SCOTUS declines to hear women's draft case.

[Rams]

Supreme Court declines to hear case questioning whether women must also register for the draft
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/supreme-court-declines-to-hear-case-questioning-whether-women-must-also-register-for-the-draft/ar-AAKNfNw?ocid=msedgntp


WASHINGTON – The Supreme Court said Monday it will not hear an appeal questioning whether the requirement that men – and not women – register for the military draft is constitutional in a case that challenged one of the last remaining sex-based classifications in federal law.

Associate Justice Sonia Sotomayor wrote that the decision is for Congress to make – at least for now.

"It remains to be seen, of course, whether Congress will end gender-based registration under the Military Selective Service Act," Sotomayor wrote in a statement joined by Associate Justices Stephen Breyer and Brett Kavanaugh. "But at least for now, the court’s longstanding deference to Congress on matters of national defense and military affairs cautions against granting review while Congress actively weighs the issue."

Forty years ago, the Supreme Court upheld the constitutionally of requiring men – and only men – to register for the draft through the Selective Service System because, the justices reasoned at the time, the purpose of a draft is to build a pool of combat troops.

Back then, that meant men. Not any longer.

The Department of Defense formally lifted the ban on women in combat in 2015. And so the question before the court now is whether a male-only registration requirement violates the Constitution's guarantees of equal protection and due process.

"The registration requirement is one of the last sex-based classifications in federal law," wrote attorneys for two men who were required to register and the National Coalition for Men. "It imposes selective burdens on men, reinforces the notion that women are not full and equal citizens, and perpetuates stereotypes about men’s and women’s capabilities."

The National Coalition for Men, a men's rights group, is backed by the American Civil Liberties Union.

The modern registration approach was adopted during World War I, according to court documents. The draft inducted nearly three million men into the military for World War I, over ten million during World War II, 1.5 million for the Korean War and nearly 2 million for Vietnam, according to the nonpartisan Congressional Research Service.

The Selective Service System, a federal agency, told the nation's highest court that reconsidering the male-only draft registration would be "premature." Its attorneys argued that the court's earlier case, Rostker v. Goldberg, "made clear that the court should defer to Congress."

In the frequently asked questions section of the agency's website, the second question is "why aren't women required to register?" The answer, in the agency's words, is that the Military Selective Service Act, enacted in 1948, authorizes only men to sign up.

A federal district court ruled for the male plaintiffs in the case but the New Orleans-based U.S. Court of Appeals for the 5th Circuit reversed that decision, citing the Supreme Court's earlier precedent in the Rostker case.

Hmm  Seems a bit cowardly on SCOTUS's part to me. IMHO, they should make a decision.   I'm not suggesting whether or not it's good for the military, just that's what is good for the goose is good for the gander.

Rams

[Skinhead]

It seems to me if they truly desire equal treatment, they should be required to register for and be treated equally in the draft.  I would also like to see equal treatment regarding divorce settlements and child custody/care policy.  You want to be equal? lets go all in.

[Rams]

It seems to me if they truly desire equal treatment, they should be required to register for and be treated equally in the draft.  I would also like to see equal treatment regarding divorce settlements and child custody/care policy.  You want to be equal? lets go all in.

I would also include parental or father's rights as it applies to abortion.

Rams

[scooperhsd]

I can see it both ways - but I would defer to Congress like the Court did.

This would beg all kinds pf questions - do we treat women and men equally in one pool, male draft / female draft, what ?

[Serk]

And in the modern era where nothing means anything any longer, does a biological female who identifies as male have to register for the draft?

Is a biological male who identifies as female required to register?

And what about the other 32,767 genders, do they need to register as well?

[Rams]

And in the modern era where nothing means anything any longer, does a biological female who identifies as male have to register for the draft?

Is a biological male who identifies as female required to register?

And what about the other 32,767 genders, do they need to register as well?

Excellent point.   That makes me think, since I identify as a 17 year old (in my mind) does that mean I need to register again on my next birthday?

Rams 

[Willow]

It seems to me if they truly desire equal treatment, ...

We must be careful to not paint all members of a group with the same brush.  Yes, there are many, male and female, who insist there is no difference between the genders and proclaim they must be treated just alike.  There are still some, male and female, who still recognize they're not the same and call for differing treatment as such.

We don't have a means of drafting women limited only to those who think they are just like men.

There is a complication with mixing males and females in combat units.  The males, by instinct being what they are, tend to pay more attention to protecting the females than to accomplishing the mission.  It's not good for either group.

I don't blame SCOTUS.  It's not their job to mold the law but only to judge the law as adopted by the legislative branch.

I am against the drafting of females into the military.  I am in support of providing opportunities to serve for all who wish (or choose) to do so. 
 

[Wizzard]

How about for capital punishment? Should women be hung like men?

[Rams]

It seems to me if they truly desire equal treatment, ...

We must be careful to not paint all members of a group with the same brush.  Yes, there are many, male and female, who insist there is no difference between the genders and proclaim they must be treated just alike.  There are still some, male and female, who still recognize they're not the same and call for differing treatment as such.

We don't have a means of drafting women limited only to those who think they are just like men.

There is a complication with mixing males and females in combat units.  The males, by instinct being what they are, tend to pay more attention to protecting the females than to accomplishing the mission.  It's not good for either group.

I don't blame SCOTUS.  It's not their job to mold the law but only to judge the law as adopted by the legislative branch.

I am against the drafting of females into the military.  I am in support of providing opportunities to serve for all who wish (or choose) to do so.  
  

While I tend to agree with you, does equal rights not include and apply to equal responsibilities?   It's a slippery slope but, having your cake (with frosting) and eating it to seems to go against the previous decisions SCOTUS has made.   Many men and women are not fit to serve in the military but, that doesn't mean they can't serve their country.   IMHO, every 18 year old should be required to serve in some manner, similar to what the Israelis do.  Not everyone is a combat troop but all are required to serve.

Rams

[Rams]

How about for capital punishment? Should women be hung  executed like men?

I amended the quote to ensure accuracy.   I've got no problem with equal treatment/punishment under the law, regardless of how that execution is carried out.

If, women were like men, I'd quickly lose interest.

Rams

[Wizzard]

How about for capital punishment? Should women be hung  executed like men?

I amended the quote to ensure accuracy.   I've got no problem with equal treatment/punishment under the law, regardless of how that execution is carried out.

If, women were like men, I'd quickly lose interest.

Rams

I stated it the way I did on purpose 

[The emperor has no clothes]

How about for capital punishment? Should women be hung like men?

I don’t want any of my women hung 

[Jess from VA]

Universal registration for a draft is not the same thing as universal acceptance/qualification for combat.

I think universal draft into military service is correct.  There's lots of non combat jobs to go around for everyone.

I think universal acceptance of women into combat service is lunacy.  

Though I think well reasoned exceptions to excluding women from combat exist.  Like pilots or tank drivers or artillery gunners.  Where they have no business is in the Infantry/Airborne/Special Forces/etc.

And certain jobs cannot be women, like part of a submarine crew with no separate facilities or berthing possible.  You cannot stick one or two women on a sub for a 6 month tour and expect everything to work smoothly.  I suppose there could be all women submarines, but that seems improbable (and funny).  

And it goes without saying that men's standards cannot be lowered to the point all women can make them.  That's also lunacy.

And if you identify as a military working dog, you cannot serve as one (no matter how convincing you can be at it).      

[98valk]

kill the women more UN population control

https://www.breitbart.com/social-justice/2016/07/07/real-war-on-women-chicks-in-combat/

[98valk]

But, as outlined in a comprehensive paper for the School of Advanced Military Studies at Fort Leavenworth, this policy — born of desperate necessity as Jewish citizens defended their homes and villages from genocidal assaults — also showed the limits of gender-integrated units. Mixed-gender units had higher casualty rates, and Haganah commanders stopped using women in assault forces because “physically girls could not run as well — and if they couldn’t run fast enough, they could endanger the whole unit, so they were put in other units.”

It’s dangerous enough for the U.S. to impair combat effectiveness and endanger soldiers for the sake of satisfying feminists’ unreasonable and unrealistic demands, but it would indeed be barbaric to then take the next step of potentially conscripting women into a bloody social-justice crusade. Israel — in spite of facing far worse strategic emergencies than the United States — has not taken that step, and cheerleaders for American military decline cannot be permitted to justify their own foolishness through its example.

https://www.nationalreview.com/2016/02/israel-women-combat-experience-not-what-left-says/

[scooperhsd]

It seems to me if they truly desire equal treatment, ...

We must be careful to not paint all members of a group with the same brush.  Yes, there are many, male and female, who insist there is no difference between the genders and proclaim they must be treated just alike.  There are still some, male and female, who still recognize they're not the same and call for differing treatment as such.

We don't have a means of drafting women limited only to those who think they are just like men.

There is a complication with mixing males and females in combat units.  The males, by instinct being what they are, tend to pay more attention to protecting the females than to accomplishing the mission.  It's not good for either group.

I don't blame SCOTUS.  It's not their job to mold the law but only to judge the law as adopted by the legislative branch.

I am against the drafting of females into the military.  I am in support of providing opportunities to serve for all who wish (or choose) to do so. 
 

  Many men and women are not fit to serve in the military but, that doesn't mean they can't serve their country.   IMHO, every 18 year old should be required to serve in some manner, similar to what the Israelis do.  Not everyone is a combat troop but all are required to serve.

Rams

Right on brother !!!!!! A 3 year term of federal service of SOME KIND (doesn't have to be military, but it should be useful work) would do wonders for the entitlement feelings of people. Successful completion of This should also be a requirement to vote (certain exceptions).

[carolinarider09]

Right on brother !!!!!! A 3 year term of federal service of SOME KIND (doesn't have to be military, but it should be useful work) would do wonders for the entitlement feelings of people. Successful completion of This should also be a requirement to vote (certain exceptions).

 

Ahh yes,,   Starship Troopers.  

[DIGGER]

I was never in the military   I registered for the draft in 1968 but was not drafted.      Just my observation over the years of boot camp is that boot camp is pretty physical.      Do you guys who have been in the military really think most women could go through boot camp successfully?   I realize there are a lot of 18 yr old women who definately could but I would think there is a very high percentage of 18 yr old women who could not.    Soooo...do you water down boot camp so they can?

[old2soon]

        Been deployed on an Aircraft Carrier for Long Duty Sessions on Station in Vietnam. A bunch of Men most of them at their physical peak and a few Females I M H O-NOT a good mix. The Mission Would suffer and combat readiness Would Decline. Anyone that's been aboard a U S Navy Vessel KNOW'S just how Cramped living quarters are. Some of the racks in the sleeping quarters were stacked 5 high. Not a lot of room but I did sleep. On a Carrier It IS All about the Aircraft embarked aboard. A 24/7 madhouse symphony or vice versa. And I wasn't even aboard an Attack Carrier. And whoever said No Woman in Special Forces type outfits-sorry-they are NOT qualified. Far as "regular" or "notmal" combat goes-Israel Already answered That question. Sides-Most of us wee raised to Protect The Female of our species. Kinda sorta impossible to train that out. RIDE SAFE.

[old2soon]

I was never in the military   I registered for the draft in 1968 but was not drafted.      Just my observation over the years of boot camp is that boot camp is pretty physical.      Do you guys who have been in the military really think most women could go through boot camp successfully?   I realize there are a lot of 18 yr old women who definately could but I would think there is a very high percentage of 18 yr old women who could not.    Soooo...do you water down boot camp so they can?

       My 2nd Ex was in Army Boot in the 70s? maybe. Couple weeks in she decided it was NOT her cup of tea. They let her go and I believe she has no DD214 or Any V A Benefits Which Is as it SHOULD Be. I on the other hand Did NOT have that option in 1964 nor Did I desire too have that option. RIDE SAFE.

[Jess from VA]

I realize there are a lot of 18 yr old women who definitely could, but I would think there is a very high percentage of 18 yr old women who could not.

Believe me, today about 60 percent of 18-21yo boys/men (or more) cannot complete the physical requirement of boot camp.

Or even a pre-enlistment PT test just to see if they can even hack boot camp.  

And of those who can get in, the Navy, Army, and Marines have recruits drop out at roughly the same rate as each other, between 11 and 14 percent annually.  

And it's easier than it used to be.

[Rams]

Right on brother !!!!!! A 3 year term of federal service of SOME KIND (doesn't have to be military, but it should be useful work) would do wonders for the entitlement feelings of people. Successful completion of This should also be a requirement to vote (certain exceptions).

 

Ahh yes,,   Starship Troopers.  

Honestly, in some form, that's not a bad idea.  I fully realize that not all men and women are cut out to serve in the military but, to do so, the standards should be the same.   All those who can't cut it, there's a lot of service related jobs they can do.

Rams

[scooperhsd]

Even when I was going to NFO training (mid 1980's) - the enlisted folks who made sure we were safely strapped into our jets at a base could be either male or female, and women as well as men are today serving onboard all of our aviation ships - including the flight deck . Women are also serving onboard other combantants (except submarines for anything but TAD). I'm sure there has been changes in the berthing areas to accomodate this, but they are there.

[98valk]

Even when I was going to NFO training (mid 1980's) - the enlisted folks who made sure we were safely strapped into our jets at a base could be either male or female, and women as well as men are today serving onboard all of our aviation ships - including the flight deck . Women are also serving onboard other combantants (except submarines for anything but TAD). I'm sure there has been changes in the berthing areas to accomodate this, but they are there.

all ships have separate male and female berthing and heads.

they started putting women on subs a few yrs ago which is really stupid since everybody is rubbing body to body just to move around most areas of the sub.