E15

[YoungPUP]

As a response to Momz AMA Fuel alert post on the General Board, I'd like to pose this question.  With all the E15 Crap going on, what would it take to convert the Valk to Alcohol friendly. I'm thinking E85 Friendly.  I know you'd need to change all the rubber to alcohol rated materials, but what else?

[Daniel Meyer]

Fuel injection. O2 sensors. Different/extremely variable timing.

[fudgie]

Will she run on e-15 or is e-10 the highest we can go?

[98valk]

As a response to Momz AMA Fuel alert post on the General Board, I'd like to pose this question.  With all the E15 Crap going on, what would it take to convert the Valk to Alcohol friendly. I'm thinking E85 Friendly.  I know you'd need to change all the rubber to alcohol rated materials, but what else?

rejetting, higher compression,  same thing cars that race on alcohol.
dyno work for correct tune esp ignition advance, bigger tank, alcohol engines run much richer to stay alive.
they don't have fuel injection.

[justintyper]

As a response to Momz AMA Fuel alert post on the General Board, I'd like to pose this question.  With all the E15 Crap going on, what would it take to convert the Valk to Alcohol friendly. I'm thinking E85 Friendly.  I know you'd need to change all the rubber to alcohol rated materials, but what else?

rejetting, higher compression,  same thing cars that race on alcohol.
dyno work for correct tune esp ignition advance, bigger tank, alcohol engines run much richer to stay alive.
they don't have fuel injection.

also dont forget alcohol is very corrosive and will make a mess in a carbuerated fuels system if left sitting for even a days time...this is why drag cars that run it have to empty the fuel system at the end of the days runs(granted they generally methanol and that is more corrosive than ethanol) and dont forget alcohols inherent property of absorbing water. thankfully some gas stations in my area are carrying non ethanol gas just for carbureted and 2 stroke engines. personally i think this corn fuel crap is for the birds. only thing its really accomplished(besides blowing up weed eaters and snowmobiles) is allowed subsidized farms someplace to sell their over planted corn. it lowers overall fuel mileage and costs more to produce than gasoline even at these inflated oil prices. sorry for the rant but that's my 10 cents on ethanol fuels. lol

[dreamchaser]

Justintyper, have you not noticed how  anything that eats corn has jumped drastically in price?  Eggs, chicken, beef, pork, turkey, livestock feed, and corn itself; the prices are way high because there is no overproduction this year.  The draught in Colorado has wiped out entire crops, as well as a few family farms.  There is no Government $ going to save them.  Sorry for hijacking the thread.......Just my first rant due to having dear friends losing their a$$e$ due to drought.  Ever since this E10 thing hit, our government has sort of forced overplanting so there is enough corn to feed our nation, as well as the mandated % of crop for Ethanol.  Thank your government and say your sorry to the farmer.  He's just trying to survive, same as you and me....but he's caught in the middle.

[John U.]

Justintyper, have you not noticed how  anything that eats corn has jumped drastically in price?  Eggs, chicken, beef, pork, turkey, livestock feed, and corn itself; the prices are way high because there is no overproduction this year.  The draught in Colorado has wiped out entire crops, as well as a few family farms.  There is no Government $ going to save them.  Sorry for hijacking the thread.......Just my first rant due to having dear friends losing their a$$e$ due to drought.  Ever since this E10 thing hit, our government has sort of forced overplanting so there is enough corn to feed our nation, as well as the mandated % of crop for Ethanol.  Thank your government and say your sorry to the farmer.  He's just trying to survive, same as you and me....but he's caught in the middle.

So you're saying that the farm lobby had nothing to do with the ethanol mandate or the current push to E15? If that is the case I also owe the farmer an apology but I very much doubt it.

[Ricky-D]

This really belongs in the general board but I'll add my two cents anyway.

Our government besides stipulating a given figure of ethanol enriched gasoline that needs to be produced yearly also, (and this is the part that pisses me off)

Pays the ethanol producers a half a buck bounty for every gallon of ethanol they produce for gasoline.

***

[dreamchaser]

The huge canning and processing interests that make up the "Agro Biz" sector, huge corporations, are the force behind the lobby.  That hardly qualifies as the individual family farm.  I have no doubt that these corperations profit no matter what happens with the crops:  Bumper crops through write-offs for crop failure: their busines is so broad based.  I'm talking third generation farmers that may own 80 or so acres and sharecrop another larger parcel in partnership with one or more neighbors. These family operations are small business, employing maybe 4 or 5 other people.  The wives bringing food and refreshments to the fields, so the men can work 16-18 hour days.  It's a hard life. I have no idea why anyone would choose this as a lifes work.

[Farther]

It's a hard life. I have no idea why anyone would choose this as a lifes work.

They are born into it, usually.

[justintyper]

The huge canning and processing interests that make up the "Agro Biz" sector, huge corporations, are the force behind the lobby.  That hardly qualifies as the individual family farm.  I have no doubt that these corperations profit no matter what happens with the crops:  Bumper crops through write-offs for crop failure: their busines is so broad based.  I'm talking third generation farmers that may own 80 or so acres and sharecrop another larger parcel in partnership with one or more neighbors. These family operations are small business, employing maybe 4 or 5 other people.  The wives bringing food and refreshments to the fields, so the men can work 16-18 hour days.  It's a hard life. I have no idea why anyone would choose this as a lifes work.

i was mainly talking about corporate farms which are the main driving force behind all of this ethanol business and the ones that make most of the profits. small farms dont really have much of hand in it at all except  maybe a bit more profit from the high prices. although most of that has probably been eaten up by artificially high fuel prices.and i spent many of my childhood summers working on my grandfathers small farm so believe me i know how hard the work is

[fudgie]

No one forced us to plant corn. We have not planted corn in over 30 yrs since g-pa sold all the dairy cows. Which is where most if not all his corn went to. We planted some for the 1st time last yr or the yr before. Not alot, maybe 80 ac. The price is what promted us to do it. Im pretty sure the ethanol companies dont go to farms and say make corn so I can make some gas. We sell it and they buy it.

[YoungPUP]

I was talking with several guys from work that play with KZ1000's on a regular basis, and asked about the E85. Was told to switch ALL rubber fuel parts to HNBR (High Nitrile Butylene Rubber), Increase idle jets 20% and Mains  35% (as a jumping off point).  E85 is 105 octane, and is commonly used as a poor mans racing fuel.  Does pingle make a mechanical fuel shut off?  (No diagphram(sp?)  I can track down the fuel rail o-rings locally, and may have a lead for HNBR Bowl gaskets.  I'm going to double check my haz-mat thinkings, but the Viton ones from Red-eye may work as well, but I want to double check that.  Probably won't jump on this as a project til the fuel rails start leaking, but will probably start hoarding the parts and pieces.

[fudgie]

Is it worth the hassle to do it? I never seen e-15 and we dont have the e-10 here. I run the e-10 west of the mississippi every year for 6 yrs.

[YoungPUP]

To convert for Just E15, no, but to go over to E85  its worth a shot  Esp. at 105 octane.
Double checked the Viton and its good to go with Ethanol.

[Hoser]

I would not try to use E85 in anything that wasn't a flex fuel vehicle.  Probly not even then, The flex fuel police vehicle I used to drive got half the fuel milage with E85,  didn't take long for the chief to specify E10 or regular only.  Hoser

[justintyper]

I would not try to use E85 in anything that wasn't a flex fuel vehicle.  Probly not even then, The flex fuel police vehicle I used to drive got half the fuel milage with E85,  didn't take long for the chief to specify E10 or regular only.  Hoser

as well afore mentioned corrosive qualities i really wouldnt use it in a carbureted anything. and 105 octane is fine if youre running high compression or forced induction other wise it doesnt help performance and the higher the octane the less actual energy is in the fuel octane mainly helps with knock resistance.

[Ricky-D]

I remember a past thread regarding the fuel rail seals.

The point was that they are not 'O' rings in the true sense but more like tapered seals.

***

[cookiedough]

don't even think of running E85 ever in the Valk engine, not designed for it, even if you get all the necessary rubber items updated to protect from the harmful effects of E85.

I have used E85 in my flex fuel silverado and tundra's in the past and gas mileage suffers from 17 to ONLY 13 avg mpg mostly hwy. miles.  That is about a 25-30% reduction in fuel economy.  Plus, NO added benefits of 105 octane and burns up much faster with NO performance increase whatsoever.  Just to break even on gas mileage, the E85 has to be 30% cheaper at the gas pump vs. E10.

I have heard rumors of E15 coming, but with the shortage of the corn supply to feed our nation doubt the govt. will enforce E15 anytime soon.  I think the Valk will run on E15, but would prefer E10 at most and preferred NO ethanol but 99% of gas stations have E10 around me.   I have tried running ONLY once 91 octane with 105 octane boost in the 6.9 gallon tank and will NOT again.  It ran 200-300 rpms at idle more and and surged at idle like a supercharger which is not normal with real no noticeable performance/off the line increase to speak of.

[98valk]

I was talking with several guys from work that play with KZ1000's on a regular basis, and asked about the E85. Was told to switch ALL rubber fuel parts to HNBR (High Nitrile Butylene Rubber), Increase idle jets 20% and Mains  35% (as a jumping off point).  E85 is 105 octane, and is commonly used as a poor mans racing fuel.  Does pingle make a mechanical fuel shut off?  (No diagphram(sp?)  I can track down the fuel rail o-rings locally, and may have a lead for HNBR Bowl gaskets.  I'm going to double check my haz-mat thinkings, but the Viton ones from Red-eye may work as well, but I want to double check that.  Probably won't jump on this as a project til the fuel rails start leaking, but will probably start hoarding the parts and pieces.

also the float needle and the float itself need to be able to handle E85.  keep us posted on what u esp find for the float needle upgrade.
your on the right track.