Need to pull and clean Carbs- Advice?

[BradValk48237]

All,

 I am having huge carb issues and I am not going to pay several hundred Dollars to have someone do what I should be able to do myself... this is the first time doing the carbs on a valk.... Lawnmower,  snowmobile, and one 2 barrel Chevy under my belt... so I know some of the basics, but it has been a long time!!!!

So that being said, I do have a Clymer that I use all the time, but....

1. What parts should I order ahead of time to make sure the bike is not down for a long period and replace just because? Should I just order new jets and replace?

2. Tips on what to use to clean them? I have Carb cleaner in the shop- but haven't used on carbs in years!

3. Tools or "special" items that I should have on hand. Dad suggested "thin "piano' wire to run thru the jets.......

4. Any Short cuts or tips to make the job go easier?

5. Any body in the Michigan area that would like a case of beer to help? 

Really, any advice would be great, cause its gonna happen....... I feel confident in my abilities, but any thing to make the job easier would be great.

Thanks in advance.

Brad

[sugerbear]

i used stabil on the little o=rings in the carbs to aid in assy.
use a toothpick to take them off(won't gouge anything that way)

redeye on e-bay has all the gaskets and 0-rings you need in one pack

http://www.ebay.com/sch/redeye.tech/m.html?hash=item35be0dfa87&item=230821853831&pt=Motorcycles_Parts_Accessories&vxp=mtr&rt=nc&_trksid=p4340.l2562

[John U.]

I found that cleaning the slow jets was not worth the effort. If the jets are badly clogged it can be nearly impossible to get piano wire through them, and you take the risk of scratching them which isn't good. Sudco has them. OEM are 35s some of us change them to 38s. Do a search of this board to decide.
The screws that hold the carb bowls are soft and easily buggered up. They look like phillips but are actually JIS (Japanese Industrial Standard) You can get JIS screwdriver bits here: http://www.rjrcooltools.com/vessel.cfm

Consider replacing the bowl screws with hex head SS, no more screwed up screws.

Also consider replacing the pilot screw O-rings. Redeye Tech has them along with the tiny washers that are easy to lose.

The O-rings on the fuel rails will shrink from being dry and will leak (maybe temporarily, maybe not) if they are not replaced. Redeye has them and also the bowl O-rings if yours are flattened out.

If you plan to do a full tear down, do one carb at a time. Someone recently posted a You Tube video on Valk carb rebuild. Search for it, it's worth watching.

Good luck

[Rokketman]

There is a dude on Youtube called D-ray that has an awesome video series on the Valk carbs and re-lining the tank.

If you type Valkyrie Carbs in youtube, you will see a 9 part series.  The carb breakdown starts on video 5. 

He does a great job showing how to tear it down, but not a good job putting it back together so just make sure you label your hoses and tubes as you take things down.  I replaced my float bowl screws because the stock ones are junk (and either are or will strip) with M-5 hex screws.

The redeye replacement gaskets is good.. i just ordered the float bowl gaskets becuase the rest seemed ok... just use a bit of automotive grease and Q tip when putting new ones back in to make it easier to put together... without it, they will want to slide out and it's kind of a pain.

Don't go searching for the "D" tool to remove the air intake screws... D-ray shows you how to remove them using a hack saw... i did this method and no problems... it is a bit scary to cut into your carb housing though.

There are methods of putting the air box in tying the intakes together with string... i did it and not a problem getting it back in. they will likely be cracked at the base.  Most say this won't affect the bike but if it bothers you get some silicone or the cement honda uses for this... don't have the specs for that as i chose not to.


In D-rays video, he has you removing the plastic  thing separating the engine from radiator.  i didn't and was able to remove the carbs without taking that out.

You may want to re-build the petcock while you are at it as well...

[Danny]

Take pictures while you tear down, good time to desmog while you are in there....Redeye has a few kits for desmog as well as oring kits, also might want to consider some petcock work or tank quick disconnect fuel line. Don't forget to order a air filter...might as well its coming off. I used two kinds of carb cleaner the paint soaker bucket kind and a few pressure cans, reassembled the o rings with a thin film of seafoam. I went ahead and replaced my slow jets and cleaned my old ones for spares...I used some light guage automotive electrical wire...just strip the insulation and cut one of the single copper wires out and smooth out the end so it does not scratch. Also get a few feet of small vac line in case you find some rotten stuff during tear down. I refrenced the downloadable shop manual for pointers and specs. Also lastly don't forget to sync after the job...I paid 50 bucks for my local shop to do it which was cheaper than I could buy all the stuff to do it myself. Things speed up significantly after you get the first few carbs rebuilt I am glad I did the job myself and had no experience with motorcycles or carbs of any kind. Good luck!

[shooter64]

Have you already tried the Berryman's (or other) cleaners and they didn't help?

[roadmap]

i just did mine and i could write a set of e-mail going over how i did mine man you need to order parts. i ended up taking my carbs off 4 times on parts that i needed to replace that i didn't order down time to long i ended up with a quick way to remove the carbs what parts are needed i decided to go with everything a extra few dollars really not a issue as far as safety and not having to have to worry about breakdown on a trip.
 i got advice from members and tips that really save me from becoming a well never mind. but i tried everything short cuts not replacing parts that needed to be changed. i live in ky almost to far to drive to help in person but can send e-mails and drink my own beer.
it took me 3 days to do the job just for the carb cleaning some parts are local to you most will take a week.

for me i only do one thing at a time a hell of allot easy to find  trouble if anything comes about.
 
i will spend the time if you need help write a few emails talk on the phone you can do this no adjustments are needed on the carbs just clean and replace parts the carb floats are not adjustable.
some of the parts you order you might think you can get around but a hydro loc can be a bad thing now that will cost a couple of thousands. so spend under 300.00 now or maybe thousands later
do not take any short cut . stay out of your local dealer prices are so much cheaper online

one thing to remember your bike has yrs left of riding i got mine from superbikes of maimi in oct. of 1996 so my 1997 has over 150,000 now and the last compression check still has great comp. like 160 to 170 on all cylinders that was when rebuilding the carbs tried to take short cuts. i thought about the spark (electrical) nope engine worn out nope (hell not showing any signs of wear) all of the time just a clogged carb, would not fire no matter what i did. 

thanks to this site and being one of the early members here i learned so much and saved myself so much money  i'm old now the bike is ready i have to admit it wore my out.

send me a message or e-mail   roadmap (at) insightbb. com

[98valk]

these type of o-rings should  only be lubed with silicon grease (dielectric grease same thing) before assy.

[BradValk48237]

thanks to all so far...

as far as some of the questions...

There is Berrymans in the tank no, and I plan to run through the tank to see if it helps, but I am not optimistic..... I think at least one carb is totally f'd and the bike is only running on 5 cylinders!.. I don't think the Berry will clean out a totally pluged carb... but will see...

I will be ordering new gaskets and all stuff from Redeye, I used some of his stuff already.. Vac plugs for the Desmog I already did thinking it was a vac leak....

The Petcock has been changed to manual, but I do have a spare cover set (new vac line from Redeye already)...... might do it put it back to stock, but have had it as manual for a month now (Didn't want have the bike down, thats why I modified the stoack petcock to manual) and it seems to be working fine, and I am always turning it off before I shut off the key, so it is becoming habit.....

I have had the bike for 3 years now, and to tell the truth, it always seemed to be a bit rough..... but until recently, I never had the chance to see what a Valk SHOULD run like.... now I definitely now how it should run and need to get mine there.....

Any more tips will be great and I am ordering things as we speak..... so I will try the Berrymans to see if it helps, but I'll bet the carbs have never been off and cleaned and it would just be good maint to do it now.......

Once again thanks for the advice so far...

Brad

[sugerbear]

these type of o-rings should  only be lubed with silicon grease (dielectric grease same thing) before assy.

B. S.

[Ricky-D]

Since you are not wanting to delineate the "huge carb issues" but rather want to jump right on in and disassemble the carburetor bank I wish you luck.

I cant imagine the results gained will be reflected in the work you contemplate.

There are many other resources and operations detailed in the archives regarding real and reported problems along with the actual type of repairs and approaches to fixing the problems that I feel you are placing the "cart before the horse" in your proposal.

Good luck!

***

[JC]

Sounds like you shouldn't have any problems based on your prior experience, it just that you get to do it 6 times. Now is also the time to consider the desmog while you're in there, if you haven't already done it. Expect to take a full weekend to do it right.

Get Redeye's full gasket kit http://www.ebay.com/itm/O-Ring-Kit-for-Honda-Valkyrie-Carburetors-Viton-GF-/330760138182?pt=Motorcycles_Parts_Accessories&hash=item4d02d72dc6and new slow jets. Don't fool with trying to clean them. I actually got a great deal on mine at the dealer, but that isn't always the case for everyone it seems. I went to 38 slows, but many stay with the 35's. 38's will cause the mpg to drop slightly, but I like em.

Load up on carb cleaner and a good acid brush, take your time and lay everything out in order, and only do one carb at a time. Dip seals in Seafoam before assembly. A good sync after reassembly should be all that's left to bring the beast back to life!

[BradValk48237]

Thanks Ricky...

 Trust me this is a last resort.....

Bike has been desmogged, new vac plugs, petcock fixed, .... still issues....

After reading another post just on here, I am going to pull the plugs.. especially #6 as I read that a leaking petcock can foul the plug and I did have that issued recently....

So if its not the plug/s( And it has good spark).... last thing it could/should be the is the carbs, gummed up.... I have the Berrymans in there, but I don't think it will clean out a totally plugged jet/s.

I did have a reliable Honda mechanic look at the bike and listen to the motor and he immediately said it was carbs... he is reasonable on price and quoted $450 to do it... and I have seen people being charged over $660 for the same work..... I have had no issue with him( others on the site have) as he has worked on my 3 different bikes for over 20 years.......

I don't have the money right now to pay and I think it would be good experience for me to do it, I do all my other work and each time I do something it makes me more familiar and comfortable with the bike......

But, believe me, it the last thing I really want to do..... but if its gotta be done, I'm going to do it!

Brad

[Fla. Jim]

I don't know if a "weaker" solution of Berryman B-12 will work...Maybe. If not or if you go to pull the carbs, while you have the gas tank removed , try a straight  Berryman internal carb soak and clean. Sure worked for me and I did not have to pull the carbs. Thanks again VRCC.

http://www.valkyrieforum.com/bbs/index.php/topic,45784.0.html

[custom1]

Moving the spring inside the petcock to the other side to make it "manual only" is not fixing it. If the 2 diaphragms are torn the fuel is still getting to the vacuum line to #6 carb. Run it then pull the vacuum line off #6 and see if it is wet inside. The vent on the bottom of the petcock should be dripping fuel also. There have been a couple threads about this exact problem recently. I would check this before pulling the carbs.

[98valk]

these type of o-rings should  only be lubed with silicon grease (dielectric grease same thing) before assy.

B. S.

I thought u block my posts.

but I guess u know more than o-ring companies and what they recommend for lubing o-rings.

http://www.theoringstore.com/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=343

Enjoy!

[custom1]

Brad, I was just looking back through some posts that you made about your petcock issues. What is the current state of the petcock? I read where you said you made it manual by removing the vacuum guts. Is that the way you did it? Did you plug the vent/drain on the bottom? Did you remove the vacuum line to #6?
Seems you have made a lot of mods recently. Could you have missed plugging something somewhere when you did the desmog? You also did the o-rings under the intakes? I would just double check all this stuff and make sure it is not sucking air in somewhere. Hate to see you spend money on the carbs if that is not the problem.

[Dozer]

Brad, I just went through this same thing with great success...and my slow jets were gummed up. Everything said here so far is dead nuts right. Make double certain thats your problem before you leap into it. I tried the chemical thing for three tanks of gas. I only had a minimal increase. As for running piano wire through the jets...I dont think thats a good idea. The slow jet holes are tiny...which is why they clog so easy. They also very soft and if you scratch them or nick them you may have even worse issues. Some people say you can soak them clean in carb cleaner and some say its just best to replace them. I replaced mine. Dead eye has a great quality kit, good parts and very good prices but no jets. He also has special tools you might need. Some have made their own. I bought mine...a pilot adjusting tool...worked well. Take lots of pics...LOTS of every nook and cranny and angles. I did and still had to come back here and ask for help. If thats what you decide to do, good luck. This is where you'll get the best help and guidence

[BradValk48237]

THe petcock has no guts!..lol

I used the outer ring of the 2 diaphragms as "O" rings and sealed the vacuum opening.... the #6 opening is plugged..... all of the vacuum plugs on the bike are new also..... the only tubing under the tank not new are the fuel lines.......

So the petcock is true manual......

[sugerbear]

these type of o-rings should  only be lubed with silicon grease (dielectric grease same thing) before assy.

B. S.

I thought u block my posts.


actually i did for a while, but decided i needed some chuckles.

the link you provided is for supplier nor a mfg. and looky looky, they sell o-ring lube.
imagine that
have a fun day

but I guess u know more than o-ring companies and what they recommend for lubing o-rings.

http://www.theoringstore.com/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=343

Enjoy!

[98valk]

these type of o-rings should  only be lubed with silicon grease (dielectric grease same thing) before assy.

B. S.

first off I don't know whay u called my first post BS.
I don't know your line of work, but most likely its not in the engineering field otherwise u wouldn't have taken issue with what I stated. here is a company that makes o-rings. if u read what requirements they state should be met for a lubricate, anyone can see that in most cases silicone grease meets those requirements and the reason why companies sell the grease for o-rings.
http://www.applerubber.com/seal-design-guide/special-elastomer-applications/index.cfm
is stabil a lubricate ? yes, but does it stay on the o-rings and protect them during heat cycles, most likely not.
do u hate everyone who has knowledge u do not?

[sugerbear]

these type of o-rings should  only be lubed with silicon grease (dielectric grease same thing) before assy.

B. S.

first off I don't know whay u called my first post BS.
I don't know your line of work, but most likely its not in the engineering field otherwise u wouldn't have taken issue with what I stated. here is a company that makes o-rings. if u read what requirements they state should be met for a lubricate, anyone can see that in most cases silicone grease meets those requirements and the reason why companies sell the grease for o-rings.
http://www.applerubber.com/seal-design-guide/special-elastomer-applications/index.cfm
is stabil a lubricate ? yes, but does it stay on the o-rings and protect them during heat cycles, most likely not.
do u hate everyone who has knowledge u do not?

no, i don't  HATE anyone. just smile when i run into someone who thinks they know everthing, when in reality they only quote what they find on the web.
i'm done messing up this thread.  

[BradValk48237]

Along with this,, where is a good place to order the slow jets?

Whats the advantage to 38's?

B

[98valk]

Along with this,, where is a good place to order the slow jets?

Whats the advantage to 38's?

B

www.sudco.com
or www.factorypro.com  which I use.

one benefit is if u use e10. ethanol causes an engine to run leaner, or u can just open up the idle mixture screws up to 4 to 4 1/2 turns depending on bike. rule of thumb is if the engine doesn't run right with that many turns open its time to go to the next larger size PJ.
other benefits is again has to to with tunning, airbox and/or exhaust mods could require a larger PJ.
factorypro has excellent tunning info and other great info in their tech section.

[98valk]

no, i don't  HATE anyone. just smile when i run into someone who thinks they know everthing, when in reality they only quote what they find on the web.
i'm done messing up this thread.  
[/quote]

Its sad that u think that way. Since persons on this site do not know my background, over 30 yrs in the design and engineering fields, the last 20 yrs being in the electro/mechanical engineering/troubleshooting/repair field which also includes training newly hired engineers, and yes also requires o-ring knownledge. I provide websites so others can see and learn what I know. Anybody in industry is not always expected to have retained everything they learned in a text book, but they are expected to know where to go to get the info and then how to apply it for their situation.
so yes I know a lot and where to get the info.
And I know people and work with some that make me look like I know nothing, I don't chuckle/smile, but try to learn from them and embrace their intelligence not get an attitude that they know everything. I'll say a prayer for u. 

[Westsider]

Also consider replacing the pilot screw O-rings. Redeye Tech has them along with the tiny washers that are easy to lose.


Ill bet this is your problem area, clean pilot circuit's real good, be super careful r+r'ing  the diaphrams,, very $$ , soak jets overnight they will be good as new, just my .02 ,, good luck