Rear Wheel

[Moonshot_1]

Been having odd noises coming from the rear wheel. When this began, when cold, I would back out of the garage and the rear wheel would make a rubber squeaky sound. After a few seconds on the road, and the rest of the time on the road, it would not make such sounds. This slowly changed to making this noise all the time and now, in the last day or two, I would hear it accompanied by what would sound like a brake pad hanging up. It is not the brakes. Just sounds similar.

Took it to the dealer this morning. (This dealer is the preeminent dealer in the region with an impeccable record and reputation. No issues with this guy at all. Great service, quality mechanics, at fair prices.)

It turns out an O-ring had failed and the rubber squeaking was from the dampers. The failed o-ring had allowed the flange to then grind away a bit of the wheel.
The recommendation is that this will simply continue to wear away and to find a good used wheel assembly to replace it. The flange is worn as well.
They showed me the wear and why it occurred so their assessment is accurate and the damage, though currently slight is clear.

The bike is still fully operational and should be for a time but the recommendation is to replace the wheel with a good used assembly.

They reassembled the bike, greased up the area and it rolls just fine with no noise now but the initial problem remains.

The questions from me to you all are....

Would you concur with the assessment?
Would you concur with replacing the assembly?
Where can I find a used rear wheel assembly that is good to use?

The dealer is currently looking for such an assembly as well.
I am also looking to see what I can find through this forum.

Any info and insights appreciated!

[Jess from VA]

With no idea of the extent of damage (no photos) it is hard to give any opinion.

You may or may not need need a new wheel and flange (or other parts) right now (or real soon).

You can keep riding and start actively buying parts, or you can just wait until your next rear tire, and then decide what to do.  (Or take your time shopping for best prices.) 

I got a new used rear wheel from Pinwall Cycle.  It was dirty and a little pitted, but in good mechanical shape.  They have an Ebay store.  I don't do Ebay.  I found a wheel on their site, called, and bought it for the Buy-It-Now listed price.  Mine had a bent rim, and a hydraulic press attempt to fix it broke the rim..... so I needed it right away.   

[The emperor has no clothes]

Are we talking about one of the o-rings or the flat plastic washer that goes between the hub and the wheel ? If it`s one of the o-rings I don`t see how that could happen.

[Moonshot_1]

The damage in my opinion is "slight". Severely scored would be slightly overstating it. Even dealer said there is no safety issue, at least not now, but that the condition will persist and the wheel will need to be replaced at some point, preferably before it falls off, which is now just barely in the foreseeable future.

So I got some considerable time to resolve this and just need to be aware of things till then.

As to the o-ring, the "inside o-ring" had failed and caused problems. That was the assessment of what may have caused the issue. Maybe the plastic washer had issues too. What was clear is that they found where the noise was coming from and it is not supposed to make such noise.

The noise that I would hear when backing out of the garage (It would do it going forward, just not as loud) would sound like the noise squeaky cheese curds would make. Lower pitched though. This would be the rubber dampers rubbing on stuff.

[hubcapsc]

Are we talking about one of the o-rings or the flat plastic washer that goes between the hub and the wheel ? If it`s one of the o-rings I don`t see how that could happen.

The failed o-ring had allowed the flange to then grind away a bit of the wheel.

But without the flat plastic washer, we know the wheel could be destroyed.

Is it all back together? I guess they'd let you take pictures, get good closeups
of stuff if you can and post them here...

Here's my pinion cup in a closeup from the last tire change...



-Mike

[The emperor has no clothes]

I guess I'm not understanding. How would a failed o-ring cause damage to the wheel and hub ? I could see over time, grease leaking and water infiltration leading to damage to the spline teeth. But it seems with the plastic spacer in place and proper torque down, there would be no movement to damage wheel.

[Jess from VA]

Flat plastic washer = Thrust washer.  

Here's a thread with pics (for your viewing enjoyment).  

http://www.valkyrieforum.com/bbs/index.php/topic,39552.0.html

[The emperor has no clothes]

Flat plastic washer = Thrust washer.  

Here's a thread with pics (for your viewing enjoyment).  http://www.valkyrieforum.com/bbs/index.php/topic,39552.0.html

I knew I wasn't describing it correctly. Just couldn't think of it. Lots seem to be failing on this old man. 

[Moonshot_1]

The assessment that the cause was a failed o-ring was the dealers. But even they were not definitive of it. They were hazarding a guess.
Earlier this summer they did replace a u-joint on the bike. It is possible that it wasn't lubed or reassembled correctly. This would be way out of character for this establishment and service crew.
Since the bike had the u-joint replaced it has rolled down the road the best it ever has since I bought it 4 years ago. Even today. I've had the odd noises but no vibrations, shimmies or other handling issues even at or near triple digits.

I just happened to be in town and stopped at the dealer to have them assess the unusual noise yesterday and they wanted it first thing this morning. Took it apart, found the wear on the wheel, had me look at it, took a guess as to the cause and greased it up, threw it back together, made the recommendation to find a good used rear wheel assembly and replace it and that it isn't a priority issue yet but that it will likely continue to wear and be problematic down the road.

The noise is now gone (at least for now) and still rolls down the road like a champ.

My mechanical aptitude is limited to changing light bulbs, wiring a horn, putting air in the tires, turning the key and riding. Much beyond that I go to the pros. It is usually cheaper and faster that way.

So basically, in short, I can't definitively speak to the o-ring being the cause of anything.

The o-ring in question would be #19 on the parts fische and the wear involved on the flange and wheel in that area.

It is likely I won't change out the rear wheel till it starts making noise again or I get a deal on one.

[indybobm]

Jess, that picture was from my bike the first time I pulled the wheel off. No thrust washer had been installed. Still makes me cringe when I see it. i still have the wheel if anyone wants to buy it 

[Jess from VA]

Boat anchor?   

[sandy]

Call the dealer and ask if he installed a new thrust washer. If not, that wheel will self destruct in a few thousand miles. The O rings keep grease in the wheel flange area. The new thrust washer needs to be greased as well. Don't hesitate.

[The emperor has no clothes]

Call the dealer and ask if he installed a new thrust washer. If not, that wheel will self destruct in a few thousand miles. The O rings keep grease in the wheel flange area. The new thrust washer needs to be greased as well. Don't hesitate.

Bingo !

[Ricky-D]

The assessment that the cause was a failed o-ring was the dealers. But even they were not definitive of it. They were hazarding a guess.
Earlier this summer they did replace a u-joint on the bike. It is possible that it wasn't lubed or reassembled correctly. This would be way out of character for this establishment and service crew.

The dealer is wrong. It was because of the missing "Thrust washer" that your wheel is being damaged.

AND the missing "Thrust washer" is because the dealer had lost it and/or forgotten to reinstall it when the were replacing the universal joint on your bike.

Your dealer may be good, but the mechanic is "rookie".

***

[longrider]

Ricky D is spot on.  The dealer just cost you a bunch of money

[Moonshot_1]

I got to see the unassembled rear wheel. The thrust washer was not missing.
I'm not going to say the mechanic is infallible but he's no rookie.
I do intend to have another chat with the guys and share your insights and see if we can come to a better understanding of what is and was going on. These guys are the only guys to work on this bike so if this is a result of an improper assembly I would expect considerable help in resolving this. I do have a fairly good rapport with the service guys as I will show up with donuts or beef sticks and such whenever they have to work on the bike. So they usually love to see me show up.

Anyway

This is one of the reasons I brought this up in this forum, so I can go back to the dealer and speak with some authority on the subject.

Thanks for the insights!

[Ricky-D]

I got to see the unassembled rear wheel. The thrust washer was not missing.
I'm not going to say the mechanic is infallible but he's no rookie.
I do intend to have another chat with the guys and share your insights and see if we can come to a better understanding of what is and was going on. These guys are the only guys to work on this bike so if this is a result of an improper assembly

Well, if you say the thrust washer was there, and not missing, I have to take your word for that, but that reveals a true conundrum. For the ONLY way the wheel will have wear like that would be from the results of a missing thrust washer.

Most times when the thrust washer is lost, is when the star is removed from the wheel. The thrust washer will come out with the star because of the grease acting like an adhesive and the thrust washer will stay with the star. When the star is set down the thrust washer will, after a time fall out of the star and then it's forgotten to be replaced back into the star. Mechanics that are not familiar with this thrust washer may not even recognize it as being part of the rear drive assembly and possibly simply toss it aside.

To say that the wear on the rear wheel hub can be the result of a missing 'o'ring is folly, and ought to be evidence enough to make you want to quit using them as your mechanical specialists.

***

[Bighead]

You know some pictures would go a Looooong way to know exactly what is going on.