Own a Ring camera?

[..]

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/may/18/amazon-ring-largest-civilian-surveillance-network-us?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Other

[carolinarider09]

That is why I don't own one.   

I do have an ARLO system which  sort of wonder about but it is hardwired to my local network... Soooo

[cookiedough]

seems like an invasion of privacy to me but if not doing anything illegal then should not matter right?

Might come in handy for suspicious activity such as I bought my kid a RING camera doorbell and have not installed yet, but bought for XMAS present for their old place that some jerkoff has tried 2x's to break into their house when not home.  The 1st time was VERY bad partially breaking the locked door down and ripping part of the door off the framework with wooden frame pretty busted up where the deadbolt was.   

Security cameras are a good idea in a lot of places nowadays since NO ONE can be trusted nowadays bunch of weirdo's out there for sure trying illegal stuff.  Even my my pretty safe small town about 15 years ago neighbors house 2 streets over some sicko tried busting thru their open screen door at night.  The owner guy I know caught him and chased after him in the dark but never caught him as he was entering the patio door area. 

I try remembering locking my patio door but have forgot to close it a few times with just a flimsy sliding screen mesh door anyone could rip thru.  That is bad for NO neighbors behind my house just an open corn field to the main hwy. thru my county about 100 yards away is all.  I know my neighbors are more trustworthy than me though having left their garage open a ton of times while they are away for even a few days.

[scooperhsd]

Looking at Arlo's website - it appears they are not much better than Ring - just saying.

[Wizzard]

That is why I don't own one.   

I do have an ARLO system which  sort of wonder about but it is hardwired to my local network... Soooo

Hardwired makes no diff when it comes to being able to be hacked. Being connected to the web does.

[carolinarider09]

Looking at Arlo's website - it appears they are not much better than Ring - just saying.

Might be the case, I am not a network Guru, however, since the thing requires me to log in to access the cameras, and it is hardwired to the network switch/modem/whatever, I felt they are fairly safe.


But... one never knows.  The cameras connect via RF (or some other way not wired) to the base station.  The base station is hardwired to the house's network.  

And yes, I am not sure where the videos are stored (when I arm the system to record which only happens when I am away), but they have a USB port for extra storage of videos.  I don't use it.  

The same might be said of the "wired" security camera system I have.  The cameras are hard wired to the recorder but you can access the recorder via the net.  The only thing I can say is that if a system comes with a pre-set user name and password, always change it when you start the system up.

[scooperhsd]

It doesn't matter whether the camera's network connection is hardwired or WiFI - it's still connected to the internet if it connects to your network router.

If you're using WiFi, you should be using as strong of WiFi encryption available with your equipment - WPA2 preferably (unless there is something newer / more secure available). If you're using that, with a reasonably complex encryption phrase, you're probably OK. I have never changed my WiFi password, because "good luck trying to crack it" . Even if you were given my scheme, it's still going to be a bugger, because I threw a few "gotchas" in there as well.

[LTD]

everyone loves this tech until its used against them you might have someone watching you right now in your home and not know it with a hidden camera.  

[carolinarider09]

Two things. 

I thought they would have to have a user name and password to access my system.  Since the security cam system has no "upgrade" path, it should be harder to hack.  But...  I just slept at a Holiday Inn over a week ago so, I could be in error.

Second thing, Since I built the house and it has had an alarm system installed since day one, and since any maintenance is supervised by me, the only way they can be "watching me" is if my Sony Bravia TV has a built in camera I am not aware of. 

When I leave the alarm is set.  It is not connected to the internet.  One of the things I did was make sure it was hardwired for alarm monitoring.  And, yes you could cut the phone line. 

I refuse to use WiFi for my alarm system communications because it can be so easily jammed. 

And yes, the charge for the land line is exorbitant (sp).  The land line is only $14 but then there are all the fees that have been there for years and years which makes it more like $35.  Remember the fee for making sure all those living in the boonies had access to a land line.  The charge is still there today.

[scooperhsd]

Do you mean "Jammed" as in they setup a transmitter that wipes out all WiFi on both the 2.4 GHz and 5.0GHz bands, or do you mean "hack your WiFI password", or something else ?

Jammed as in the first definition would require that they find a powerful enough transmitter to cover both bands (and I had training as the Tempest control officer, as well as Electronic Warfare / CICO on a Perry class Frigate), and as for the second - you just have to make it hard enough to make it not worth their time to try (again - I have considerable IT Security training / experiance).

For your alarm system - you might want to ask the alarm company if they have cell service call out equipment (thus eliminating the wire that can be cut).

[carolinarider09]

No, I was thinking about the Cell phone.  I did a search once and found that they are readily available, don't know if they work or not. 

Yes, if they can find the phone line it can be cut, but they will need bolt cutters to do that.   

Or they will have to work at digging it up.

In my opinion, the key is to try and prevent the fly by the seat of the pants intruder.  If there is someone who really wants to get into the house and do damage, steal stuff he will succeed. 

Just as an aside.   Have you (or anyone else) ever considered why the residential building code requires the doors that are used for house entry to open "inward". 

The only prevention you have for an inward opening door is the area where the locks penetrated the door jam.  It takes very little force to break in. 

While if the door was required to open outward, it would take considerably more force to enter/force the door open since the entire jam/door area would have to be breached. 

Get your cell phone jammer here.

https://www.perfectjammer.com/all-cell-phone-jammers-blockers.html

[Jess from VA]

I have long wondered at the universal use of inward opening doors on residences.  Making them stupidly easy to breach without significant work.  Extra good locks, strike plates, lag screws on both sides of the door (even a double deadbolt) only make it a little bit harder to breach a door.

While fire codes require all business to have outward opening doors so people can't crush up against a door and not get out and burn to death.

An old fashioned car jack, set across a door jam, can gain anyone entry to any residence door in less than a minute.

I'm not sure, but I don't think inward opening residence doors are required by code (unless they open to an immediate flight of stairs).  What I have read is that only tradition makes it nicer for welcoming guests into your home by opening the door inward, instead of pushing them off the door step to open the door.  It's certainly more convenient when entering your house.  But it's lousy security.

My front door needs replaced (eventually) and I have thought about making it open out, to gain the security of the entire door jam.

Sorry for the drift in your thread on cameras.    

[carolinarider09]

Not a problem Jess,

When I built my house (well before) I went to the local tech school to attend a class to get my license to build a house.  Turns out you have to have some "experience" ect to get licensed but.... that's another story.  But I completed the course, passed the test and could have gotten my license if I had the required experience. 

That is where I learned about the code requirements.  And it was emphasized by the local building inspector. 

And your analysis of the requirement for commercial buildings to have outward opening doors for "safety" is correct. 

But the code for residential requires inward opening.  It makes no sense. 

[Jess from VA]

Bill, it may be code some places, but I don't think it's universal at all.

Couple the fact that it takes one minute to breach most all exterior residence doors, with the fact you better never shoot through such doors.  

Some (maybe even most) residential security cameras should be hidden, but the one over your front door should be patently obvious.

Besides hardening of locks, plates and lag screws, my only extra security is solid lockable storms, that do open out (they both can't open in).  So it takes them a minute and a half to get in.  

[Serk]

Supposedly, the reason for residential doors opening inwards is because that places the hinges, traditionally the easiest means of attack, on the inside of the house, not the outside where it'd be trivial to  attack the hinges and gain entrance.

Not 100% sure I believe that, but that's the explanation I've found.

[Jess from VA]

Yes, I forgot to mention hinges.  However, exterior hinges can be very hardened and tamper proof, like on virtually all public buildings (and many guns safes).

The amount of hammering and banging would be a dead giveaway, and much longer than 60 seconds.  

[scooperhsd]

Unless you have placed your phone  line in an armored tube - it can be cut with a pair of pliers or wire cutters (it's only a pair of 18-20 awg wires).

[carolinarider09]

Yes the hinges are a vulnerable point.  Here is a picture of an exterior hinge that is sort of hardened.

The pin can be removed but the hinge has two slots in it that are filled by pins from the jam part of the hinge. 

Therefore it would be hard to move the door outward after the hinge pin removed. 

Not perfect but, it requires the person seeking enter to remove three pins and then use a large pry bar to gain entry... Not as easy as just a hard push on the door.

And yes, you can buy and install cross members for barricading doors that open inward but they are only useful if you are home. If you are away from home, your door is vulnerable.

[carolinarider09]

Jess,  I understand about concealing the security cams.  Back when I put in the hardwired system, the cameras were fairly large and could not be easily concealed (well they are embedded in the ceilings and not specifically obvious until you are already on camera).

The other interesting part is that two of the cameras have integral infrared lighting which is not really infrared but "red".  While its not much of a red light (like one large LED) it does show the cameras location.  But again, by then its already on disk. 

[Ramie]

Here in Minnesota I've often opened my front door to find 6" of snow blocking it.