Went to the Dodge dealer today

[Jess from VA]

to get some interval work and an oil change.  It's a dealer that can take my 8'5" van in the doors (all of them can't).  So I have time on my hands and walk around the lot and look at the stunning new cars and trucks (Ram trucks is their thing).  Not something I've ever done more than a few times.  I found one of their new trucks in back with the window open and reported it before birds moved in.

But the stickers floored me with the prices.  Fancy RT 392 Hemi Chargers over $70K, RT Durdango $60K, turbo diesel Ram full bed double cab loaded $80K.  Rubicon Jeeps $60-70K.  Beautiful paint, and I'd be afraid to park any of them anywhere but my driveway.  This is more than many paid for their homes (back in the day).

The cream of the crop was something I've not even seen anywhere before; the Jeep Grand Wagoneer at $94 to 116K.  Quite the luxury yacht.  




I told my tech I paid $26.5K for my 2500 Promaster and he said I could easily sell for $10K more than I paid for it (6 years ago).  No thanks.  With any luck, I'll never buy another 4 wheeler.

It's fun to look.  And I have to say I was happy some salesman didn't come out there and try to work on me.  I don't like it.  If you ever want to go look, do it on a cold day so they stay inside.

 

[old2soon]

    I'd mentioned couple months back at the Chevy dlr here in Willow Springs I was there to check on some stuff for my 06 Grand Prix and before I went inside the parts room there was a Brand New Suburban either a G M C or a Chevy. I'd call it fire mist red Completely decked out and I guessed 80G-WRONG sez the Svc Mgr-nearer 104G!  We have a Chrysler dlr in West Plains and couple years back 1 of those 800 H P +++ Dodges was there in that Plum color and it was North of 75G then!  Yuppers Jess Too danged far outa this old mans reach! RIDE SAFE.

[carolinarider09]

I guess my question is, (considering the notion of supply and demand) with prices this high and people  having to pay more for food and housing and....   who can afford one of these?

Having said that, since the prices is there, someone is buying them.   Are thy paying cash?????  Long term financing??????   

the 2024 Subaru I just purchased (used with 2,287 miles on the odometer) Was just at my limit of affordable.   

The 1996 Ford Explorer I will be trying to sell, maybe won't be so hard to sell at $1,600.

[da prez]

  I think you are light on the $1600.00. Double it at least.

                                                     da prez

[ridingron]

 I agree, your price seems a little light.   Have you looked through any ads to get a comparable number?

[LTD]

that grand waggoneer is very nice interior is awesome but over a 100 grand no thanks

[Jess from VA]

First, NoVA is part of the DC conglomerate.  There's always lots of employment (regardless of economy) working for the G or working for private business which sells to, services or buys from the G.  There's a lot of wealthy and affluent people up here.  (So keep paying your taxes.)

Second, I think the relative glut at my dealership of the highest end cars and trucks shows they aren't selling as well as they used to.  And this may be true all over.

But this place (catering to all Mopar trucks, SUVs, Jeep) was booming with service work.  My service man told me they had contracts with many companies for their fleet repairs.  A long building with lifts down each side, full of vehicles being worked on.  They had 5 people taking work in and doing paperwork for service, and a tech on every lift.  Sales, business managers, parts.  So sales may be down but business is still good.  There had to be 40 or more employees working there.

So I could get $30K or more for my truck.  So I could buy a new one for $55-60K and pay the difference in cash?  I don't think so.  This is exactly why I came in to do all service interval work.  I paid cash for it, and have not had one problem with it in 6 years, and I want it to stay that way.  It cost me hundreds, but not thousands. 

[old2soon]

I guess my question is, (considering the notion of supply and demand) with prices this high and people  having to pay more for food and housing and....   who can afford one of these?

Having said that, since the prices is there, someone is buying them.   Are thy paying cash?????  Long term financing??????   

the 2024 Subaru I just purchased (used with 2,287 miles on the odometer) Was just at my limit of affordable.   

The 1996 Ford Explorer I will be trying to sell, maybe won't be so hard to sell at $1,600.

      That's a $5500.00 ask down here. Go higher. You MAY come down you can NEVER go up! RIDE SAFE.

[Rams]

It's fun to look.  

Every now and then I get the notion to go take a look.   While I do have a 2018 Ram 3500 (still under warranty) with very low miles, it's always fun to "look" until you see that salesman heading your way.

it's always a compromise between what I need and what I'd like to have.   I suspect my Ram 3500 is the last truck I'll ever buy.  The reason being what I'd like to have and what it now costs.   There is absolutely no way I'm paying the prices the dealers are asking now.   I have to assume the buyers of these vehicles have some very long-term financing.  I won't do that.

Just for fun, I enquired as to what a new Goldwing and a new HD would cost.   That was a short phone call.  

Rams

[cookiedough]

my new 2021 tundra was 43K msrp forced to pay full msrp most dealers wanted 2-5K over msrp no wiggle room.  The all new totally revamped 2022 tundra identical cab SR5 trim went to 49K msrp when I checked. 

Normally, most new model to model years identical go up 3%, give or take that number.  Well, do the math,  43 to 49K is one heck of a lot more in one year price increase than 3 percent. 

NOT many people that I know will blow 50K on up for a new vehicle.  Wonder where dealers are getting their buyers?  The days of me ever blowing 45K on up are gone for good.  NO vehicle with all the bells and whistles to me is worth over 45K msrp. 

If this mfg price increasing continues well over 2-3 percent increase year after year by adding all the techy stuff NOT needed to drive any vehicle,  I am pretty certain that there will be NO MORE mfgs. in business in 10 more years or so.   All vehicles will be double in price so NOT worth it.

[Jess from VA]

I have to assume the buyers of these vehicles have some very long-term financing.  I won't do that.

Neither will I.

The last car I financed was at Maxwell AFB AL, my first duty station (1985).  I showed up there with a three on the tree Ford (which was clean, but not to my liking).  I got orders overseas, and didn't want to ship that thing, so I went looking.  A Chevy dealer had a used 79 SS El Camino with matching paint shell cap with low miles in good shape.  He told me Yankees didn't know this, but El Caminos were considered to be red neck Cadillacs.  I was intrigued.  Then he told me it had been owned by the old gal dispatcher for the Montgomery Police Department, and that it had had the catalytic converter and smog pump removed by the PD mechanics (probably did all their patrol cars too).  That did it, I was sold.  It wasn't too expensive, and I took a two year note.  

The Ford got sold to a Col (O6) living on base for his daughter as a new driver.  I wasn't asking much for it, and the old tightwad bargained hard for a lower price.  I knocked a few hundred off to make him feel good.  

What I hadn't considered was how unique that car would be in Turkey (probably the only one in the whole country), and how much it screamed "American" driver in a heating up Middle East (and I drove that thing all over the country).  I must have attracted 20 crowds of locals looking it over (lived off base).  And I had multiple offers to buy it, which was strictly prohibited under Turkish Law (it went on my import documents, and I had to take it with me when I transferred out, or I got in trouble with a huge fine).  

Driving out in the boondocks (reminiscent of Biblical times with sheep and goat herds) the police didn't patrol, they just had one guy standing along the road, who would raise his hand to stop you and check your paperwork.  Each of us might know 40 words of the other's language, so the conversations were brief. One of them wanted to buy it too.

So I shipped it back to CA and drove it for another 5 years, got out of USAF and drove it cross country to VA, and it became the wife's car for many years, until repairs exceeded value and it got sold.  



Driven in Istanbul (the worst traffic I ever experienced in my life), along most of the Black Sea coastline East (but they wouldn't let me get closer than 40 miles of the USSR border), then down to the Mediterranean Sea, East close to Syria (again, they wouldn't let me go to the border) then West up the Aegean Sea coast to Izmir.  

The first rule of driving in Turkey.  Always use the horn and never the brakes; the horn never wears out.  

[scooperhsd]

Throughout my life, I've always driven cars until they couldn't go anymore. I don't consider a car broken in until 100K miles.

[h13man]

I came to terms with having my 10' GMC Sierra truck restored vs buying a newer truck. I'm all in with purchase price in 2018 and restore so far about $38,000. Yes it seems to be my money pit but it only had 39,000 mi. hard miles on it when purchased and quite obvious not cared for as it showed 2 yrs. after purchase. All new from cab back all OEM body repair and front end rebuild. $48,000 base for a 24' GMC 1500.

[Rams]

Throughout my life, I've always driven cars until they couldn't go anymore. I don't consider a car broken in until 100K miles.

At least and more.  

For me, until a vehicle's repair cost equals or exceeds it's value, it's worth fixing.   My last three Ram diesels all had over 300,000 miles before I traded them off.
Edited: Two of those Rams are still in use, the third one was wrecked.

Rams

[John Schmidt]

In my case I generally will run a car to a minimum of 100k which I did with the '08 Highlander I just traded in December. Bought a 2018 Buick Enclave SUV with 44K on it, drove great coming down to Fla. last week, mileage was mid-20's and it's really comfy. Unless we travel more, this may well be the last vehicle I buy. I did take out a 6 yr. note but I already have it about half paid for, will see what funds are available after this trip and InZane before making any more large chunk payments. Only thing I don't like on it is that stupid stop/start system at every light. I understand there is a bypass kit for it that goes for a bit over $100 so will be looking for that eventually when we get back home.

[cookiedough]

It's fun to look.  

Just for fun, I enquired as to what a new Goldwing and a new HD would cost.   That was a short phone call.  

Rams

back on cycle purchasing,  I never understood the reasoning of buying pretty much ANY new cycle when there are dozens of low mileage like near new say Goldwings out there for half price of new under say 20K miles on them.  I did, however, buy a new boat/motor for 7K in 1997, but now looking at the same Alumacraft boat model being 13K now with high aluminum pricing nowadays,  am pretty sure I can still get 6k for it still today in very good shape.

[Rams]

It's fun to look.  

Just for fun, I enquired as to what a new Goldwing and a new HD would cost.   That was a short phone call.  

Rams

back on cycle purchasing,  I never understood the reasoning of buying pretty much ANY new cycle when there are dozens of low mileage like near new say Goldwings out there for half price of new under say 20K miles on them.  I did, however, buy a new boat/motor for 7K in 1997, but now looking at the same Alumacraft boat model being 13K now with high aluminum pricing nowadays,  am pretty sure I can still get 6k for it still today in very good shape.

A boat?   Was always told a boat is just a place to sink your money..................   

But, to each their own.   My son has 38 foot (I think) Formula with twin 454 (again, I think that's the motor size) supercharged engines.   I can only imagine what it costs to fill the tanks on that thing up.   He took his mom and I for a ride in it and took us up to about sixty mph.   That was about half throttle.  Scared his mom so bad she won't get back on it. 

Rams

[LadyDraco]

I always  liked  them ..



If  I was  to get a  car.. that would  be  it !

[Jess from VA]

Me too Tracy, but they were just a chopped Chevelle, not a real truck for work, hauling or towing much.

With the little camper shell, my wife and I (not over 5'9") could make beds on air mattresses and sleep in the back, which we did a number of times in Sequoia and Yosemite National parks in CA (and in Turkey).  June was wetter and colder than we thought it would be up at those elevations, and it beat the hell out of my pup tent on the ground in the cold and mud.  Just had to take all our carried gear out of the back and stick it up in the driver's compartment to make room.  The other nice thing about them was the heat and AC system was the same as for a full size Chevelle, so it was real warm and cold when you wanted it.  The spare (full size) tire, jack and tools carried in a little hidden shelf behind the single front bench seat (under the truck bed).  The bathroom was out in the weeds though.   

Also, in 1985, GM shifted El Camino production to Mexico, and the new fuel-injected 4.3 L V6 became the base engine through 1987 (instead of earlier 350 and 305ci V8s).  El Camino production ended quietly in late 1987.  So you'll have to find a used one.

Ford sold the same concept Ranchero between 1957 and 1979, which was initially a chopped two-door station wagon, but later was a much smaller chopped Falcon, then a chopped Fairlane, then a chopped Torino and finally a chopped Ford LTD.  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_Ranchero

But I liked the Chevys better. 

[3fan4life]

The EL Camino is making a comeback in 2025:




https://www.chevelles.com/threads/2025-el-camino.1172470/


I had a 1975 GMC Sprint which was the sister to the El Camino.

I might have to take a look at one when they hit the market.

[Jess from VA]

Hey Mark, at first I though... don't do this to me.

But after taking a closer look, no thanks.  I'm not sure what it is but (with a back seat) it's not an El Camino.  None of them are. (Sorry for the size, but the only rear shots I could find)



More like a nice sedan with provision for a hot tub in back.    (nothing of decent size will fit)

Apparently it's to compete with the new Ford Maverick and Hyundai Santa Cruz.





BTW, I may be riding down and around Maggie Valley in early summer with a pal (BRP as usual).  

[f6john]

From the comments on the Chevelle message board it seems pretty much thumbs down.  Time will tell.

[HayHauler]

I am glad I got my 2020 Ram 3500 dually before all of the chip shortage and the prices went out of sight.  Bought it Christmas week in 2019.  Very happy with it.

Hay 
Jimmyt

[3fan4life]

I've seen some pics that indicate there may be a 2 door version as well, probably the SS model.

Let me know when you plan on riding the BRP, maybe we can get together.

[cookiedough]

be nice bring back the el camino, but with a 6 to 6.5ft bed.  The whole major issue for me is required needs of 6 to 6.5ft bed length, NO shorter.  The maverick, ridgeline, santa cruz are making a huge mistake, for me anyways, of not offering longer bed lengths to be a substitute for a truck.

Cannot be that hard to stay under 30K nothing too fancy able to tow 5000lbs. truck bed 6 to 6.5ft length and still sit 4 adults comfy.  The mfgs. are making a HUGE mistake not doing this, would sell like hotcakes.

[Jersey mike]

The EL Camino is making a comeback in 2025:




https://www.chevelles.com/threads/2025-el-camino.1172470/


I had a 1975 GMC Sprint which was the sister to the El Camino.

I might have to take a look at one when they hit the market.

Going back about a decade or maybe more, I remember Chevy came out with a 2 door hot rod with a 5’ or 6’ bed. Can’t remember what they called it. There was someone in my neighborhood who had a bright yellow one for a pretty long time. When they came out I thought they’d be pretty popular but I don’t think those cars ever really took off, never saw that many on the road…anywhere.

[Jack B]

From the front it looks like a Camaro, 2024 is the last year for the Camaro
I wonder if they’ll be making a comeback with the El Camino, if it’s made at all?

[f6john]

The EL Camino is making a comeback in 2025:




https://www.chevelles.com/threads/2025-el-camino.1172470/


I had a 1975 GMC Sprint which was the sister to the El Camino.

I might have to take a look at one when they hit the market.

Going back about a decade or maybe more, I remember Chevy came out with a 2 door hot rod with a 5’ or 6’ bed. Can’t remember what they called it. There was someone in my neighborhood who had a bright yellow one for a pretty long time. When they came out I thought they’d be pretty popular but I don’t think those cars ever really took off, never saw that many on the road…anywhere.

You are thinking of the SSR which came out in 03-04. It had a retractable hardtop and a short narrow bed, strictly a two seater. Approximately $45,000 sticker and some sold for over sticker.

[Jess from VA]

I've seen some pics that indicate there may be a 2 door version as well, probably the SS model.

Let me know when you plan on riding the BRP, maybe we can get together.

As of now Mark (assuming no week of rain) we will come down the BRP from up here and stay at the Floyd (VA) Hotel on Saturday 15 June (few miles off the Parkway) (afternoon arrival), departing in the AM for Maggie Valley NC (couple days), then to Deals Gap (couple days), then home.  It would be good to see you again my friend and you'd be welcome.  We're bunking in on hotel reservations though.

The computer says Floyd is 52 miles and 1 hr 17 min from Moneta.   

[F6Dave]

I was at the Scottsdale Barrett Jackson in January. At the Dodge corporate display the crowds were focused on Chargers and Challengers with Hemi V8s. The new Hornet, actually a rebadged Alfa Romeo, got far less attention. I talked with a rep and mentioned that the cars getting all the attention were being discontinued. She said they were getting vague promises that some interesting cars were in the pipeline, but agreed the situation was a bit depressing.

If only they still built cars like these!


There's a lot more than cars to see at Barrett Jackson...

[f6john]

You could be seeing this at Barrett Jackson one day. A build commissioned to Kindig-It design. A recreation of the Corvette based Corvair concept car of the early 50’s displayed first at the 1953 GM Autorama. This car is a five year effort with a hand formed aluminum body and a V12 engine. I can only imagine the $investment. Dubbed TwelveAir.

[Jess from VA]

Man, I'd drive that.   

I've not had a moving violation in around 20 years, but that all could change.   

When they ask you if you know how fast you were going.... it's a trick question. 

[3fan4life]

I've seen some pics that indicate there may be a 2 door version as well, probably the SS model.

Let me know when you plan on riding the BRP, maybe we can get together.

As of now Mark (assuming no week of rain) we will come down the BRP from up here and stay at the Floyd (VA) Hotel on Saturday 15 June (few miles off the Parkway) (afternoon arrival), departing in the AM for Maggie Valley NC (couple days), then to Deals Gap (couple days), then home.  It would be good to see you again my friend and you'd be welcome.  We're bunking in on hotel reservations though.

The computer says Floyd is 52 miles and 1 hr 17 min from Moneta.   

Are you planning on riding the BRP from Afton to FLoyd or are you taking another route?

[Jess from VA]

I've seen some pics that indicate there may be a 2 door version as well, probably the SS model.

Let me know when you plan on riding the BRP, maybe we can get together.

As of now Mark (assuming no week of rain) we will come down the BRP from up here and stay at the Floyd (VA) Hotel on Saturday 15 June (few miles off the Parkway) (afternoon arrival), departing in the AM for Maggie Valley NC (couple days), then to Deals Gap (couple days), then home.  It would be good to see you again my friend and you'd be welcome.  We're bunking in on hotel reservations though.

The computer says Floyd is 52 miles and 1 hr 17 min from Moneta.   

Are you planning on riding the BRP from Afton to FLoyd or are you taking another route?

Afton?

We'll probably get on BRP off 211 at the top, then stay on until mile marker 165, and get off North on Route 8 to Floyd which is only 6 miles from the BRP.

[3fan4life]

I've seen some pics that indicate there may be a 2 door version as well, probably the SS model.

Let me know when you plan on riding the BRP, maybe we can get together.

As of now Mark (assuming no week of rain) we will come down the BRP from up here and stay at the Floyd (VA) Hotel on Saturday 15 June (few miles off the Parkway) (afternoon arrival), departing in the AM for Maggie Valley NC (couple days), then to Deals Gap (couple days), then home.  It would be good to see you again my friend and you'd be welcome.  We're bunking in on hotel reservations though.

The computer says Floyd is 52 miles and 1 hr 17 min from Moneta.   

Are you planning on riding the BRP from Afton to FLoyd or are you taking another route?

Afton?

We'll probably get on BRP off 211 at the top, then stay on until mile marker 165, and get off North on Route 8 to Floyd which is only 6 miles from the BRP.

Afton is at the beginning of the BRP (US250/I-64).

[F6Dave]

You could be seeing this at Barrett Jackson one day. A build commissioned to Kindig-It design. A recreation of the Corvette based Corvair concept car of the early 50’s displayed first at the 1953 GM Autorama. This car is a five year effort with a hand formed aluminum body and a V12 engine. I can only imagine the $investment. Dubbed TwelveAir.

I like it, but the big wheel trend has gone too far for my tastes. Those tires look like rubber bands, and probably ride that way. On the crumbling roads here in Colorado the wheels wouldn't last very long.

[f6john]

You could be seeing this at Barrett Jackson one day. A build commissioned to Kindig-It design. A recreation of the Corvette based Corvair concept car of the early 50’s displayed first at the 1953 GM Autorama. This car is a five year effort with a hand formed aluminum body and a V12 engine. I can only imagine the $investment. Dubbed TwelveAir.

Stylin’ @ profiln’ Dave. I imagine that car will only be driven off the trailer and into the convention hall! I also suspect Lloyds of London would want a heads up it you decided to take it for a spin! Those low profile tires can ride pretty good if the suspension is set up right, but no match for potholes.




I like it, but the big wheel trend has gone too far for my tastes. Those tires look like rubber bands, and probably ride that way. On the crumbling roads here in Colorado the wheels wouldn't last very long.

[F6Dave]

Here's what I need for the roads around here...