Are the North Koreans.....STUPID??....

[Stanley Steamer]

WTH do they think they will accomplish by threatening the US with a nuclear attack??....Biden said that Nobama would be "tested" in his first 6 months....well, here it is...so??.....Anyone else a little concerned about those dimwits??

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090625/ap_on_re_as/as_koreas_nuclear

[Doc Moose]

I also heard that they now claim that the U.S. started the Korean War by attacking them first.....

But ya gotta admit, they are unique in that not too many countries have leaders sporting a pompadour hairdo today.

[JimL]

Biden said that Nobama would be "tested" in his first 6 months....

Steamer I respectfully look at it a bit differently.  There is a huge difference between "being tested" and being considered so "naive" that a third world lunatic feels that they can treat you with complete disrespect without any fear of retaliation.  I am sure that Kim Jong IL feels that the only response will be yet another "apology".

[Stanley Steamer]

Biden said that Nobama would be "tested" in his first 6 months....

Steamer I respectfully look at it a bit differently.  There is a huge difference between "being tested" and being considered so "naive" that a third world lunatic feels that they can treat you with complete disrespect without any fear of retaliation.

accuracy that they could put a "smart bomb" right in that guys lap and send him to 7734....and make an example out of these two-bit Dictators that think they can run their mouth....I wonder what GW or Billy Bob would have done??...

[ptgb]

Remember before the first war with Iraq (the one to free Kuwait)? Saddam was spouting off to the world that they would fight to the death, etc... even the US media was talking about the "infamous" Republican Guard that were highly trained and would fight the elite US Forces to their death in the vast desert? Scud missiles were going to rain down on Israel, etc.

We reached Bagdad in like six hours, and it was pretty much over in two days?

Kim Jong Il is nothing more than another in a long line of sawed off little bastards who "talk the talk"... but will his people "walk the walk"? I don't think so... if it came to war (which I hope it doesn't)... his own people will fold, with mass surrenders and the like... just like the Iraqi's did. Just because they have conducted nuclear tests does not mean they are capable of delivering a nuclear attack.

But alas, we will continue to take their crap, like we do with pretty much everybody else... Democratic, Republicans, whoever... none of those limp-wristed bureaucrats we send to Washington stand up for this country anymore... unless there is a TV camera around... (sigh)   

 

[JimL]

accuracy that they could put a "smart bomb" right in that guys lap and send him to 7734....and make an example out of these two-bit Dictators that think they can run their mouth....I wonder what GW or Billy Bob would have done??...

I seriously doubt that Jong IL would have treated GW (or Clinton for that matter) with quite the disrespect he seems to feel he can get away with under this administration.  If he had, I feel certain that GW would have emasculated Jong IL (providing that he has any balls to begin with) by intercepting and boarding the Kang Nam.  This would have solved the problem either 1 of 2 ways:

(1) Jong IL would have backed down in order to keep from being humiliated further, or
(2) He would have tried to make good on his "crazy threat" and he would have died quickly

Either way the world would be better of with one less "goofy looking" dictator...

[bigvalkriefan]

Obama is indeed being "tested". He already proved that his kill them with kindness diplomacy doesn't work with the muslims,  so N. Korea figures he's weak. If they fire a missile toward Hawaii Obama really better step up and show some balls or every two bit dictator in the world is gonna try us.
Our country is never going to be the same, which is just the way the progressives want it.

[Smokinjoe-VRCCDS#0005]

They rank number 4 in the world with military manpower .
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_number_of_active_troops

[JimC]

If the chart that Smokin Joe posted is correct, that is really something to ponder.
50 active troups per thousand of population?
It looks to me like they have been building an army up for a skirmish somewhere.


Any way you look at it it does not add up to good.

Jim

[JimL]

I can't dispute Joe's facts because I suspect they are true.  Since they have well over 1,000,000 troops in their standing army, they probably are in the top 5.  

However....I will say this....Iraq at the time of Desert Storm had the 4th largest army in the world at just under 1,000,000 soldiers.  To add to that their army was experience on the battlefield since they had been involved with a war with Iran for a few years.  Even though the Iraqis had the 4th largest army in the world (with battlefield experience), once they were engaged it took little more than 3 days before they surrendered.

[DIGGER]

WTH do they think they will accomplish by threatening the US with a nuclear attack??....Biden said that Nobama would be "tested" in his first 6 months....well, here it is...so??.....Anyone else a little concerned about those dimwits??

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090625/ap_on_re_as/as_koreas_nuclear

I think that all those small countries leaders with the Little Man Syndrome would just LOVE to go down in history as the first to drop a nuclear bomb on U S soil.....even if it cost them their lives

[Master Blaster]

Our country is never going to be the same, which is just the way the progressives want it.

Why is it a surprise??   Hussien did promise change right up front.  What did all the worshipers think would happen.  His platform promoted group hugs with the terrorists, uh-oh cant call them terrorist anymore.  The libs are holding hands and singing cumbya while all the baddies are joyously laughing and planning how to take advantage of this tragical lack of judgement and honor.  As soon as Hussien, his Czars, and Hinchmen can get the public disarmed the USA will be ripe for the plucking.  We are facing the enemy and he is working from the inside.

[JimL]

I think that all those small countries leaders with the Little Man Syndrome would just LOVE to go down in history as the first to drop a nuclear bomb on U S soil.....even if it cost them their lives

Digger I agree with you that some countries would be willing to sacrifice themselves in order to launch a first strike nuclear offensive against a US territory (especially the Islamic fools that think immediately after their innialation they are going to be greeted by a flock of virgins).  I am a little relieved that we have a reasonable chance of defeating a first strike from rogue nations such as Korea (and soon to be Iran) thanks to our Terminal High-Altitude Air Defense missile systems. 

I am sure a few here can appreciate the irony that the current administration is readying this system in Hawaii even though our current "chief executive" dismissed them as “unproven missile defense system” and promised to "cut the tens of billions of dollars in wasteful spending".  Of course by definition any nuclear defense shield would be "unproven"...since by my recollection we have not been the subject of a nuclear attack to date (duh...).

[Strong Eagle]

I love it.  "Hussein".  "worshipers" (sic)... why can't you anti Obama guys spell?

The red meat posts above clearly show an ignorance for the facts.

What would happen if the US attacked North Korea?  Well:  Here are a couple of possibilities.

a)  300,000 North Korean troops cross the DMZ and head for Seoul, only about 75 miles away.
b)  North Korea launches several rockets, all loaded with biological weapons (North Korea can kill millions with its chemical/biological weapons).
c)  China interdicts all US ships, including warships, challenging the US right and might in Asia.
d)  The US, already over committed in Afghanistan and Iraq, finds itself in yet another 100,000 man war, while Iran boils.  Ever heard of limits, boys?

Wake up, red meat people.  North Korea can not be attacked by the US.  China, for whatever the reason, protects, feeds, supplies oil and a lot more.  Only the malinformed and the cretins would actually talk seriously about attacking North Korea.

Glad it gives you red meat boys a reason to attack Obama but the fact is that he has taken a much stronger stance than either Bush or Clinton... why the hell do you think that North Korea is threatening to wipe the US from the face of the earth?  Because they are getting what they want?  Get real, red meat people.  They are doing this because Obama has drawn a hard line.  Time to wake up and smell the coffee.
   

[JimL]

Eagle there is one clear point where you and I do agree...it really aggravates me when I encounter lots of misspellings!

Furthermore, I do agree with a couple of the points you made, however I am a bit confused by the very premise of your post: "What would happen if the US attacked North Korea?".  

I re-read the initial post made by Steamer and the first line of the discussion read "WTH do they think they will accomplish by threatening the US with a nuclear attack?".  As an ignorant engineer, mathematics are my stronger area, but with my limited command of the English language...the context of that question suggests that the US would not be the "attacker", but rather the defender.  I am sure Steamer will set me straight I am misinterpreting his statement.  The subsequent discussion on the thread seemed to follow that basic premise of the scenario where the US was "attacked" rather than that of the aggressor.

Anyway I clearly agree with your statements in (A) and (B).  In statement B, I would offer the following thought...I suspect that any deployment of biological weapons on the part of North Korea would be considered "a deployment of weapons of mass destruction", and as such would be responded to in kind.  Much like Israel's ambiguous position on being a nuclear power, I suspect that South Korea has been supplied this capability.  An attack by North Korea with biological weapons, would probably be trumped with a Nuke (and I suspect that they have been told this behind closed doors).

Point (C) is debatable, but since China and the US have a somewhat symbiotic relationship (and furthermore...we owe them tons of debt!), I think this is very unlikely.

Point (D) I agree with, but I think that if a conventional war were to be waged....the "boots on the ground" would be predominately South Korean boots.  Should we be attacked (which to my understanding was the original debate), I would expect that the British, Aussies (possibly even the French) would lend assistance.

After this point in your post, it is hard for me to seriously have any further debate other than to say that I respectfully do not agree with you assessment of Mr. Obama.

[Willow]

I love it.  "Hussein".  "worshipers" (sic)... why can't you anti Obama guys spell? ... Wake up, red meat people.  ...  Only the malinformed and the cretins would actually talk seriously about attacking North Korea

Wayne, I'm an anti-Obama guy and I can spell.  How would you spell "worshipers"?  I couldn't find malinformed in any of my dictionaries, but I could derive what you intended it to mean.  I am apparently misinformed as to what are red meat people, but I assume it is intended as a term of disdain.

I mean this in the kindest way possible, Wayne, but one reason you are so widely disrespected is that you can only go so long without reverting to broad brushing and name calling.  You actually have the ability, at times, to put together an almost convincing argument, but you quickly lose from your audience, by your vituperation, all but those who already have heartily agreed with your position.

Yes, yes, I do know.  They did it first.  When I was in grammar school "they" always did it first.  I don't agree with everything all the anti-Obama people say and I am bothered by how a lot of folks express their political views.  Some simply can't help it.  You can.  You have within you the ability to rise above and to demonstrate superiority by the way in which you present yourself.

Maybe it really doesn't matter to you and perhaps you want to be seen as a pompous boor or an inadequate want-to-be bully.  What others think matters enough to me that in the morning before I go to work I don't put on those cute little skirts that would be so comfortable on a hot summer's day.    From your delivery I would guess that image is even more important to you than it is to me.

I really do enjoy when you post regarding your motorcycle adventures and I sincerely do wish that some of the anti-Obama combatants would give it a rest.

Be safe.

[bsnicely]

If Ronaldus Maximus were still the Prez the first and following missles would have been destroyed on their launch pads!! With current and recent leadership we might as well keep our traps shut because we won't back up our threats......oh for the good ol' days.

[Trynt]

There are two p's in worshippers

[Willow]

There are two p's in worshippers

Check your dictionary.  It can be spelled either way.  If memory serves well, only the single "p" spelling was acceptable until recent years.

My point is that if we are just jousting we can all be wrong, but when one begins to ridicule another, the ridiculer needs to be careful to be correct.   I try not to put myself into that position.

[Trynt]

Hey Willow, I agree.  While I have sometimes disagreed with other on this board, if you review my posts, I've never resorted to disparaging remarks towards individuals or groups.  In my mind to do so, although perhaps cathartic, it is counterproductive.  I was just trying to be helpful with the worshipper, worshiper thing. And spelling not being a personal strength,  I had checked an online dictionary prior to posting.

[Willow]

 

[Dogg]

I can't dispute Joe's facts because I suspect they are true.  Since they have well over 1,000,000 troops in their standing army, they probably are in the top 5. 

However....I will say this....Iraq at the time of Desert Storm had the 4th largest army in the world at just under 1,000,000 soldiers.  To add to that their army was experience on the battlefield since they had been involved with a war with Iran for a few years.  Even though the Iraqis had the 4th largest army in the world (with battlefield experience), once they were engaged it took little more than 3 days before they surrendered.

Ok, This point is pretty close to accurate...BUT....
In N. Korea, there are no deserts that you can see for 10 miles, there are jungles and boggs and swamps and mountains...

Does anyone really think that if they launched a long range nuke at us (they haven't the technology to reach us yet but are working on it) that they would actually leave N. Korea to fight us? No, They will stay in their swamps and rivers and mountains and jungles and wait. Think about that for a while...and with the population they have, nobody is going to authorize a strike to just bomb the whole country to clear out the military...

[JimL]

I can't dispute Joe's facts because I suspect they are true.  Since they have well over 1,000,000 troops in their standing army, they probably are in the top 5.  

However....I will say this....Iraq at the time of Desert Storm had the 4th largest army in the world at just under 1,000,000 soldiers.  To add to that their army was experience on the battlefield since they had been involved with a war with Iran for a few years.  Even though the Iraqis had the 4th largest army in the world (with battlefield experience), once they were engaged it took little more than 3 days before they surrendered.

Ok, This point is pretty close to accurate...BUT....
In N. Korea, there are no deserts that you can see for 10 miles, there are jungles and boggs and swamps and mountains...

Does anyone really think that if they launched a long range nuke at us (they haven't the technology to reach us yet but are working on it) that they would actually leave N. Korea to fight us? No, They will stay in their swamps and rivers and mountains and jungles and wait. Think about that for a while...and with the population they have, nobody is going to authorize a strike to just bomb the whole country to clear out the military...

Dogg I agree that the jungle theater would be much more difficult than the Iraq desert.  The cost in money and lives in a conventional war would be more like Vietnam than Iraq.  I also agree with you that if they launched a nuke, they would prefer to engage us in a conventional war in their swamps and jungle.  My point is that this would not be a conventional engagement.  If they chose a nuclear first strike/attempt, we would respond in kind...and the only time that boots would hit the ground would be in the clean up effort after it is all over.

The part that troubles me even more is than I think there would be a feeling that we would HAVE TO respond in kind.  Much like the game of chess were offense and defense are planned moves in advance, I feel that the prevailing thinking would be that if we were reluctant to respond in kind, that it would signal weakness...and we would fear that someone else would try to exploit this perceived weakness in some future conflict.  

Quite frankly it depresses me to dwell on it any further, hopefully someone of greater intelligence will be in charge over there in the not too distant future...

[Willow]

It's all interesting speculation.  The truth is this.  There are rogue (by our viewpoint) powers who would not think twice about launching a nuclear attack against the cities, and civilian populace, of the United States or another western nation.  We would like to think that from our position of strength we would "retaliate in kind."  We will not.  Striking in a way intended to decimate a large civilian population is unthinkable to the American mind.  We're bluffing.  We have been since we first demonstrated to the world what a nuclear weapon could do some sixty-five years ago.

Our best hope is a defense system that makes it greatly improbable that a nuclear weapon will reach our cities intact.  That's why it's so important that we contain the technology, not only for the weapons themselves, but for the delivery systems.

One in twenty persons of the population in military uniform?  That's a nation that's itching for war.  North Korea sits next to half of what they consider to be their own country, and a half that enjoys much more wealth than does the "Democratic People's Republic of Korea".  What's stopping them?  They must be afraid of something.  Hopefully the United States, or the western world as a whole, can keep them back on their heels and in doubt.  

[JimL]

I agree it is interesting speculation. 

I don't know if I fear that you are right, or if I fear that you are wrong in your assumption!  I do agree that the best possible solution is to fund research aimed at preventing a rogue warhead from making it to American soil.

[Dogg]

I believe Jim, that if thye DID launch a long range missle with a nuke(once they learn how), our best scenario would be to take it out before it reaches the beaches. and retailiation by doing the same(lobbing a nuke back) would be totally out of the question becasue of
China and Japan sitting right there as neighbors. One being a strong ally and the other being our bank . Might aughta think like willow, drop it over the water. no chance of reachin us and just sit back and smile...what you gonna do now, boy???lol

[fiddle mike]

During the Bush years the N Koreans equated "saber rattling" with "shaking the money tree".  They are used to being payed off and placated. 

[daytona]

I'm ready for alot of bang for my tax Buck B 4 its hopelessly pissed away for some other B.S. Its time to do some push button arse kickin B 4 its done to US. 

[Hoser]

Honest to God, there are no jungles in North Korea, my uncle lost his toes there to frostbite.  It's kinda like.... North Dakota maybe?  Except, unlike North Dakota, there are no civilized human beings there. Hoser 

[Brad]

During the Bush years the N Koreans equated "saber rattling" with "shaking the money tree".  They are used to being payed off and placated. 

Guaranteed when it is all said and done they will be given a pile of our money.  We will be paying for their food imports and their oil imports.  They get it every time they act up.  They then behave for a year or two until they want more.

[Scanner]

Some people never learn 

Some insane dictator of a third world country that can't even feed his people mouths off and they start going nuclear....

The fact is we have 30,000 troops sitting across a 2.5 mile wide DMZ from that million man army. Our troops would be a speed bump but not much more.  But hey, we can't take guff from anybody now can we! We're the 800 lb gorilla!

NK can't launch a warhead to our shores. They could plant one, like most nations.  It's just not all that simple now is it?

Thank god we have a president with intelligence and strategic vision so he doesn't automatically puff his little chest up and declare "bring em on" when the crazies rattle sabers. Here or abroad.

[NiteRiderF6]

Ever heard of limits, boys?
  

Yes, term limits.... the Democrats are about to learn about those the hard way....

Our best hope is a defense system that makes it greatly improbable that a nuclear weapon will reach our cities intact.  That's why it's so important that we contain the technology, not only for the weapons themselves, but for the delivery systems.

Yes, you are correct Willow... but our "best hope" just had it's budget cut by about 35%.

[f6john]

"Thank god we have a president with intelligence and strategic vision so he doesn't automatically puff his little chest up and declare "bring em on" when the crazies rattle sabers. Here or abroad."

Hell yea!!!! He's gonna save us all from ourselves. A little less than half or the American people barely have enough sense to get out of bed in the morning. I know God must rest a little easier knowing we have  a new Jesus to take care of the day to day mundane things that so many of us just can't handle on our own. We should just go ahead and declare a national holiday for our new King, Jesus, no need to wait till he's dead he's still a young man. What month sounds good to you?

Ooopppss. Does this seem harsh? I know from his press conferences that he is very intelligent, well read, well briefed, and smooooth. Do I trust him and the people who put him in power? Am I so happy we got change that nothing else matters? He has the position , he has tremendous power, can he control it or will someone else? And for that matter do I trust anyone in Washington to do the right thing unless it is of some significant boost for themselves? As long as the money flows and no is being tapped for the payback this house of cards will stand but payday will come and of all these thoughts that is what I'm most sure of.

[John Schmidt]

Just think of all the destruction worldwide caused by war and threats of war over just the last century. One day, all the technology of the world will be for naught, and I don't feel that day is far off.

How do you handle your children when you see them destroying something you've built(created) for them, something beautiful? Does anyone understand to what I'm referring?

[Strong Eagle]

During the Bush years the N Koreans equated "saber rattling" with "shaking the money tree".  They are used to being payed off and placated. 

Guaranteed when it is all said and done they will be given a pile of our money.  We will be paying for their food imports and their oil imports.  They get it every time they act up.  They then behave for a year or two until they want more.

Possibly could be... but I think this administration won't cave... instead, they will force the Chinese to up the ante to keep their tinpot dictator in power.

[sandy]

Strong Eagle makes some good points. Mostly about our military being stretched too thin right now. An all volunteer army can't sustain another conflict. If you want the draft back and escalate another world war, keep upsetting North Korea. Teddy Roosevelt had his policy. "Speak Softly but carry a big stick". Obammy is speaking softly but his big stick has termites right now. Our "current" military can't handle much more. PS: Not an Obammy fan, just agreeing with one issue. Our guys are tired and lots of them need to come home to heal up.

[Stanley Steamer]

we ARE spread way too thin!!....I'm not sure what the answer is, but I think some of those crazies over there would not hesitate to attack us if they had the ability to....I hope we don't have to find out the hard way.....they are like little kids throwing a temper tantrum, and in the past, I guess they have been "paid" in various ways to knock it off...that's not a long term solution....

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090627/ap_on_re_mi_ea/ml_iran_election

[f6john]

One of the most amazing weapons we have at our disposal are the Preditor drone planes that have both amazing camera's and the ability to deliver some deadly firepower. The "pilot's" are safe inside air-conditioned control modules in Nevada and since the planes can stay airborne for 24 hours the pilots can rotate out on shifts. 60 Minutes or one of the news programs did a piece on them a few weeks back and it was very interesting.