Burnt up starter relay connector

[pancho]

I'm getting ready to add a custom accessory fuse block and power distribution panel to clean up the mess under my right side cover (random relays for the air horns, stereo, spots etc.)



and decided to take a look at the starter relay connector for any sign of damage. A look at the wiring diagram shows that 100% of the juice that runs the bike (ignition, lights, accessories etc.) runs through the red wire in the connector.

            tried to paste that section of the wiring diagram but was not able to do it

Also, a look at the pictures of damage to others bikes (Chrisj and Smokinjoes') that have had the problem seem to show that the majority of the heat damage seems to be centered around that junction.

http://www.valkyrieforum.com/bbs/index.php/topic,74229.0.html

So I make a pin removal tool from the pocket clip off a small screwdriver and clip the nub off the end, (fits perfectly) and remove the red terminal to look for damage.





I find a bit of burning in the female connector, but it has not gotten out of hand yet, I will scrape clean the inside of the female spade and reassemble.

Conclusions:

1. All fusible accessories should be connected directly to the battery to keep any additional loads from using this weak link in the electrical system.

2. The blank spot in the connector  on the relay is the same 30 amp fused power buss from the relay, so an additional female spade can be put in that position and wired into the line to give parallel paths for the power distribution spade connector.

3. remove the connector and clean it properly and re tension it from time to time,,, just putting dielectric grease on it will do nothing if the contact is not tight.

[Smokinjoe-VRCCDS#0005]

Good post...Thanks for sharing 

[pancho]

Thanks,,  Here is the modification of adding a parallel connection to keep the lone female spade on the 30 amp buss from burning up the connector.







Other than all four positions in the connector plug being used, there is no sign that any work has been done.

[gordonv]

Conclusions:
2. The blank spot in the connector  on the relay is the same 30 amp fused power buss from the relay, so an additional female spade can be put in that position and wired into the line to give parallel paths for the power distribution spade connector.

Oh, now that I see the above pics, I understand now what you where saying (also why) here.

I think it's RJ who posted (and others repost) the repair of using the GW replacement connector, and requesting a wire moved over. I'm going to take that it is the Red wire that was moved. Seems this isn't needed, if both sides are hot after the relay triggers.

Also means we have a nice 30amp, if this is on the cold side of the relay, not the hot, for triggering an additional fuse block. Or do I have that wrong, would need to look over the schematics.

[pancho]

Hey Gordon,, not sure about the repair using the GW connector and what wire is moved for what reason,,,, this mod is to prevent the problem from ever happening in the first place.

If you take a look at the wiring diagram and you will see that the 30 amp circuit is always hot,, EVERYTHING (other than the starter cranking current, and the alternator charging current) on the bike that uses 12 volts is drawn through the connector on the red wire. (the gauge of the wire is sufficient to carry the maximum required current, but apparently the connection at the relay is lacking at times) The relay supplies the 30 amp main circuit on two terminals, but only one is used in our wiring harness. This mod simply provides a parallel path through the connector to supply the 30 amp main power line. Any connection provides potential high resistance, voltage drop, heat problem that can cause a meltdown of the connector, this will just drop the total current flow through any one connector by half.  Less chance of a problem...

Popping this terminal out of the connector housing for an occasional inspection and cleaning cannot be a bad idea, or you can do this mod or something similar and double up on your insurance.  

[Firefighter]

Looked at my 30 amp relay and found it has also melted some plastic ( a hole where the female spade connector is ). I took it apart and cleaned everything. Did not see any damage to the terminal itself, just dirty. I cleaned and greased these same terminals about a year ago and it looked ok then. This is probably the worst place for these electrical components as the rear tire probably slings water and dirt in there constantly. Did your double wire upgrade and used two new female spades. Now I will have to reset the radio and clock. Thanks for the heads up and new idea!  Firefighter

[Black Dog]

There is a fix first posted by 'Kruzin', way back when...  It uses a relay from a late 80's vintage Ford F150, cleans up the whole gob of wires, and IMO will last for a much longer time than the Honda setup 

After I found my second 'toasted' Starter Relay, I used this fix, and wrote about it...

Here is the post, and the link to Kruzin's fix -

snip

For the second time, in her 16 years of providing miles of smiles, my lady let me down the other day 

Got up Monday morning, looked at the weather and saw a perfect chance to 'ride' to work.  Pushed the beast out of her cave, strapped on the helmet, snugged up the gloves, slid on my sun glasses, turned the key, pushed the starter, and ...  Nothing    No indicator lights, no headlights, no nothing...

I've experienced this once before, while in the driveway of a Harley riding friend of mine...  Bad timing, and kinda is the reason I no longer give him crap about his bike (in good fun   ). 

Last time, it was the starter relay 'meltdown' that got me (I had made a point of glooping up the connection portion of the relay with Di-Electric grease, every spring, since the last repair...)  Same symptoms, same everything.  Last time I 'fixed' the problem using the OEM parts, as outlined in many posts found if you search 'Starter Relay' on these boards.

To refresh my memory, I searched again, and found many helpful hints (RJ's is probably the best known, using the 'kit').  While reading, I came across the write up by Kruzin (Dave) that uses a much beefier, heavy duty starter relay made for an 80's vintage Ford F150 

See it here...

http://www.valkyrieforum.com/bbs/index.php/topic,45371.0.html

Went to my local NAPA after work on Tuesday, picked up the relay, a heavy duty inline fuse holder, some beefier connectors and shrink tubing...  Out the door for less than $40 (and no waiting for parts to be delivered) 

Tore in to the Fat Gurl at about 5:30 last night, and was on my way to grab a burger and a shake, with my brother, at 8:00. 

The new install is clean, sturdy, and IMO, will last much longer than if I went with the OEM parts.

Big    cooldude  to Dave for taking the time to take pictures and document the process for maybe fixing this issue for good!  I 'PM'd" him Monday, asking if I could contact him if I encountered any issues, and he gave up his cell number, no questions asked.

Just another reason to hate this club, and to ask where I can fill out a form to get my dues back 

end snip


Black Dog

[pancho]

Hey firefighter,, I guess I should have mentioned that after I crimped the new spade on, I soldered all connections to further insure against a high resistance spot...   Also don't forget to move the power sources of any owner added accessories to the battery to keep the load off the 30 amp buss, The design is probably fine for a stock bike, but the lone spade connector,, or two if you do this mod, is only capable of carrying so much current trouble free,, not designed to carry anything other than a stock compliment of accessories.



"There is a fix first posted by 'Kruzin', way back when...  It uses a relay from a late 80's vintage Ford F150, cleans up the whole gob of wires, and IMO will last for a much longer time than the Honda setup  cooldude

After I found my second 'toasted' Starter Relay, I used this fix, and wrote about it...

Here is the post, and the link to Kruzin's fix - "

Well,,  that modification will certainly do away with the lone spade connector carrying the entire bikes electrical load and overheating,,,,,,     this is a simple minimally invasive mod to prevent the problem on bikes that have not had a meltdown, or at least are still sporting original hardware. 

Also, I think the biggest preventative measure is to insure that any wired accessories ( driving lights, horns, stereo, heated clothes etc.) get their 12 volt source directly from the battery, or the large hot terminal on the starter relay, as any other source will cause more current to flow through the 30 amp line (and the female spade) than the original design had accounted for.

[Firefighter]

I don't have mine soldered, but I have a lot of experience with crimp connections as I used to be in the marine business. Hopefully I did it right, used non insulated butt connector with heavy heat shrink. If not I will solder it, was not a good time last night. And yes, all my accessories are wired from the battery through fuses and relays. I was surprised to see heat damage as I cleaned that connection about a year ago and it was fine at that time. Sure don't want any trouble!  Thanks again Firefighter