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north-aurora
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« on: December 09, 2012, 11:27:42 AM » |
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While this is not about my Valk, I could use some good advice. I winterized my 99 Honda Shadow today, put stabil in it and ran it on idle for 10 minutes to make sure it gets into the engine. When I turned it off, removed the key, and started to take the battery out I saw some sparks on in the wire that connects to the positive battery terminal, about an inch above where it connects. The sparks quickly turned into a small flame, and I got a fire extinguisher and used it to extinguish it. It all happened in less than 20 seconds. I then removed the battery and assessed the damage. This is a real bummer just before I am ready to put it away and sell it in the spring. Take a look at the damage in the pictures. What would you do if you were me? I am thinking of having it towed to Honda and replace the wires and hope that is all it takes. But who knows what this fire damaged in the electrical system beyond just the wire? The bike is worth just about $3,000, and I need to do what's right to sell it with a clean conscience. The yellow powder in the picture is from the fire extinguisher. The damage visible in these pictures is the only damage I can see right now. This happened before I had removed the connections. If I recall correctly, I had just started to use the screwdriver to remove the positive connection.  View from above positive terminal. Electrical fire destroyed the wire.  Closer look at the wire.  The type of battery I have. About 2 years old and seemed to be in good condition. What would you do if you were me? |
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« Last Edit: December 09, 2012, 11:30:21 AM by north-aurora »
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Momz
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« Reply #1 on: December 09, 2012, 12:19:39 PM » |
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I wouldn't blame the battery.
Did you remove the negative terminal first?
If using a Phillips screwdriver, good mechanics slip a long piece of heatshrink tubing on the shank and heat it to prevent shorting the battery/harness. This prevents the situation you now have.
Just one of the many things you learn after years of working on motorcycles.
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 ALWAYS QUESTION AUTHORITY! 97 Valk bobber, 98 Valk Rat Rod, 2K SuperValk, plus several other classic bikes |
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saddlesore
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« Reply #2 on: December 09, 2012, 12:36:50 PM » |
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Kind of looks like you didn't take the negative cable off first. Then when you started to loosen the positive cable it turned a bit, came in contact with the frame and shorted out. The cable has a tendency to corrode right on the end and the insulation may have been degraded also.
Happened on my lawn tractor.
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DARE TO BE DIFFERENT
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north-aurora
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« Reply #3 on: December 09, 2012, 12:46:54 PM » |
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I definitely just started to take off the positive (red with + symbol) screw when this happened.
Do you think other electronics could be fried, or is it impossible to tell until the bike gets checked out? I am thinking this is a case where I will let a real mechanic do his job. I am afraid this might be expensive though.
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saddlesore
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« Reply #4 on: December 09, 2012, 01:03:41 PM » |
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Can you replace the cable without tearing apart the wiring harness? If you can't, is there room to cut the end off and crimp a new o-ring connection on it. I would do that, then you can check if anything else is damaged.
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DARE TO BE DIFFERENT
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tonyfan70
Member
Posts: 295
Apparently they know you?
Central Illinois
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« Reply #5 on: December 09, 2012, 01:16:53 PM » |
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Electronics aren't my thing, so I'm no help there. However I wanted to just point out how much worse it could of been. Really bad if it had done that a bit later when noone was around. Guess in that respect you were pretty lucky. I know if something caught on fire in my garage or mancave it would be about as easy as a tire fire to put out.
Hope it can easily and cheaply be fixed. And kudos to wanting to sell your bike with everything on the up and up. Enough scams and shady deals out there.
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  1997 Standard. Original bumblebee tin stored. 1998 Magna 750 2000 POS Sportsman 500 |
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Skinhead
Member
Posts: 8728
J. A. B. O. A.
Troy, MI
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« Reply #6 on: December 09, 2012, 02:02:23 PM » |
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If you just shorted the positive to ground with the key off, you probably didn't do any damage to other components. Your pictures look like you burned the insulation of the positive cable. Do a search of your bikes electrical system on HDL and see if the + cable is sold separately, where it goes, and replace it. I'll bet you'll be good to go.
Now lesson learned time. ALWAYS remove the - (or ground if a positive ground system, not likely) FIRST.
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 Troy, MI |
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Daniel Meyer
Member
Posts: 5493
Author. Adventurer. Electrician.
The State of confusion.
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« Reply #7 on: December 09, 2012, 03:28:53 PM » |
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Replace the battery cable on go on. Always remove the ground cable first, install last. No big deal.
The rest of the bike is most likely just fine.
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CUAgain, Daniel Meyer  |
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YoungPUP
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« Reply #8 on: December 09, 2012, 04:34:48 PM » |
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Replace the battery cable and light it run it. Also most fire extinguisher powder is slightly corrosive if left for periods of time and exposed to moisture. Need to clean that up sooner than later.
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Yea though I ride through the valley of the Shadow of Death I shall fear no evil. For I ride the Baddest Mother F$#^er In that valley!
99 STD (Under construction)
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hubcapsc
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Posts: 16788
upstate
South Carolina
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« Reply #9 on: December 09, 2012, 04:57:46 PM » |
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 to you for having a fire extinguisher you could lay your hands on in under 20 seconds... -Mike
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john
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« Reply #10 on: December 09, 2012, 08:10:03 PM » |
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Did you remove the negative terminal first?  positive cable ... ebay .... 5 buck |
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vrcc # 19002
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olddog1946
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« Reply #11 on: December 09, 2012, 09:07:32 PM » |
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Current takes the path of least resistance, baterry terminal to the bare spot (grnd), so the odds are good that cable is the only damage to the system. Replace the cable and see what she does.
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VRCC # 32473
US AIR FORCE E7, Retired 1965-1988
01 Valk Std.
02 BMW k1200LTE
65 Chevelle coupe, 1986 Mazda RX-7 with 350/5spd, 1983 Mazda RX-7 with FOMOCO 302/AOD project, 95 Mustang GT Convertible 5.0, 5 spd
Moses Lake, Wa. 509-760-6382 if you need help
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da prez
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« Reply #12 on: December 10, 2012, 06:30:29 AM » |
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N/A pm me if you want help going over the bike . You met me at the meet and greet. buying me a cup of coffee is cheaper than going to a dealer. I would be glad to help!
da prez
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north-aurora
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« Reply #13 on: December 10, 2012, 07:13:59 AM » |
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Thanks guys for the responses. Definitely learned a lesson here (ALWAYS remove negative first!!!).
Having fire extinguishers handy paid off, this is the first time I ever had to use one. It's like paying for insurance or wearing a helmet, don't need them 99.9% of the time...
I am hopeful that the bike is okay and I just need to replace the wire. I am not able to find them on ebay, but Powersportsplus.com has them at a reasonable price. I will keep you posted if it turns out the wire is the only thing that needs replacing.
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Madmike
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« Reply #14 on: December 10, 2012, 03:02:17 PM » |
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most fire extinguisher powder is slightly corrosive
been told that it is baking soda...... |
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YoungPUP
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« Reply #15 on: December 10, 2012, 03:07:35 PM » |
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Most ABC fire extinguisher powder is Sodium Bicarbonate ( Baking soda) Its some of the anti clumping agents and other additives that make it less than desirable to use with out cleaning it up.
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Yea though I ride through the valley of the Shadow of Death I shall fear no evil. For I ride the Baddest Mother F$#^er In that valley!
99 STD (Under construction)
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salty1
Member
Posts: 2359
"Flyka"
Spokane, WA or Tucson, AZ
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« Reply #16 on: December 11, 2012, 05:21:52 PM » |
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+1 on changing the cable after you remove the ground from the battery. Take the battery out and charge it and then have it tested under load. You may have significantly shortened the life of the battery with that dead short.  |
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My rides: 1998 GL1500C, 2000 GL 1500CF,2006 GL 1800 3A   |
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Kymbo
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« Reply #17 on: December 15, 2012, 03:05:41 AM » |
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most fire extinguisher powder is slightly corrosive
been told that it is baking soda...... baking soda is a "base ",opposite to an acid thats why it canbe used to clean battery terminals if all furry and crusty .A strong" base" can corrode similar to an" acid" |
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Kymbo
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« Reply #18 on: December 15, 2012, 03:08:52 AM » |
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looks like you may have had a section starting to wear through on the insulation of the positive cable and when you started to loosen the terminal it shorted on the battery box every thing else should be ok but possible damage to battery
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north-aurora
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« Reply #19 on: December 15, 2012, 11:17:58 AM » |
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I had the battery tested and it's fine. Am getting a new wire next week, hopefully it's no additional damage.
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cookiedough
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« Reply #20 on: December 16, 2012, 05:14:39 PM » |
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that extreme battery is from batteries plus, wouldn't buy one ever again. Replace cable and should be good to go no problems looks like, good luck.
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north-aurora
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« Reply #21 on: December 16, 2012, 08:44:14 PM » |
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Got the cable in the mail yesterday, so I was anxious today to put it in and find out if any damage had been done to the electrical components. The battery had checked out as being good earlier in the week, and once I had the wire replaced the bike started right up and everything works like before. Yes, baby!  Thanks all for your help on this! Now it's stored away until the spring. |
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Bone
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« Reply #22 on: December 17, 2012, 02:59:14 AM » |
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Glad it was just a cable.
Hope you treated the gas for the winter storage. I'm in southern Mich.
and use Stabil in my mower and bike every winter, never a problem.
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