CD has polished wheels and rear drive.  "Good used" rear drive components may not be any better than what you have now.  Also, take a look at the wiring harness.  It is a tight fit, and complicated.  If it ain't broke, leave it alone.  I have had shaft drive Hondas with disc brakes since 1981.  The fluid in the rear master can get gummy and lock up the brake.   Synthetic brake fluid, changed every two years is prevention.

ALL brake fluid is synthetic.  Use one with the highest wet boiling point.  Dot 4 LV is higher which allows a safe replacement btwn 3-4 yrs, and provides a more constant firm brake feel through a wider range of temps. There are others with even higher WBP but cost goes up.

Hey, CA.  Is Dot 4 LV the Pentosin product?  Probably the same as the Ford F150 brake fluid that's expensive.  Anyway, there are a few stores that sell "Silicone DOT 5", right next to "Synthetic DOT 4".  Bel-Ray makes them both.  I look for the word "Synthetic"; for me it means "Not silicone"

Ride safe / Pluggy

Pentosin is what I've been using, usually NAPA has it and now PEPBOYS carry it.   DOT 5 is always silicone and nothing else is or can be in the automotive world.    There is a DOT 5.1 for abs similar to the LV, but it is not silicone.

nice chart,  Wet numbers are for street use, dry numbers are strictly used for race track use.
https://www.lelandwest.com/brake-fluid-comparison-chart.cfm

[Moofner]

It would be cheap insurance to change the timing belts at this time and inspect the idler pulleys. My 99 Interstate only had 10,700 miles on it when I bought it a year ago and both idler pulleys were slinging grease out the backsides.

I found the belts to be the cheapest on Amazon. You need 2.
Gates T275 Timing Belt https://www.amazon.com/dp/B000CRDMS8/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_i_nYdxCbZYDN4ZY

I'll add it to the list!

I double checked my rear wheel bearings. They feel smooth with no binding or grinding. I'll skip the bearing mod this time as my list of things to do continues to grow and grow.

[Moofner]

Today's addition to this little adventure required me to build up a hydraulic press.



It was then time to put in the pumpkin case and ring gear to line them up. Immediately noticed I would have enough clearance to separate!


Put in a couple jack stand bars and made some space.


Ring gear popped right out! The bearing looks good and turned smoothly, almost as if it were brand new. I'll have to double check that it isn't loose on the new ring gear but my fingers are crossed that it can still be used.

Now to source a new ring gear setup. The crazy head in me wants to try and remove the spindle/spline hub from the ring gear with the press, but I'm not sure what good it would do in the end.

[RonW]

You're sure doing an amazing amount of work! Just an option for the desmog, I plugged the airbox spout using a ⅛-inch I.D. vacuum cap (Dorman brand). It's not the silicone material thin walled cap. The dome is solid (second pic). Fits tight, ain't going anywhere.

[indybobm]

Now if you use that press to press the hub/drive splines out of a GW1500 riing gear and press it into the Valkyrie ring gear and then use the Valkyrie bearing and bearing spacer you have repaired your final drive.

[indybobm]

Also be advised, if you do purchase a new ring gear/pinion gear from Honda, it does not come with the o-ring holder #10 in the Final Drive fiche.

[Moofner]

Now if you use that press to press the hub/drive splines out of a GW1500 riing gear and press it into the Valkyrie ring gear and then use the Valkyrie bearing and bearing spacer you have repaired your final drive.

I started doing some searching on the forums and ran into a thread showing that Grumpy has done the exact same thing I was thinking of trying. Which model years of the GW are safe to go with? So far I'm thinking 1997-2000?

I'm going to try pressing the spline hub out of the ring gear tonight. A 20 ton press should do it!

[indybobm]

Look for a matched set (final drive and drive flange) from 1990-2001 Goldwing. Earlier goldwinds used a six finger drive flange.

[98valk]

Now if you use that press to press the hub/drive splines out of a GW1500 riing gear and press it into the Valkyrie ring gear and then use the Valkyrie bearing and bearing spacer you have repaired your final drive.

I started doing some searching on the forums and ran into a thread showing that Grumpy has done the exact same thing I was thinking of trying. Which model years of the GW are safe to go with? So far I'm thinking 1997-2000?

I'm going to try pressing the spline hub out of the ring gear tonight. A 20 ton press should do it!

I used a 12 ton press, zero problem. heated up the ring gear some during disassembly.  put the new center in freezer for an hour before installing.

[Moofner]

I have tabs on a 2000 GL1500 entire rear drive (swingarm, shaft, diff, wheel,etc). Working it out now. Didn't get a chance to press the splines from the ring gear last night as I went to bed at 8:00 PM and slept for 12 hours.

The closer I get to 40, the more sleep I seem to need!

[Moofner]

Ta da!

[Moofner]

I have sourced a 2000 1500 Goldwing 12k miles and 1999 1500 Goldwing 33k miles full rear setup for (hopefully) $60. Both include driveshaft, swingarm, rear diff, wheels, and brake assemblies. I should be able to salvage the splines and flange, then press the splines into the Valk ring gear.

[indybobm]

I would recommend using the Valkyrie ring gear bearing and the Valkyrie spacer between the ring gear and bearing. The Goldwing spacers are usually a little thicker than the Valkyrie. This pushes the ring gear closer to the pinion gear and reduces the backlash. I have done five spline swaps and in each case the Goldwing spacer was thicker than the Valkyrie one.

[Moofner]

I would recommend using the Valkyrie ring gear bearing and the Valkyrie spacer between the ring gear and bearing. The Goldwing spacers are usually a little thicker than the Valkyrie. This pushes the ring gear closer to the pinion gear and reduces the backlash. I have done five spline swaps and in each case the Goldwing spacer was thicker than the Valkyrie one.

I plan on using as many parts from the Valk rear drive when it all goes back together. Seals are looking good and I will need to check the bearings against the new spline. I head out tomorrow to pick up 2 complete Goldwing swingarm & final drive assemblies. They should have 2 good spline/flange sets for me to use.... all for $60!

I also found a perfect condition flange for $40 that came in. I'll have enough spare parts in case this ever happens again. Which it won't, because I'll make sure the rear maintenance gets done as long as I own and ride this bike!

[98valk]

I would recommend using the Valkyrie ring gear bearing and the Valkyrie spacer between the ring gear and bearing. The Goldwing spacers are usually a little thicker than the Valkyrie. This pushes the ring gear closer to the pinion gear and reduces the backlash. I have done five spline swaps and in each case the Goldwing spacer was thicker than the Valkyrie one.

I plan on using as many parts from the Valk rear drive when it all goes back together. Seals are looking good and I will need to check the bearings against the new spline. I head out tomorrow to pick up 2 complete Goldwing swingarm & final drive assemblies. They should have 2 good spline/flange sets for me to use.... all for $60!

I also found a perfect condition flange for $40 that came in. I'll have enough spare parts in case this ever happens again. Which it won't, because I'll make sure the rear maintenance gets done as long as I own and ride this bike!

make sure u use the same ring gear spacer, so u don't have to reset the engagement with the pinion.

[Moofner]

Made the trip to Kansas and picked up my parts. $60 for both of these assemblies:



I'll dismantle the one with 12K miles first and see how the flange/splines look!

Here is what I didn't take! Anyone need some earlier model Goldwing bags and parts?
The gentleman in KS is keen to get rid of it all. It might be worth my time to get more of the rear end assemblies between 95-00 for the flanges and splines for our Valkyries. There are still 8 assemblies left that are 5 flange compatible. The rest of the parts could be sold off for cheap.







The owner of the shop was super nice and gave me permission to give his info out to anyone needing some of these parts. PM me if you want his phone number. I'd say today was a rather productive day for me, even if I did drive for over 10 hours today.

[Moofner]

So I'm not sure if anyone is still checking into this thread, but I'm having an absolute blast so I'm not gonna stop!

Today, I cracked into the 2000 GW w/ 12K miles assembly. First thing I noticed when pulling the wheel was that the flange was in excellent condition. A very good sign. I now have 2 good sets of flanges (I got one off ebay in fantastic condition too).



I then got to the business of cracking the rear diff. No issues found and as a bonus, the plastic dust cover is a perfect match to the Valk cover. No need to buy a new one.



I then mic checked the ring gear shims to see how much a difference there was. The larger 2.20 mm value is the Valkyrie. The 2.02 is the GW.




I separated the the ring gear and the splines. This time, the bearing stayed on the splines.


I pressed the splines out of the bearing and compared it to the Valk bearing. There is a little bit more scoring on the Valk bearing interior, which I suspect is from the movement induced in the worn spline/flange issue. These type of bearings never fare well in the aircraft world with sudden start/stop movement pressure, which is a reason we constantly change main landing gear bearings upon rebuild in my profession. I'll be using the 12K bearing along with the splines in the Valk housing.

I then cleaned everything up and checked the splines out. Dang near perfect. The spline shaft is now sitting in the freezer getting chilly for pressing into the Valk's ring gear.



I should be able to assemble everything tonight after I clean up the old sealant from the rear diff housings. Unless something catastrophic happens, I would now say I'm well versed enough to do this job again in the future. I'll now have some spare parts in case it ever happens again!

[98valk]

looking good.

[Moofner]

Annnnnnnd it is done. I cleaned up a lot of the casing plate and bearing housing. I then prepared to press the lesser mileage bearing in.



Then I worked the ring gear and spline set. Took the splines from the freezer and they mated smoothly.



Lubed up the oil seal, used the Valk spacer 2.20 mm (book shows it on the higher end, 2.0 mm is the standard), and pressed everything together. I then checked the deck height of the ring gear to the stop spacer, .012 inch as called for in the book.



I did a preliminary check torque down on the 2 halves and everything snugged up nicely. I don't have any Prussian Blue to do a mate check but some residual oil markings from the pinion gear on the ring gear looked good after about 4 spins. I'll clean and seal up the mating surfaces tomorrow to finalize the  job.

I think I could do this job in the future for forum members if needed!

[Jess from VA]

Very nice work.   

I don't suppose you can fix up my old Seiko watch guts in a real Rolex housing/and band for me?   

They were called Foolex's.  Really a nice looking & working watch, until it quit.

A real Rolex crystal lens cost more than the watch did in Tijuana.

[The emperor has no clothes]

Excellent work ! Thanks for documenting it with pics. 

[Moofner]

Very nice work.   

I don't suppose you can fix up my old Seiko watch guts in a real Rolex housing/and band for me?   

They were called Foolex's.  Really a nice looking & working watch, until it quit.

A real Rolex crystal lens cost more than the watch did in Tijuana.

Thanks, this has been a super fun project.

I'm going to have to pass on watch work. I just don't have .............. "the time".

I'll be here all week ladies and gentlemen.

[mello dude]

Great work dude. ..... I chuckle when I read your thread title... Semi Teardown...  --- I think you mean Total Teardown.

[..]

I'm watching.

[Lyle Laun]

Great work and great post Moofner ! No doubt you could do well if you had a supply of rebuilt pumpkins for sale.

Is the engine desmogged ? Looks like now is the time to do it if the carbs and mufflers are off

Regards
Lyle

[Moofner]

Great work and great post Moofner ! No doubt you could do well if you had a supply of rebuilt pumpkins for sale.

Is the engine desmogged ? Looks like now is the time to do it if the carbs and mufflers are off

Regards
Lyle

Engine is now desmogged. I did it while I have the carbs pulled. I still need to install the exhaust gaskets and covers to finish it up.

I have access to at least 21 more pumpkins if I wanted... just not sure where I would put them all to do the work. Or if there is enough demand for flange/spline combos to make it worth it. The seller in KS is very keen to sell them to me or go halves on getting them out to other people. The problem is that I wouldn't know the condition until I pulled the wheels.

I did decide to take a part the second assembly I picked up. It is a 99 model with 33K miles. The flange came out looking like a champion. No spline wear that I can see.



The pumpkin splines look pretty good too. My eyes picked up a slight wear but nothing that I would have a problem with. No discernible clunk movement like the set I replaced on my Valkyrie. I'd be comfortable with installing these in another assembly.

Fun fact: I have been told that I have about 30% more rods and cones in my eyes than the average man. This allows me to see blue and green ranges better than most guys. I'm by no means a tetrachromat (women only), but it does allow me to see a wider range of color shades. This, coupled with my severe nearsightedness (glasses correctable and no other eye conditions), allows me to see exceptionally well close to my face and spot flaws in surfaces. I've used this to my advantage as an aircraft mechanic.




So I would say I'm winning for the $60 I paid, the drive time, and the time spent doing the work itself. Much better than the $170 flange and $270 ring gear new prices I would have paid.

Side note question:
Are these the two piece rubber dampeners that were mentioned? The left side was pulled from the 2000 GW wheel. They look two piece-ish. The right side are my Valkyrie dampeners I pulled from my wheel and are clearly one piece molds. The GW ones look to be in much better condition (they should with only 12k miles!).