Who do I talk to about this...

[pago cruiser]

cr@p.
Frickin ethanol.
Had to rebuild the carbs on the Hack, as it sat too long (8 months?) before I could get the hack subframe, electrics, lights, paint, powder, etc all squared away.  This is the bottom of what I pulled from the tank.

 

 

Would like to have a friendly chat with the folks who still think this is a good idea...

[Chrisj CMA]

Sorry to say, but the person you need to talk to will be found in the mirror. 8 mo is WAY too long.

[98valk]

u have to use a stabilizer all of the time with today's fuel.  the ethanol only absorbs water. the gumming/settling etc., is the lower grade petroleum product aka as low octane they can use now due to the ethanol which ups the octane. the LG petro will degrade within 3-4 wks without a stabilizer. I always use a double dose of stabil. Star Tron is just as good as stabil and usually cost less, I just don't see it in my area.
too much ethanol and phase separation can/will occur. Acetone will stop phase separation and is what the methanol racers use.

[Paladin528]

That will also occur if there is any water in your tank.  The water will pull the ethanol out of suspension.  Sometimes you just have to run it till it quits.  You could also clear that up with Sea Foam or some other fuel additive.  Which coincidentally contain Alcohol.

[Joevalk]

That is what I found in the bottom of my carbs after sitting 4 months.

[Ricky-D]

It has always been a good maintenance practice to drain a little bit of fuel

from each carburetor float bowl every now and then. Besides it's such an easy thing to do.

So you see what happens when you don't do this!

***

[Michvalk]

I use stabil in every tank of fuel, no matter what. Mine rarely sit, but you never know when it will, and I don't want to have to tear stuff apart (again)

[98valk]

It has always been a good maintenance practice to drain a little bit of fuel

from each carburetor float bowl every now and then. Besides it's such an easy thing to do.

So you see what happens when you don't do this!

***

I feel going WOT now and then is much better and more fun.   

[tonyfan70]

Take this however, but a friend of mine owns a motorsports shop and he did the carbs on my Magna last winter. I told him I had used the regular (red?) Stabil so why did I develop problems? His advice was to use Startron or the other color of Stabil, think it may be blue.  He said hes found that the old formula Stabil won't "work" for very long and really, the fuel in Illinois is so shitty that none of them are good for keeping it usable for more than 4-5 months or so.

I didn't have that gummy thick build up that I've seen before, but the jets were plugged so it ran like we all know. He recommended at the end of the season to drain the carbs, lines and tank. I know I will with the Magna this winter but the Valk will get Startron...I've ridden it in January so I'll probably keep fuel in it.

One thing I like about sledding in northern WI...the premium is all gas.

[Jess from VA]

Who do I talk to about this...

I generally end up talking to (cursing) myself.   

No one else is around. 

Write your congressman.......... or the Easter Bunny (both are equally effective).   

[Paladin528]

I find it quite funny.  When I travel in the USA I get better gas mileage on the bike even though I am driving faster.  But you guys have this fuel separation issue.  In Canada I can let fuel sit for the entire winter and there is no separation of the compounds in the fuel.  I still use a stabilizer when I store the bike in the winter but I have never had this issue with any vehicle or piece of equipment.
When I had the carbs out of my old bike with 96K KM on it they were spotlessly clean.

[98valk]

Take this however, but a friend of mine owns a motorsports shop and he did the carbs on my Magna last winter. I told him I had used the regular (red?) Stabil so why did I develop problems? His advice was to use Startron or the other color of Stabil, think it may be blue.  He said hes found that the old formula Stabil won't "work" for very long and really, the fuel in Illinois is so shitty that none of them are good for keeping it usable for more than 4-5 months or so.

I didn't have that gummy thick build up that I've seen before, but the jets were plugged so it ran like we all know. He recommended at the end of the season to drain the carbs, lines and tank. I know I will with the Magna this winter but the Valk will get Startron...I've ridden it in January so I'll probably keep fuel in it.

One thing I like about sledding in northern WI...the premium is all gas.

marine stabil is blue, twice as concentrated twice as expensive.

I double dose regular stabil. bike was sitting for about nine months, over the winter. had to replace clutch and just too busy with work to ride. took 3-4 months doing the clutch in my spare time. After all that time the bike fired right up and rode like nothing was wrong. all gas in my state is mandated 10% ethanol. still running at the end of the tank with 11 month old fuel now. same goes for stabil mixed gas that goes into snow blower. sits until next season always fires right up after 10-11 months, have been doing this for yrs. stabil works for me, and always has.
the internet horror stories are from guys who can't or don't want to read and understand the instructions. they think the 1oz shot is all they have to do.

[98valk]

I find it quite funny.  When I travel in the USA I get better gas mileage on the bike even though I am driving faster.  

that's cause your going down hill coming into the states. I'm sure your mileage is worst going back up hill into canada.

[Paladin528]

Only worse when I cross the border.  Even thoug we have a MAX ethanol content of 10% and I run ethanol free most of the time, our fuel formulation is different and seems to contain less energy.

[slabghost]

Take this how you will but I use automatic transmission fluid in my gas for everything. I've let my bike sit for 9 months and it fires right up. My 84 goldwing has about 4 oz of atf in the oil too. Only downside is if I get a little too much in the fuel it will send up a blue cloud at startup but that clears up quick. I haven't had any reason to remove the carbs on my 1200 in 5 years.

[pago cruiser]

Thanks for the replies.

While I guess I am going to be forced into a fuel stabilizer, I have read that it will only work to keep the ethanol and gasoline mixed; it will not, and cannot prevent water absorption.

http://www.fuel-testers.com/expiration_of_ethanol_gas.html

Most of my bikes have carbs, so I guess the vents are the means of moisture ingress.  

I have a few bikes, and unfortunately I cannot tell when one is going to be down for a week, a month, or longer.  The Valk Hack project was to have taken 3 months.  I actually started the engine once a month and let it come up to temp.  But each month is just seemed to run a bit worse; until the right bank of carbs was totally dead.  Then I knew I was f'cked.    

I also ride about 100 miles a day on my commute; seems a travesty to be adding stabil (or something) as a regular course of action.  Between gasohol, tires, oil, filters, and now a stabilizer, it would almost be cheaper to drive the frickin Jeep!

The US is now at the lowest amount of imported oil in the last 30 years.
http://www.eia.gov/tools/faqs/faq.cfm?id=727&t=6

Isn't it about time to quit this charade that converting corn into gasoline is a good decision?.  It STILL takes more energy to create than benefit derived, and in addition screws up millions of small engines across the country.  I checked with my local Indie bike shop; they get $600 for a Valk carb rebuild.  In a just world, we should all be able to send the repair bill for this government created fiasco to the politicians who created this mess...
 

[Paladin528]

If you are worried about water then follow this very simple procedure.  If the bike sits for any length of time, before you start it turn the petcock to Reserve.  DO NOT MOVE THE BIKE AT ALL.  Start it up and let it run for 5 minutes or so.  This will pick up any water in the tank since it settles to the bottom.  Of course there is some residual that the petcock cannot pick up but any significant accumulation will be sucked out first.
The other option is to dump a half can of seafoam into the tank and shake the crap out of it and run the tank dry.  The Isopropyl in the seafoam will mix readily with any water in the tank and allow the engine to burn it.

[98valk]

If you are worried about water then follow this very simple procedure.  If the bike sits for any length of time, before you start it turn the petcock to Reserve.  DO NOT MOVE THE BIKE AT ALL.  Start it up and let it run for 5 minutes or so.  This will pick up any water in the tank since it settles to the bottom.  Of course there is some residual that the petcock cannot pick up but any significant accumulation will be sucked out first.
The other option is to dump a half can of seafoam into the tank and shake the crap out of it and run the tank dry.  The Isopropyl in the seafoam will mix readily with any water in the tank and allow the engine to burn it.

good points. I have always when I fill the tank leave it on reserve for at least 100 miles for reasons u mention and then switch to the main.

[zzed28]

I have never had much luck with Stabil or Seafoam, neither has ever produced the results claimed even at double concentrations.  I use Berrymans B12 if I need to clean something, dont know that it works, just seems better.  I intend to fill tanks with pure gas if they are going to be sitting for any period of time. Its four bux a gallon, but since there is little use until spring or use anyways, the price doesnt bother me.  Around here they call it Rec 90,, for its octane number.  The only concern I have with that is, I dont know how much of it the station sells, and who knows how old whats in their tank is  anyways. Ive read that its good for two years.

[Ricky-D]

When I was a kid and worked at a combination Dodge dealership and Amoco gas station the

mechanics told me that the Amoco white gas went stale a whole lot faster than the regular

gas which was leaded. I think nowadays non-ethanol gasoline will go much longer in useable

condition that gasoline that has ethanol. I use non-ethanol in all my machinery and never have had

any kind of gasoline related problem. It is readily available in this area and sells for around $2.60 gal.

***

[cookiedough]

When I was a kid and worked at a combination Dodge dealership and Amoco gas station the

mechanics told me that the Amoco white gas went stale a whole lot faster than the regular

gas which was leaded. I think nowadays non-ethanol gasoline will go much longer in useable

condition that gasoline that has ethanol. I use non-ethanol in all my machinery and never have had

any kind of gasoline related problem. It is readily available in this area and sells for around $2.60 gal.


At that cheap 2.60 price, why not us 91 octane or similar NON-ethanol gas all the time?  I think most of us in the states using that non-ethanol gas are in the 3.15-3.20 range or thereabouts vs. say 2.60 for E10 87 octane gas. 

I like most use regular 87 octane E10 gas, but come near winter time in November,  the last 2 tankfuls I put 91 octane NON ethanol gas in the Valk and fill it up as well with stabil and seafoam both and run it for 5-10 minutes to get it mixed in good. 

For rarely used items like snowblowers or weed eaters or roto-tillers,  good idea to use NON ethanol higher octane gas all the time. 
***