Front fender gets dented alot

[Earl in Pensacola]

I think I agree with 1500rider, even though I can not "clearly" see the tops of the forks.  I'd almost be willing to bet that the forks have been raised enough to creat the problem. You should check the manual for the correct mounting spec's for the forks.

[Rio Wil]

Nope....then fork tubes are clamped exactly where they should be......the top clamp could not be tightened down enough to grip the tube if the tube was up an inch too high.  There is a increased diameter on the tube right at the top for clamping.....the bottom clamp would tighten properly as the diameter of the tube remains the same from the clamp downward to the seal where it enlarges.

[1500Rider]

Maybe so but if you look at the pictures the fork tube is clearly above the triple tree by at least an inch, possibly more. He's just lucky the lower clamps are holding!

[Rio Wil]

I think what that pic shows is clearly the hex head on the fork cap, below that is the fork clamp, below that is the upper clamp for the wind deflector.......I think you are seeing the deflector clamp as the fork clamp and that would make it appear the tube is too high..

I still say a big part of the problem is the fork travel is not correct.  The front suspension is sagged to about half its normal height .  If he measures from the top surface of the upper clamp to the bottom of the fork below the pinch bolts, it should be right at 34 inches with no weight on the bike.  I bet his is only about 32 inches.....some one has done something to the internals of the forks to lower them or the perhaps the forks are bent backward just enough to bind the travel and not allow the forks to extend their full length........wonder if the back of the bike is lowered also????

[semper5]

With the curiosity of wondering if the bike has been lowered, what would be the height of a Valkyrie? I am 6 foot, and must wear boots in order to flat-foot the ground when riding. If it was any taller, I may have an issue!!

[pancho]

Hey semper5 ,,,  have you ever taken a look around the neck area of the frame to look for any previous work or damage???  Your bike is just sitting wrong somehow..... the pictures look to me like it does not have enough caster  "rake"... 

I sit flat footed on my bike with stock suspension and am quite a bit shorter than you...

[1500Rider]

I think what that pic shows is clearly the hex head on the fork cap, below that is the fork clamp, below that is the upper clamp for the wind deflector.......I think you are seeing the deflector clamp as the fork clamp and that would make it appear the tube is too high..

I still say a big part of the problem is the fork travel is not correct.  The front suspension is sagged to about half its normal height .  If he measures from the top surface of the upper clamp to the bottom of the fork below the pinch bolts, it should be right at 34 inches with no weight on the bike.  I bet his is only about 32 inches.....some one has done something to the internals of the forks to lower them or the perhaps the forks are bent backward just enough to bind the travel and not allow the forks to extend their full length........wonder if the back of the bike is lowered also????

You might br right Rio. It's hard to tell given the windscreen isn't OEM. Still, there's something in that area that doesn't look right in the photos. I'd place my money on height of fork issue before a bent frame - at least that's an easier fix. I'd start with checking the forks to see how straight they are and if okay rebuild the with new springs.

[WamegoRob]

So Semper5, have you seen enough people yet saying things like, "can't see it clearly" so as to make you want to go take a good picture of the bike like I mentioned earlier?

It bugs me that you've got so many people here trying to help, yet all you did was come back and ask yet another question.

[Chrisj CMA]

With the curiosity of wondering if the bike has been lowered, what would be the height of a Valkyrie? I am 6 foot, and must wear boots in order to flat-foot the ground when riding. If it was any taller, I may have an issue!!

You do have an issue.  That bike is a danger to yourself and others.  Take it to someone that knows bikes (Valkyries) and get it inspected, repaired or condemned

[old2soon]

So Semper5, have you seen enough people yet saying things like, "can't see it clearly" so as to make you want to go take a good picture of the bike like I mentioned earlier?

It bugs me that you've got so many people here trying to help, yet all you did was come back and ask yet another question.

   +1 at the very least. I'm with the Kansas guy here.  RIDE SAFE.

[mirion]

I have two Valkyries 25 miles north of you in Frankenmuth. One is a 97 with +six degree raked front end and 11.5 rear shocks which make it sit low, the other a 2000 Interstate pure stock if you want a look.

[semper5]

So Semper5, have you seen enough people yet saying things like, "can't see it clearly" so as to make you want to go take a good picture of the bike like I mentioned earlier?

It bugs me that you've got so many people here trying to help, yet all you did was come back and ask yet another question.

Some of you guys sure have tender feelings here. I appreciate all the help and advice, I'm thankful for the input, and I believe I have made it clear. Glad your comfortable enough to tell me I have bugged you, but get over it. When I get the time to take pics and post them, I surely will as I believe this forum has been very helpful. Not wanting to wear out a welcome, it appears I have offended a few of you with my curiosity and newness. In addition, I work full time at a somewhat stressful job, and have other priorities, as have most of you do as well.

I just logged in to check this thread out, as it has been quite popular with input. Let me know if this post bugs you too.

[semper5]

I have two Valkyries 25 miles north of you in Frankenmuth. One is a 97 with +six degree raked front end and 11.5 rear shocks which make it sit low, the other a 2000 Interstate pure stock if you want a look.

Thank you for the offer, when I can, I will contact you. Time is short right now. Thank you again.

[Moonshot_1]

Nah, what's bugging everybody is the inability to wrap their head around your problem.

I think this is one that will require a 3 dimensional perspective. Coming at this with a host of measurements and photos isn't enough since this could be an intentional modification or result of a bent frame or forks or even combination of both.

Maybe a video of you turning the front wheel from side to side and showing the contact point would be what is needed for a solution to come from the folks here.

Your best solution is to find someone knowledgeable locally. Preferably a fellow Valkyrie guy if available.

What is clear is that there is a strong possibility that the problem is severe and can lead to a catastrophic failure if the bike is ridden. So don't be a ridin it till you know for sure and it's fixed.

For some, this is like a puzzle. They want to come up with a solution for you. They feel they are confident in giving you a solution but need just ONE MORE CLUE to put it all together and await your next post for that clue. The clue that will, once and for all, solve the problem of your front fender getting dented by another part of your bike.

Then you post that you are 6' tall and wear boots. 

Not the clue some were hoping for. LOL

I see you got some local leads and some Valkyrie guys in the area from the postings here.

Good Luck and KEEP EVERYONE POSTED ON THE PROGRESS! This place is a wealth of knowledge and it's because guys like you and everyone else here, add to it.



 
 

[pancho]

Moonshot_1 put jis finger on the problem.........  This is just a place where some attack problems like pitbulls and usually expect the person with the problem to be as interested in fixing it as we are. The more elusive ones get more attention.

[Skinhead]

Just measure your wheelbase and compare to a known good bike.

I fear I am the only Valk owner in Genesee County Michigan. 

To the rest-- awesome! Thanks!

Dude,

You may be the only valk owner in Genesse County (I doubt it though) but there are a whole bunch of us to the south of you.  Join up on the MI VRCC board.  I personnally am in Troy, stop by if you get the chance.

[Skinhead]

I just looked at picture 5 in the series that RJ posted (front of bike) and it looks to me like the forks are offtop to bottom, clutch side to F Brake side.  Look at the fork legs and how they line up with the radiator side covers, wider at the top, narrower at the bottom.

[Rio Wil]

Think that is a optical contusion.....

[WamegoRob]

 Let me know if this post bugs you too.

And now we're on to something... it seems your Valkyrie's problem lies between the hand grips and the seat.

Good luck to you, I hope you get around to figuring it out.

[semper5]

 Let me know if this post bugs you too.

And now we're on to something... it seems your Valkyrie's problem lies between the hand grips and the seat.

Good luck to you, I hope you get around to figuring it out.

Sure glad you aren't the representative for VRCC. 

[Chrisj CMA]

So Semper5, have you seen enough people yet saying things like, "can't see it clearly" so as to make you want to go take a good picture of the bike like I mentioned earlier?

It bugs me that you've got so many people here trying to help, yet all you did was come back and ask yet another question.

Some of you guys sure have tender feelings here. I appreciate all the help and advice, I'm thankful for the input, and I believe I have made it clear. Glad your comfortable enough to tell me I have bugged you, but get over it. When I get the time to take pics and post them, I surely will as I believe this forum has been very helpful. Not wanting to wear out a welcome, it appears I have offended a few of you with my curiosity and newness. In addition, I work full time at a somewhat stressful job, and have other priorities, as have most of you do as well.

I just logged in to check this thread out, as it has been quite popular with input. Let me know if this post bugs you too.

This post does not bug me at all.  I gave you my best advise as far as safety goes.  I would hate to hear of another crash; continuing to ride a bent motorcycle is insane.  I know you are a new owner and you want to enjoy your new ride.  Unfortunately you inherited a nightmare that needs to be sorted out.

1. First thing to do is to make sure the forks are mounted properly and not bent.  The best way to do that is to raise the front of the bike and remove the front wheel and fender.  Then loosen the pinch bolts on the triple trees so you can rotate the fork tubes.  If they are bent even a little it will be obvious as you turn them.  if they are good set them in the trees so the top corner of the tube is at the top of the tree and the cap is riding just above the tree so the line between the bottom of the fork cap and the top of the fork is right at the top of the tree.

2.Remove the tank and the plastic neck covers and get a good look at the frame, the welds and the angle of things.  If you dont know what to look at, this is where you need help.  If you can get another known good Valkyrie next to your bike the frame inspection will be so much easier to verify.

My money is on something being bent.  Riding it that way is not a safe thing.

[semper5]

So Semper5, have you seen enough people yet saying things like, "can't see it clearly" so as to make you want to go take a good picture of the bike like I mentioned earlier?

It bugs me that you've got so many people here trying to help, yet all you did was come back and ask yet another question.

Some of you guys sure have tender feelings here. I appreciate all the help and advice, I'm thankful for the input, and I believe I have made it clear. Glad your comfortable enough to tell me I have bugged you, but get over it. When I get the time to take pics and post them, I surely will as I believe this forum has been very helpful. Not wanting to wear out a welcome, it appears I have offended a few of you with my curiosity and newness. In addition, I work full time at a somewhat stressful job, and have other priorities, as have most of you do as well.

I just logged in to check this thread out, as it has been quite popular with input. Let me know if this post bugs you too.

This post does not bug me at all.  I gave you my best advise as far as safety goes.  I would hate to hear of another crash; continuing to ride a bent motorcycle is insane.  I know you are a new owner and you want to enjoy your new ride.  Unfortunately you inherited a nightmare that needs to be sorted out.

1. First thing to do is to make sure the forks are mounted properly and not bent.  The best way to do that is to raise the front of the bike and remove the front wheel and fender.  Then loosen the pinch bolts on the triple trees so you can rotate the fork tubes.  If they are bent even a little it will be obvious as you turn them.  if they are good set them in the trees so the top corner of the tube is at the top of the tree and the cap is riding just above the tree so the line between the bottom of the fork cap and the top of the fork is right at the top of the tree.

2.Remove the tank and the plastic neck covers and get a good look at the frame, the welds and the angle of things.  If you dont know what to look at, this is where you need help.  If you can get another known good Valkyrie next to your bike the frame inspection will be so much easier to verify.

My money is on something being bent.  Riding it that way is not a safe thing.

Thanks, will do. When I have time. I know you guys are anxious to help, hoping for a great solution, and willing to offer up what you can. I appreciate it. I will be doing this soon, as time allows. All the best.

[old2soon]

When you finally pinpoint the problem on yer lady you simply will NOT believe the folks that will want to come over and lend a hand. There may be a little discord from time to time between various members but what WILL have everybody heading in the same direction here is our unbridled passion for the motorcycles we ride and the riding itself.  I've been fortunate to meet and share wind with some folks from this board and had the opportunity to break bread with a lot of them(think I-13)and i'm proud to call a bunch of them FRIEND. While some of us-me-may seem pushy at times in actuality we are just tryin our damndest to be of some help.  THAT is what we try to do-HELP other folks because other folks at one time or another have helped us. Besides-most dealerships want outrageous sums to do wrong work on our gals.  HERE is where to go for help on our Valkyrie rides.  RIDE SAFE.

[Rio Wil]

So has Semper5 got his priorities straight yet......just can't leave the phat lady bumping her fender...

[semper5]

I left this thread alone because knowing the outcome and the disagreement I'd encounter, I didn't want to hear it. But I took the Valk up to a motorcycle mechanic in Genesee County. He took off several parts and pieces, and looked around. Removed tank, twisted the forks, several things that cost enough to make my wallet wince. We agree the frame is bent so slightly that it's hard to see where. No broken welds, no obviously bent frame, even though the wheelbase being shortened by .75 inches exists.

In short, I've been riding it, enjoying, and playing it safe.

Now, comes the flaming I expect.

[Michvalk]

If there is no handling problems, I, like you, would ride it. No visible cracks, or kinks in the frame. Maybe in the future you will have time to tear down and find the actual problem

[Rio Wil]

Did his actions do anything to restore the front suspension travel.  In the side pic's, it appeared the bike was sitting down about 2 inches from normal.....this is enough to shorten the wheel base by .75 inches.  Look at the fork travel available on the picture of my bike (or the red/white bike in this thread) vs a side pic of your bike....half of the travel on your bike is already used up........

It would be real interesting to see a picture of your bike from the side that included both wheels and taken with the camera at about 2 feet above ground and centered at the back of the front wheel (front wheel straight ahead).......does that make sense??

There has been a few folks that increased the rake on the front fork and claimed more comfortable steering (to me it would be slower reacting) and decreasing the rake such as suspected in your bike would make it quicker reacting.

[pancho]

It would be real interesting to see a picture of your bike from the side that included both wheels and taken with the camera at about 2 feet above ground and centered at the back of the front wheel (front wheel straight ahead).......does that make sense??

I did some measurements on the side pictures of the bike and got a reading of 28 degrees!!! , not the 32+ it is supposed to be.  A better picture like what is suggested would help.

[Valkpilot]

I left this thread alone because knowing the outcome and the disagreement I'd encounter, I didn't want to hear it. But I took the Valk up to a motorcycle mechanic in Genesee County. He took off several parts and pieces, and looked around. Removed tank, twisted the forks, several things that cost enough to make my wallet wince. We agree the frame is bent so slightly that it's hard to see where. No broken welds, no obviously bent frame, even though the wheelbase being shortened by .75 inches exists.

In short, I've been riding it, enjoying, and playing it safe.

Now, comes the flaming I expect.

It is my opinion that no frame and/or suspension should be so compromised that the front fender routinely makes contact with the rest of the bike, and still be trusted with life and limb.

[Rio Wil]

I did some measurements on the side pictures of the bike and got a reading of 28 degrees!!! , not the 32+ it is supposed to be.  A better picture like what is suggested would help.

========================================================================

Semper5, please don't feel obligated to participate in this discussion.....I am just finding this issue very interesting and would like to see something definitive come out of it....
 ========================================================================

I did not do the math, but if the rake changed from 32 to 28 deg, I would guess the wheel base would decrease by 2 inches or more...... not the .75 they measured.....so the 28 deg is a optical contusion.  The .75 inch is probably within a margin of error determining the bottom dead center of each wheel.

That's why I would like to see a pic that would minimize the lens effect and get a better measurement.

It still appears that in an unloaded state, the front suspension is already sitting at half of its downward travel.....compression from there would damn near routinely bottom out the fork travel and due to some amount of fork tube flex would allow the fender to contact the bolt...... in short, I don't think the frame is tweaked.....but what the hell do I know!!!! 

[pancho]

"It still appears that in an unloaded state, the front suspension is already sitting at half of its downward travel.....compression from there would damn near routinely bottom out the fork travel and due to some amount of fork tube flex would allow the fender to contact the bolt...... in short, I don't think the frame is tweaked.....but what the hell do I know!!!! "

  .....  HA  ....... You know as much as any of the rest of us Rio, probably more than some!  When I look at the pictures of the bike with a partial load, I see the distance from the bottom of the fork tube protective shield, to the top of the bottom fork casting that the axle goes through to be about an inch,,,, pretty much the same distance as what shows in the pictures of Mikes and RJs bikes in this thread....  I wonder which pictures look to you like half compression?? , I did not see that,,, certainly not saying it is not so,, just haven't seen it yet.

 While I am sure that the pictures I measured from do have parallax error from not being at exactly 90 degrees off,,  the four degrees + error I measured was enough that I mentioned it for further investigation.

[pancho]

PLUS,,,, as long as the sliders are in the proper position in the trees, and the rake is proper,, even with full compression, the fender should never be able to contact anything else.

[Rio Wil]

Look at how much more travel the red/white bike has than the problem bike.  I am saying the suspension on the problem bike operates in the bottom 50% of its travel even to the point of actually bottoming out........the red/white bike operates in the top 50-60% of its travel and would never bottom out......


I suspect someone has shortened the springs in the problem bike!!!!



Another reference point is the bolt that holds the front brake line attached to the fender.  On the white fender the bolt is well below the fork seal.  On the problem bike the bolt is well above the fork seal....

[The emperor has no clothes]

Look at how much more travel the red/white bike has than the problem bike.  I am saying the suspension on the problem bike operates in the bottom 50% of its travel even to the point of actually bottoming out........the red/white bike operates in the top 50-60% of its travel and would never bottom out......


I suspect someone has shortened the springs in the problem bike!!!!



Another reference point is the bolt that holds the front brake line attached to the fender.  On the white fender the bolt is well below the fork seal.  On the problem bike the bolt is well above the fork seal....

I think you are right, but I wonder why someone would shorten the springs? I can't think of any advantages. Plus it seems like it shouldn't hit the fender anyway.

[R J]

I'd like  to see someone follow the problem bike down the road and see if the tires follow in the same track or if they are stuck out at the bottom.

If he wasn't so damn far away, I'd go get it haul it to my house and check it over real good.   Fix it if possible and take it back.

[semper5]

You guys are right nice folk, I had planned on rebuilding the forks this winter for familiarity's sake. Maybe, just maybe...

To note though, the fender doesn't contact except in a hard bump.

[The emperor has no clothes]

You guys are right nice folk, I had planned on rebuilding the forks this winter for familiarity's sake. Maybe, just maybe...

To note though, the fender doesn't contact except in a hard bump.

Yeah, don't worry about the ones getting their panties in a wad on occasion . They are just trying to help.

[pancho]

"Another reference point is the bolt that holds the front brake line attached to the fender.  On the white fender the bolt is well below the fork seal.  On the problem bike the bolt is well above the fork seal...."

I see it,,,, the parts I was looking at for reference are all on the sprung side,, they wont't change in reference to one another... Still, I'm not sure that even with the springs removed, that there should be contact between the fender and anything else with full compression.  Also, the "problem bike" is not unloaded in that picture, there is a person on it.....  

I still measure the rake at about 28 degrees in that picture......  I'm like RJ,, wish I had that bike here,, then we would see!

[Rio Wil]

I was just looking at the witness marks on my forks created by the dust seal, the lowest mark I can see (and its very vague) is about 1 inch from completely bottoming out and hitting the cast aluminum bottom fork (and it never hits the fender at that point, although I am not sure exactly how far it is from doing do).  Most of the action seems to be about 2 inches up from the bottom and higher (or 3 inches down from the top). The bike sits down about a quarter to a half inch when I sit on it so I kind of doubt the problem bike suspension is compressed much by the little lady sitting on it.....


It is an interesting problem, but I guess I will leave it alone until Semper5 gets a chance later in the year to do further diagnostics........will be interesting to finally determine the solution...

[pancho]

Just for comparison, I shot a picture of mine from approx. the same angle to see if there was any validity to trying to measure the rake from a picture..... Using the same reference for the horizontal ,, a line drawn through the center of the upper valve cover fasteners, and a line drawn through the middle of the fork tubes, I get a reading between 32 and 33 degrees on mine... measuring semper5's bike. I get 28..??? Still, interesting as it is, we will need to wait on him to go through it to find the root cause of the problem.  Then again, I have gone through a bike after a crash before and found EVERYTHING tweaked a bit.

 I do think that if there is no vibration, buzzing or shaking at any speed semper5, you can get away with riding it,,,,, but I don't think I would do it until I knew more.