Need Info on maybe a Possible Clutch Problem

[Old Geezer Richard]

The other weekend I was out riding on my 1998 Valk Tourer with 97,000 miles on the clock  and I stopped in a Auto Parts Store now when I was leaving I noticed that when I pulled the clutch lever in to put it in gear , I noticed it did not slip into gear very easy it felt like I didn't have the clutch lever in all the way pulled in and when it did go into gear the bike lurched forward just ever so slightly with the clutch lever pulled ... I also noticed that I could not find Neutral at all with the bike running , it would either jump into 1st or 2nd but no neutral .... Now when riding home the clutch lever felt like it did not go all the way down unable to touch the grip and the shifting was not smooth at all  .... OK , I got her home and right then and there I flushed out the fluids all the way around and saw that the fluid's were a Whiskey color and low on both the clutch and brake Master Cylinder .... Now with fluids flushed , the front & rear brake's works great , but the clutch side still was not easy going into gear , so I bled the Clutch side again just in case I might had any air bubbles in the line .... Well it's still doing the same thing , Neutral I cannot find while the bike is running and it still does not shift smooth like before but it does shift into gear .... This is the first time the clutch has given me any problem since I have owned my Valk .... So my question is , is the Master Cylinder need to be Re-built or Re-placed or is the Clutch Slave Cylinder going out or is it the Clutch Plates crapping out .... Thanks for the help the Geezer   

[Daniel Meyer]

The clutch lever not going all the way in is a symptom of the rivet problem on the older clutches...so, yah, sounds like bad clutch.

Others more experienced with this will chime in but search for "rivet" and there's some good info on it...

Here's one:
http://www.valkyrieforum.com/bbs/index.php/topic,80441.0.html

[wiggydotcom]

Yep, it sure sounds like your rivets are letting go in the damper plate. That's the telltale sign of the clutch lever not pulling all the way back at times. My bike had the exact same symptoms...not wanting to go into gear...it also slipped in every gear when I gave it a hard twist of throttle.

This is what happens if your clutch damper rivets let go. Your spacers are free to move around and they all bunch up, expanding the width the plate takes up. That's why the clutch lever no longer pulls back to the handlebar.




And here is what the damage looks like.


I changed out my master cylinder and slave cylinder at the same time as I changed out the clutch. 2 weeks later I totaled out the bike on a deer strike...go figure.

Good luck,

[Mr.BubblesVRCCDS0008]

Richard the rivets in the damper are shot. My clutch did the same thing it had 160K on it and the whole prooblem developed in about 15 minutes. I did my clutch  myself took about 4hrs and not real hard. Red Diamond loaned my an outer basket to stack clutch ass. on workbend which made it very easy.

[Old Geezer Richard]

I'm guessing I'll need to replace the whole Clutch Pack with  new Clutch Springs along with a new gasket for the Clutch Cover .... I looked on Flea - bay and they have the complete Clutch Pack as a packsge deal for $158 with Clutch Disc's & hard  disc's made by Barnett .... Is that all parts I'll need or is there more parts ??  Is $158.00 a good price ??  Any special tools I'll need  ???

[F6Dave]

When my rivets sheared, I bought a new damper plate, spring, fiber plates, clutch nut, and gasket.  After I opened everything up I found that I only needed the damper plate, as everything else was fine.

The job isn't hard at all, and takes about 4 hours as others have said.  The only unusual tools needed are a big socket for the clutch nut (I forget the size), and a holder for the basket so you can get the big nut off.  I made a holder out of a 2x4.  The other option is to use an impact wrench.

[F6Dave]

Here's an old post I made a few years back:

After many months I finally got around to replacing the clutch on my ’98 Tourer.  As some others have experienced, the rivets in the damper plate failed.  This is not uncommon on some high mileage Valks.

The job took several hours, but was not difficult at all.  Getting the center plastic cover off was more of a PITA than any of the other work.  Clearance isn’t as good as in a bike with a more typical transversely mounted engine, but once you have it on a lift with a few pieces removed (I didn’t even remove the tank) there is plenty of clearance to remove the rear cover and clutch center pack without any special tools (not even a wobble joint for your ratchet).

Here are of a couple of things I learned:

I’d read that the disk alignment must nearly perfect or the compressed clutch center pack will not fit back into the basket.  I used a couple of large washers and a spring in 2 places to hold the pack together with some light pressure.  This allowed me to align the disks in the basket, and keep them aligned when I compressed the diaphragm spring and replaced the circlip.



Speaking of compressing the spring, I made a simple tool out of a 2x4, long bolt, a plastic pipe fitting, and an old lawnmower blade.  I knew that blade would come in handy one day!  This allowed me to use straight tips on the circlip pliers which seem to work better than 90 or 45 degree tips.



While I used an impact wrench to remove the big clutch nut, I wanted to torque the new one to the Honda spec.  Here’s a simple clutch holder tool I made from another 2x4.

[Ricky-D]

There have been some reported problems (in the past) with using Barnett clutch components

in the Valkyrie engine. You cannot go wrong using genuine Honda OEM parts.

***

[mark81]

has Honda revised the rivets? this seems to be the weak link. I am not disputing the quality and reliability of oem parts but is there a company that makes a damper plate that holds up better to abuse?

[Ricky-D]

It's not imperative that you use a damper plate. The only necessity is that the clutch pack makes

it to the necessary stack-up height. You can do this any way you like.  Leave out the damper plate and

add in it's place another friction plate and steel plate, or two. It's up to you.

***

[Valkpilot]

has Honda revised the rivets? this seems to be the weak link. I am not disputing the quality and reliability of oem parts but is there a company that makes a damper plate that holds up better to abuse?

The problem has been attributed to a bad batch/vendor of the damper plate components. Virtually all widely documented damper plate rivet failures have been in 97 and 98 models.  Other years, and currently available OEM damper plate assemblies, do not appear to be a problem.

[wiggydotcom]

has Honda revised the rivets? this seems to be the weak link. I am not disputing the quality and reliability of oem parts but is there a company that makes a damper plate that holds up better to abuse?

The problem has been attributed to a bad batch/vendor of the damper plate components. Virtually all widely documented damper plate rivet failures have been in 97 and 98 models.  Other years, and currently available OEM damper plate assemblies, do not appear to be a problem.

Not disputing there might have been a bad batch but my plate gave out and my Interstate was a 99 with about 80k miles on it when it failed. The pics I posted earlier in this same thread were from that 99 I/S. Might have been a leftover. Who knows.

[Old Geezer Richard]

Being Ree-tired on a fixed income , who would have the Cheapest Prices on Clutch Parts ?? I called my two local Stealer-ships here in San Antonio and one quoted me $344.03 & $355.80 which includes all the Friction & Hard Disc's and Spring plus another $18  for the Clutch Cover Gasket .... Is there anywhere else Cheaper ??  or is this gonna be the Standard Cost for OEM Parts ??  Thanks the Geezer   

[Ricky-D]

As a practical matter, you only need replace the parts that are bad or broken. And people complain about the dealers

screwing them over. Being practical and reasonable are positive traits.

***

[Valkpilot]

Being Ree-tired on a fixed income , who would have the Cheapest Prices on Clutch Parts ?? I called my two local Stealer-ships here in San Antonio and one quoted me $344.03 & $355.80 which includes all the Friction & Hard Disc's and Spring plus another $18  for the Clutch Cover Gasket .... Is there anywhere else Cheaper ??  or is this gonna be the Standard Cost for OEM Parts ??  Thanks the Geezer   

I doubt seriously that you need anything but the damper plate, spring, and gasket.  To my knowledge, true wear & tear failures that could be attributed to worn friction plates are extremely rare.   And, a symptom of this would be slipping, and you didn't report that.

I would buy those parts first, and then measure the friction plates when you disassemble.  Or, if you've got a cooperative source, buy the whole mess and return what you don't need.

[F6Dave]

As a practical matter, you only need replace the parts that are bad or broken. And people complain about the dealers

screwing them over. Being practical and reasonable are positive traits.

***

I agree with Ricky.  When I fixed mine, I ordered a new set of clutch disks, the spring, the big nut, damper plate, and gasket.  I wanted everything to be on hand when I opened it up.

However, I measured the old spring and it was well within the factory specs.  I didn't need that but replaced it anyway.  The disks were in great shape and could easily go another 100K miles (I did this at about 145K).  I didn't need those disks either, but used the new ones because I had them.  I replaced the big nut because the book said you should, but I really doubt that was necessary.  The old gasket looked great and wasn't leaking, so I left it alone because I didn't feel like scraping it off.  It still doesn't leak.

So the bottom line is, all I really needed was a new damper plate.  And if I were in a bind, I could probably have simply replaced the rivets.  The springs and plates in the old damper looked just fine.  If you want to do this on a budget, just order a damper plate.  If you get inside and see something else damaged you can replace it, but there's a very good chance you won't find any other problems.  These GL1500 clutches were built to haul a lot of weight around.  They are pretty durable.

[Old Geezer Richard]

 Well Boy's & Girl's , I solved my clutch shifting problem I hope , I rebuilt the clutch master cylinder and replaced the pivot parts and bled the system several times to make sure any and all air bubbles were purged from the line .... Low and Behold my clutch is working smooth again , the clutch lever goes all the way down to the hand grip , I can find neutral again anytime and it shifts smooth as hell  ..... When I let the clutch out the Old Fat launches a lot better without the shuddering like before , thank you lord ...Thank you all for your in-put .... Thanks the Geezer