99 I/S Neutral indicator glowing while in gear when bike is warm

[jer0177]

Oddest problem, popped up while on my last business trip (Pittsburgh to Port Huron, then on to Niagara Falls and back to Pittsburgh).

When the bike's cold, the neutral indicator works just like it's supposed to, but when the bike warms up, the indicator begins to glow.  It's an LED indicator, so 'backfeed' through it to a ground isn't an option.  I pulled the double diode and it went out (and the diode tested OK too), but put it back in, and it glows again, as long as the bike is warm (and on).  It does it with the sidestand up or down.

Any ideas?  Neutral switch going bad? 

[Gryphon Rider]

High beam/neutral/turn indicator bulbs are incandescents, not LEDs, unless you have a custom setup.  Of course, this will cause it to glow without a good ground connection in the ground wire system.

[jer0177]

High beam/neutral/turn indicator bulbs are incandescents, not LEDs, unless you have a custom setup.  Of course, this will cause it to glow without a good ground connection in the ground wire system.

On the Standard and Tourer, they're incandescents, but on the Interstate, they're LEDs.

http://www.rattlebars.com/valkfaq/schematics/rpage11.html

[Gryphon Rider]

I just did a Google image search of "valkyrie interstate dash" and was amazed by how the first image was photographed!

[Ferris Leets]

I did not see anything in that chart indicating and LED.  I had my (99 IS) dash open and they are standard auto bulbs.

[jer0177]

I did not see anything in that chart indicating and LED.  I had my (99 IS) dash open and they are standard auto bulbs.

The backlights are stanndard bulbs, but the illumination for the directional, neutral, engine temp and oil pressure indicators is provided by LED.  The absence of those being indicated on that chart indicates that they don't use a replaceable bulb, and when I had mine apart that far - they're LEDs on the circuit board.

Part number 5 here http://www.mositesmotorsports.com/fiche_section_detail.asp?section=148531&category=MOTORCYCLES&make=HONDA&year=1999&fveh=3473 is the circuit board, and you don't see 6 light sockets going through it.

[Ricky-D]

I can't see a grounding switch such as the neutral switches acting like a potentiometer.

They are either on or off!

There is something making a poor connection when it gets hot, and feeding it in to that circuit.

I'd look back at the board for clues, I'd clean it good with a solvent if necessary.

***

[jer0177]

I can't see a grounding switch such as the neutral switches acting like a potentiometer.

They are either on or off!

There is something making a poor connection when it gets hot, and feeding it in to that circuit.

I'd look back at the board for clues, I'd clean it good with a solvent if necessary.

***

If that were the case, when I pull the double diode, it shouldn't affect the 'glow', but removing the diode shuts the light off, correct?

[eric in md]

mine did that 90 thousand miles ago really think something got wet , never did find what it was never had a problem since . good luck . ps nice looking bike

[jer0177]

mine did that 90 thousand miles ago really think something got wet , never did find what it was never had a problem since . good luck . ps nice looking bike

That could be - it was washed between my last trip and this one.

How long did it do that to you?

[PhredValk]

Had the same thing with my GL1100, N on all the time. My first and most elegant solution was a small patch of black duct taped over the light. Eventually I undid all the tape on the bundle of wires that went from the bike to the headlight assembly and found the two wires that had rubbed a naked spot and were touching. Taped them, and the harness up and solved.

Not heat related, but some circuits are. It's wire may be shorting with the ECT wiring somewhere.
Fred.

[jer0177]

Thanks Fred.

If it was on all the time, I could troubleshoot it, but with it only being a faint glow (when I click into Neutral, it goes full-bright), and only while hot, it makes it a PITA to troubleshoot.

[Ricky-D]

It would be a help to have the electrical schematic for your Interstate at hand.

And the comment about water intrusion holds real merit.

If that is the case, a dry wait would reveal the truth of the matter.

***

[jer0177]

It would be a help to have the electrical schematic for your Interstate at hand.

And the comment about water intrusion holds real merit.

If that is the case, a dry wait would reveal the truth of the matter.

***

Here's the entire schematic on one (very large) page: http://www.rattlebars.com/valkfaq/ISschem.jpg

Here is the first page of a broken down set: http://www.rattlebars.com/valkfaq/schematics/rpage02i.html

(They also have the wiring diagrams for the Standards / Tourers)

I was thinking about the drying issue, and I washed the bike on Sunday, rode to Michigan on Wednesday, rode to Niagara Falls on Friday, and then home on Saturday, and it was still doing it on Monday when I was out and about for a dr's appt.  What could get so wet that it'd stay wet a week (and literally hundreds of miles) later?

[Ferris Leets]

QUOTE
The backlights are stanndard bulbs, but the illumination for the directional, neutral, engine temp and oil pressure indicators is provided by LED.  The absence of those being indicated on that chart indicates that they don't use a replaceable bulb, and when I had mine apart that far - they're LEDs on the circuit board.

Part number 5 here http://www.mositesmotorsports.com/fiche_section_detail.asp?section=148531&category=MOTORCYCLES&make=HONDA&year=1999&fveh=3473 is the circuit board, and you don't see 6 light sockets going through it.
[/quote]

I was thinking of the backlight bulbs.  You are correct about the indicators.  Would be a pia if they go out.

[BlueValk]

[/quote]


I was thinking about the drying issue, and I washed the bike on Sunday, rode to Michigan on Wednesday, rode to Niagara Falls on Friday, and then home on Saturday, and it was still doing it on Monday when I was out and about for a dr's appt.  What could get so wet that it'd stay wet a week (and literally hundreds of miles) later?

[/quote]

Well, at least there are only a few reasonable choices.  Unless the other one of the double diodes is leaking (and I doubt that), then the leak turning on the LED is coming from either the neutral switch, the ICM, or the wiring to one of those.

If it was the neutral switch, I would hope that jiggling it would make a difference (I'm guessing it did not).  IF you could disconnect the 4 pin connector going to the neutral switch, that would tell you a lot (depending on the results)  I don't know, but am guessing it is in the neck area on the right side behind the black plastic cover.

The ICM is probably not leaking current to the LED. 

So, I side with a partial short between two wires.  A good place for that to happen and stay wet might be the ICM boot.   Another good choice is at the connector behind the neck cover.  Some of those have boots on them as well and could hold moisture.

I agree that trouble shooting an intermittent problem is a pita.  Good luck!

BlueValk

[Novavalker]

It could be the splice plug connector which is only associated with Interstates

"Problems with this splice plug may be associated to the following:

•   Stop Lights;
•   Clutch Lever Switch;
•   Side Stand Switch;
•   Neutral Switch;
•   Alternator turn on and voltage sensor wire;
•   Bank angle sensor and relay
•   General grounds


There may be more, there is at least one report of the LCD display also being involved.

These problems may be hard (always there) or soft (sometimes there).

The problem is that this splice plug is located below and in front of the battery box. In a place that is subject to rear tire splash. It is protected under one layer of harness tape. "

It feels like a square block inside the wiring harness.

The aforementioned information in quotations is an excerpt from the splice plug repair document.

I had LCD display issues with my Interstate a few years ago and completed the repairs outlined in the splice repair document.


There is no guarantee this will solve you neutral light issue. I would locate the splice block and give it a wiggle to see if has any effect on your neutral light. At this stage you have nothing to loose.

If you want the splice repair document send me a PM and I'll email it. The instructions are a MS Word document with pictures. The only way to rectify issues with the splice is removing it from the wiring harness.


Due to the crappy design of the splice plug and the location its only a matter of time before these gremlins appear.

[hubcapsc]

Sometimes (twice that I remember, I probably remember them all) my tourer lies to me and
says it is in neutral when it is not (the green light is on).

I'm sure I look like a dope mashing the starter button with the bike in gear and the clutch out, but it is so
easy to trust the usually-correct neutral light.

The first time it happened, I had just been bragging on Valkyries to the guy at Mark of the Potter,
then he watched as I walked out to my bike and acted like a klutz trying to start it.

The next time, all the guys who I traveled with to HotGlue's with saw that the light was
lying to me.

Maybe someday it will result in something worse than looking klutzy...

-Mike "what if it started..."

[RP#62]

Take the 4-pin red connector at the steering head loose.  That will isolate the neutral switch.  If it still glows, its finding a ground somewhere else.
-RP

[jer0177]

It could be the splice plug connector which is only associated with Interstates

"Problems with this splice plug may be associated to the following:

•   Stop Lights;
•   Clutch Lever Switch;
•   Side Stand Switch;
•   Neutral Switch;
•   Alternator turn on and voltage sensor wire;
•   Bank angle sensor and relay
•   General grounds


There may be more, there is at least one report of the LCD display also being involved.

These problems may be hard (always there) or soft (sometimes there).

The problem is that this splice plug is located below and in front of the battery box. In a place that is subject to rear tire splash. It is protected under one layer of harness tape. "

It feels like a square block inside the wiring harness.

The aforementioned information in quotations is an excerpt from the splice plug repair document.

I had LCD display issues with my Interstate a few years ago and completed the repairs outlined in the splice repair document.


There is no guarantee this will solve you neutral light issue. I would locate the splice block and give it a wiggle to see if has any effect on your neutral light. At this stage you have nothing to loose.

If you want the splice repair document send me a PM and I'll email it. The instructions are a MS Word document with pictures. The only way to rectify issues with the splice is removing it from the wiring harness.


Due to the crappy design of the splice plug and the location its only a matter of time before these gremlins appear.

Went out to bike night tonight and by the time I got home, the indicator was glowing, so I popped off the seat, moved the radio out of the way, removed the battery cover and jostled the wires in front of the battery box and lo and behold, it went out!

Argh...I read through the procedure you sent me...I guess I'll wait to see if it happens again and if it does, tear into it.

Thanks for the info!!

[Walküre]

I just did a Google image search of "valkyrie interstate dash" and was amazed by how the first image was photographed!

You mean this one? I've seen that guy's photo here before - something about "man boobs"...sick, eh??

[Jess from VA]

Nice headlights............... can't see if they're on dim or brights though.

[Mr.BubblesVRCCDS0008]

Now you've done it my kickstand indicator is starting grow I mean glow.