Is my Interstate cursed?

[burple05]

Well,  She's developed another problem.  This would be #4 on my beautiful , low mileage had it a year now IS.  You guys have helped me through all the others.  #1 failed altenator, #2 replace rear end splines, #3 direct short blowing fuse (caused by me..).  And now hopefully #4.  Went to start her up Saturday morning.  Pull the choke tap the starter button, ( I always just tap it at first to make sure no-lock), didn't sound right.  uh oh, could it be locked?  I chanced it so I hit it again, she starts right up, seems normal.  I get about 5-6 miles down the road and it starts missing, running like crap.  Can't hardly get it to take off from a stop light.  Steadily getting worse as I barely make it to my buddies shop.  Total of about 10 miles.  Feels like my F150 truck does when it drops a coil pack.  Now it ran fine until it warmed up about 5-6 miles.  First thing I checked was plugs and wires,  Pulled all the plugs and spun it over to make sure no gas in cylinders, it had none.  Left side plugs all looked rich, black.  Right side looked perfect.  Put the best plug in each individual wire to check fire, they all had a good blue spark on them.  Not sure why left was showing so rich.  Installed new set of plugs, started it up seemed fine.  Go for a test ride.  Ran good till it warmed up again, about 5 miles, started doing the same thing.  Couldn't hardly take off from stop.  Just kept getting worse back to the shop.  Also seems to be making a slight knocking sound at this point?  Not sure where sound is coming from.  Again only does it when it gets warmed up.  So what do you guys think?  Doesn't seem to be fuel related, but hey I don't know.  Bikes been de-smogged and pingel fuel valve so no vacuum lines.  One of the coils heating up and not firing?  Ecm?  I'm at a loss again.  This is suppose to be my jump on and ride around the country bike.  I have a 2001 standard with 70,000 miles and it has not left me stranded, ever.  This IS, with now 26,000 has failed me 4 times now.  I"ve only had it a year, and I want to believe in her.  Stuff just keeps happening.  I look forward, and depend on you'alls help.  Let me know what you think.

Peace, Ron.

[SCain]

Mine did the same thing many years ago, turned out I got a bad tank of fuel. When did you fill up last?

[Bagger John - #3785]

Left side rich + right side "normal" = left-side enricheners stuck on.

Remove the carburetor enrichener linkage covers (have to remove the radiator pods to do this) and make sure each side releases completely when the "choke lever" is off. Adjust cable slack as needed.

This is the first thing I'd check.

[burple05]

Mine did the same thing many years ago, turned out I got a bad tank of fuel. When did you fill up last?

I filled up, along with 10 others, got on the Interstate and hauled ass 32 miles to the house.  Average speed 80-85 mph.  Not one hiccup until next ride.  2 weeks later now this.

[SCain]

I would get rid of that fuel if it were me, my bike had the same issue, ran great when it was cold, once it warmed up it wouldnt get out of its own way.
This is just my experience with the same type of problem, pulled the carbs twice, if I would have just got rid of that fuel the first time, but it was odd that the bike ran so good when it was cold, once it warms that fuel it turned to gel.
Lessons learned.

[Jess from VA]

Tank vent line issue? (drooping, kinked, clogged, mud dobbers)

After no start, if you open the cap will it then start, and run?

Close cap on a ziptie to keep small vent open?

[Bagger John - #3785]

Here's a potential clue:

Left side plugs all looked rich, black.  Right side looked perfect. 

Bad gas or gas with too high an octane for complete combustion should foul ALL the plugs, not just the left side - which is evidently running very rich.

What;s the common denominator here?

[gordonv]

To me, it sounds like insufficient fuel while driving.

You mentioned pingel, so it couldn't be the petcock vacuum leak. Do you turn it off/on with each use? Does it have an indent (notch) you can feel when you turn it off/on, could it not be fully on?

I would test the pingel, test it for the flow, and see how fast it comes, and if it matches the manual.

Like mentioned, pinched gas tank vent hose. Have you had the tank off? Like recommended, open the gas cap and place a piece of plastic (zap strap/coffee stick) in it to break the air tight seal, and try again.

If fuel delivery isn't a problem, then I also would suspect the fuel quality.

[The emperor has no clothes]

Here's a potential clue:

Left side plugs all looked rich, black.  Right side looked perfect. 

Bad gas or gas with too high an octane for complete combustion should foul ALL the plugs, not just the left side - which is evidently running very rich.

What;s the common denominator here?

+1

[John Schmidt]

You said you had the carbs out twice, therein might be the source of the problem. I had the exact same issue...right side ran good most of the time, left side...not so much. When I remove the carbs, I also dismount the two upper engine hangers. The left side hanger is also is where the coils for 3/4 and 5/6 are mounted. I also removed the front coil which fires 1/2 and left all three coils hanging while I pulled the carbs. Upon reinstallation, after running for a time...it didn't want to. Right side was fine most of the time, left side rich and not firing hardly at all. The cure was found accidentally and was my own fault. By leaving the coils hanging caused the plug wires to partially pull out of the coils, odd...yes, but by trimming the coil end of those wires back and reinserting them cured the issue. Apparently the weight of the coils and/or their mount caused them to pull slightly out of the socket. Whatever the reason, trimming and reinserting them all was the cure.

Generally speaking, you don't have a fuel issue. As was stated...that would affect all the cylinders so if one side is running clean and the other isn't, forget fuel delivery or quality problems. Also, the vent tube isn't going to affect just one side when it's plugged. If you don't have a plug wire problem at the coils, I would test the impulse generators behind the timing belt cover. Keep us posted on your discovery.

[Jims99]

John makes good sense. I would try this first.

[pancho]

Hey Ron,, Did you try the above and get to the bottom of the problem?  I would really think you have a fuel delivery problem first.  If not, here is my .02. From what you described, I'd suspect an electrical problem next. The first thing I would do is go back over everything I touched while I was chasing down the blowing the fuse problem, looking for a loose or intermittent connection, not seated connector, half pulled termination, etc. If I was satisfied all the electrical was solid, I would get a couple of cans of freeze spray or canned air "Duster",,  something that will cause freezing when sprayed upside down.  Then I'd go riding until the problem showed up and cool one suspect component at a time to see if you can isolate the problem.    I'd start with the ECM.  Good luck on getting this straightened out, I'm sure you will.  Mine is down waiting on a clutch part, at least you have another bike to ride.

[burple05]

So far.  Drained the fuel from tank using pingel valve, plenty of gas flow. Gas looked good.  Check choke cables operation, seem fine.  Filled with fresh gas started her up.  I had borrowed an infa red ?? thermometer to check the header pipe temps to see if all were getting combustion.  Never done this before.. read about it.  Front 2 cylinders took longer to heat up, other ones heated quickly with the rears the quickest and hottest.  But after a few minutes  they all were pretty much around 175-180 degrees.  Bike got up to temp, fan came on.  Seemed to run ok, but didn't get to go for test ride late last night.  I'll try this evening.  Man it's hot here in ARkansas.  It's not the heat it's the humidity
right..anyway I'm pretty confident that bad gas isn't the problem.  Not with my luck.  I'll keep you posted.
     Oh yeah,  I never removed my carbs or messed with them, just to clarify.

Peace, Ron.

[pancho]

You know what it feels like when you are running out of fuel and need to switch to reserve, is it like that? Check for a fuel shutoff valve in the delivery line and how the fuel line is routed. Don't worry about the temp differences or the apparent richness on one side for now, that stuff isn't related to your problem.

Check choke cables operation, seem fine.

Did you verify that the rails and enrichner valves are going completely back in place on both sides when lever "choke" is pushed off?

[burple05]

I would get rid of that fuel if it were me, my bike had the same issue, ran great when it was cold, once it warmed up it wouldnt get out of its own way.
This is just my experience with the same type of problem, pulled the carbs twice, if I would have just got rid of that fuel the first time, but it was odd that the bike ran so good when it was cold, once it warms that fuel it turned to gel.
Lessons learned.

Scain,

When you suggested "bad tank of gas"  I thought now way, to easy.  But after draining 4.5 gallons of fuel, adding fresh fuel and a good dose of Seafoam.  I"ve ridden the bike 3 different times over the weekend.  30 miles, 50 miles, 140 miles.  She runs really well.  All over the rpm range, pulls hard, starts easy, idles well after warm, and choked when cold.  No hesitation on acceleration from stop. 
Only other thing I did was change the plugs.  Now I haven't pulled them again to see if the left is still showing rich, but I will next couple of days.  I'm hesitant to trust the bike.  Was that truly all that was wrong???  I've got this so called tainted gas in cans in the garage now.  Push mower??

[SCain]

When it happened to me years ago, I didn't think it was the fuel, I swore it wasn't the fuel, it felt like it was electrical to me, ran great cold but once the fuel in the carbs warmed up the bike wouldn't get out of its own way, like something electrical was cutting out.
Glad you are back on the road.
Steve

[Bagger John - #3785]

...once the fuel in the carbs warmed up the bike wouldn't get out of its own way, like something electrical was cutting out.

AKA "vapor lock", usually caused by overheating in conjunction with a fuel-delivery issue. It's the magic combination of circumstances and depending on ambient temperatures can be a right royal PITA to duplicate and troubleshoot.

[Skinhead]

I don't know the history of your bike, but the mention of vapor lock get me thinking.  Is the plastic air deflector (in front of the cab bank immediately behind the radiator)?  If not, it may be your problem.  Easy enough to check.

[SCain]

...once the fuel in the carbs warmed up the bike wouldn't get out of its own way, like something electrical was cutting out.

AKA "vapor lock", usually caused by overheating in conjunction with a fuel-delivery issue. It's the magic combination of circumstances and depending on ambient temperatures can be a right royal PITA to duplicate and troubleshoot.

When this happened to me years ago, once the bike warmed up the fuel would gel in the carbs, I never went back to that station again.

[burple05]

I don't know the history of your bike, but the mention of vapor lock get me thinking.  Is the plastic air deflector (in front of the cab bank immediately behind the radiator)?  If not, it may be your problem.  Easy enough to check.

Air dam is present

[burple05]

...once the fuel in the carbs warmed up the bike wouldn't get out of its own way, like something electrical was cutting out.

AKA "vapor lock", usually caused by overheating in conjunction with a fuel-delivery issue. It's the magic combination of circumstances and depending on ambient temperatures can be a right royal PITA to duplicate and troubleshoot.

Wouldn't I get a lite if it was overheating.  Cooling system seems to work as designed.  No signs of overheating.

[Bagger John - #3785]

...once the fuel in the carbs warmed up the bike wouldn't get out of its own way, like something electrical was cutting out.

AKA "vapor lock", usually caused by overheating in conjunction with a fuel-delivery issue. It's the magic combination of circumstances and depending on ambient temperatures can be a right royal PITA to duplicate and troubleshoot.

Wouldn't I get a lite if it was overheating.  Cooling system seems to work as designed.  No signs of overheating.

Overheating the carbs isn't necessarily overheating the cooling system. You just have to get enough hot air into the vicinity of the bowls to warm them sufficiently that the fuel will begin vaporizing.

The plastic air dam being omitted will cause this when run in warmer climates, as will omitting the rubber sheeting atop the motor. User-added accessories to the radiator (the nice sculpted grill guards, for example) may, but I don't have any experience with those on my bikes to get an idea of temperature rise over the "stock" arrangement. FWIW, all of my Valkyries have had accurate coolant temperature indicators installed. I like to keep tabs on what the various systems are/aren't doing.