masks a feel good thing but not science

[98valk]

not needed unless of course you a rioter and looter. who pushed for these masks to be worn? was it the the group that want chaos? it all seems like such perfect timing.

https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2020/05/29/nolte-the-science-turns-against-americas-mask-fascists/

No less than the New England Journal of Medicine has dealt a body blow to America’s growing army of mask fascists with the news that “wearing a mask outside health care facilities offers little, if any, protection from infection.”

The reasons for this are both simple and logical:

    We know that wearing a mask outside health care facilities offers little, if any, protection from infection. Public health authorities define a significant exposure to Covid-19 as face-to-face contact within 6 feet with a patient with symptomatic Covid-19 that is sustained for at least a few minutes (and some say more than 10 minutes or even 30 minutes). The chance of catching Covid-19 from a passing interaction in a public space is therefore minimal. In many cases, the desire for widespread masking is a reflexive reaction to anxiety over the pandemic.

So there you go… The only real way to catch the China Flu is to hang out with someone infectious for a protracted period of time, so it’s unlikely you will catch it walking along somewhere, like a store or sidewalk.

[scooperhsd]

Yep - the only logical reason to wear a mask in public is IF you're contagious, and HAVE to get essential supplies. If you ARE contagious - stay home otherwise.

[..]

It's always helpful to use a confirmed original source rather than a 3rd party quote.

I did a quick search and find nothing from the Journal.

[carolinarider09]

I did a search and found this

Universal Masking in Hospitals in the Covid-19 Era

Editor’s Note: This article was published on April 1, 2020, at NEJM.org. (The date is amusing).

https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMp2006372

I have not read it in its entirety.  But this is a quote from the first part of the article.

We know that wearing a mask outside health care facilities offers little, if any, protection from infection. Public health authorities define a significant exposure to Covid-19 as face-to-face contact within 6 feet with a patient with symptomatic Covid-19 that is sustained for at least a few minutes (and some say more than 10 minutes or even 30 minutes). The chance of catching Covid-19 from a passing interaction in a public space is therefore minimal. In many cases, the desire for widespread masking is a reflexive reaction to anxiety over the pandemic.

[..]

I did a search and found this

Universal Masking in Hospitals in the Covid-19 Era

Editor’s Note: This article was published on April 1, 2020, at NEJM.org. (The date is amusing).

https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMp2006372

I have not read it in its entirety.  But this is a quote from the first part of the article.

We know that wearing a mask outside health care facilities offers little, if any, protection from infection. Public health authorities define a significant exposure to Covid-19 as face-to-face contact within 6 feet with a patient with symptomatic Covid-19 that is sustained for at least a few minutes (and some say more than 10 minutes or even 30 minutes). The chance of catching Covid-19 from a passing interaction in a public space is therefore minimal. In many cases, the desire for widespread masking is a reflexive reaction to anxiety over the pandemic.

 

[Valkorado]

I've worn an n95 a few times in high traffic stores.  It didn't make me feel particularly good.

[Moonshot_1]

I'm not quoting any "scientific studies" or have any specific evidence derived from them. Just some questions, applications of logic, and basic understanding of biology and physics 101.

I have always been wary of the policy of having the general public in the general public environment wearing masks for mitigation of this, or any virus.

First issue is that it would seem to have the same basic effect of wearing a typical swimsuit to protect yourself from others peeing in the pool. You can actually get swimsuits that would do that but not your typical swimsuit and the public is wearing some typical stuff as masks go.

Add to that the fact that wearing the mask for hours a day in an uncontrolled environment can lead to serious bacterial infections. You are basically wearing a warm, moist, petri dish on your face. If you are healthy, you won't be after you do this for days on end. This is pretty much Biology 101 here. I don't think it is common practice to clean or change your mask after restroom use. You just concentrate the bacteria, hour after hour, in your mask and breath it right back in.

Mask use in a strictly controlled and sterile environments is vital. But we don't live day to day in such environments.

But contemplating this even more, we are told that we need to wear masks in case we are infected and contagious so we don't spread the virus.

Seems logical. But is it?

A person unknowingly is infected and becomes wildly contagious. No significant symptoms but the person is wearing a mask. We can suppose that wearing the mask would mitigate the spread.

But if the person is contagious and the wearing of the mask mitigates the spread, how does the mask do that? Where do the contagions go?

The person breathes them right back in. Basically re-doses them self with the virus with every breath. Without the mask the virus is expelled from the person out into the air. But with the mask the virus is simply concentrated on the inside of their mask. When you wear a mask you always inhale the end of your previous breath. If you are contagious you are re-dosing yourself with each breath.

Leads me to wonder at why we see such a broad spectrum of this disease. Are we masking the residents in nursing homes 24/7 and when the virus infects these folks they are just dosing and dosing themselves with the virus till they just get so sick they die? Same for other people with health issues. They become contagious and wind up recirculating the virus to themselves. They can't get better. The mask use won't let their body rid itself of the contagion naturally.

Then we see folks who test positive and didn't have a clue they had it. I'd like to see their history of mask use.

I'm not a doctor or medical professional, but this seems so logical and obvious to me and has from the start.

[Valkorado]

I guess you dont wear a mask then.  Who cares?  Not me!

[Moonshot_1]

I guess you dont wear a mask then.  Who cares?  Not me!

The question isn't whether they work, the question is are they making things worse?

[Valkorado]

I understand the argument, and it may be legitimate.  I dunno.

I was just saying I am not going to concern myself with or judge others no matter if they wear 'em or not.  As long as they aren't spraying their rights in my face, literally.  I'm all for rights, freedom and law.  I'd bet I've worn an n95 15, maybe 20 minutes tops total in the last several months.  I may or may not choose to wear one again.  Who cares?

[scooperhsd]

I guess you dont wear a mask then.  Who cares?  Not me!

I sure don't wear one. I just this weekend had the wife make me one just in case someplace I have to go has a "masks required" policy just to sooth the unthinking fine Americans, but I don't plan on wearing it otherwise.

[Valkorado]

I guess you dont wear a mask then.  Who cares?  Not me!

I sure don't wear one. I just this weekend had the wife make me one just in case someplace I have to go has a "masks required" policy just to sooth the unthinking fine Americans, but I don't plan on wearing it otherwise.

I'm sure the unthinking fine Americans all think highly of you when you abide by store policy.  Or, perhaps they just see another harmless sheepie.

Now, if you were wearing a wolf mask...

[Bret SD]

This puts it into perspective.. Haha

[ridingron]

Now that's funny!!

[Bighead]

I'm not quoting any "scientific studies" or have any specific evidence derived from them. Just some questions, applications of logic, and basic understanding of biology and physics 101.

I have always been wary of the policy of having the general public in the general public environment wearing masks for mitigation of this, or any virus.

First issue is that it would seem to have the same basic effect of wearing a typical swimsuit to protect yourself from others peeing in the pool. You can actually get swimsuits that would do that but not your typical swimsuit and the public is wearing some typical stuff as masks go.

Add to that the fact that wearing the mask for hours a day in an uncontrolled environment can lead to serious bacterial infections. You are basically wearing a warm, moist, petri dish on your face. If you are healthy, you won't be after you do this for days on end. This is pretty much Biology 101 here. I don't think it is common practice to clean or change your mask after restroom use. You just concentrate the bacteria, hour after hour, in your mask and breath it right back in.

Mask use in a strictly controlled and sterile environments is vital. But we don't live day to day in such environments.

But contemplating this even more, we are told that we need to wear masks in case we are infected and contagious so we don't spread the virus.

Seems logical. But is it?

A person unknowingly is infected and becomes wildly contagious. No significant symptoms but the person is wearing a mask. We can suppose that wearing the mask would mitigate the spread.

But if the person is contagious and the wearing of the mask mitigates the spread, how does the mask do that? Where do the contagions go?

The person breathes them right back in. Basically re-doses them self with the virus with every breath. Without the mask the virus is expelled from the person out into the air. But with the mask the virus is simply concentrated on the inside of their mask. When you wear a mask you always inhale the end of your previous breath. If you are contagious you are re-dosing yourself with each breath.

Leads me to wonder at why we see such a broad spectrum of this disease. Are we masking the residents in nursing homes 24/7 and when the virus infects these folks they are just dosing and dosing themselves with the virus till they just get so sick they die? Same for other people with health issues. They become contagious and wind up recirculating the virus to themselves. They can't get better. The mask use won't let their body rid itself of the contagion naturally.

Then we see folks who test positive and didn't have a clue they had it. I'd like to see their history of mask use.

I'm not a doctor or medical professional, but this seems so logical and obvious to me and has from the start.

Well I dont know about you saying people that wear them for days on end won’t be healthy after doing so as I wear one at work and have evryday for dang near 35 years and have seen no ill affects from it.

[Oompa Loompa]

Hmmm... Who to believe? Medical professionals or my favorite "news show" host.

[Moonshot_1]

I'm not quoting any "scientific studies" or have any specific evidence derived from them. Just some questions, applications of logic, and basic understanding of biology and physics 101.

I have always been wary of the policy of having the general public in the general public environment wearing masks for mitigation of this, or any virus.

First issue is that it would seem to have the same basic effect of wearing a typical swimsuit to protect yourself from others peeing in the pool. You can actually get swimsuits that would do that but not your typical swimsuit and the public is wearing some typical stuff as masks go.

Add to that the fact that wearing the mask for hours a day in an uncontrolled environment can lead to serious bacterial infections. You are basically wearing a warm, moist, petri dish on your face. If you are healthy, you won't be after you do this for days on end. This is pretty much Biology 101 here. I don't think it is common practice to clean or change your mask after restroom use. You just concentrate the bacteria, hour after hour, in your mask and breath it right back in.

Mask use in a strictly controlled and sterile environments is vital. But we don't live day to day in such environments.

But contemplating this even more, we are told that we need to wear masks in case we are infected and contagious so we don't spread the virus.

Seems logical. But is it?

A person unknowingly is infected and becomes wildly contagious. No significant symptoms but the person is wearing a mask. We can suppose that wearing the mask would mitigate the spread.

But if the person is contagious and the wearing of the mask mitigates the spread, how does the mask do that? Where do the contagions go?

The person breathes them right back in. Basically re-doses them self with the virus with every breath. Without the mask the virus is expelled from the person out into the air. But with the mask the virus is simply concentrated on the inside of their mask. When you wear a mask you always inhale the end of your previous breath. If you are contagious you are re-dosing yourself with each breath.

Leads me to wonder at why we see such a broad spectrum of this disease. Are we masking the residents in nursing homes 24/7 and when the virus infects these folks they are just dosing and dosing themselves with the virus till they just get so sick they die? Same for other people with health issues. They become contagious and wind up recirculating the virus to themselves. They can't get better. The mask use won't let their body rid itself of the contagion naturally.

Then we see folks who test positive and didn't have a clue they had it. I'd like to see their history of mask use.

I'm not a doctor or medical professional, but this seems so logical and obvious to me and has from the start.

Well I dont know about you saying people that wear them for days on end won’t be healthy after doing so as I wear one at work and have evryday for dang near 35 years and have seen no ill affects from it.

What kind of mask and what type of work? My concern personally is where I work we have pallets of product like tuna, cat food, soups, etc that we have easy open cans open easily and spoil. We can't get to these until the product is picked down to that level to get them. Sometimes we can't get to it for weeks and don't know there is a problem till we get to that point. To my concern, our housekeeping staff has to deal with that. This is not good.
While I rarely deal with this stuff, I do wind up at the end of the day with a sore throat when wearing the mask.
Not saying that no one should wear a mask. Obviously you wear one to mitigate a risk of some kind.

[Bighead]

I wear one in the operating room not to protect me but to protect the patient from me. Same as anyone who is wearing one for this china bug.  People think they are protecting themselves but in reality they are only making themselves feel protected from the virus which is BS.

[Bret SD]

I wear one in the operating room not to protect me but to protect the patient from me. Same as anyone who is wearing one for this china bug.  People think they are protecting themselves but in reality they are only mqking themselves fell protected from the virus which is BS.

This^^^ 

[Valkorado]

https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2020/06/who-updates-guidance-on-masks-heres-what-to-know-now/

What's new:

In areas with widespread transmission, the WHO advises medical masks for all people working in clinical areas of a health facility, not only workers dealing with patients with COVID-19. In other words, said the Director General, when doctors are doing a ward round on the cardiology or palliative care units where there are no confirmed COVID-19 patients, they should still wear a medical mask.
In areas with community transmission, the WHO now advises that members of the general public aged 60 and older and those with underlying conditions should wear a medical mask in situations where physical distancing is not possible.
The general public should wear non-medical masks where there is widespread transmission and when physical distancing is difficult, such as on public transport, in shops or in other confined or crowded environments.
Additionally, the WHO has released new guidance on cloth masks, recommending that they consist of at least three layers of different materials: an inner layer being an absorbent material like cotton, a middle layer of non-woven materials such as polypropylene (for the filter) and an outer layer, which is a non absorbent material such as a polyester or a polyester blend.
To develop the guidance, the agency consulted with a range of international experts from different countries and disciplines such as infectious diseases and epidemiology. Their review of a variety of evidence demonstrated some new findings, including that face protections, including respirators or medical masks, can result in a large reduction of transmission of coronaviruses, including COVID-19.

Recommendations, such as those regarding fabric masks, are the result of new research that the WHO commissioned that was not available a month ago. This new evidence, said Dr Maria Van Kerkhove, WHO Technical Lead, has shown that the recommended fabric combination "can actually provide a mechanistic barrier that if someone were infected with COVID-19, you can prevent those droplets from going through and infecting someone."

[Bighead]

Still not protecting the wearer.  Just protecting those around them.

[3fan4life]

Requiring everyone to wear masks in public is insane.

Not only do they not protect the wearer but if you are wearing a mask you are much more likely to touch your face.

This is the #1 thing that we have been told NOT to do when out in public.


I have been doing a good job of avoiding touching my face when out in public.

A few days ago while in a store and wearing a mask (thanks Northam) I caught myself reaching up and adjusting the mask.

I am much more concerned about catching something by transferring germs from a contaminated object than I am from casually passing someone.

[cookiedough]

last week in the office with the 5-6 'essential' employees out of 300 total,  a dummy walked about 15 feet from my desk telling me I MUST wear a mask while sitting at my desk NO ONE else around even close.  NO idea who he was nor did I care but should have gotten his name and rank of what job he does at my employer.    Then send him an email of that pick of the lady wearing a mask and the guy putting up a fence to keep mosquitoes out. 

I told my bosses since building under construction still I am staying HOME working from HOME since an email came out from President that since social distancing while in office when we all go back to work next week that they will be asking most (so I volunteered) to work from home 1 more month until construction done since not enough social distancing in place to work all of us in the building.  The other 2 ladies can work at our desks in that office since NOT WEARING A MASK ON MY FACE 24/7 WHILE THERE DAILY,  screw that.   EVERY desk that I am aware of if measured has about 6-8 feet away from each other already so why even a need for a mask UNLESS someone comes up to my desk and asks me a question?   I have NO problems with that put on my mask for a few minutes or if I walk away from my desk I will put on my mask, but sitting at my workstation desk already 6 feet away from EVERYONE is stupid.