Backwards front tire

[cabincruiser]

Thanks all for your help with my exhaust troubles, I was able to find a virginal set of standard pipes for my 98 Tourer and she is much quieter now.  I purchased this bike with a darkside rear tire, a Kelly Charger 205/60R 16 which I'm getting used to. I noticed that the newer front tire, a Dunlop E3 150/80R 17 is mounted with the directional arrow pointing the wrong way.  A friend suggested this may have been intentional. Any feedback on this as I'm worried it might hydroplane if the rain grooves aren't positioned as the factory intended.  Also, the rear is at 32 psi, and I have about an inch of sidewall wear only on the right side. It seems like a pretty substantial flat spot and the tread does not seem to be worn at all.  Is my sidewall collapsing in right-hand turns?
Thanks, Chris

[jim@98valkyrie.com]

I had a rear tire mounted at a Stealer when I had a flat on the road a few years back. I didn't notice (my fault) that the tire was mounted on the incorrect direction for several months. Needless to say, I got that corrected pronto. Along with the rain groove directions, it is my understanding that the tires have a lap in the tread that could come delaminated if run the incorrect direction. I was lucky. You may not be. You should get that tire changed around ASAP!

[Cracker Jack]

Thanks all for your help with my exhaust troubles, I was able to find a virginal set of standard pipes for my 98 Tourer and she is much quieter now.  I purchased this bike with a darkside rear tire, a Kelly Charger 205/60R 16 which I'm getting used to. I noticed that the newer front tire, a Dunlop E3 150/80R 17 is mounted with the directional arrow pointing the wrong way.  A friend suggested this may have been intentional. Any feedback on this as I'm worried it might hydroplane if the rain grooves aren't positioned as the factory intended.  Also, the rear is at 32 psi, and I have about an inch of sidewall wear only on the right side. It seems like a pretty substantial flat spot and the tread does not seem to be worn at all.  Is my sidewall collapsing in right-hand turns?
Thanks, Chris

No comment on the rear. Concerning the direction arrow on motorcycle tires, front tire treads are designed for maximum traction on breaking. Rear tire treads are designed to prevent spinning on acceleration as opposed to maximum breaking.

I run my rear tire on front with the arrow reversed since I don't accelerate with the front wheel and want maximum wet traction on breaking. That's it as far as tread direction goes. You decide how you want the best wet traction on the front.

Some people are of the opinion that the direction arrows have to do with the way the tires plys are layed up during construction and running the arrow in reverse may cause the tires to delaminate. I personally place no credence in that argument.  

[98valk]

both subjects addressed many, many times.
suggest a search, it is your friend. 

[cabincruiser]

OK thanks, wasnt sure what to search for at first but a couple of replies has enlightened me.  Pretty sure its a back tire mounted in reverse in front as CrackerJack discussed, and I'm betting the front rear fender bolt is the culprit on the rear.  Thanks for all the help.

[MarkT]

I have hit deep water at 60 (thought it was a shallow puddle, it was a foot deep)  And there was no sign of hydroplaning. I don't think a rounded bike tire can hydroplane at reasonable speeds.  The rounded tire just parts the water like the prow of a boat.

On the tire direction.  The radial plies are wrapped around the tire, the direction is not random but determines which way the tire will rotate.  Back tires are set up so the stress and overlap is compatible with acceleration.  Front tires, for braking.  Some argue ply separation is more likely if these overlaps are not observed. I suspect the tires are mostly pretty durable and they are not likely to delaminate in normal use.  But run them at high speeds, in very hot weather, and/or with too much or too little pressure and such abuse might be the severe condition that delivers failure. As for tread design, I hold that it matters not, as far as rotation. Cruiser or road or touring or sport bike tires get most of their traction from the softness of the rubber compound, traction delivered at the micro level - that's why they wear so fast. Back tires typically start out with much more tread depth, like 11/32.  Fronts, typically 6/32.  A back tire will last longer when mounted in front but may exhibit problems like cupping.  So if the tire is newish, if it has deep tread it is likely a back tire, and if mounted in front, should be mounted to rotate reverse of the arrow.  As for me, I run Bridgestone Batlax BT45 bias rear tires on the fronts, mounted reversed - get nearly twice the wear out of them, compared to tires designated as fronts. Balanced with Ride-On, I don't get cupping.  Pressure set generally 39-40 lbs.  Handle well in all conditions I ride, which includes wet clay/sand - if rain shows up at the house before I return.  A big reason for me to want as much tread as I can get on my tires. (Austone Taxi tire on the rear). I have run a couple other brands of back tires in the front, the same way -  and also ignored the overlap issue; ran the arrow forwards.  (Dunlop K491 IIRC) No difference found in traction or delaminating problems. I'm not an expert on tires but more knowledgeable than your average bear - I worked in the truck tire industry going through college.

[Cracker Jack]

One additional thought on the ply layup and the possible delamination issue, the rear tire is exposed to opposite forces whether breaking and accelerating. If the tire is susceptible to delamination when the force is in one direction over the other, should I be gentle with the tire when accelerating or breaking if I want to minimize my chances of having a delamination?  

[cabincruiser]

Great info Mark, thanks much. What is your thought on whether or not to replace my rear tire now that the fender bolt has taken perhaps as much as 1/8" out of the right sidewall? It doesnt appear it has worn down to any cords.  Despite reading the tutorials, I am still having no luck inserting pictures on this forum 

[Chrisj CMA]

OK thanks, wasnt sure what to search for at first but a couple of replies has enlightened me.  Pretty sure its a back tire mounted in reverse in front as CrackerJack discussed, and I'm betting the front rear fender bolt is the culprit on the rear.  Thanks for all the help.

An E3 150/80R17 is a front tire. It should be mounted with the arrow going the right way.  Was probably a  mistake if its backwards

[Chrisj CMA]

Thanks all for your help with my exhaust troubles, I was able to find a virginal set of standard pipes for my 98 Tourer and she is much quieter now.  I purchased this bike with a darkside rear tire, a Kelly Charger 205/60R 16 which I'm getting used to. I noticed that the newer front tire, a Dunlop E3 150/80R 17 is mounted with the directional arrow pointing the wrong way.  A friend suggested this may have been intentional. Any feedback on this as I'm worried it might hydroplane if the rain grooves aren't positioned as the factory intended.  Also, the rear is at 32 psi, and I have about an inch of sidewall wear only on the right side. It seems like a pretty substantial flat spot and the tread does not seem to be worn at all.  Is my sidewall collapsing in right-hand turns?
Thanks, Chris

No comment on the rear. Concerning the direction arrow on motorcycle tires, front tire treads are designed for maximum traction on breaking. Rear tire treads are designed to prevent spinning on acceleration as opposed to maximum breaking.

I run my rear tire on front with the arrow reversed since I don't accelerate with the front wheel and want maximum wet traction on breaking. That's it as far as tread direction goes. You decide how you want the best wet traction on the front.

Some people are of the opinion that the direction arrows have to do with the way the tires plys are layed up during construction and running the arrow in reverse may cause the tires to delaminate. I personally place no credence in that argument.  

I don't want anything to be maximum breaking especially while I am braking with my motorcycle and if I am maximum braking on my motorcycle that means I am way more heavily using the front brakes and therefore if the E3 150/80R17 is on backwards its not ready for maximum braking without some form of maximum breaking.

[Cracker Jack]

Everything I've written on this thread is intended to apply to a rear tire mounted on the front. Right or wrong, that's what I thought we were talking about. As far as I know, there's no question when a front tire is mounted on the front. The arrow rotates forward. 

[Jess from VA]

OK thanks, wasnt sure what to search for at first but a couple of replies has enlightened me.  Pretty sure its a back tire mounted in reverse in front as CrackerJack discussed, and I'm betting the front rear fender bolt is the culprit on the rear.  Thanks for all the help.

An E3 150/80R17 is a front tire. It should be mounted with the arrow going the right way.  Was probably a mistake if its backwards

YES.     This was very likely a mistake (or bad judgment if intentional).

Good catch, BTW.  (most of us may never have noticed it)

A rear tire, deep tread, bias mounted on the front should be reversed, but not a front tire radial (or front bias for that matter).  

It's not an emergency (avoid heavy rain and hard stops), but get it changed as soon as practical.   And with a metal valve stem if it's not already on there.

[John Schmidt]

The front tire issue with a rear mounted in reverse has been adequately covered here, but your rear tire issue hasn't. First, you're not using enough pressure in back, add another 3-5 lbs. psi. At 32 psi the tire will be too soft and the sidewalls will allow it roll and sway in the turns. Re. the wear, it's not coming from the front bolt of the rear fender, it comes from contact with the right rear nut cage. Look under the rear fender in that area where the rear bolt comes through and you'll see a small cage with a square nut in it. That cage is what's causing the damage and needs to be removed. Remove the rear bolt on both sides and the single bolt on top of the fender at the rear. You'll need to support the fender while you unplug the harness where the two fender pieces meet. Lay the fender on an old towel or similar to prevent scratching the proceed to cut off that cage....the big square nut usually will fall out on its own. Once removed, give it a shot of black paint where you did the cutting to help prevent rust. Pick up a couple carriage bolts of correct size/length, and at least three nuts for each side; two for spacers against the fender rail and one on the outside to hold the bag mount on. Replace the rear fender and run those bolts from the inside out, place a couple nuts with a washer against the fender rail, hang the bag mount and install the outer nut. I use an acorn nut with a lock washer under it. Now you'll have enough clearance between your tire sidewall and the inside of the fender.

Having said all that, if you find that cage is already gone, then my guess is you're simply running the tire with too little a psi. That allows the sidewall to extend outward when your weight added to the bike.

[MarkT]

Great info Mark, thanks much. What is your thought one whether or not to replace my rear tire now that the fender bolt has taken perhaps as much as 1/8" out of the right sidewall? It doesnt appear it has worn down to any cords.  Despite reading the tutorials, I am still having no luck inserting pictures on this forum 

I might not change it if the cord isn't damaged or visible, for around town riding.  Might change it before a trip.  Probably change it if I was going to be pulling my camper trailer. But that's me, I have run my rear tires locally until the cord shows so I might not be as conservative on tire safety as some. I will also run a plugged rear tire, if the tire is in great shape otherwise and I'm satisfied the plug is properly installed.  Prefer the patch-plug type plug for that - and I also run Ride-On anyway so that helps keep the air in the tire.

[Jess from VA]

Valk nut cage mod.  Fender does not have to come off, if you take tire off you can slide in/under and do all work easily.

http://lifeisaroad.com/stories/2005/08/24/valkyrieRearFenderNutCageMod.html

[Chrisj CMA]

Everything I've written on this thread is intended to apply to a rear tire mounted on the front. Right or wrong, that's what I thought we were talking about. InAs far as I know, there's no question when a front tire is mounted on the front. The arrow rotates forward. 

I was just pulling your chain about breaking vs braking.  When it comes to bikes braking is a good thing when you need to stop but breaking stuff is hardly ever a good thing.

[cabincruiser]

Thanks all, good catch on identifying this tire as a front tire, as its not designated on the sidewall. Thanks John for the great description of the cage modification, I know this has been covered before so I really appreciate the extra effort you took to explain it to me.  I think I will lose the damaged tire after all, since CT's are relatively cheap and I have to pull the wheel anyway. I was considering a 195 width rather than the 205 just to be safe in terms of clearance, even after the mod. I think this happened with my wife on the back, glad I caught it before a disaster.

[Cracker Jack]

Everything I've written on this thread is intended to apply to a rear tire mounted on the front. Right or wrong, that's what I thought we were talking about. InAs far as I know, there's no question when a front tire is mounted on the front. The arrow rotates forward. 

I was just pulling your chain about breaking vs braking.  When it comes to bikes braking is a good thing when you need to stop but breaking stuff is hardly ever a good thing.

No problem, chain pulling deserved. I certainly know better.

[Gryphon Rider]

This is what it should look like, even if it were a back E3 mounted on the front.  At the front of the tire, the groove should go upward from the outside to the middle of the tread.  I.e., the grooves look kind of like mountains rather than valleys.

Link to my explanation why: http://www.valkyrieforum.com/bbs/index.php/topic,40891.msg387385.html#msg387385