Valve Stem

[9Ball]

I'm not too sure you want the stems with the nuts on the inside.....there's no safe way to ensure they remain tight or in place and you might be creating a bigger hazard than staying with the stock setup....

Locktite is your friend!  
How many people have had failures with these valves? I doubt very MUCH that they are more than a very few .... but MANY of us have had those on our Valks for many years/miles/kilometers.  

I agree with you to a point, but there are better designs than those witth the nuts on the inside...especially if you're looking for something much safer and durable than the OEM.

Myself, I stay with the OEM and replace the stems at each tire change.  I alsoinspect the black plastic pieces as part of my pre-ride checks and carry spares when travelling.

I'm not sure locktite is truly the answer...I'd prefer a better grade of valve if my life is depending on it (which seems to be the reason some are changing to metal valves in the first place).

YMMV...

[Valkpilot]

There have been no catastrophe reports relating to the stock Honda tire valve stem.

There have been a lot of "could have been a catastrophe" reports from a lot of faint hearts.

This is just another case of "crying wolf" from a lot of riders thinking they have found the holy grail of tire valve stems.

Just as threads posted would make you think "hydrolock" is a common and widespread occurrence, so is it with the "valve stem" instant death following.

I'm sure with a little prodding the "death wobble" faction along with the double rear wheel modification afficionado's can surely be enticed to join in the widespread condemnation of Honda's offering of a wonderfully engineered motorcycle being so poorly executed.

***

I know of two catastrophic accidents in which the likely cause was the failure of a stock valve stem.  

But, you are correct in that valve stem failure, hydrolock resulting in damage, and u-joint failure are all much discussed but seldom actually experienced by the larger population of Valk owners.  However, when they do happen to an individual owner, they're a very big deal.

My stand on hydrolock and valve stems is that the potential negative consequence far outweighs the low probablilty of occurence.  Easy and inexpensive preventative measures are available, so why not exercise them?

[quexpress]

I'm not too sure you want the stems with the nuts on the inside.....there's no safe way to ensure they remain tight or in place and you might be creating a bigger hazard than staying with the stock setup....

Locktite is your friend!  
How many people have had failures with these valves? I doubt very MUCH that they are more than a very few .... but MANY of us have had those on our Valks for many years/miles/kilometers.  

I agree with you to a point, but there are better designs than those witth the nuts on the inside...especially if you're looking for something much safer and durable than the OEM.

Myself, I stay with the OEM and replace the stems at each tire change.  I alsoinspect the black plastic pieces as part of my pre-ride checks and carry spares when travelling.

I'm not sure locktite is truly the answer...I'd prefer a better grade of valve if my life is depending on it (which seems to be the reason some are changing to metal valves in the first place).

YMMV...

I should have typed: If you are worried about it, locktite could help.

I have not used locktite because there are 2 nuts on the end of the Patchboy valve.



After tightening these 2 together, I have never thought about it again. 

[Farther]

How about removing the two nuts and replace with one nylock nut.

[Tropic traveler]

Had the factory style stems complete with the plastic retainers on Kim's '98. Constant 2-3 lb. pressure loss per week. Removed stock style stems & replaced them with the external nut style from Jake Wilson last month. No more pressure loss.
To be fair the stock style stems were of unknown age & origin. Also cleaned & reseated the bead but used the same tire.

Bought 6 of the external nut stems.  Eventually all our bikes will have them.
Also have the internal double nut style stems on my '97 for over 40,000 miles with zero pressure loss. 

[Tim H]

I'm not too sure you want the stems with the nuts on the inside.....there's no safe way to ensure they remain tight or in place and you might be creating a bigger hazard than staying with the stock setup....

Locktite is your friend! 
How many people have had failures with these valves? I doubt very MUCH that they are more than a very few .... but MANY of us have had those on our Valks for many years/miles/kilometers. 

Thanks for the thing that triggered me to say "Duh!"  I have some Loctite just for the occasion.  If they can only be installed like that then they'll get the treatment.

[Disco]

I know of one near-fatal catastrophic oem valve stem failure (one of the ones Valkpilot refers to) - at least the multi-year lawsuit concluded it was the valve stem - and one that nearly caused an accident last July on our way to InZane.  It might have caused an accident had it not been for the size and strength of the rider. 

Patchboys are great, just be sure to get them really tight.  IMO, the ones from Jake Wilson are a better design.

Re the plastic retainer being the weak link, I believe it's the absence of the plastic retainer that allows the deformation that leads to the catastrophic failures of old oem stems.  The mere presence of those retainers - the fact that they are even needed - is indicative to me that the oem stem is a lesser product than the patchboys or Jake Wilson options.  Throw in the fact that unless you do your own tire work, watch it being done, or purposely destroy your oem stems prior to a third-party tire change, you have no guarantee the third party will replace an oem stem or reinstall the retainer.  I would agree that if the oem stems are changed at every tire change they would most-likely never be a problem.  But for 2 bux a piece...

There have been no catastrophe reports relating to the stock Honda tire valve stem.

Ricky D, I can't figure you out.  One day you're up.  The next day you're down.  You've provided lots of good input since I've been here.  You've also come up with questionable input.   That's OK, but I have to draw the line at dangerous input.  For example, do you remember the advice you gave (with no smileys) to use WD-40 to stop brakes from squealing?  Your post here has to be some of the, well...  Please consider doing a favor for the less-experienced who rely on this site for good and safe information and remove it.

I'm sure with a little prodding the "death wobble" faction along with the double rear wheel modification afficionado's can surely be enticed to join in the widespread condemnation of Honda's offering of a wonderfully engineered motorcycle being so poorly executed.

I don't know which Valkyrie you ride but, if it's a Standard or Tourer, have you done the headlight relay mod?  Or, do you ride an Interstate that came with a headlight relay?  Do you have an aftermarket horn that actually makes noise?  Brighter headlight bulb(s)?  Auxiliary lights up front?  Headlight modulator?  Have you converted your rear turn signals to running lights?  Flashing brake lights?  Auxiliary brake lights?  Avon Tires?  Heaven forbid, a DS tire?  Dyna Beads or Ride-On?  Progressive fork springs and/or shocks?  Clearview or Cee Bailey windshield? 

Get my point?  The Valkyrie is a great motorcycle, but lots of people have come up with lots of things that lots of other people believe are safety/reliability improvements.  $4.00 per bike is about as cheap an upgrade as I can think of. 

[The Anvil]

Re the plastic retainer being the weak link, I believe it's the absence of the plastic retainer that allows the deformation that leads to the catastrophic failures of old oem stems.

That's exactly what I mean when I say "weak link".

[Willow]

Even with the plastic retainer in place one can still flex the valve stem sufficiently when inflating the tire to weaken and eventually crack the base.

I guess I'd have to concede that if a rider replaces the eleven dollar OEM stem with every tire change and is careful to support the stem when airing the tire, the chance of failure can be reduced to almost nil.

On the other hand, one could install a five dollar metal stem, stop worrying about supporting it when inflating the tire, and replace it every ten years just in case.

I experienced two valve stem base failures before going to metal stems.  No catastrophes resulted, but they were significant annoyances.

The choice seems pretty obvious to me.  However if one wants to herald the supremacy of OEM Honda design while riding a Valk with a pingle petcock and a tire on the back originally marketed for a four wheeled vehicle, well, after all it is a free country in which we live.

Consider the source.

[Jess from VA]

Disco, excellent post.  I have read here and elsewhere of valk traumatic valve stem failures with rapid air loss while riding.  (You'll likely survive a rear, but a front could be terminal)

However, if the retainer elbow departs the bike, the stem doesn't have to be very old to fail after a few weeks of riding.

I would also add, if you want to stay OEM, since the OE stems AND ELBOWS (they fall off because of fatigue) should be changed at EVERY tire change to be safe, it's actually cheaper over the life of the bike to do the lifetime upgrade of metal stems, even my $33 billet Anchor stems.  (yes, one could eventually fail, though it'll be a few years before we hear of it happening, if ever).

So, it can save your life and it's cheaper than OE.  I rest my case.

[Tropic traveler]

The choice seems pretty obvious to me.  However if one wants to herald the supremacy of OEM Honda design while riding a Valk with a pingle petcock and a tire on the back originally marketed for a four wheeled vehicle, well, after all it is a free country in which we live.

Consider the source.

ZIIING!!!!!!!!!

[The Anvil]

Even with the plastic retainer in place one can still flex the valve stem sufficiently when inflating the tire to weaken and eventually crack the base.

That's eventually what happened to Eddie's rear stem block which is why you really should still support the outer radius of the bend while putting air in. I think that plastic piece is just there to prevent centrifugal force from throwing it outward at speed and it has the wheel itself for support in that job. It can take a pretty hard push to overcome the valve pin on some chucks, especially one putting out over 100psi.

[Sodbuster]

Had the factory style stems complete with the plastic retainers on Kim's '98. Constant 2-3 lb. pressure loss per week. Removed stock style stems & replaced them with the external nut style from Jake Wilson last month. No more pressure loss.
To be fair the stock style stems were of unknown age & origin. Also cleaned & reseated the bead but used the same tire.

Bought 6 of the external nut stems.  Eventually all our bikes will have them.
Also have the internal double nut style stems on my '97 for over 40,000 miles with zero pressure loss. 

Those Jake Wilson ones look like the better design - Is the part that sits in the rim Rubber or Neoprene ??

[gordonv]

What more can I say, the first thing I did on my new-to-me bike, was check the air in my tire, and while applying presure on the valve stem with the gauge, I broke the support.

Now I use my air compresser which is a screw on line, to check my presure. Needs air? then I just plug it onto the battery and fill. This way there is no presure applied to the stem.

I bought the billet style replacements, and am waiting for a tire change to replace the stem.

[Sodbuster]

FYI - The billet type website is apparently defunct

[Jess from VA]

FYI - The billet type website is apparently defunct

No it's not.  These are the billet stems I have, and I doubt they will ever fail.  They lay nearly flat on the wheel.

See notes, on cutting the T's off the wheel to allow the stems to face the high side of the bike (right).  Losing the T (which hold the elbow) is no big deal, it's not like you'll ever go back to an OE stem.


http://www.motorcycleanchor.com/tire_valves/index.htm

[Disco]

Which Jack Wilson stem?  Got a link?

Here you go, Mase.  (it's Jake Wilson)  90 degree metal valve stems with the nut outside the wheel

[Tim H]

So the ones I ordered and the ones that came in were two different items, but that's a good thing I think.  These seem to be better quality than those that were pictured.  I took a photo of the 4 valve stems that I bought for $10 in a layout where you can see pretty much all sides.  It tightens from the inside of the rim, but uses an allen instead of just a regular nut.  Loctite will put my mind at ease for the joint not loosening.  These seem more heavy duty.  I guess we'll see how they'll be for the long haul, but they seem like they'll work.

[John U.]

Where did you order them?

[Tim H]

I found these guys on the bay today.  My Metzler ME880 Front just came in today.  I shopped around town for some stems, but came up with less than satisfactory ends.  I search online again and these turn up.  It's a set of 4, I hope they work out okay.  They look very similar to the patchboy.

90 DEGREE CHROME METAL VALVE STEMS 1.75" LONG SET OF 4

This is post with the link.  I'm sure there will be plenty left, and they're not a bad price.

[Tropic traveler]

So the ones I ordered and the ones that came in were two different items, but that's a good thing I think.  These seem to be better quality than those that were pictured.  I took a photo of the 4 valve stems that I bought for $10 in a layout where you can see pretty much all sides.  It tightens from the inside of the rim, but uses an allen instead of just a regular nut.  Loctite will put my mind at ease for the joint not loosening.  These seem more heavy duty.  I guess we'll see how they'll be for the long haul, but they seem like they'll work.

What country did those stems come from??
The arrangement, Yikes!!

[Tim H]

I figured somebody would go there. 

[cantom]

Thank you to all of those on here that have warned people to dump the factory tire stems. A very valuable service. Thank you also to Hay Hauler for sending me 2 of the new Jake Wilson stems with the outside nut. A very nice nice product that and 2 of them now live in my Valk's wheels.

Yes, that's blue Loctite running down the rim in the pic, I'll give that a wipe. 

Breaking the bead on the rear tire was a bit tougher but did em both on the bike, up on the bike jack, with little issues. A little bit of dish soap on the rim bead area and the beads both easily popped back on with a little air. I used 2 pieces of oak and a new, quality 8" C clamp.

Unless you're having problems with the OEM stems, I'd leave them alone. Mine have been there 11 years now with no problems.

I disagree very strongly with this advice and I hope you are kidding..

If you run the OEM stems, they are a steel stem part with a rubber insert that holds it in. A rubber insert just like your car stems, and they should be changed with EVERY tire change.

However, not only are they rubber, they are crap as well. They are simply a bad design. They are subject to failures that result in rapid loss of air...ESPECIALLY at high speed They are dangerous. They suck. They blow. They should not even be on a riding lawn mower, much less a motorcycle.  (getting my point? ).

Friends don't let friends run OEM stems. If you have them, ditch them. If you've not changed them with every tire change or they are more than two years old, replace them now and don't ride till you do.

Clear yet? Change the damn stems. Single most dangerous part on your motorcycle.

[FryeVRCCDS0067]

So is it pretty well a given that the oem retainers are no longer needed with the Jake Wilson stems?

And, I also owe Hay Hauler a thank you for sending me a couple of Jake Wilson stems too.
It's much appreciated Hay Hauler, thanks.

[Jess from VA]

No Mike, they are not necessary,  metal stems do not flex under torque.

I have seen them reused with 90* metal stems, but to me, that just adds weight to the valve stem side, to be balanced with more weights on the wheel.  And if they are used, it means the Ts have not been cut off and the stems are aimed at the low side.... not a big deal on the front, but a PITA on the back if there are bags, esp big hardbags.

 

[Daddie O]

Which is more likely to leak, rubber or metal?  Which is cheaper to purchase, rubber or metal?  Which look better, rubber or metal?  Nuff said.

[Willow]

Rubber.  Metal.  Metal.

All the answers for which you could hope.