libertarians let a dem take over kentucky

[98valk]

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/2019-general-elections/kentucky-results


thought I read also they caused Trump to lose one or two states.  Their votes are always wasted. They need to learn a Republican is the closest they will get to a libertarian views.

[Serk]

Libertarians didn't "let" a democrat win.... Republicans didn't entice enough libertarians to vote for them.

[scooperhsd]

Maybe you need to learn that sometimes a 3rd party vote is the best thing possible when both major parties are failures to your viewpoints....

[Pappy!]

^^^^ And that, ladies and gentlemen, is what free speech is all about!

[98valk]

Libertarians didn't "let" a democrat win.... Republicans didn't entice enough libertarians to vote for them.

voting for a libertarian that has zero chance of winning is insane esp when it allows a dem whose views are even farther away from libert views than a repubs views which are closer.

watching districts in NJ. a few if the independents put their vote to the repub the repub whould have won over the dem.

“Insanity is doing the same thing, over and over again, but expecting different results.”

― Narcotics Anonymous

[Serk]

“Insanity is doing the same thing, over and over again, but expecting different results.”

...the same could be said about voting for a Republican hoping they'll respect your libertarian values too.....

If Republicans want to entice libertarian voters, then they need to start seriously espousing libertarian values.....

[Pluggy]

This happens.  Ross Perot got enough votes to put Bill Clinton in the White House.  The consensus of experts was most Perot votes would have been Bush votes if Ross would have not been on the ballot.

[The emperor has no clothes]

This happens.  Ross Perot got enough votes to put Bill Clinton in the White House.  The consensus of experts was most Perot votes would have been Bush votes if Ross would have not been on the ballot.

It does. Hillary Clinton would likely be president were it not for the Green candidate Jill Stein.

(Figured that would make the conservatives feel a little better with that info) 

[Rams]

This happens.  Ross Perot got enough votes to put Bill Clinton in the White House.  The consensus of experts was most Perot votes would have been Bush votes if Ross would have not been on the ballot.

It does. Hillary Clinton would likely be president were it not for the Green candidate Jill Stein.

(Figured that would make the conservatives feel a little better with that info) 

Who??

[98valk]

This happens.  Ross Perot got enough votes to put Bill Clinton in the White House.  The consensus of experts was most Perot votes would have been Bush votes if Ross would have not been on the ballot.

It does. Hillary Clinton would likely be president were it not for the Green candidate Jill Stein.

(Figured that would make the conservatives feel a little better with that info) 

actually there were a few states that if libertarians voted for Trump, he would have won those states.

[f6john]

I voted for Matt Bevin because I refuse to even consider a Democrat given the party’s current platform. Yes the libertarian vote was much greater than the margin between the two candidates but don’t be fooled, Bevin was his own worst enemy. His policies toward teachers and education lost his more than enough votes to lose the election. My wife, a retired educator, held her nose and voted for Bevin because she won’t support a Democrat either.

The Democratic machine is alive and well in Kentucky and Andy’s dad having been a previous Governor gave him all the “right contacts”. I’m not losing any sleep over the election as neither candidate was great. Republicans need better candidates and for Kentucky they need to be home grown not from the northeast.

[Jess from VA]

Exceedingly bad news here in VA.

https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2019/11/5/20944109/virginia-elections-legislature-results-democrats

[F6Dave]

I would think some of the people who voted for Jill Stein now regret helping to elect Donald Trump!

People who vote for third party candidates don't seem to understand how our system works.  We have a two party system, period.  You have a binary choice, like a ballot issue where you can vote YES or NO.  If you try to write in MAYBE, your vote doesn't count.  If you vote for a third party candidate, you might as well write in MAYBE.

Party is much more important than a candidate's personality or policy positions.  In fact, in congress (and most state legislatures) party counts for everything.  That's because the party with even a single seat majority will control and chair every committee in the House or Senate.  Control of the committees is critical, since they decide which bills will even make it to the floor for a vote.  They also get to investigate anything they want!

Personally I have a lot of libertarian views.  But I realize I only have two real choices on the ballot.  If I don't like either party my only option is to join the one I agree with the most, and try to change them from within.

[98valk]

I would think some of the people who voted for Jill Stein now regret helping to elect Donald Trump!

People who vote for third party candidates don't seem to understand how our system works.  We have a two party system, period.  You have a binary choice, like a ballot issue where you can vote YES or NO.  If you try to write in MAYBE, your vote doesn't count.  If you vote for a third party candidate, you might as well write in MAYBE.

Party is much more important than a candidate's personality or policy positions.  In fact, in congress (and most state legislatures) party counts for everything.  That's because the party with even a single seat majority will control and chair every committee in the House or Senate.  Control of the committees is critical, since they decide which bills will even make it to the floor for a vote.  They also get to investigate anything they want!

Personally I have a lot of libertarian views.  But I realize I only have two real choices on the ballot.  If I don't like either party my only option is to join the one I agree with the most, and try to change them from within.

great post 

[Jess from VA]

You got it exactly right Dave.

You must support the side that will go your way more than the other (holding your nose or not), that has an actual chance to will (and not a snowball's chance).

Voting your conscious for 3d parties is a wasted vote, and generally a vote for the wrong side.

I don't like it any more than anyone, but that's the way it is.

The only exception is for exceeding local votes for low level government positions where the luxury of voting you conscious probably doesn't shoot you in the foot.

Ross Perot would have made a fine president, maybe the best in 100 years, but my vote for him helped elect Bill Clinton.  Never again.    

[Alpha Dog]

This happens.  Ross Perot got enough votes to put Bill Clinton in the White House.  The consensus of experts was most Perot votes would have been Bush votes if Ross would have not been on the ballot.

It does. Hillary Clinton would likely be president were it not for the Green candidate Jill Stein.

(Figured that would make the conservatives feel a little better with that info) 

actually there were a few states that if libertarians voted for Trump, he would have won those states.

Stein got 1.5 million votes.  Gary Johnson got 5 million, the vast majority who mostly would have voted Trump.

[scooperhsd]

No - you better check that again - the reason the wife and me BOTH voted Liberterian is that neither Trump NOR Hilary were acceptable as President.

[scooperhsd]

Exceedingly bad news here in VA.

https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2019/11/5/20944109/virginia-elections-legislature-results-democrats

Considering how badly racial gerrymandered some of your districts were, is it any surprise when those districts got redrawn to be "more fair" ?

[The emperor has no clothes]

This happens.  Ross Perot got enough votes to put Bill Clinton in the White House.  The consensus of experts was most Perot votes would have been Bush votes if Ross would have not been on the ballot.

It does. Hillary Clinton would likely be president were it not for the Green candidate Jill Stein.

(Figured that would make the conservatives feel a little better with that info) 

actually there were a few states that if libertarians voted for Trump, he would have won those states.

Stein got 1.5 million votes.  Gary Johnson got 5 million, the vast majority who mostly would have voted Trump.

Maybe. It’s an Electoral College system. Total votes mean squat, (just ask Hillary). The Midwest states that narrowly swung for Trump made the difference in this respect. As to if Gary Johnson voters would have voted for Trump, highly doubtful. Most were a protest vote against both Clinton and Trump. A more likely scenario would be they just would have skipped the vote all together.

The results are the results regardless. Personally I find it repugnant to think we shouldn’t vote with our conscience. We will never reform the system unless we do. Besides, what happened in 2016 is irrelevant now, what happens in 2020 is what matters now.

[G-Man]

Exceedingly bad news here in VA.

https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2019/11/5/20944109/virginia-elections-legislature-results-democrats

And the black faced guy who thinks infanticide is an OK discussion to have after birth is still running the whole show.

What the heck happened to that once great state?

[G-Man]

I would think some of the people who voted for Jill Stein now regret helping to elect Donald Trump!

People who vote for third party candidates don't seem to understand how our system works.  We have a two party system, period.  You have a binary choice, like a ballot issue where you can vote YES or NO.  If you try to write in MAYBE, your vote doesn't count.  If you vote for a third party candidate, you might as well write in MAYBE.

Party is much more important than a candidate's personality or policy positions.  In fact, in congress (and most state legislatures) party counts for everything.  That's because the party with even a single seat majority will control and chair every committee in the House or Senate.  Control of the committees is critical, since they decide which bills will even make it to the floor for a vote.  They also get to investigate anything they want!

Personally I have a lot of libertarian views.  But I realize I only have two real choices on the ballot.  If I don't like either party my only option is to join the one I agree with the most, and try to change them from within.

great post 

 

[scooperhsd]

Exceedingly bad news here in VA.

https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2019/11/5/20944109/virginia-elections-legislature-results-democrats

And the black faced guy who thinks infanticide is an OK discussion to have after birth is still running the whole show.

What the heck happened to that once great state?

Northern VA (anywhere north of Richmond, maybe Fredricksburg instead) is dominated by Democrats. That's also the most heavily populated area. Out to the south and southwest is pretty rural, and Norfolk / Hampton Roads / Virginia Beach is pretty urban (democrat).

[Savago]

What if, maybe, just maybe GOP & Trump tried for once to reach out to the other side, stop the speech of 'us against them' and had an agenda that wasn't unpopular (e.g. tax breaks only for the rich and snuggle the middle class, throwing away environment protections set in place back in the 70's, subverting government agencies for profit, giving public lands to the oil industry, etc)?

Nah... non-sense.

Let's just blame it all on those pesky immigrants and when we loose the election claim it was unfair.
 

[Willow]

...
Let's just blame it all on those pesky immigrants and when we loose the election claim it was unfair.
 

I'm good with your plan but I hope we don't lose (one o) the election to need it in the near future.

[MAD6Gun]

What if, maybe, just maybe GOP & Trump tried for once to reach out to the other side, stop the speech of 'us against them' and had an agenda that wasn't unpopular (e.g. tax breaks only for the rich and snuggle the middle class, throwing away environment protections set in place back in the 70's, subverting government agencies for profit, giving public lands to the oil industry, etc)?

Nah... non-sense.

Let's just blame it all on those pesky immigrants and when we loose the election claim it was unfair.
 

 OK how is your 401K and or retirement plan doing? Mine is up, my brothers is way up, even my liberal brother in law admits his is up since Trump took office. So tell me again how his tax plan isn't helping the middle class? You need to open your eyes and stop listening to the Trump hating media.

[Savago]

OK how is your 401K and or retirement plan doing? Mine is up, my brothers is way up, even my liberal brother in law admits his is up since Trump took office. So tell me again how his tax plan isn't helping the middle class? You need to open your eyes and stop listening to the Trump hating media.

Since you asked:
a) Concerning 401k: Only now the losses of last December were recovered. Losses that were a result of bad economy policy (trade wars with everyone) plus the government shutdown (i.e. who will invest in a country that has no government).

b) Tax: if you live in NY/CA/etc and have a middle class wage, you end up paying more in taxes after the so 'called reform'. Now it may be different what is considered a middle class wage depending on where you live. In the SF Bay Area, anyone making less than 117K/year is officially poor.

[signart]

Here's the trouble. Maybe time for an electoral college.

[Jess from VA]

The federal G should not give (unlimited) credit to taxpayers to write off the exorbitant state taxes on their federal returns in those states which soak their taxpayers.

If it does, it forces the taxpayers in more reasonable tax states to underwrite the (leftist) tax and spend states by paying a greater percentage of federal tax revenue.

If you want relief from exorbitant state taxes go after your own state governments, don't ask the rest of us to help enable, legitimize (and underwrite) those tax and spend states.

If liberals vote those tax and spend politicians into state office, they should pick up their own tab for it.  

[98valk]

This happens.  Ross Perot got enough votes to put Bill Clinton in the White House.  The consensus of experts was most Perot votes would have been Bush votes if Ross would have not been on the ballot.

It does. Hillary Clinton would likely be president were it not for the Green candidate Jill Stein.

(Figured that would make the conservatives feel a little better with that info) 

actually there were a few states that if libertarians voted for Trump, he would have won those states.

Stein got 1.5 million votes.  Gary Johnson got 5 million, the vast majority who mostly would have voted Trump.

Personally I find it repugnant to think we shouldn’t vote with our conscience. We will never reform the system unless we do. Besides, what happened in 2016 is irrelevant now, what happens in 2020 is what matters now.

many times your conscience is your emotions. peoples emotions will lie to them most of the time.

if u don't learn the mistakes from history you are bound to repeat those same mistakes.

[RDAbull]

Libertarians didn't "let" a democrat win.... Republicans didn't entice enough libertarians to vote for them.

First let me say that I am considerably more Libertarian than Republican:
You are absolutely right Brian, but now both the Libertarians and the Republicans have to live with the result for the next four years.  Being right is not always being smart.

[..]

Trump bad
Dems are trying to meet in the middle ground and help America.
Oil industry bad, gas prices need to be higher due to less oil production.



Such a load of bollocks from brain washed fools.



What have the Dems done since the first day of screaming IMPEACHMENT 3 YEARS AGO to help the average tax paying citizen of the USA?

[scooperhsd]

I would think some of the people who voted for Jill Stein now regret helping to elect Donald Trump!

People who vote for third party candidates don't seem to understand how our system works.  We have a two party system, period.  You have a binary choice, like a ballot issue where you can vote YES or NO.  If you try to write in MAYBE, your vote doesn't count.  If you vote for a third party candidate, you might as well write in MAYBE.

Party is much more important than a candidate's personality or policy positions.  In fact, in congress (and most state legislatures) party counts for everything.  That's because the party with even a single seat majority will control and chair every committee in the House or Senate.  Control of the committees is critical, since they decide which bills will even make it to the floor for a vote.  They also get to investigate anything they want!

Personally I have a lot of libertarian views.  But I realize I only have two real choices on the ballot.  If I don't like either party my only option is to join the one I agree with the most, and try to change them from within.

COntrary to your assertion - we do understand THAT IN PRACTICALITY we have a 2 party system. The Constituition is silent about political parties, and in fact George Washington warned the nation about them on his exit speech as President. SOmetimes you have to vote your concious even of the net effect is that it doesn't get counted.

Now - even with the 2 parties - there are some districts that are so overwhelmingly one or the other that the winner of the primary (a party race) is essentially the elected person. In such a case, anyone not of the majority party essentially has no vote. How do you propose to solve THAT problem ?

[Jess from VA]

I would think some of the people who voted for Jill Stein now regret helping to elect Donald Trump!

People who vote for third party candidates don't seem to understand how our system works.  We have a two party system, period.  You have a binary choice, like a ballot issue where you can vote YES or NO.  If you try to write in MAYBE, your vote doesn't count.  If you vote for a third party candidate, you might as well write in MAYBE.

Party is much more important than a candidate's personality or policy positions.  In fact, in congress (and most state legislatures) party counts for everything.  That's because the party with even a single seat majority will control and chair every committee in the House or Senate.  Control of the committees is critical, since they decide which bills will even make it to the floor for a vote.  They also get to investigate anything they want!

Personally I have a lot of libertarian views.  But I realize I only have two real choices on the ballot.  If I don't like either party my only option is to join the one I agree with the most, and try to change them from within.

COntrary to your assertion - we do understand THAT IN PRACTICALITY we have a 2 party system. The Constituition is silent about political parties, and in fact George Washington warned the nation about them on his exit speech as President. SOmetimes you have to vote your concious even of the net effect is that it doesn't get counted.

Now - even with the 2 parties - there are some districts that are so overwhelmingly one or the other that the winner of the primary (a party race) is essentially the elected person. In such a case, anyone not of the majority party essentially has no vote. How do you propose to solve THAT problem ?

That is exactly the case in my local district, and for some county offices.  Not only is no Republican on the ballot (only an unopposed Democrat), the Republican party will not even look for a candidate or contribute any money if one does run.

So this is what I do.  My ballot has a spot for a write-in, so I write in The Easter Bunny.

I voted for him three times Tuesday.  

[Serk]

So, sane Virginians, ready to vote with your feet and move yet? 

"Virginia Gov. Ralph Northam (D) says he will reintroduce gun control measures in the upcoming legislative sessions now that Democrats have taken control of the state legislature.

"Getting rid of bump stocks, high volume magazines, red flag laws… These are common-sense pieces of legislation. I will introduce those again in January. And I'm convinced, with the majority now in the House and the Senate, they'll become law and because of that, Virginia will be safer."

Northam has also called for a ban on "assault weapons", a ban on suppressors, a limit on the number of firearms people can buy, expanded background checks, and increased age requirements, among other things.

Democrats took control of the Virginia House and Senate on Tuesday for the first time in more than 20 years. Northam and Democrats will now have the ability to pass strict gun control laws that Republicans have opposed.

Northam said today that Virginia residents have "had enough" of gun violence, and that sentiment was a contributing factor to the Democrats' victories. "People spoke yesterday.""

[Jess from VA]

The man wouldn't know common sense if it bit him in the ass.

I would like to stay in my home of 27 years.

I will wait and see just how bad it gets.

The NRA lives here, and I expect some high end litigation.

I will move if I have to.

SH!T!

[98valk]

the governor who wants to kill babies after they are born and did black face.

if it was a republican gov who said and did that.......

[98valk]

The man wouldn't know common sense if it bit him in the ass.

I would like to stay in my home of 27 years.

I will wait and see just how bad it gets.

The NRA lives here, and I expect some high end litigation.

I will move if I have to.

SH!T!

https://www.kiplinger.com/tool/retirement/T055-S001-state-by-state-guide-to-taxes-on-retirees/index.php

[98valk]

So, sane Virginians, ready to vote with your feet and move yet?  :'(

"Virginia Gov. Ralph Northam (D) says he will reintroduce gun control measures in the upcoming legislative sessions now that Democrats have taken control of the state legislature.

"Getting rid of bump stocks, high volume magazines, red flag laws… These are common-sense pieces of legislation. I will introduce those again in January. And I'm convinced, with the majority now in the House and the Senate, they'll become law and because of that, Virginia will be safer."

Northam has also called for a ban on "assault weapons", a ban on suppressors, a limit on the number of firearms people can buy, expanded background checks, and increased age requirements, among other things.

Democrats took control of the Virginia House and Senate on Tuesday for the first time in more than 20 years. Northam and Democrats will now have the ability to pass strict gun control laws that Republicans have opposed.

Northam said today that Virginia residents have "had enough" of gun violence, and that sentiment was a contributing factor to the Democrats' victories. "People spoke yesterday.""

democrats are UN Fifth column members hell bent on destroying american. they are implementing UN 2030 Agenda.
Goal 11) Make cities and human settlements inclusive, safe, resilient and sustainable

Translation: Ban all gun ownership by private citizens, concentrating guns into the hands of obedient government enforcers who rule over an unarmed, enslaved class of impoverished workers. Criminalize living in most rural areas by instituting Hunger Games-style "protected areas" which the government will claim are owned by "the People" even though no people are allowed to live there. Force all humans into densely packed, tightly controlled cities where they are under 24/7 surveillance and subject to easy manipulation by government.

That article references this UN "2030 Agenda" document that pushes a blueprint for so-called "sustainable development" around the world.

This document describes nothing less than a global government takeover of every nation across the planet. The "goals" of this document are nothing more than code words for a corporate-government fascist agenda that will imprison humanity in a devastating cycle of poverty while enriching the world's most powerful globalist corporations like Monsanto and DuPont.

In the interests of helping wake up humanity, I've decided to translate the 17 points of this 2030 agenda so that readers everywhere can understand what this document is really calling for. To perform this translation, you have to understand how globalists disguise their monopolistic agendas in "feel good" language.

Here's the point-by-point translation. Notice carefully that nowhere does this document state that "achieving human freedom" is one of its goals. Nor does it explain HOW these goals are to be achieved. As you'll see here, every single point in this UN agenda is to be achieved through centralized government control and totalitarian mandates that resemble communism.

Total enslavement of the planet by 2030
As the UN document says, "We commit ourselves to working tirelessly for the full implementation of this Agenda by 2030."

If you read the full document and can read beyond the fluffery and public relations phrases, you'll quickly realize that this UN agenda is going to be forced upon all the citizens of the world through the invocation of government coercion. Nowhere does this document state that the rights of the individual will be protected. Nor does it even acknowledge the existence of human rights granted to individuals by the Creator. Even the so-called "Universal Declaration of Human Rights" utterly denies individuals the right to self defense, the right to medical choice and the right to parental control over their own children.

The UN is planning nothing less than a global government tyranny that enslaves all of humanity while calling the scheme "sustainable development" and "equality."

https://www.naturalnews.com/051058_2030_Agenda_United_Nations_global_enslavement.html

http://endoftheamericandream.com/archives/the-2030-agenda-this-month-the-un-launches-a-blueprint-for-a-new-world-order-with-the-help-of-the-pope

[Serk]

..... I'm so looking forward to moving out to my land..... It's in Ellis County.....

https://www.fox4news.com/news/commissioners-vote-unanimously-to-make-ellis-county-second-amendment-sanctuary-county

[baldo]

the governor who wants to kill babies after they are born and did black face.

if it was a republican gov who said and did that.......

How in the hell can you possibly believe that bullshit?

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trump-northam-abortion-execute/