Danmarc Install

[Harryc]

So in trying to help answer a question about hydrolock in another thread I did some research here and at Horseapple and other places on the Danmarc fuel valve. That was probably a mistake (or not) because I convinced myself to order a Danmarc. Anyway, I understand the fuel hookup ... no problem. My question is on the electronics side. Ground is a no brainer, and I am not interested in the momentary switch with the relay for security. This will be a straight hookup to switched 12V. I am thinking of picking up the switched +12v at the nearest coil on the Bl/W wire. I've read that is a good source because it is tied into the kill switch, ignition switch, and the bank angle sensor. All that makes sense to me. The question is would you fuse that +12v wire coming off the coil to the Danmarc? If so, assuming we're using an inline fuse holder, what rating fuse would you use? At the Danmarc site they list the unit as having .75 amp minimal draw. I'd 'guess' the Danmarc wire is 18 guage? Thoughts? I am probably over-thinking this, so if that's what you want to tell me I can take it. Lol
If I look at the following link it looks like I'd want something smaller than a 5amp fuse depending on the exact wire guage of the danmarc unit and any wire used to extend it if needed ... https://www.oznium.com/forum/topic15761

[Pete]

The fuse needs to be greater than max current draw of the device and lower than the maximum for the wire gauge, not minimum or average.
Which occurs at activation.
5 amp should be fine.
If you think that is to much, try a 2 or 3 amp with a 5 amp in your pocket as a spare.

[Harryc]

I hear you on the fuse, which was my understanding as well, but is it needed in this application? I know the entire ignition is fused, a 10 amp fuse exists already on that particular circuit. My thinking is a fault in the danmarc circuit 'might' cause a fire before it would blow a 10amp fuse, therefor a smaller fuse is needed.

[WintrSol]

There are two currents drawn by a coil, the pull-in current, which is set by the force needed to move whatever it pulls on and overcome the return force, and the holding current, which what it needs to hold against the return force, usually a spring. The pull-in current could be as much as 10x the holding current, but, in this application, I doubt that very much; it is probably about 2-3X holding current. In that case, a 5A fuse would give enough margin to protect the wiring and the fuse for the ignition circuit. If you blow a 5A fuse, the coil is failing, anyway. You could use a smaller fuse, but repeatedly hitting a 2A fuse with 2A will slowly fatigue the wire, and it will blow for no apparent reason, probably months or years later.

BTW, the fuse on the ignition wiring protects the wires from overheating, even if a coil shorts, so I wouldn't worry about your small addition starting a fire, even if you use a 10A fuse in line with it.

[Harryc]

@WintrSol & @Pete, good information thanks. So an inline 5A fuse it is ...

[Pete]

There is nothing wrong with you logic.
A secondary fuse of 5 amps after a primary fuse of 10 amps is fine for the application you are using.

Needed. Probably not, but still a good idea. And the added expense is so small for your peace of mind.

[Harryc]

Thanks Pete. I picked up a fuse holder today and a pack of 5A fuses.  Total cost was under 5 bucks. We're good to go.

[The emperor has no clothes]

So in trying to help answer a question about hydrolock in another thread I did some research here and at Horseapple and other places on the Danmarc fuel valve. That was probably a mistake (or not) because I convinced myself to order a Danmarc. Anyway, I understand the fuel hookup ... no problem. My question is on the electronics side. Ground is a no brainer, and I am not interested in the momentary switch with the relay for security. This will be a straight hookup to switched 12V. I am thinking of picking up the switched +12v at the nearest coil on the Bl/W wire. I've read that is a good source because it is tied into the kill switch, ignition switch, and the bank angle sensor. All that makes sense to me. The question is would you fuse that +12v wire coming off the coil to the Danmarc? If so, assuming we're using an inline fuse holder, what rating fuse would you use? At the Danmarc site they list the unit as having .75 amp minimal draw. I'd 'guess' the Danmarc wire is 18 guage? Thoughts? I am probably over-thinking this, so if that's what you want to tell me I can take it. Lol
If I look at the following link it looks like I'd want something smaller than a 5amp fuse depending on the exact wire guage of the danmarc unit and any wire used to extend it if needed ... https://www.oznium.com/forum/topic15761

Hey Harry, I just hooked mine up thru the 5 amp accessory plug. I don't know if using the coil will be an issue, but I remember years back guys having high speed misses when using the coil for power to things. It's been a while, but I think they were either for cruise control or flashing led's. Just a heads up 

[Harryc]

Hey Harry, I just hooked mine up thru the 5 amp accessory plug. I don't know if using the coil will be an issue, but I remember years back guys having high speed misses when using the coil for power to things. It's been a while, but I think they were either for cruise control or flashing led's. Just a heads up 

Interesting, thanks for the info. Hmmm, on the one hand I like the fact that the coil 12v input is tied to the kill switch, ignition, and bank angle sensor, but then there is this issue. Not sure what to do now...I wonder what would cause a 12v input to 'cut-out' on high revs. Some kind of feedback through the coil?

[MarkT]

My Dan-Marcs are wired from the bl/wh coil wire on Deerslayer and Jade.  No issues of ignition misses. BTW on Jade I also power the fuel pump from that circuit.  If you are concerned on the power draw use the circuit to trigger a relay which powers the Dan-Marc - then you are using a smaller current.  I like the fuel shutoff with tipover fn on the coil circuit. Not to mention my security circuit which you don't want to implement. I like it - hijack or steal my bikes and I'll tell the cops, you are on the side of the road 1 mile away.

[Harryc]

Not to mention my security circuit which you don't want to implement. I like it - hijack or steal my bikes and I'll tell the cops, you are on the side of the road 1 mile away.

Hey Mark. It's not that i don't like or appreciate the design of the security circuit...I do. It's just that in this neck of the woods it is not needed. Thanks

[The emperor has no clothes]

Hey Harry, I just hooked mine up thru the 5 amp accessory plug. I don't know if using the coil will be an issue, but I remember years back guys having high speed misses when using the coil for power to things. It's been a while, but I think they were either for cruise control or flashing led's. Just a heads up 

Interesting, thanks for the info. Hmmm, on the one hand I like the fact that the coil 12v input is tied to the kill switch, ignition, and bank angle sensor, but then there is this issue. Not sure what to do now...I wonder what would cause a 12v input to 'cut-out' on high revs. Some kind of feedback through the coil?

I'm having trouble remembering the details. I don't think it involved a Dan Marc though. I think it was a cruise control setup. For some reason I'm thinking it was BonS that had the issue. I'll see if I can find it in search. But if MarkT hasn't had an issue I'm sure you'll be fine.

[The emperor has no clothes]

Ha ! Found it. This encyclopedia of knowledge on here is awesome.
http://www.valkyrieforum.com/bbs/index.php/topic,61393.0.html

[Harryc]

Ha ! Found it. This encyclopedia of knowledge on here is awesome.
http://www.valkyrieforum.com/bbs/index.php/topic,61393.0.html

Ok then, thanks Meathead. Looks like I need a relay too. This is starting to get complicated. Lol.

[BonS]

Hey Harry, I just hooked mine up thru the 5 amp accessory plug. I don't know if using the coil will be an issue, but I remember years back guys having high speed misses when using the coil for power to things. It's been a while, but I think they were either for cruise control or flashing led's. Just a heads up 

I'm one of those that had a high speed miss after tying the Dan Marc to my coils. As soon as I moved the Dan Marc to the 5A accessory outlet the miss disappeared. I've never put a voltmeter or scope to the coils on Valkyrie coils but I've seen other bikes go as low as 9 volts when the coils are drawing current. The total voltage drop depends on a lot of things such as the wiring harness gauge and length, ignition switch resistance, bank angle relay wiring, the condition of the kill switch and all associated connectors. Adding another amp of draw, in my case, proved to be too much. Adding a separate ignition coil relay on some older bikes raises the voltage at the coils and stops problems with fouling plugs and misfiring.

[Harryc]

@BonS & @meathead, thanks for bringing this to my attention. I think I am going to go with plan 'B'. I'll get a 40 amp relay and put it in front of an AUX fuse panel and tie the 40 amp relay into the 5amp accessory circuit as a trigger. I'll put the dan-marc on the aux panel. I have some other things that I'll move to it as well as I currently have too many circuits feeding off of the battery directly. Just need to make sure I don't overload the relay. I am also going to carry a spare relay. Ya never know ... fuel is important. Lol Thanks!

[The emperor has no clothes]

@BonS & @meathead, thanks for bringing this to my attention. I think I am going to go with plan 'B'. I'll get a 40 amp relay and put it in front of an AUX fuse panel and tie the 40 amp relay into the 5amp accessory circuit as a trigger. I'll put the dan-marc on the aux panel. I have some other things that I'll move to it as well as I currently have too many circuits feeding off of the battery directly. Just need to make sure I don't overload the relay. I am also going to carry a spare relay. Ya never know ... fuel is important. Lol Thanks!

Harry, that's the way I have my Interstate set up.  On my standard I don't have much wired up and have the Dan Marc powered directly off the Acc. Plug. I don't think you'll have to worry about over amping your 40 amp setup. 

[Harryc]

Very cool my friend, thanks again. On a different topic, Oss says he will most likely host another NY ride this summer... it would be great to see you and the Mrs again. If it's not in the cards, then we'll meet somewhere down the road. 

[The emperor has no clothes]

Very cool my friend, thanks again. On a different topic, Oss says he will most likely host another NY ride this summer... it would be great to see you and the Mrs again. If it's not in the cards, then we'll meet somewhere down the road. 

We would love to, but we've got many places on the list. I'm really hoping to save up for a riding trip in New Zealand. Hope we can do another ride with you also. 

[Harryc]

We would love to, but we've got many places on the list. I'm really hoping to save up for a riding trip in New Zealand. Hope we can do another ride with you also. 

New Zealand, awesome. I know a Valk rider down there that would like to meet you.
@Leathel , send him a PM....great guy.

[The emperor has no clothes]

We would love to, but we've got many places on the list. I'm really hoping to save up for a riding trip in New Zealand. Hope we can do another ride with you also. 

New Zealand, awesome. I know a Valk rider down there that would like to meet you. Great place. @Leathel
[/quote]I wondered if you knew him. You seemed familiar to him in his posts.  It's probably going to be a while before we can do it. We did Ireland a couple years ago and LOVED it ! Have wanted to do New Zealand since then. When we do we'd love to meet Leathel. He sure did a nice job on his bags. 

[Harryc]

Got the Dan-marc installed today. No surprises thanks to the good information here. Wired to the 5A accessory circuit with an inline 5A fuse, soldered, shrink wrapped...done. I tested it before putting the air box back on too. Just hooked a hose to the outlet on the dan-marc , turned the key on and was able to suck air thru the hose...not so with the key off. Thanks !

[Leathel]

We would love to, but we've got many places on the list. I'm really hoping to save up for a riding trip in New Zealand. Hope we can do another ride with you also.  

New Zealand, awesome. I know a Valk rider down there that would like to meet you.
@Leathel , send him a PM....great guy.

Cheers for the good Rep

 I think I have briefly talked re heading to NZ with meathead... and when things are getting close to planning I will be happy to help with must do roads and locations, depending on the time of the year there are also some good events, Street racing and rallies etc and should be able to meet and ride some

 A couple of pics from the weekend rides (Not huge into group rides but these went well, Trips to and from events were great doing the back ways too)

The first we had 3-400 bikes for the "Riders against teen suicide" fundrasier











Today was much much smaller and started wet and finished wet but some great weather in between










  Video from the look out point I stopped at (Jeff had not been there before so stopped in with him)

Was it you I said I would video it H?

https://youtu.be/a7sotNJTi6s

[Leathel]

Now back on topic, What model Danmarc was it (I suppose I could search) been thinking of fitting a fuel shutoff myself, My tap have been replaced some years back (old owner) but the factory vacuum seams to be a week point, And it wouldn't hurt to have a switch inline for the odd area I leave the bike (mostly sweet here but not 100% safe from theft in some areas)

[Harryc]

Great pics and thanks for the video.  The dan-marc fuel valve was this model - http://www.dan-marc.com/79-afc11112.html

[The emperor has no clothes]

I used this one for the larger orifice. But many have used the one Harry linked with good effect.
http://www.dan-marc.com/79-afc1231412.html

[MarkT]

I used the larger one as well on Jade, due to fuel starvation with the smaller one, pulling a heavy trailer to Inzane with the smaller Dan-Marc last year. Have had the smaller one on Deerslayer for years w/o issues.

[Leathel]

I have a 1/4 AFC 121 on the way....didn't end up getting it from Dan Marc as his site didn't workout the International freight, did email him and he was going to email back a paypal inv after I gave him my address.... didn't here back and no replies since, No drama though found the same part for the same price with OK freight prices elsewhere, Tried local but they were either not enough flow, or needed power to close (default open) or just too big... Now just need to wait for it to get here, new Pingel petcock on the way as well as some Spots and air horns..... tempted to desmog as well to have less chance of a vacuum leek


Going to be some busy nights

[Harryc]

Nice set of Mods you have planned Leathel. I think I've done them all except for the spots. Would be interested in what you got and how they work.