Refurbing a Valk

[jabster]

Hi.

So something like 5 years ago, with the arrival of the second kid, I was unable to winterize my 1998 Valkyrie Tourer. Family issues and what not kept me from getting to it until now. I'm in Chicago, and it has been kept in the garage the whole time. I have about 25k miles on it.

So, I realize I have a lot of work ahead of me, and I'm looking for any advice while I try and get this Beast running again.

I've got the tank and airbox off so far, and will start pulling the carbs off next to clean them out.

While I'm down there, I am going to replace all the fuel and air hoses. Are there any improvements I can make while I'm in there? I'm not so much looking to rejet or desmog or anything; I'm thinking more along the lines of anything I can do to make it more robust that will last longer than stock items and allow me to go longer without doing full rebuilds. For example, I've seen stainless covered fuel lines, but I don't know if those would be more robust or would just hide the decay as the years go by. Also seen some kind of marine, Coast Guard rated fuel lines.

I have a trigger wheel installed, and am planning to polish my intakes.

Here's the better part of my to-do list:
-Replace the rear wheel bearing(s?) when putting new tires on (I think I saw that someone recommended replacing the Honda part with a better bearing (Timkin?)
-Oil (duh)
-Transmission fluid
-Drain & flush radiator
-Drain brake lines and put in new fluid
-New tires
-Inspect inside of fuel tank
-Replace all hoses
-Lubricate control cables

Any thing else major I'm missing? Either to replace or at least check?

I've never had a problem with the stock petcock, so I'm not planning to replace that. Should I replace my control cables? Keep the brake lines or replace?

I replaced my radiator hose with a stainless covered one like a week after I bought the bike. Should I replace that, or does the stainless offer enough protection that I won't need to worry about that hose?

From reading here and other places, it also seems like I should be stocking up on spare parts since Honda no longer makes the Valk. I actually do have a spare set of brake pads lying around. Anything in particular I should be on the lookout for?

Thanks,
John

[old2soon]

Drain and replace clutch fluid. Brake and clutch both use D O T 4 fluid. Make sure all calipers(3) move freely. As a side note the engine oil is your transmission fluid. Might want to make sure the pistons in the brake calipers move freely also. Make sure nothing found a home behind the timing belts cover. Pay attention to the timing cover bolts-different lengths. I know i'm most likely missing some thing but there is a wealth of knowledge on this board. Good luck with the ressurection. Please let us know how goes it. When you get it runnung again-RIDE SAFE.

[9Ball]

I wouldn't worry about changing the transmission fluid....just change the engine oil instead.

It's a good list....new fuel lines, vacuum tubing, and carb drain tubing.  Don't go too exotic, not needed.  Redeyetech on ebay has some of the tubing and o-rings you need.

Good luck...shame on you for neglecting that bike!!!   

[Willow]

... I'm thinking more along the lines of anything I can do to make it more robust that will last longer than stock items and allow me to go longer without doing full rebuilds.

From reading here and other places, it also seems like I should be stocking up on spare parts since Honda no longer makes the Valk.

Longer without doing complete rebuilds?  I don't know of anyone who has done a complete rebuild.  How many miles do you think you'll put on that bike?

I wouldn't mess with the bearings unless they're bad.  

If it were me, I'd probably go ahead and rebuild the petcock just to give it a fresh start.  Don't forget to clean and lube the splines and remember both to include ends of the driveshaft.

Other than that what's on your list plus brake and clutch fluid should do what you need.

As for rarity of parts, I wouldn't pay much heed to the Chicken Littles of the world.  Stockpile what gives you peace.

[jabster]

Ok...maybe "complete rebuild" is not quite the right term..... ;-)

Don't forget to clean and lube the splines and remember both to include ends of the driveshaft.

Can you clarify that please?

One more thought...what about the fork oil?

thanks for the help.

-john

[old2soon]

Fork oil. If your happy with the ride and the forks aren't leaking It's all good. And if you do have a leaking fork seal-under no circumstances use a screw driver to put new seals in. Either find out if you can borrow the fork seasl tool or build one yourself. A little research here goes a long way. git er done and RIDE SAFE.

[Michvalk]

Search the tech page. There are many threads on splines and rear end maintanance. The splines are the connection between the rear end and the wheel. Needs to be greased, and there are O-rings in there that need to be replaced fairly often to keep the grease in. Usually pull the rear end and driveshaft and lube the splines on the driveshaft when I replace the rear tire. There is great advice available here, especially using the search on the tech page

[John U.]

+1 on rebuilding the Petcock. The possible result of a petcock failure is hydrolock, very bad, very expensive.
Get a "cover set" and the screen from HDL.
Check the Shop Talk section of this site for info on the rebuild process, lubing the splines and many other maintenance proceedures.
BTW, get your list together, HDL has a Labor Day sale going on the code is LABOR2011 10% 0ff, no handling charge over 199.00. No affiliation etcetera.

[valkyriemc]

Add a decent gas filter. You may knocking rust loose in the tank by cleaning it-nothing wrong with a clean out. But the carbs et.al may be your biggest issue.

[fordmano]

Well there is nothing better than patting yourself on the back so let me do just that,,,,,,,,

I hate to type so I will just throw out my input to some maintenance ideas and other farkely stuff, from my thread with bunches of pictures and a little bit of typing.

I sure do love showing off all my hard work... 

http://www.valkyrieforum.com/bbs/index.php/topic,21439.0.html


Take your time and have fun with that "Big Girl" she will love you for all your efforts, mine does.

[sugerbear]

before pulling the carbs, do all the other stuff and start her up. you never know, you could get really lucky and not need to pull them.  couldn't hurt.

[Jeff K]

... I'm thinking more along the lines of anything I can do to make it more robust that will last longer than stock items and allow me to go longer without doing full rebuilds.

From reading here and other places, it also seems like I should be stocking up on spare parts since Honda no longer makes the Valk.

Longer without doing complete rebuilds?  I don't know of anyone who has done a complete rebuild.

Yes you do. 

[Willow]

... I'm thinking more along the lines of anything I can do to make it more robust that will last longer than stock items and allow me to go longer without doing full rebuilds.

From reading here and other places, it also seems like I should be stocking up on spare parts since Honda no longer makes the Valk.

Longer without doing complete rebuilds?  I don't know of anyone who has done a complete rebuild.

Yes you do.   

Oops.  I stand corrected.     I was going to put in a caveat about under normal wear conditions or some such, but couldn't quite come up with the wording that suited me.    

[jabster]

Hi there. Me again.

Got a question.

I started to really take things apart this weekend, and when I went to drain my carbs, nothing came out. My wife thinks that I did drain the carbs, because I drained both my Valk and her Virago (since sold). I honestly do not remember.

So I see two possibilities here:
1) I did drain the carbs, and the only leftover gas was the little bit in my tank;
2) I did not drain the carbs, and everything is so gunked up in them that nothing will drain, what little gas there was evaporated, etc.

Here's the question then: Is #2 there likely? Or have I potentially lucked out and will not have to tear my carbs apart?

Even if #1, do I still need to tear the carbs apart? Or can I (eventually) put gas in the tank and ride away? ie: Besides gas in the carbs, is there any other reason I would need to take them apart after it's been sitting there for several years? Should I fill up the tank, ride away, and see how it runs, and THEN take the carbs apart if need be?

thanks,
john

[GOOSE]

put fresh gas in it with some techron additive, and start her up.......you really may not need to pull those carbs.

[Westsider]

you will need to remove the tank,  rebuild or replace the petcock as stated,- while the petcock is removed rinse out that tank with a couple gallons or so of fresh gas over a bucket and make sure its good and clean.- then  any problems are going to be down range of the tank.. might as well start at the top..you might be surprised or lucky ,one...but gas now days goes bad quick, so with a 6 carb machine, i keep the fuel tank full and the fuel in it  treated all the time....good luck, keep us posted...

[Kingbee]

I agree with Goose.  Just put 2 gal of gas & 1/2 can of Techron in the tank & see if she'll start.  You may want to manually supply vacuum to the petcock (via hose at #6 intake) for a minute or so to fill the carbs to save a whole bunch of cranking.  Maybe you want to drain the carbs at this point and fill them again before attempting to start her.

It's very likely some O rings will leak at the carbs, but it's been my experience that once the gas hits them, they might very well swell up in a day or two and be just fine.  Just shut the gas off & let her sit a day or two.

If she'll idle at all once warmed up, you're well on your way to possibly getting the carbs cleaned without taking them apart.  Your vacuum hoses may be just fine, it's heat, more than time that hurts them.

Whereabouts in Chicago do you live?

[sugerbear]

before pulling the carbs, do all the other stuff and start her up. you never know, you could get really lucky and not need to pull them.  couldn't hurt.

after that long, if its rubber - replace it, you will need new tires - trust me ! do bearing maintainance then. replace all vaccum hoses, when you do cut them about 4 inches too long, that way as they crack on the ends from heat, you can cut 1/2 inch at a time off and not need to replace them all.

carbs, if you don't need them boiled and new jets, consider yourself the luckiest person ever to own a valk. you got the hard part off, go ahead and pull them down, boil with gunk and by all means throw the slow jets in the trash and go with new ones.

forks ? if it aint leaking, leave it alone. it ain't a harley, it don't need all that.

and valks don't have transmission fluid, the engine oil takes care of that.

also replace the differential oil.

wash it good and ride it till one of you dies of old age. wouldn't put money on which one.

consider throwing that trigger wheel in the same can as the slow jets, keep it the way honda built it. you will thank yourself later.

i didn't think that was funny at all.

[97BLKVALK]

  Westsider

Save yourself the work on carbs fresh gas plus Seafoam or Techron this machine is an awesome lady!

Welcome back to the two inline crowd.

Michael

[rodeo1]

before pulling the carbs, do all the other stuff and start her up. you never know, you could get really lucky and not need to pull them.  couldn't hurt.

after that long, if its rubber - replace it, you will need new tires - trust me ! do bearing maintainance then. replace all vaccum hoses, when you do cut them about 4 inches too long, that way as they crack on the ends from heat, you can cut 1/2 inch at a time off and not need to replace them all.

carbs, if you don't need them boiled and new jets, consider yourself the luckiest person ever to own a valk. you got the hard part off, go ahead and pull them down, boil with gunk and by all means throw the slow jets in the trash and go with new ones.

forks ? if it aint leaking, leave it alone. it ain't a harley, it don't need all that.

and valks don't have transmission fluid, the engine oil takes care of that.

also replace the differential oil.

wash it good and ride it till one of you dies of old age. wouldn't put money on which one.

consider throwing that trigger wheel in the same can as the slow jets, keep it the way honda built it. you will thank yourself later.

i didn't think that was funny at all.

wasn't meant to be funny, except the part about putting some carb cleaner in and hoping that will work.

in a couple weeks, when you have tried every carb cleaner on the market you will understand. my point was to save a lot of time and heartache and change the slow jets from the get go.

i didn't i listened to all the carb cleaner talk as did a few others who had bought bikes that sat for a couple years with no seafoam or stabil in them. the third time i took the carbs out i wised up and ordered new jets, it has ran fine ever since. but by all means try everything else first.

 you will really get good at removing the carbs. once would have been plenty for me, and they need balanced every time you rip them apart. i actually spent $300.00 on balance guages i had them out so many times. if anyone is in western colo. and needs a free carb balance give me a jingle.

[sugerbear]

before pulling the carbs, do all the other stuff and start her up. you never know, you could get really lucky and not need to pull them.  couldn't hurt.

after that long, if its rubber - replace it, you will need new tires - trust me ! do bearing maintainance then. replace all vaccum hoses, when you do cut them about 4 inches too long, that way as they crack on the ends from heat, you can cut 1/2 inch at a time off and not need to replace them all.

carbs, if you don't need them boiled and new jets, consider yourself the luckiest person ever to own a valk. you got the hard part off, go ahead and pull them down, boil with gunk and by all means throw the slow jets in the trash and go with new ones.

forks ? if it aint leaking, leave it alone. it ain't a harley, it don't need all that.

and valks don't have transmission fluid, the engine oil takes care of that.

also replace the differential oil.

wash it good and ride it till one of you dies of old age. wouldn't put money on which one.

consider throwing that trigger wheel in the same can as the slow jets, keep it the way honda built it. you will thank yourself later.

i didn't think that was funny at all.

wasn't meant to be funny, except the part about putting some carb cleaner in and hoping that will work.

in a couple weeks, when you have tried every carb cleaner on the market you will understand. my point was to save a lot of time and heartache and change the slow jets from the get go.

i didn't i listened to all the carb cleaner talk as did a few others who had bought bikes that sat for a couple years with no seafoam or stabil in them. the third time i took the carbs out i wised up and ordered new jets, it has ran fine ever since. but by all means try everything else first.

 you will really get good at removing the carbs. once would have been plenty for me, and they need balanced every time you rip them apart. i actually spent $300.00 on balance guages i had them out so many times. if anyone is in western colo. and needs a free carb balance give me a jingle.

sooooooooooo, what your saying is. since it didn't work for you, it absolutely, positively, with out a doubt, WILL NOT work for him.

did i get that right?

[9Ball]

that's been my experience.....having done (or been a part of) 4 of these so far.  By time you get done paying for all the chemicals and putting up with a poorly running bike, replacing the slow jets with new ones would normally have been cheaper.  Plus, you have visual confirmation that everthing is clean and in order for long-term peace of mind.  The chemical solution doesn't allow replacement and inspection of all the drain hoses, vacuum lines, fuel lines, o-rings, and pilot circuit cleanliness.

It's a calculated risk, but everyone has to decide what makes sense for them.  I like doing the job thoroughly and enjoy a mechanical challenge.  It really is an easy job to remove the carb bank and can boost your confidence for doing more difficult maintenance work in the future.  I like the idea of keeping the dealer mechanics away from my pride and joy.  Unless you have a good Valkyrie mechanic, I've run into a couple of Honda parts counter people that don't even know that Honda made a Valkyrie.  There are probably quite a few young mechanics in the same boat, although I plan to never have to find out first hand.

YMMV

[VegasF6]

that's been my experience.....having done (or been a part of) 4 of these so far.  By time you get done paying for all the chemicals and putting up with a poorly running bike, replacing the slow jets with new ones would normally have been cheaper.  Plus, you have visual confirmation that everthing is clean and in order for long-term peace of mind.  The chemical solution doesn't allow replacement and inspection of all the drain hoses, vacuum lines, fuel lines, o-rings, and pilot circuit cleanliness.

It's a calculated risk, but everyone has to decide what makes sense for them.  I like doing the job thoroughly and enjoy a mechanical challenge.  It really is an easy job to remove the carb bank and can boost your confidence for doing more difficult maintenance work in the future.  I like the idea of keeping the dealer mechanics away from my pride and joy.  Unless you have a good Valkyrie mechanic, I've run into a couple of Honda parts counter people that don't even know that Honda made a Valkyrie.  There are probably quite a few young mechanics in the same boat, although I plan to never have to find out first hand.

YMMV

Do you know of a good write up on removing the carbs? I think it sounds kind of intimidating. Can you pull them out as a whole or do you have to split them off of the bracket thing that holds the 6 of them together?

[9Ball]

the best write up is the Honda service manual.....very detailed and yes, you remove the entire bank.  Unless you are experiencing fuel leaks at the rails there is no need to break apart the carb bank.  You'll get a lot of comments that you don't need to remove the bank to replace the jets, but you won't be able to properly clean and inspect the carbs unless you pull them off the bike.

There has been so much traffic on here regarding the carb cleaning you only need to do a search, grab a six pack, and read for quite a few hours.

Buy a shop manual and ask questions.

[NCGhostrider]

I just pulled mine and put them back on.   Follow the manual.  I pulled my slow jets and did a general clean up.  You should probably order the assorted vac hoses and o-rings that you will need.  A hand held vacuum pump is pretty handy, as is a bit of compressed air to blow things.

Pay attention to the clamps location and direction on the risers.  I had to pull my risers back off and change their position so I could get my right angle screwdriver to the mixture screw easier.  I polished my risers while I had them out, not sure how that helped things, but it is done.

Overall, I mostly satisfied my curiosity, replaced some things that I probably wouldn't have done if I hadn't pulled the carbs out.  Bike does run better and looks like fuel economy is a bit better.   You wil spend some time doing the pull and the reinstall.  I am fairly handy, and it took me several hours, but I am also particular about putting things back either like they come off or better if they are modified. 

Having a lift is a plus to keep things up where you can see them and be more comfortable.

Good luck!!!

Craig
99 I/S

[jabster]

Just a quick update....I now have all the fluids drained except I still need to drain and flush the radiator. Going to try to get to that next weekend.

I'm noticing a LOT of rust spots on my chrome now tho. I suppose elbow grease and polish for that, eh? Any suggestions for a good polish? I've used mother's a lot in the past.

I've still been to scared to peek in my tank yet, but does anyone have thoughts on Red-Kote tank liner liner? Just in case.

Also, can someone please provide a color picture of all the fuel lines etc under the tank? I missed disconnecting one before I pulled off my tank, and I'm not 100% sure where a couple of connections go. And it's hard to tell from the picture in the manual. Thanks.

Kingbee, I missed your post earlier. I'm on the northwest side of the city. Near Harlem & Irving.

John

[Kingbee]

Your easiest bet to get her going again, since you have the tank off, is to remove the petcock to drain the tank, then put a clean gal of gas in & shake it up a bit and drain again.  Repeat until the gas comes out clean, with no small particles.  Put the petcock back on, making sure the fuel screen is clean an in place & reinstall the tank.  The large & small lines coming from the front of the bike go on the petcock, the other small one coming straight up from in front of the seat area goes to the tank vent nipple.  Put 2 gal of gas in tank, along with a ten gallon bottle of Techron & see if you get lucky.
If you get a bunch of gas leaks from the fuel lines around the carbs, just stop, shut off the gas & let her sit for a day.  Gas lines and 0 rings will swell back up and most likely things will be fine.

I live in Glenview, so if you get her running, give me a shout.....

[salty1]

Mothers mag and aluminum works good with some elbow grease. Don't coat that tank if you can get away with it. There are alot rust removal products that can be used to clean it. Evaporust is available at Harbor Frieight. Once it's cleaned, keep it full.

[Paxton]

How 'bout new tires! Is the battery good? Are the switch assemblies on the handlebars free of gunk?
Is the 6-gear transmission with reverse still operational? 

BTW, if you paint her Black it will snap your neck then you can skip that list of pesky chores. 

Congratulations!

[jabster]

I hate to ask this......10w40 or 20w50?

Pretty sure I was running 20w50 back when I rode.

-john


p.s. Just came across Evans NPG+ Waterless coolant. Thoughts? Still have to drain the radiator.

[salty1]

10 W 40 should be your choice for Illinois weather. Take it for what it's worth.  Here in AZ, 20 W 50 would only be used during the hot summer months, temps above 100 F.

[jabster]

May as well keep this in the same thread...

So, I got the petcock kit, but things don't quite look right:


The back is my petcock. The front is from the kit.

Where does the bottom-right piece go?

And then there's this:


EDIT: Not sure why the link broke. Damn you google drive.


Do I just pull the diaphragm out and push the new one in there?

Or is that the wrong kit?

Thanks,
john


And how does one put a picture inline here anyways? Figured it out...

[whitestroke]

I'd stay away from doing any mods i.e. polishing intakes.  Get it running good so you have a baseline for a proper running bike.  Then you can start with mods one at a time.

[CASABROKER]

Start it up run it go from there.

[FryeVRCCDS0067]

Westsider

Save yourself the work on carbs fresh gas plus Seafoam or Techron this machine is an awesome lady!

Welcome back to the two inline crowd.

Michael

I agree concerning the carbs. Fresh gas with 1/2 can of seafoam (haven't tried techron, I'm happy with seafoam so no need to change). Run it a little, then drain the carb bowls and restart. Maybe let her sit with the seafoam/gas in the carbs for a day or two, then start her back up and see how she runs. Just watch closely for flooding. The only time I've seen a stuck float on a valk it would start dumping gas out the carb overflow nearly as soon as it was started. If that happens, shut off the gas, push her outside and don't try to restart until you've pulled the plugs to see which cylinder or cylinders are flooded. Then crank the motor over with the plug removed to blow out the excess gas. The gas will go 15' easy, so don't park where that will matter.

I've got a 97 with 91,000 miles and I haven't had to pull the carbs yet. Thought I might need to once but it was just bad vac caps on the intakes.

Your motor should be good for at least 200,000 miles without a rebuild under normal circumstances. At least one has made it over 400,000 and still going strong. I'm not sure what anyone could modify to do better than that.

I would buy a cover set and rebuild the petcock. I'd buy the in-tank screen at the same time and replace it when you do the petcock. Ditto what has already been said about the brake and clutch fluids. Drain the "dragon drool" too.

[hubcapsc]

I'm noticing a LOT of rust spots on my chrome now tho. I suppose elbow grease and polish for that, eh? Any suggestions for a good polish? I've used mother's a lot in the past.

Read this, follow the amazing links... I spent a lot of nickles and dimes replacing rusty chrome
bits and pieces when I got my tired Valkyrie... I haven't tried using oxalic acid on rusty chrome
yet, but I plan to...

http://www.valkyrieforum.com/bbs/index.php/topic,37234.0.html

...and... I really like the OEM fuel filter... whatever you do, remember that gas needs to
really flow like gangbusters when you turn the throttle wide open...

-Mike

[jabster]

Man. Putting that airbox back in and getting everything hooked up to it has probably been the hardest part of all this. Sheesh.

-john

[jabster]

OK. So I'm close.

I got the petcock to work correctly on a table top. ie: Hook up a hose, suck on it, and gas flows.

However, it does not seem to be working on the bike. Seems like it's not getting any vacuum applied to it. At first I figured it was was just taking a long time, so I sucked on the #6 (left side rear, number 6 right?) tube, hoping to get some gas down the line. Still won't start. So I disconnected the fuel line (at the redeye quick-disconnect) and the hose seemed dry. I put another hose on the nipple and sucked on that one, and when I disconnected the fuel line some gas leaked out.

Which leads me to believe either the vacuum line is bad or I'm not getting any vacuum to the petcock.

I double checked all my connections. (That I can see right now anyways.) Nine air box connections, all tight. Six manifolds, tight top and bottom, as well as the 12 screws. Petcock works manually. It's currently set to reserve.

I did replace all my vacuum hoses (redeye again). I did that awhile ago, and while I don't recall double checking everything before putting the air box back on, I do remember connecting everything so that I would not forget where everything goes.

I was cranking for a while and I can hear my brand new battery start to struggle.

Is there anything else I can quickly check? Any other ideas?

I'm so gorram close!

Thanks,
John

[Michvalk]

If your battery is low, the chances are it will not start. Battery needs to be at or near full charge to start. Put the battery on the charger and let it sit overnight. You could try jumping from a car battery, without the car running. 

[custom1]

The bike will not make enough vacuum until it's running. It's a catch 22 thing. Apply some vacuum orally (your word not mine) till the carbs fill up. Then try to start it. Some of the float needles may be stuck closed from sitting so long. Also haven't heard good things about those fuel disconnects. Do you have any dips in the fuel line? Has to be all down hill.