Shot on vacation! It happened to a cop. It could happen to you!

[Titan]

I know this topic has been hashed before but I always think about folks who wonder why we (some of us) carry guns. Anybody who thinks that it can't happen to them are living in a fantasy world. In this case it happened to be a cop on vacation.

I just wish there was a better way to carry while on the Valk (related!) so you could actually get to it while still in motion.


I've posted the copy of the article here so you don't have to go to another link...
-------------------
When two gunmen tried to rob a New York City detective vacationing in Miami Beach last weekend, he fought back hard.

The veteran of 27 years on the force opened fire, wounding both attackers who accosted him and also shot him in the courtyard of a hotel on Collins Avenue.

Those details of the events during Saturday's attempted hold-up of Det. Harold Thomas, 48, were revealed for the first time Thursday as police announced the suspects' arrest -- and how Thomas' quick actions helped solve the case.

Thomas' family flew down from New York and was present at the news conference while Thomas remained at Jackson Memorial Hospital recovering from a gunshot wounds to the thigh that damaged his femoral artery.

"Twenty-seven years on the force and you come out on vacation and something tragic like this happens," said one of Thomas' two sons, Brandon, 23.

Arrested were Francisco Henriquez, 35, who is charged with attempted felony murder and is being held in a Miami-Dade County Jail, and Mustafa Lee, 28, who is also charged with attempted felony murder and is being held in a Broward County Jail medical ward.

One of the wounded gunmen sought medical care in Broward County hours after the attack, raising suspicions that led to the duo's arrest.

Police said Thomas had been in town vacationing with two other NYPD detectives, one of whom had a wife celebrating a birthday. The group spent Friday evening at Mansions. Early Saturday, Thomas escorted the group to another hotel blocks from where he was staying at the 1233 Lofts.

According to the report, as he returned to his boutique hotel and walked through a courtyard to his room, the men followed him and tried to rob him.

Thomas ran a few feet and hid behind a nearby tree and drew his firearm, exchanging shots with the men before they fled wounded and empty handed, police said.

Responding Miami Beach officers found Thomas "bleeding profusely on the floor and...unconscious."

"They [the suspects] left Det. Thomas as dead on the ground," said Miami Beach police spokeswoman Det. Vivian Hernandez

Later that day, while Miami Beach police were still at the scene of the shooting, a break in the investigation came. A Plantation police officer called to say a suspicious gunshot victim had arrived at the Plantation Hospital around 9 or 10 a.m. seeking treatment and was scheduled to be transferred to Broward General Hospital.

The victim turned out to be Lee, who was later identified by Thomas in a photo line-up. Lee had been wounded in the leg and lower extremities.

Henriquez was grazed in the ribs and DNA evidence left at the scene helped to identify him, Hernandez said.

Henriquez and Lee have extensive criminal histories, and the former was on probation, police said.

Henriquez has had a slew of felony arrests dating back to 1997, including a second-degree felony involving a homicide. His latest was a 2010 armed robbery.

Lee has similarly had a range of felonies. He was charged with strong-arm robbery in 1999 and aggravated assault with a firearm in 2004.

Thomas is now conscious and will be receiving skin graft surgery at a later date. The two other NYPD officers whom he was with have returned home.

His family says they're thankful the tough detective survived.

"He's the backbone of our family,'' Brandon Thomas, 23, said. "He's everything to us."

[fudgie]

Glad he made it. 

As far as carring on the Valk, how do you carry that you cant get it while in motion? It would be rare to use it while in motion tho. My 40 is on my left hip. Easily obtainable while on the bike. The one in my vest is a tad slower to get at tho.

[The Anvil]

I've always practiced some shooting left handed, just because you never know. I've also practiced drawing left handed from a left handed holster that I have specifically for riding which is a little trickier because I need to disengage the safety before I draw the weapon as it's not ambidextrous on my primary carry gun.

[RoadKill]

I've always practiced some shooting left handed, just because you never know. I've also practiced drawing left handed from a left handed holster that I have specifically for riding which is a little trickier because I need to disengage the safety before I draw the weapon as it's not ambidextrous on my primary carry gun.

Glock has MULTIPLE ambidextrous Safetys all in ONE MOTION !     But practice ,practice,practice..Left and right hand    "just because you never know."  Damn right !

[The Anvil]

I've always practiced some shooting left handed, just because you never know. I've also practiced drawing left handed from a left handed holster that I have specifically for riding which is a little trickier because I need to disengage the safety before I draw the weapon as it's not ambidextrous on my primary carry gun.

Glock has MULTIPLE ambidextrous Safetys all in ONE MOTION !     But practice ,practice,practice..Left and right hand    "just because you never know."  Damn right !

I've actually thought about getting a Glock or perhaps even a wheelgun for carry when I'm riding for that reason.

[fudgie]

Bersa's have ambi safeties and mag releases. I find the standard right hand? mag release easier to use by my left hand. I dont use safties so that is not a issue for me. I have a TCP that I carry in my pants, boot, or vest, depending on the application. It has no safty. I also dont/wont chamber a round in it unless I'm ready to fire. It has no hammer. I hate hammerless guns. 

[KW]

Glock are used/issued by 65% of all police agencies in America now. There’s a reason for that WAY beyond pricing. It’s a great gun with legendary accuracy and dependability. The fact they’ve been able to achieve the status they have, in what? 40 years? Is amazing!

FULL DISCLOSER: I own three Glocks (22, 23 and 27) that I purchased at our Department price (A benefit that continues even though I’m retired!)  I also had the privilege of attending their Armorer class two times. I also was able to attend Remington’s and Rugers (Ruger issued certificates that entitle 'attendees' to purchase one Ruger, any model, at factory cost. No expiration.)  All three gun manufactures ran a first-rate, professional, informative, well organized class, but Glock was exceptional.

I just like Glocks. . . .

[BigAl]

Tank Bag is an option a friend of mine uses.

Gun in Tank Bag.

Side pocket that will allow you to slide it out.

One Handed.

But shooting from a moving vehicle is precarious at best.

I tend to use evasive maneuvers, brake hard to get behind them, or in a pinch drop a gear and gas it.

Get in a better position and maybe even let them think it over and the confrontation may be over at that point.

[The Anvil]

Bersa's have ambi safeties and mag releases. I find the standard right hand? mag release easier to use by my left hand. I dont use safties so that is not a issue for me. I have a TCP that I carry in my pants, boot, or vest, depending on the application. It has no safty. I also dont/wont chamber a round in it unless I'm ready to fire. It has no hammer. I hate hammerless guns. 

So you walk around with an empty chamber? To each his own, but I personally would not do that.

I love shooting Glocks, I really do. They are great guns. Accurate, comfy and reliable. But I just don't like the idea of not having a manual safety.

[Bigun]

I've actually thought about getting a Glock or perhaps even a wheelgun for carry when I'm riding for that reason.
[/quote] I'm a Police firearms instructor/armorer and carry strong side cross draw when I'm on the bike. I practice with my left hand as well as my right so either way I'm gonna hit what I shoot at. Dont overlook the SIG DAK series pistols they seem to be much safer to carry than a Glock and still have a decent useable trigger. I carry a full sized stainless 1911 off duty Lightly customised and fully ambidextrous and a SIG 229 DAK on duty. I feel well armed with both.

[fordmano]

Another SUCK reason to live in Kalifornistan, at this very moment I am strugglng with the thought of risking the legal issues related to unlawful concealed carry for my trip to Vegas on the Valk with friends next week.

My childrens mother (AKA: Wife, love of my life, my primary reason for breathing) will be with me so my persoanl safety is only a small part of my consideration.

[fudgie]

Bersa's have ambi safeties and mag releases. I find the standard right hand? mag release easier to use by my left hand. I dont use safties so that is not a issue for me. I have a TCP that I carry in my pants, boot, or vest, depending on the application. It has no safty. I also dont/wont chamber a round in it unless I'm ready to fire. It has no hammer. I hate hammerless guns. 

So you walk around with an empty chamber? To each his own, but I personally would not do that.

Not in my Bersa. Its chambered. The TCP is my BUG. If I do only carry the TCP, its where 'its not allowed' and what I do its better that its not chambered.

[fudgie]

Another SUCK reason to live in Kalifornistan, at this very moment I am strugglng with the thought of risking the legal issues related to unlawful concealed carry for my trip to Vegas on the Valk with friends next week.

My childrens mother (AKA: Wife, love of my life, my primary reason for breathing) will be with me so my persoanl safety is only a small part of my consideration.

The guy that taught my Utah class lives in Ill. He still carries. He said he was not killed doing 2 tours in the sand and will not be killed on his own soil. He said he will reap the precutions.

I dont know about Kali if you have a permit or not but you do ,you can transport across State lines if the clip and gun are separate in a non passenger compartment. Its the FOPA laws. Might want to look into it.

[fordmano]

Nope no permit, they just are not available here. I know there are some permits given out but last time I checked into it (a long time ago) they are up to the discretion of each county sherrif and the county I live in will only allow 300 active permits at a time back then. San Jose has well over a million residents and the county is probably 2.5 millionor more,,, you do the math I ain't getting one in this crap state.

I know all about legal transporting of weapons in this state and if a bullet can touch a metal gun part including a clip your probably looking at some troubles with the local Po-Po.
Now the state police Highway patrol are a little easier going especially if they stop a traveler. I was told by a Highway Patrolman that when traveling they would allow a loaded out of immediate touch weapon in a car but probably not gonna slide with one loaded cocked and locked on your persons... That said I called the local Higway Patrol office and they about took my head off for accusing and officer of telling me to directly break the law they actually yelled at me on the phone and said if I was caught with a loaded firearm in my car even locked in the trunk they would have me on fellony weapons transporting charges with arrest and vehicle impound and all passenger arrested with me....

So if we travel in the car I carry loaded clip in glove box and gun in trunk with another loaded clip hidden back there... I have never "traveled" out of the area on a bike since I was old enough to own a gun in California....

[fudgie]

Remember, they need a resonable articulate suspicion to search your vehicle/ person. Getting a speeding ticket wont work. So if you dont leave drug paraphnilia laying around I doubt you will get searched. BUT this is something I would do (not the drugs) and hate to give 'illegal' advice. Use your own decretion and not mine. If that makes sence. 

[rmrc51]

I've been around guns all my life. From the time I had my first .22 as a kid, through my service days and then in various gun clubs while also being an NRA instructor. Although I've always held a concealed carry permit, I never did.

For some reason,, after reading this latest post regarding the NYC police detective being shot while on vacation, I now find my self at 60 years of age, 'convinced' that I must re-evaluate my position. I have to go into town for other reasons this afternoon so I'll be making an additional stop. The Gun Shop to take a look at a Glock model 19.

[The Anvil]

I've been around guns all my life. From the time I had my first .22 as a kid, through my service days and then in various gun clubs while also being an NRA instructor. Although I've always held a concealed carry permit, I never did.

For some reason,, after reading this latest post regarding the NYC police detective being shot while on vacation, I now find my self at 60 years of age, 'convinced' that I must re-evaluate my position. I have to go into town for other reasons this afternoon so I'll be making an additional stop. The Gun Shop to take a look at a Glock model 19.

I typically carry when I go to certain parts of town (that I don't go to often) but just around my hometown I don't bother. 

A few years ago I did almost have to shoot my way out of a riot at Laconia though. That was hairy.

[Titan]

How does one arrive at the notion that it's not necessary to carry in "certain areas"?

[The Anvil]

How does one arrive at the notion that it's not necessary to carry in "certain areas"?

High crime areas typically.

[Titan]

[Titan]

How does one arrive at the notion that it's not necessary to carry in "certain areas"?

High crime areas typically.

As opposed to "low crime areas" such as perhaps churches? Just one example of many.

18 church shootings in 11 years (A comprehensive list)

http://www.defensivecarry.com/forum/general-firearm-discussion/98256-18-church-shootings-11-years-comprehensive-list.html

[The Anvil]

I'm aware that it can happen anywhere. But when they day comes that I feel the NEED to take my gun to my church is the day I move somewhere else entirely. I used to carry a lot more than I do these days but I don't want to become one of those paranoid androids who stashes guns in every imaginable crevice "just in case". I have a few, I know where they are when I need them and I know how to use them. That's good enough for me. I've lived that paranoid life and it's not really living in my opinion.

[KW]

Will everyone PLEASE stop saying Glocks don’t have a safety? In fact, they have THREE (3) internal safeties and CAN NOT discharge by being dropped, banged, hit, sledgehammered, or even thrown against a brick wall. You MUST pull the trigger in order to get a Clock to go ‘bang!’ They’re easily as safe as any wheel gun.  A Glock won’t go off unless there’s a finger squeezing the trigger.

What many (most) people are really talking about when they refer to a ‘safety’ on a gun is a trigger or action lock. Personally, I think external switch safeties are extremely dangerous.  I won’t delve any further into this because it ends up being a car tire or type of oil debate.

http://www.glock.com/english/pistols_adv01.htm

[fudgie]

How does one arrive at the notion that it's not necessary to carry in "certain areas"?

 

[The Anvil]

Will everyone PLEASE stop saying Glocks don’t have a safety? In fact, they have THREE (3) internal safeties and CAN NOT discharge by being dropped, banged, hit, sledgehammered, or even thrown against a brick wall. You MUST pull the trigger in order to get a Clock to go ‘bang!’ They’re easily as safe as any wheel gun.  A Glock won’t go off unless there’s a finger squeezing the trigger.

What many (most) people are really talking about when they refer to a ‘safety’ on a gun is a trigger or action lock. Personally, I think external switch safeties are extremely dangerous.  I won’t delve any further into this because it ends up being a car tire or type of oil debate.


http://www.glock.com/english/pistols_adv01.htm

I'm aware of the Glock's safety system and I personally never said they don't have "safeties". But I happen to think that manual safeties (i.e; external switch safeties) are an extra measure of protection when you find yourself in a protracted situation. I've drilled with my weapon enough to be confident with the safety. I don't see it as a hindrance.

[Bigun]

Will everyone PLEASE stop saying Glocks don’t have a safety? In fact, they have THREE (3) internal safeties and CAN NOT discharge by being dropped, banged, hit, sledgehammered, or even thrown against a brick wall. You MUST pull the trigger in order to get a Clock to go ‘bang!’ They’re easily as safe as any wheel gun.  A Glock won’t go off unless there’s a finger squeezing the trigger.

What many (most) people are really talking about when they refer to a ‘safety’ on a gun is a trigger or action lock. Personally, I think external switch safeties are extremely dangerous.  I won’t delve any further into this because it ends up being a car tire or type of oil debate.

http://www.glock.com/english/pistols_adv01.htm

 Alot depends on the holster you use, thumb breaks on certain synthetic holsters can and have caused the deaths of Law Enforcement Officers, I dnt find the Glock to be particularly unsafe but do not recomend them to first time handgun owners. If you are well schooled in firearms and keep the booger hook off the bang switch they are great reliable and accurate guns. I have done trigger jobs on some of my friends Glocks that are competative shooters that are just as good as anything I can do with a 1911 but Iwould not advise them for Concealed carry. A New York trigger however is as safe as any revolver and what I would advise for CC use. I have carried a C&L 1911 since I got out of the service in 1989 and carried one in the service as a MP so I am thouroughly trained on the weapon and take every opportunity to continue my education with it

[SPOFF]

No one has pointed out the obvious: the wisdom of vacationing in one of the crime-ridden "occupied" areas of the U.S. -- in this case Little Cuba. I won't even bother on commenting that neither of these animals should've been out of prison.

[Nickster]

I carry my full framed kimber 1911 in my vest.  Cant even tell i got it.  But as for on the valk i have a holster zipped tied to my handle bar. It tucks in nicely behind my batwing fairing and thats where my nickle plated .38 rides.  I can get it with either hand and up here in alaska we can carry guns.  You all can keep those cali gun laws down south.

[FryeVRCCDS0067]

I'm left handed which of course, is a help. When riding I carry a Kel-Tec 380 in a sewn-in holster in my left boot. It's a right-hand inside the waistband holster which doesn't cost much. It goes inside the boot on the outside-side of my leg if that makes sense? The waistband clip made it easy to try different sections of the boot till I found what was comfortable, then I used a leather awl to sew it in. The Kel-Tec's are double action only with no manual safety and I carry it with a loaded chamber. Never tried pulling and firing it while riding but it would be a ball if I had access to the right place to practice such a thing safely.

I changed to this form of carry after a close call on an off-camber, washed out gravel road corner in the rain. Two pitbulls and a doberman came charging at me from a rundown house as I negotiated the corner. I was going way to slow to avoid them and had no choice but to continue slowly due to the road conditions. I kept my feet on the pegs, didn't kick at the growling, barking beasts and in effect, just ignored them and hoped one didn't stop in the road in front or me or grab my leg.

When I got home I started thinking about another from of carry when riding instead of my pants pocket which was useless in that situation. I ride in short sleeves with no vest so it didn't leave many options. Been using the boot holster for several years and many miles now with no problems.