Softer rear shocks?

[Glaserbeam]

I have an '02 Standard, and the forks are plush now that I had the oil and seals changed, but the rear shocks seem harsh, even at the "lightest" setting.  Are there options that are the same length as stock shocks but give a softer ride?  I weigh 160 and rarely carry passengers, so the stock setup just doesn't work for me. 

I see that Progressive made air shocks for the Interstate, but wondering even at the lowest air setting if the internal springs are still too "heavy" for my needs.

Thanks!
Ken

[98valk]

did u buy used? some changed out to the I/S shocks which have stronger springs. post the number that is on the shocks.
Std '02 shocks have good valving for a smooth ride and minimum setting must be #2.

[Gondul]

Progressive is a really a 'has been' when it comes to shocks.

YSS sells a very good shock already set up for your weight with manual preload, rebound, and ride height adjustments at a reasonable price.

I went through Traxxion Dynamics... I think the set was $460

[Peteg]

I have a pair of YSS shocks on order for mine. RZ362 Twin Emulsion shocks with threaded pre load, height adjustment and damping adjustment. I couldn't get Traxion to return my calls. Traxion represents both YSS and Bitubo and I wanted to get their opinion on which to buy.  I ordered mine through EPM Performance. I wanted the adjustability for two up riding. The YSS's come with very stiff spings 45-60's which converts to 256 lbs/in 342 lbs/in. Right now I'm riding on progressive 412's with heavy duty springs (140/200 lbs/in). I installed 9/16" preload spacers above the springs. It's like I ride at level 5 when I'm one up (on cam 1) and level 9 when we're 2 up (on cam 5). The tech from EPM performance said that I'm over compensating for the weak 412's. He said I would love the YSS's if I just dialed in the preload for 30% recommended sag for each load. I'll believe it when I see it, but he also indicated I can order new springs for $100 with free delivery. YSS has a large selection of springs. I was quoted $688 for the RZ362's. I'm not a track guy by any means and I don't ever spend a lot on shocks, but I made an exception for my Valk. It seems to love firm rear shocks and lots of preload for touring loads.

[Gondul]

I have a pair of YSS shocks on order for mine. RZ362 Twin Emulsion shocks with threaded pre load, height adjustment and damping adjustment. I couldn't get Traxion to return my calls. Traxion represents both YSS and Bitubo and I wanted to get their opinion on which to buy.  I ordered mine through EPM Performance. I wanted the adjustability for two up riding. The YSS's come with very stiff spings 45-60's which converts to 256 lbs/in 342 lbs/in. Right now I'm riding on progressive 412's with heavy duty springs (140/200 lbs/in). I installed 9/16" preload spacers above the springs. It's like I ride at level 5 when I'm one up (on cam 1) and level 9 when we're 2 up (on cam 5). The tech from EPM performance said that I'm over compensating for the weak 412's. He said I would love the YSS's if I just dialed in the preload for 30% recommended sag for each load. I'll believe it when I see it, but he also indicated I can order new springs for $100 with free delivery. YSS has a large selection of springs. I was quoted $688 for the RZ362's. I'm not a track guy by any means and I don't ever spend a lot on shocks, but I made an exception for my Valk. It seems to love firm rear shocks and lots of preload for touring loads.

Those are the same ones I ordered from Traxxion... it is unfortunate they never called you back, I dealt with them over email (usually a 1-2 day response time).

When I asked about which shock, they recommended the YSS over the Bitubo, specifically the RZ362 over the RE302 due to it's greater adjustability.

[98valk]

found my post from last yr which I forgot to bookmark.

OEM std/tourer shocks spring rate all years.
problem with '97-'98 std/tourer shocks is the compression and rebound valving, hence the harsh ride. '99-'03 all shocks all models have better valving for a great ride.

Std/Tourer shocks spring rate

setting

1  120   lbs
2  132.5
3  145
4  157.5
5  170

OEM I/S  shocks spring rate

setting

1  140   lbs
2  155
3  170
4  185
5  200

how to take apart showa shocks

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eKIFnxjSehE

progressive shocks spring rate

412 std/tourer

120/170 lbs

412 I/S

140/200

416 all models

125/180

per VTX sites the Triumph Rocket III shocks fit and are 12.5" eye to eye.  spring rate is 140/200

[Peteg]

Yes Gondul, too bad. I reached out to Traxion like 3 different ways and they never got back. Pretty strange, but that's a great savings over EPM Performance. I had lot's of trouble getting responses from internet sites and other vendors too. At least EPM picked up the phone and answered all my questions. If I do want to try softer springs I feel confident they will be there to support me. They also indicated the shocks would come as exact left right parts to fit our Valkyries. No stealing the lower right inner sleeve off your old Showa's to make a right, and no universal metric sleeve kit to make a Harley shock into a Metric shock.

I've read owner complaints on this website about YSS shocks having overly stiff springs. So if you don't know this already, if you look at your springs you should find the part number. The progressive spring rates are in the part number. These helpful links will show you what springs are available, and how the part numbers work. Spring rates are in n/mm so the second link does the conversion to LBS/ in. Used in conjunction with 98 Valk's useful post you might be able to pick out a softer spring if you are unable to tune out harshness. I expect to have my shocks in 2-3 weeks, and I'll checking them out to death. Pretty much the only way I do things. I was the kid who got the new toy and took it apart and broke it the first day.

Spring Link
https://www.suspension-store.com/YSS_twinshock_springs#filter:b12aec10790b9a20a4ea01d2bcabd067

Conversion Link
https://www.convertunits.com/from/N/mm/to/pound/inch

[Knapdog]

found my post from last yr which I forgot to bookmark.

OEM std/tourer shocks spring rate all years.
problem with '97-'98 std/tourer shocks is the compression and rebound valving, hence the harsh ride. '99-'03 all shocks all models have better valving for a great ride.

Std/Tourer shocks spring rate

setting

1  120   lbs
2  132.5
3  145
4  157.5
5  170

OEM I/S  shocks spring rate

setting

1  140   lbs
2  155
3  170
4  185
5  200

how to take apart showa shocks

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eKIFnxjSehE

progressive shocks spring rate

412 std/tourer

120/170 lbs

412 I/S

140/200

416 all models

125/180

per VTX sites the Triumph Rocket III shocks fit and are 12.5" eye to eye.  spring rate is 140/200

Thank you.
This is very interesting.

I have put Interstate shocks on my '98 Tourer. I weigh around 180lbs.

What exactly does "Shock Spring Rate Setting" mean?
I currently have my setting on #2, which you have as 155lbs. Due to my weight should I therefore have it on #3 or even on #4, presumably to stop it bottoming out?

[98valk]

found my post from last yr which I forgot to bookmark.

OEM std/tourer shocks spring rate all years.
problem with '97-'98 std/tourer shocks is the compression and rebound valving, hence the harsh ride. '99-'03 all shocks all models have better valving for a great ride.

Std/Tourer shocks spring rate

setting

1  120   lbs
2  132.5
3  145
4  157.5
5  170

OEM I/S  shocks spring rate

setting

1  140   lbs
2  155
3  170
4  185
5  200

how to take apart showa shocks

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eKIFnxjSehE

progressive shocks spring rate

412 std/tourer

120/170 lbs

412 I/S

140/200

416 all models

125/180

per VTX sites the Triumph Rocket III shocks fit and are 12.5" eye to eye.  spring rate is 140/200

Thank you.
This is very interesting.

I have put Interstate shocks on my '98 Tourer. I weigh around 180lbs.

What exactly does "Shock Spring Rate Setting" mean?
I currently have my setting on #2, which you have as 155lbs. Due to my weight should I therefore have it on #3 or even on #4, presumably to stop it bottoming out?

your welcome.

setting rate is the starting spring rate, spring pushing back from compression which goes higher as it compresses.

I have same shocks on my std/tourer, setting 2 should be good for your weight which would be more with all of your clothing and ATGATT.  if it is a firm stable ride under most conditions then its a good setting.  if u are going to ride hard/fast in the twistys, then the next setting might be warranted to prevent bottoming, since the suspension will see more force.

There is always the SAG measurement procedure one can do to fine tune, which most who ride very aggressive do.

[Peteg]

I agree. I also have the following thoughts: If you feel your bottoming prematurely at level 2 with interstate shocks (no trunk @ maybe 25 lbs) your springs may be at the end of their service life. Pretty much all you can do is go to a higher setting. All springs take a set and get shorter from use. If you bought them used, you don't know the mileage, load, or road conditions the shocks have seen. You can have the spring rate checked by a shop or check them yourself, but I would suggest the following. First make sure you have good grommets. Then set the shocks to level 5 and see if there is a noticeable improvement in handling on familiar roads (the bottoming will get better) but I suggest you focus on the overall feel of the bike. If you like level 5 the best that's an indication the springs are at end of service life. Unfortunately the shocks really aren't serviceable, although there is some reported success. Next I would say check the sag with you on the bike or your equivalent weight on the bike. There are lots of good videos on how to check sag. Most will tell you to check the travel distance of a point on the frame to the ground. Loaded sag should be 30% of full travel. I just measure the sag on the shocks as 30% of travel as data is so hard to find on travel distance. My guess on these bikes is fully compressed shock length for all models is about 10". So jack up the bike and measure the fully extended shock and see if you have the standard 13" shocks (from center of eye to center of eye). If so your loaded sag should bring the loaded shock to 12". My shocks are special 12 1/2" so I look for a sag of 3/4" or 11 3/4". If your needing level 5 to get to target sag with one passenger - good bet your springs are at end of life.

The reason for the 30% is when a standard shock is compress over a bump it compresses twice as far as it returns past normal riding position. So if you go over the design basis speed bump that fully depresses the shock to the bump stop, it returns full stroke to the top of travel, the tires stay on the road, and you don't get bumped off.   

[98valk]

I agree. I also have the following thoughts: If you feel your bottoming prematurely at level 2 with interstate shocks (no trunk @ maybe 25 lbs) your springs may be at the end of their service life. Pretty much all you can do is go to a higher setting. All springs take a set and get shorter from use. If you bought them used, you don't know the mileage, load, or road conditions the shocks have seen. You can have the spring rate checked by a shop or check them yourself, but I would suggest the following. First make sure you have good grommets. Then set the shocks to level 5 and see if there is a noticeable improvement in handling on familiar roads (the bottoming will get better) but I suggest you focus on the overall feel of the bike. If you like level 5 the best that's an indication the springs are at end of service life. Unfortunately the shocks really aren't serviceable, although there is some reported success. Next I would say check the sag with you on the bike or your equivalent weight on the bike. There are lots of good videos on how to check sag. Most will tell you to check the travel distance of a point on the frame to the ground. Loaded sag should be 30% of full travel. I just measure the sag on the shocks as 30% of travel as data is so hard to find on travel distance. My guess on these bikes is fully compressed shock length for all models is about 10". So jack up the bike and measure the fully extended shock and see if you have the standard 13" shocks (from center of eye to center of eye). If so your loaded sag should bring the loaded shock to 12". My shocks are special 12 1/2" so I look for a sag of 3/4" or 11 3/4". If your needing level 5 to get to target sag with one passenger - good bet your springs are at end of life.

The reason for the 30% is when a standard shock is compress over a bump it compresses twice as far as it returns past normal riding position. So if you go over the design basis speed bump that fully depresses the shock to the bump stop, it returns full stroke to the top of travel, the tires stay on the road, and you don't get bumped off.   

springs can be changed out. 

[Glaserbeam]

Thanks to all for giving great info.  Now I know that stock Standard shocks would be better for me than Interstate shocks, but I don't know which one is on my bike.
Where would I find the part number or other indication that I have either the Standard or Interstate shocks on the bike?

[98valk]

lower part of shock there should be a Showa sticker with a letter/number.  MBY-671 is the I/S shocks.

[Challenger]

I have I/S shocks on my STD at #2 setting. I weigh 175. Ride is plenty soft. Wondering if one of your shocks are seizing up internally. Does it squat when you sit down on it. Will it squat further when a passenger jumps on?

[98valk]

also the OEM upper shock bushings most likely need replacement. once gone  a harsh ride will happen.

[Glaserbeam]

My shocks are MBY-671 - that explains why they're too stiff - they're the Interstate shocks.  What's the code number or part number for the Standard shocks? 

And I had replaced the shredded mounting bushings when I got those shocks (had gotten the shocks on eBay and seller didn't indicate they were for the Interstate).  They work, they're just wrong for the bike and load.

Thanks again, all!

[Joe333x]

My shocks are MBY-671 - that explains why they're too stiff - they're the Interstate shocks.  What's the code number or part number for the Standard shocks?  

And I had replaced the shredded mounting bushings when I got those shocks (had gotten the shocks on eBay and seller didn't indicate they were for the Interstate).  They work, they're just wrong for the bike and load.

Thanks again, all!

A cheap pair of progressive shocks will be better than any 20+ year old shock unless they were taken off and never used. I replaced mine with progressive 412s, progressive tells you that you need heavy duty with an interstate but I wanted softer not harder shocks and ride 90% 1 up and am only around 160lbs so felt it made more sense to go with standard duty. So far I am happy with them, definitely better than the stocks that came on the bike. Plus with progressive theres no bushing to wear out.

I went with 12.5 but stock is 13. I went with progressive springs upfront which are also 12.5 so I wanted to match and am 5'7 and now I can flat foot the bike.
Progressive Suspension 412-4209C Chrome 12.5" Standard Low Buck Factory Replacement Rear Suspension Shock https://a.co/d/6k4CGTc

[Glaserbeam]

Is Showa 52500-MZ0-A41 the right one for the Standard?  Is it also known as MZ0-003?

[Chrisj CMA]

My shocks are MBY-671 - that explains why they're too stiff - they're the Interstate shocks.  What's the code number or part number for the Standard shocks? 

And I had replaced the shredded mounting bushings when I got those shocks (had gotten the shocks on eBay and seller didn't indicate they were for the Interstate).  They work, they're just wrong for the bike and load.

Thanks again, all!

I like my interstate OEM shocks on my standard. You can send me those wrong shocks if you want

[Glaserbeam]

Chris, I will definitely place a For Sale ad for them here as soon as I replace them with late-model Standard A41 shocks!

[Peteg]

I have a pair of 12.5 1998 Showa's if anyone want to buy them LOL.

[Glaserbeam]

I installed Showa 52500-MZ0-A41's on my Standard, and they are MUCH better than the Interstate shocks.  They actually compressed a bit when I bounced on the saddle ... the I/S shocks never did that.  Thanks to all your help!  I'll be listing the I/S shocks here soon.  They look like new.

[98valk]

I installed Showa 52500-MZ0-A41's on my Standard, and they are MUCH better than the Interstate shocks.  They actually compressed a bit when I bounced on the saddle ... the I/S shocks never did that.  Thanks to all your help!  I'll be listing the I/S shocks here soon.  They look like new.