question for Jeffk

[Jean the Black Wolf]

Hi Jeff Hi at all
I ask this question for a friend from the VRCC France
he would like to know something
here it is his question many thanks for him

HI .
My name is Alain, member of the french VRCC. I have a technical question and need some help :
I bought an engine which has 2 striped cylinders. I will rebore it and change the pistons. I wish to increase the cubic capacity of the engine and would like to know until where can one go in reboring beyond the dimension repair recommended by Honda (+ 1mm I believe in 3rd reboring)
In addition, do you know a piston supplier (drop forged or not) ?
The dealer proposed to look if some Gold 1800 parts would fit in F6c, maybee the gear box (without reverse gear).... Some ideas???

Thanks by advance for your help
Friendly
Alain 

[steveB (VRCC UK)]

Jean posted this on the UK site this morning in reply to same question - apologies for stealing this thread-

OK prepare to open can of worms.
steveC and I built a 1800cc Valk a few years back with liners and pistons from TTS (UK).
The bores cannot be overbored (beyond Hondas limits), you need to press out the original liners, bore the blocks, then press in oversize liners.
This is where it goes tits up.
At 1800cc the lands between the bores are too narrow, so despite using solid copper head gaskets and machining sealing rings into the cylinder head, gaskets blew after only hundreds of miles. After several rebuilds I admitted defeat and we fitted a stock GL1500 bottom end. An expensive and time consuming excercise - oh and TTS were next to useless with tech assistance.
When it was going power was well up on stock but it never lasted long enough to strap it on the dyno.

Few things Alain should consider;
1. 1500 Wing and Valk blocks are interchangeable only gearboxes differ. You can fit all the chrome timing cases, water pump, gearbox, cylinder heads, cams and rocker boxes etc from the Valk to the Wing motor, so the 1500 Wing is another source of lower end parts.
2. 1800 Wing is a 'new' design, dimensions differ, to fit parts or indeed a complete motor would be next to impossible, chances of anything cross fitting would be at best coincidental.... You could fabricate a custom frame but WTF.
3. Any dealer who is suggesting modding the Valk in this way probably has not been there. Gearbox is in deep, complete motor strip is required, when I've fitted Marios overdrive gears we left the one bank of pistons in but it's still a major tear down with lots of service tools required. Most don't realise there is no cylinder block the liners are part of the crankcase (doh). Pistons are a bear to fit into bores, you need the Honda service tools, if you overbore you will need to fab your own tools, gudgeon (wrist) pins are a press fit in the piston - sliding fit in the rod, all good fun to fit and set up.
4. I'm baffled as to why Alain is considering using another gearbox anyway (reverse is powered by the starter motor on the 15 & 18 wing).
5. If you are paying labour to a Honda dealer consider a DIY or ship to Mario or similar on a fixed price basis. Personally I would look for a good low mileage unit from a salvage yard, will work out far cheaper.
6. If you want bang for bucks, supercharge it, the blower kit from Magna is around $3000 and bolts on in weekend, Makes more power than any porting, polishing, cams, pipes etc etc but does use obscene amounts of fuel. It would be easy to spend big bucks going the the overbore/conventional tune route without real results.
7. TTS can supply pistons, liners etc from known manufacturers, but I would be wary of letting them loose on machining work

Finally - steveC sold the Valk plus loads of bits to his brother Martin and bought a Rune. Martin feels TTS bored the blocks out of line and its on his list of long term projects so maybe he can make it work. Just my 2 pence worth - steveC and Martin will probably chime in here.

[fstsix]

Steve B you may not know this but you must of posted your project years ago. I read it carefully hoping your R&D would work it self out Been there done that   I did just that installed puffer. I had contacted this guy about 5 years back like your self need more power (Addiction) I had 750 K1 back in the 70"s and had this same guy installed 1080cc kit i look back now and glad some one offered big bore kits and did the R&D at their expense.  http://www.hondahog.com/RCeng_01.htm  Russ knows a little about Fuel injection i think?

[fstsix]

Sorry Old picture i have tried to find the guy that i sold it to not knowing that it would be collector item  :'( How about that Darkside 34 years ago!!

[Jean the Black Wolf]

Hi SteveB 
thank you for having posted this on the uk board this morning
thank for this reply , Vrcc is a great family
I send to Alain this reply and hope he is  courageous for his project 
happy to read your advice
see you later my friend
again lot of thanks
JEAN

[666]

Hello to everybody, 
It is cool  to have answered my technical problem and for your reception
I did not intend to re-bore until 1800 but a little more than the size of repair honda, 1600 or 1700.
In view of shirts , there is a lot of material (Metal)  to re-bore beyond 1 millimeter.
If I re-bore in 0,50, I have to pass from 1520 till 1560 cc,
And it is true that it is expensive, réalésage, pistons, complete dress handkerchief of joints, small cushions, costs approximately 3673 $
I still think!
Alain
I had an answer of England and Germany, I have to see all this 

1000 merci Jean

[Jean the Black Wolf]

 
must excellent my bud Alain !!!welcome aboard bro
hope this project will be a great success