Toilets and Subfloors

[ArmyValker]

Ok, I went to replace the wax ring under the toilet today (It was leakin) and realized the subfloor is in terrible shape. I'm gonna need to rip it out and replace it. That bein' said... how hard is it to replace the flange for the toilet, and is their anything I need to know besides
rip out the floor, cut a hole, stick a new flange on there, screw it down and it's good to go? I've done subfloor before, but not around a toilet.

[Ratdog]

Ok, I went to replace the wax ring under the toilet today (It was leakin) and realized the subfloor is in terrible shape. I'm gonna need to rip it out and replace it. That bein' said... how hard is it to replace the flange for the toilet, and is their anything I need to know besides
rip out the floor, cut a hole, stick a new flange on there, screw it down and it's good to go? I've done subfloor before, but not around a toilet.

Personally, I like to put a bead of caulk between the flange and the floor (generous) before securing it... as well as a good sealer on the new piece of subfloor (like "Kilz"), if it's going to be something like sheet goods for your finish surface, or T/G wood, or a laminate material.  If it's going to be a multi-piece material (T/G, or laminate, etc), I like a bead of caulk between the pieces, or a waterproof glue (to keep future spills on the surface).  Then I like to do a generous bead of caulk between the flooring surface and the underside of the drywall before the moulding goes down.  I also put the moulding on with a bead of sealant between the bottom of the moulding and the floor's surface.  

[laserpat]

There are different types of flanges. One type is a brass flange soldered onto a lead stub, a job for a plumber too much heat will melt the stub(pipe) there is also a stamped metal over pvc flange.  Home depot sells repair flanges.

[Clark]

Ok, I went to replace the wax ring under the toilet today (It was leakin) and realized the subfloor is in terrible shape. I'm gonna need to rip it out and replace it. That bein' said... how hard is it to replace the flange for the toilet, and is their anything I need to know besides
rip out the floor, cut a hole, stick a new flange on there, screw it down and it's good to go? I've done subfloor before, but not around a toilet.

   just dont forget to WASH YOUR HANDS when yer done

[Ratdog]

Ok, I went to replace the wax ring under the toilet today (It was leakin) and realized the subfloor is in terrible shape. I'm gonna need to rip it out and replace it. That bein' said... how hard is it to replace the flange for the toilet, and is their anything I need to know besides
rip out the floor, cut a hole, stick a new flange on there, screw it down and it's good to go? I've done subfloor before, but not around a toilet.

   just dont forget to WASH YOUR HANDS when yer done

And, it's NOT F.L.G. !!!!  (Finger Lickin' Good)   

[fudgie]

Usually the flange never needs replaced. Is it cast iron or PVC? Just clean it up and see if its broke.
Normally you will have 3/4 subfloor with 3/8 or so on top for your linoleum or such. You can piece the 3/4 around it and cut a hole for the 3/8 and put it over. If you do replace the flange, I think it has to be 14" from the wall to center. Make sure your wax is warm when you put it on the toilet. I like the ones with the rubber inside the wax. Sometimes, just sometimes, you'll have to use 2 rings on top of each other. A tip, put your new toilet flange bolts on and use the old nuts to secure it to the flange. This will keep the bolts from moving as you set the toilet.

[fudgie]

Ok, I went to replace the wax ring under the toilet today (It was leakin) and realized the subfloor is in terrible shape. I'm gonna need to rip it out and replace it. That bein' said... how hard is it to replace the flange for the toilet, and is their anything I need to know besides
rip out the floor, cut a hole, stick a new flange on there, screw it down and it's good to go? I've done subfloor before, but not around a toilet.

   just dont forget to WASH YOUR HANDS when yer done

Yes, wear your rubbers. 

[f6john]

Usually the flange never needs replaced. Is it cast iron or PVC? Just clean it up and see if its broke.
Normally you will have 3/4 subfloor with 3/8 or so on top for your linoleum or such. You can piece the 3/4 around it and cut a hole for the 3/8 and put it over. If you do replace the flange, I think it has to be 14" from the wall to center. Make sure your wax is warm when you put it on the toilet. I like the ones with the rubber inside the wax. Sometimes, just sometimes, you'll have to use 2 rings on top of each other. A tip, put your new toilet flange bolts on and use the old nuts to secure it to the flange. This will keep the bolts from moving as you set the toilet.

     Standard rough-in for for most toilets in the last 30-40 years is 12" off the wall. 14" rough in toilets are still available for replacements. Naturally if yours is currently 14" off the wall you would not want to change it. If the flange is broken and the sewer pipe is either cast iron or lead I like to remove the damaged brass flange and replace it with a PVC flange designed to fit inside the existing sewer pipe. They are available at Lowes and even though they are a little pricey at around $20.00 they are easy to use and very effective. I've been using them for a couple of years now in my remodeling business with no problems. If you go this way it makes it easier to repair the wood portion of your job as you are not trying to fit your wood under an existing flange. It is always important to me to have a good solid surface under my new flange to hold the screws that attach the flange to the floor.

[ArmyValker]

Thanks for the help guys. One more question... may be stupid but,
what's the torque spec on them toilet bolts ? Seems like you can turn them forever and squish that wax ring down, but doesn't seem to me that you'd wanna do that too much...

[f6john]

Thanks for the help guys. One more question... may be stupid but,
what's the torque spec on them toilet bolts ? Seems like you can turn them forever and squish that wax ring down, but doesn't seem to me that you'd wanna do that too much...

 


    Kind of like exhaust header bolts on the Valk. Snug them down, make sure the toilet base is sitting flush on the floor and not able to rock side to side. Check them again after a day or so to snug them down again if necessary.

[Ratdog]

Thanks for the help guys. One more question... may be stupid but,
what's the torque spec on them toilet bolts ? Seems like you can turn them forever and squish that wax ring down, but doesn't seem to me that you'd wanna do that too much...

You just want 'em snug.  Hog down on 'em and you're likely to crack the china base.  A bead of clear around the foot of the base will help to keep it firmly in place for you.

[fstsix]

Sit on it with all your weight and let it settle into into the wax on the flange, and just snug them as said above.

[ArmyValker]

Perfect that's what I needed 

[ArmyValker]

Imagine my joy when I yank up the old subfloor and find... low and behold... 3/4 particle board underneath...

Boy I wish I could strangle that guy that lived here before sometimes.

Instead of replacing the obviously rotten subfloor, this dipshit put 1/4" plywood overtop and called it a day... oh well, I'll fix it. (like always) 

 

[X Ring]

AV, I feel your pain.  Friday morning the feed line on the toilet in the front bathroom separated.  Due to the rare snow day, I didn't dare go anywhere.  Saturday morning, I went to the hardware store got a new feedline, valve, hold down bolts and wax ring.  There's no telling how long ago the wax ring was even looked at.  When I pulled the toilet, I discovered the osb around the toilet was rotten.  Even worse the boards under the osb were crumbling and one was completely missing.  As I'm planning to complete gut the house and remodel it, I decided to just patch the floor to get me through the next couple of months.  Found a 2x4 ft piece of 1/2" plywood in the shed along with some deck screws.  It was bigger than the rotten part of the floor.  Used deck screws to secure the flange to the plywood and the plywood to the floor.  When I put the toilet on its side, I discovered the wax ring was no longer there.  No wonder everything was in such bad shape.  It was 40* in the bathroom with absolutely 0 chance of the wax ring sticking to the bottom of the bowl.  I ended up doing what fstsix told you.  Then I used a 4 inch crescent wrench to snug the hold down bolts.  The master bathroom toilet will almost throw you to the floor if you try to sit on it.  It's not being used so I will wait until I gut the house to tackle it.

Marty

[fstsix]

Just a thought, this could be considered water damage by your Homeowners ins, not considered a flood, i would call my agent, just in case, guess what i do for a living 

[X Ring]

Uh, you're an insurance agent? 

[ArmyValker]

Just a thought, this could be considered water damage by your Homeowners ins, not considered a flood, i would call my agent, just in case, guess what i do for a living 

Yeah that's true.. I ended up replacing the subfloor and buying a new toilet (old one was made in the 60's) and it still cost less than my deductible would've cost, so I guess it's a moot point.

Boy, spending the day ripping out subfloor, and pickin up toilets definitely ain't no good for folks with back problems. I think I'll lay here awhile and decide whether or not I'm gonna go ahead and rip out that old vanity while I've got the flooring up....

[ArmyValker]

AV, I feel your pain.  Friday morning the feed line on the toilet in the front bathroom separated.  Due to the rare snow day, I didn't dare go anywhere.  Saturday morning, I went to the hardware store got a new feedline, valve, hold down bolts and wax ring.  There's no telling how long ago the wax ring was even looked at.  When I pulled the toilet, I discovered the osb around the toilet was rotten.  Even worse the boards under the osb were crumbling and one was completely missing.  As I'm planning to complete gut the house and remodel it, I decided to just patch the floor to get me through the next couple of months.  Found a 2x4 ft piece of 1/2" plywood in the shed along with some deck screws.  It was bigger than the rotten part of the floor.  Used deck screws to secure the flange to the plywood and the plywood to the floor.  When I put the toilet on its side, I discovered the wax ring was no longer there.  No wonder everything was in such bad shape.  It was 40* in the bathroom with absolutely 0 chance of the wax ring sticking to the bottom of the bowl.  I ended up doing what fstsix told you.  Then I used a 4 inch crescent wrench to snug the hold down bolts.  The master bathroom toilet will almost throw you to the floor if you try to sit on it.  It's not being used so I will wait until I gut the house to tackle it.

Marty

yeah, sounds like your was worse than mine... I got that particle board up and the 2X8 's *I think* underneath where in fine shape. It was a pain in the ass getting all that PB outta there, but I got some 3/4" Sub-floor, cut it arounod the flange, and it was good to go. Then I layed some underlayment on top of that, so we are ready for finish flooring once I decide whether I'm up for a new vanity.

[fudgie]

Might as well while your at it. Stop at the shower. 

[fstsix]

Yep what Fudgie said, by the time you try to fit around the cabinet, it will be just as easy to put it square to your tub, also make sure you use exterior grade plywood so if you get wet again. hopefully you have no mildew behind the walls, that's why i mentioned the Ins, thing, these things sometimes are worse than most expect. if you have children with asthma or allergies.