I just don't understand :(

[Reb]

We got the pleasure of reviewing this case today at work.

For anyone with a riding mower, It's crap like this that is the reason for all the ridiculous safety feature's.

This clown initially pressed the RIO switch that allows you to go into reverse without the PTO disengaging.... A safety feature that is required so you don't back up over someone or something. The "I'm just stupid" plea worked in this case....

A Springfield girl who lost her leg in a riding lawn mower incident was awarded a total of $12.25 million in economic and other damages Monday after a jury sided with her following a weeks-long civil trial at Lane County Circuit Court.

Kirk Norton, a Springfield man who backed over his 2½-year-old daughter, Isabelle Norton, with a riding lawn mower in 2006, was ordered Monday to pay his daughter about $2.7 million in economic and other damages.
  
Isabelle, now 14, lost her leg as a result of the incident and sued her father and the mower’s manufacturer, Deere & Co., through a court-appointed conservator. Deere & Co. was ordered by the jury to pay about $9.5 million. The trial took place before Judge Karsten Rasmussen.

The suit was seeking more than $20 million in combined damages for injuries that include the loss of Isabelle’s leg, damages covering past and future medical expenses; a loss in future earning capacity as a result of her massive injury; and the day-to-day impacts she experiences as a result of living with the injury

Following the three-week-long trial, jurors deliberated for nearly seven hours Monday before reaching a verdict that found Deere & Co. 78 percent at fault for the incident and Kirk Norton 22 percent at fault. The collective verdict was $12.25 million.

The claim against Deere focused in part on a feature that kept the blades spinning at nearly 200 mph as the mower went in reverse.

Normally, the blades did not rotate when the machine backed up, but a button on the dashboard that Norton pushed before going into reverse engaged the mower’s blades and overrode a child safety feature. Norton has said that he thought he was supposed to press the button, according to court records.
  
The machine’s blades still were rotating when Norton backed up the mower and unintentionally ran over his daughter.

Lawyers for the girl argued that Norton was negligent when he backed up on the riding mower as Isabelle and other young children at the Norton’s home were being supervised by a 9-year-old cousin when Isabelle approached her father’s riding mower.

Following the verdict, Isabelle said she was happy to be done with the trial.

“It’s been a long nine years of waiting for this verdict,” she said. “I’m very grateful to the jury and for my attorneys for all the hard work they did. Now I just hope that John Deere and other manufacturers will change the design (of riding lawn mowers) so that no one else will have to go through what I’ve been through.”

The case has been in the courts for a decade.

When Isabelle was 4, an $8.5 million lawsuit on her behalf was filed against the manufacturer and the mower’s seller, Ramsey-Waite Co. of Eugene.

A Lane County jury in 2009 rejected claims that Deere had made and sold a defective and unreasonably dangerous product and that neither it nor Ramsey-Waite were negligent.

Isabelle’s conservator, Springfield attorney Dwight Purdy, appealed the verdict and gained a partial victory in 2016 when the Oregon Court of Appeals ordered a new trial and ruled that Rasmussen had made errors when he instructed the trial jury regarding the law on the product liability claim.

Meanwhile, Norton was arrested for child molestation in 2010, and he pleaded guilty in the case one year later. He’s now serving a 17-year prison sentence. Norton’s criminal case was unrelated to Isabelle, according to one of her lawyers.

Purdy in 2013 filed suit on Isabelle’s behalf against Norton, alleging that he had been negligent by not keeping a proper lookout before he ran over his daughter; not reading instructions about how to use the mower while driving in reverse; and treating the lawn mower as being suitable for use in his backyard.

In opening statements to the jury on March 8 at the beginning of the civil trial, attorneys for Norton and Deere & Co. disputed the allegations

Deere attorney James Brogan told jurors that the mower that Norton bought and used in his backyard had met all applicable standards and contained no manufacturing defects. “It was designed with everything necessary to make it safe,” Brogan said.

The plaintiffs, however, claim the machine’s design prevented an ordinary consumer from avoiding back-over injuries to children; had a rear-view “visibility defect”; and was equipped with inadequate warnings and instructions.

Isabelle’s lawyer, Don Corson, said the verdict likely will be appealed by Deere & Co. and that the case could drag on for several more years.

http://registerguard.com/rg/news/local/36588567-75/girl-who-lost-her-leg-awarded-12.25-million-in-springfield-lawn-mower-injury-case.csp

We need to act now a band assault mowers,
restrict use of high capacity mower decks,
issue a 30 days waiting period after a background check to get your mower.

Make America Push Mow Again!!!

[Wizzard]

Years ago when I was selling Wheel Horse lawn mowers they got sued because the guy physically bypassed the safety switch on the seat, let the blades run as the mower got stuck and he got off and tried to pull the mower out buy grabbing the deck with his fingers under it. He won. I know as I sold the mower to him.

[Serk]

Wow... So you wouldn't recommend my shorting the PTO button out so it's always sensed as pressed? I know the lawyers require those things but it annoys the snot out of me...

[Gavin_Sons]

Reb i have wanted to ask you this for a long time but always forget. So since you brought up mowers....... Why the hell do they have to be so loud?

[Jess from VA]

The first thing we do, let's kill all the lawyers.

William Shakespeare's Henry VI, Part 2, Act IV, Scene 2 (1709)

Bill Shakespeare may have been onto something 309 years ago.

It sure hasn't got any better.


So a guy intentionally (whether mistakenly or not) overrides a safety feature installed specifically to protect against this exact danger, and backs up without looking or due care at all (for a helpless 2 1/2yo), but he's only 22% at fault, but Deere is 78% at fault?

I guess Deere should just stop putting reverse on their mowers.

Or maybe the reverse over-ride button needs put so far in back, he has to turn completely around in the seat to reach it.  

These kind of verdicts are nothing more than an insidious socialist redistribution of wealth, through judicial means.

You know how much of all our insurance policy premiums for everything are based on protecting insurance companies from just these kind of verdicts?  We the consumer pay the lions share of these verdicts, indirectly. 

The longstanding contingent fee agreements (allowing lawyers to take cases for no money, but up to some 50% of the judgment/verdict), thus perpetually driving greedy lawyers (and clients) to sue deep pockets everywhere (business and industry and entities that actually produce things and employ people) need to be revisited.  

There must be some way for poor people to seek redress of grievances against powerful opponents (which is why contingent fee agreements exist), but this system has long been out of hand.

[phideux]

There should be a provision in there that Deere doesn't have to pay out until the other one pays out.
What do they mean when they say the mower has a Rear View Defect???? The idiot didn't look behind him when he backed up??? So it's the mowers fault???

[oldsmokey]

How about the re work campaign that Toro did in the mid-late 80s on machines made in the 70s. Regardless of original purchase.
Rear engine riding mower. Battery goes dead, only paid 100 bucks at yard sale for unit.
Lift seat tower assy. Rap rope around cup and pull.
Oops, forgot to put it in neutral, QUICK, JUMP ON THAT MACHINE.

Original wording stated that "serious laceration to the buttocks mat occur"
Go figure. It happened.

[old2soon]

  Case in point-stupid idiotic "people"! A gal used to live across the street from me in a rent house. Her son was cutting the grass one day over there with one on those whirly gig 21" push mowers where all the engine does is spin the blade.
   The boy is cutting the grass mama got her big keester parked on the porch with an infant on her lap! While the mower is being operated!  
    I just about came unwrapped! I hauled butt across the street and none too politely splained the WHY and WHEREFORE of keepin the infant safe!  
     She had no sooner gone inside closed the storm door and the inner door and the boy restarted the mower and he hit "something" that broke the storm window as I was walking back to my Casa.  
      How long ago were it the stupid person sued micky Ds and won over the too hot coffee?  
    Long as these "things" go to trial still MORE stupid people WILL git money from not so smart juries.
                                   RIDE SAFE.
    

[oldsmokey]

Why are the loud? They're not a Valk. 
Average 3200 explosions per minute, air cooled for the most part.
You'd be surprised at how much engineering goes into quieting as much as possible.
Nobody would want to pay the cost for an elaborate exhaust system, at least not ones sold from Home Cheepo.
That flywheel does move a lot of air when wound up, and then just listen to those blades when engaged, maximum 19,000 feet per minute at the blade tip.

[Reb]

Reb i have wanted to ask you this for a long time but always forget. So since you brought up mowers....... Why the hell do they have to be so loud?

Harmonic and mechanical vibrations are a touchy science when dealing with something travelling at high RPMs. A lot has been done over the past decade with blade angle and cut pitches to try and limit the excessive decibels. Unfortunetly it comes at a cost of effecting overall cut quality.

Electric riding lawn mowers are in the works to enter the market. A lot are already out there but pto noise is still an issue even without a combustion engine

Based on the initial product of an entry level mower, the budget doesn't really allow extensive R&D in harmonic dampening.

[Oss]

In 2001 on my way to Denver I stopped at a steak house in Lawrence Kansas. I met a man who if I remember correctly was nicknamed the miracle man and he knew our adm.

He was on a riding mower when the shell (ok wrong word maybe its deck) collapsed he fell thru and was mowed down - almost died, someone had forgotten something on the way to work, fortuitously returned down the block and found him and thank goodness he or she got him to hospital before he bled out

Willow or Lori knows what I am talking about   I dont think he sued.  I hope he is still alive.

There has to be a better way for that verdict to go. But the tort system is a necessary evil as it is an important method of getting changes made to products.  Whether Deere will ultimately pay, they have paid for attorneys etc. already for right or wrong.   The Plaintfiff atty has made zero at this time and probably laid out tens of thousands of dollars to date   It seems stupid to have a warning for every possible thing but people are stupid in large and small number

I feel bad for the kid, injured, maybe molested by her idiot father

What a sad clusterf*** of a post

[sheets]

Maybe a small plastic windshield just ahead of the steering wheel, just big enough for all the requisite warning stickers - and with the ignition key smack dab in the middle of all the warning stickers. Never ceases to amaze me some of the tort lawsuits that favor of the plaintiff (my orange mower as all the warning stickers on the floorboard between the pedals).

[old2soon]

   As an aside crayons and square point plastic scissors are made for good REASONS. Some idjits can't be trusted with even those implements.                   
    How long after purchase is a company to be held liable to dumb asses?  MAYBE just through the warranty period?  RIDE SAFE.

[cookiedough]

maybe stupid question, but why can't john deere with all their intelligence just automatically STOP the blades from spinning when pushing down on the reverse pedal WITHOUT having to push a button to keep the blades moving in reverse.  Just eliminate that button to push to keep blades spinning in reverse.  

I have driven my neighbors cheap L110 mower and totally HATE having to push that button to keep blades spinning in reverse.  I think without pushing that button if I push down on reverse pedal with foot, the engine kills which totally pisses me off and I would prefer OLD SCHOOL just keep the darn blades spinning ALL the time even in reverse, but I can look behind me easy enough to make sure nothing is behind me before going in reverse...

[Reb]

In 2001 on my way to Denver I stopped at a steak house in Lawrence Kansas. I met a man who if I remember correctly was nicknamed the miracle man and he knew our adm.

He was on a riding mower when the shell (ok wrong word maybe its deck) collapsed he fell thru and was mowed down - almost died, someone had forgotten something on the way to work, fortuitously returned down the block and found him and thank goodness he or she got him to hospital before he bled out

Willow or Lori knows what I am talking about   I dont think he sued.  I hope he is still alive.

There has to be a better way for that verdict to go. But the tort system is a necessary evil as it is an important method of getting changes made to products.  Whether Deere will ultimately pay, they have paid for attorneys etc. already for right or wrong.   The Plaintfiff atty has made zero at this time and probably laid out tens of thousands of dollars to date   It seems stupid to have a warning for every possible thing but people are stupid in large and small number

I feel bad for the kid, injured, maybe molested by her idiot father

What a sad clusterf*** of a post

This has been my first stent in product engineering dealing with residential based products. I honestly can say I miss working on forestry equipment. You would think heavy equipment would lead to more mishaps and work place accidents, but it is the complete opposite. Ideally they both are not comparible based on shear production numbers.

Regardless as an engineer we have to review all claims and are ask to provide guidance and information for the Deere legal teams in various cases on product design. This is just one of many that are made public. A majority are fire related as folks do not tend to head the clean out warning labels under the hood. Last month we dealt with a suit where some ass clowns mower cought fire, he proceeded to drive his mower (while it was on fire) into his garage and start streaming it on Facebook live, cursing John Deere while watching his house catch on fire.  

With the sue happy world we live in today, I don't see why any company would head the risk of manufacturing anything anymore :/

I've lost a lot of respect for the public in general [sorry folks] but some people out there shouldn't be able to reproduce IMHO  

[Reb]

maybe stupid question, but why can't john deere with all their intelligence just automatically STOP the blades from spinning when pushing down on the reverse pedal WITHOUT having to push a button to keep the blades moving in reverse.  Just eliminate that button to push to keep blades spinning in reverse.  

I have driven my neighbors cheap L110 mower and totally HATE having to push that button to keep blades spinning in reverse.  I think without pushing that button if I push down on reverse pedal with foot, the engine kills which totally pisses me off and I would prefer OLD SCHOOL just keep the darn blades spinning ALL the time even in reverse, but I can look behind me easy enough to make sure nothing is behind me before going in reverse...

The RIO (Reverse Implement Option) button is actually a standard that is required for lawn tractors to have. A tractor cannot exceed a speed of 1ft/s in reverse without the safety features automatically cutting power to the engine. I'm not sure of the exact date it became a ANSI standard, but it is because of cases above that annoying feature is present on all riding tractors now. I do not believe Zero turn mowers are required to have one. Cub Cadet Z-turns are the only ones I know off that utilize the safety feature.

[Ramie]

I once worked for a large company that had made meat grinders. 

When I was with them they hadn't manufactured them for over 10 years but they were getting sued right and left by people who lost hands and arms. 

They had them in their garage and were bypassing all the safety switches and removing guards. 

That company spent millions locating those machines and buying them back or as a last resort modified them replacing guards and switches so they couldn't be bypasses or removed.

[Serk]

My Father-In-Law, who's missing part of his thumb from a table saw accident, borrowed my table saw a few years ago.

When he finally returned it, all the safety features had been removed.

I had to bug the hell out of him to find all the parts for them so I could put them back on.

(I avoid loaning him stuff anymore, but the spousal unit says I should be more understanding...)

[old2soon]

I once worked for a large company that had made meat grinders. 

When I was with them they hadn't manufactured them for over 10 years but they were getting sued right and left by people who lost hands and arms. 

They had them in their garage and were bypassing all the safety switches and removing guards. 

That company spent millions locating those machines and buying them back or as a last resort modified them replacing guards and switches so they couldn't be bypasses or removed.

                  Various powered equipment I've purchased over the years had a line in the warranty information that more or less stated-modifications OTHER than factory authorized void the warranty. Seems to me YOU void the warranty do not even CONSIDER hiring a Lawyer fer yer own dumbassedness. When I was learning tool and die one old guy with ALL his fingers on his hands told me something I still remember. Lock out the main power switch BEFORE you do ANYTHING on ANY Machine. I have a handle bar safety on my lawn mower-hold to start and keep running-but to this day I still pull the plug wire before I put my hands under the deck. I MH O long as stupid people walk this Earth the lawsuits will continue and stupid WILL be rewarded.  RIDE SAFE.

[michaelyoung254]

I've often thought that perhaps the best way to fix this type of lawsuit abuse is to have some type of panel similar to a grand jury whereas you have to get permission to file a lawsuit. Have the panel made up from various backgrounds. A couple of everyday people, and a few that have some level of expertise in law such as retired judges or attorneys. The panel wouldn't decide right or wrong in the case, but rather if the plaintiff seems to have a legitimate argument or not, and if it does in fact seem that the plaintiff has a legitimate argument, let the lawsuit move forward. This way the frivolous lawsuits could be rejected. Being a dumbass, and too frigging stupid to operate a piece of equipment you purchased is NOT a valid reason to file a lawsuit. That would be like buying a new car, and then suing Ford after you had a wreck because you didn't know that if you set the "Cruise Control", the car wouldn't drive itself.

[Jess from VA]

When I just barely put my fingers in the discharge chute of a Craftsman lawn chipper, and just barely sliced the tip of a finger off, the irony (and accuracy) of the graphic picture of a hand with it's fingers being cut off, right over the discharge chute, was not lost on me.

I was stupidly trying to work on a wet lawn and leaves, the small machine kept getting clogged up, I had to keep shutting it down to clear the wet jam-up.  And about the 20th time I did it, I impatiently did not wait for the unit to COMPLETELY come to a stop, before clearing the chute.

The only person that deserved to be sued was me.  Spending 8 hours at the ER, getting the tip sewn back on and cleaned and shot up with antibiotics, and about three months of painful reminders of a previously injured but not yet fully healed finger injury was the justice I had earned for my stupid behavior.

I settled out of court with myself.

[The emperor has no clothes]

It used to be very commonplace for all the safety guards to be removed or disabled in meat shops. I’ve seen some gruesome stuff, but the worst was a young lady who had run her hand down the tenderizer machine. For those that aren’t familiar it makes cube steaks. It had pulled her hand in all the way to the palm. Although the guards are a pain in the ass, I won’t let any of my guys disable them.

[pago cruiser]

 "I have a handle bar safety on my lawn mower-hold to start and keep running..."

I was told a long time ago how that device came to be.  Seems as reasonable as anything else in this thread...   Not sure about the names, but you get the picture...

Joe was mowing his yard back in the day with his Craftsman mower, and still had to trim the hedge.
After seeing how efficient the lawnmower was, he had an idea.  Hm....Got his neighbor Fred to come over and give him a hand.
It was heavy, but between the two of them, they were able to lift the running mower, walk it over to the hedge, and proceeded to straddle the hedge with the running mower.  Then they lowered it onto the hedge... then, something unexpected happened.

Unfortunately, this was before u-tube... A lawsuit resulted (don't know how it went), but the result was that handlebar safety device is now on all mowers.

Which as we all know is useless.  If Joe and Fred were to get Murray to come over, and put him on  a pair of stilts to hold the safety lever, this could still work...

[hairyteeth]

Other than appeal what do you think JD will do to keep this from happening?
My JD 830 zero turn has no ROI button, that sucker will chop up anything and not even slow down.
My polaris 500 four wheeler has a reverse bypass switch and if you don't push it will barely move backwards.
 As a toddler I was taught if you can see the mower your too close. Around the farm I tell everyone never sneak up behind me or the equipment I'm running.
But I've seen too many folks mow the whole yard with a child on their knee.
They call them accidents for a reason.
 Mark

[hubcapsc]

It used to be very commonplace for all the safety guards to be removed or disabled in meat shops. I’ve seen some gruesome stuff, but the worst was a young lady who had run her hand down the tenderizer machine. For those that aren’t familiar it makes cube steaks. It had pulled her hand in all the way to the palm. Although the guards are a pain in the ass, I won’t let any of my guys disable them.

I love the guard on my DeWalt miter saw... my arm even touched it the other day,
I don't think I've ever let that happen  ... I remember my father's table saw,
just turn it on and there was the raw blade, ready for anything that came its way...

I wonder about all these safety guards on lawnmowers being talked about on
this thread... does a "professional grade" mower, like a Dixie Chopper, or a
non-big-box-store John Deere have all the same boo-boo inhibitors on it?

-Mike

[Robert]

It gets really frustrating when something is designed or taken off the market that was a good product and worked well but because of liability was redesigned or removed from the market. I agree that in some instances it is deserved but in most cases its about money. Someone else paying for someones stupidity all the way down to drugs and just about anything else we use or consume.

 We have seen kids not take the chances or get exposed to the things we did as kids effectively changing childhood and society. I was wondering if enough kids get killed with the Tide pods would they be taken off the market. Now they are redesigning them, really, OH come on.

We all have stories of products that work as shown but some Jackalope goes and does something and gets himself hurt and figures its the company's problem. We pay for higher product costs, some products not coming to market, small companies not being able to be formed because of the cost of product liability insurance. Heck I used to have a sinus medicine that worked for me that I had to change because they pulled it from the market because kids would make drugs from it.

What happened to personal responsibility?

[baldo]

It used to be very commonplace for all the safety guards to be removed or disabled in meat shops. I’ve seen some gruesome stuff, but the worst was a young lady who had run her hand down the tenderizer machine. For those that aren’t familiar it makes cube steaks. It had pulled her hand in all the way to the palm. Although the guards are a pain in the ass, I won’t let any of my guys disable them.

I love the guard on my DeWalt miter saw... my arm even touched it the other day,
I don't think I've ever let that happen  ... I remember my father's table saw,
just turn it on and there was the raw blade, ready for anything that came its way...

I wonder about all these safety guards on lawnmowers being talked about on
this thread... does a "professional grade" mower, like a Dixie Chopper, or a
non-big-box-store John Deere have all the same boo-boo inhibitors on it?

-Mike

Back when I was butchering wood projects more frequently, I almost pulled the trigger on a new SawStop table saw. I saw one in action once, pretty cool.

[hubcapsc]

It used to be very commonplace for all the safety guards to be removed or disabled in meat shops. I’ve seen some gruesome stuff, but the worst was a young lady who had run her hand down the tenderizer machine. For those that aren’t familiar it makes cube steaks. It had pulled her hand in all the way to the palm. Although the guards are a pain in the ass, I won’t let any of my guys disable them.

I love the guard on my DeWalt miter saw... my arm even touched it the other day,
I don't think I've ever let that happen  ... I remember my father's table saw,
just turn it on and there was the raw blade, ready for anything that came its way...

I wonder about all these safety guards on lawnmowers being talked about on
this thread... does a "professional grade" mower, like a Dixie Chopper, or a
non-big-box-store John Deere have all the same boo-boo inhibitors on it?

-Mike

Back when I was butchering wood projects more frequently, I almost pulled the trigger on a new SawStop table saw. I saw one in action once, pretty cool.

I saw a youtube of some table saw that had some kind of super-duper safety on it, they demoed
it by feeding a hotdog into it, and it clanked to a stop instantly... is that a "SawStop"?

-Mike

[Serk]

I saw a youtube of some table saw that had some kind of super-duper safety on it, they demoed
it by feeding a hotdog into it, and it clanked to a stop instantly... is that a "SawStop"?

-Mike

That's the one... They make a band saw now too I believe...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eiYoBbEZwlk

[MarkT]

The RIO (Reverse Implement Option) button is actually a standard that is required for lawn tractors to have. A tractor cannot exceed a speed of 1ft/s in reverse without the safety features automatically cutting power to the engine. I'm not sure of the exact date it became a ANSI standard, but it is because of cases above that annoying feature is present on all riding tractors now. I do not believe Zero turn mowers are required to have one. Cub Cadet Z-turns are the only ones I know off that utilize the safety feature.

My Kubota doesn't have that and I bought it new less han 2 years ago.  It's bigger than a lawn tractor though it does mow lawns.  It's actually a small agricultural tractor being 4WD diesel with industrial tires & ballast, weighs just over a ton, 3 pnt hitch, front loader, grader and snow blades, hydrostatic drive and PTO's with driven implements etc. Using the PTO's it can mow with a mower deck in mid and rear positions, or pull gang mowers. Must be excepted from the rules for lawn mowers.  Frankly I'm glad it doesn't have all the safety interlocks / stupid switches of garden tractors though it does have some.  eg, doesn't shut off if you rise from the seat in all circumstances though it needs to have the PTO off and be in neutral or parking brake set.  I regularly mow while backing and there's no push button - that shut off would be a PITA and impede functionality as well as leave grass in some places uncut.

On a related topic IIRC the private plane makers - Cessna, Piper, et al, were killed by litigation.  For a long time you could not buy a new Cessna (and others) 2-6 place single engine plane.  Don't know if they ever came back to production.  New planes were kit-built, 51% by the buyer and I believe that was to provide legal protection for the makers.  I could be FOS but that's my memory; someone with more involvement feel free to correct this.

I once worked for a large company that had made meat grinders.  

When I was with them they hadn't manufactured them for over 10 years but they were getting sued right and left by people who lost hands and arms.  

They had them in their garage and were bypassing all the safety switches and removing guards.  

That company spent millions locating those machines and buying them back or as a last resort modified them replacing guards and switches so they couldn't be bypasses or removed.

The farmer where I hunt in KS has one of those big commercial meat grinders he bought from a butcher years ago; it's old school.  Really big grinder, multi-hp motor, has no safety interlocks.  Yep you best keep aware while using it.

My Father-In-Law, who's missing part of his thumb from a table saw accident, borrowed my table saw a few years ago.

When he finally returned it, all the safety features had been removed.

I had to bug the hell out of him to find all the parts for them so I could put them back on.

(I avoid loaning him stuff anymore, but the spousal unit says I should be more understanding...)

I'm sorry, that would TOTALLY piss me off, no matter if it was a relation.  Borrow my tools, they BETTER come back in the same condition, and promptly.  Or that will be the last time.  Never mind, I don't ever loan tools out.  If you need the tool - you can use it here under my supervision.  Provided we are friends and they are hand tools.  Strangers or power tools - no.  We're not United Tool Rental here, I make my living with these tools.  When your doctor agrees to loan you his stethoscope - then we can discuss it.

[sheets]

Years ago, I had a self-propelled walk behind mower with the secondary handle bar lever that engaged the front drive wheels when you held it with the handle bar, and would stop the drive wheels when you let go. To mow multiple lengthy straight line passes I had used an old shoe lace to secure the drive lever to the main handle bar so I could steer it with fingertips of one hand while I walked a couple hundred feet each pass. With earplugs firmly planted, going in circles doing the deed and for a reason I don’t recall, decided I needed to grab something from the garage. It would only take fewer than thirty seconds. I stopped close to the garage and promptly let go of the handlebar and without looking proceeded to run to the garage. I was back on scene in a matter of about twenty seconds – and went to grab the mower . . . but it wasn’t there. I thought WTH! I looked up to look around thinking I was having an old guy moment when I see my mower going full throttle across the front yard (2 acre) headed for the highway. It had a head start on me but was still about half-way there. I did the 50-yard dash in record time to retrieve my self-propelled mower before it made its way to the highway. If it managed to cross the road without cars crashing it would have been in the neighbor’s yard running willy-nilly. A year later I graduated to 15 hp DR walk behind brush mower. It has a dead-man switch on the handlebar grip. I’ve never considered the thought of using the shoe lace trick on that machine.     

[Jess from VA]

Sheets, on a related (but different) matter: I got the folk's Impala for New Years eve once, after swearing on a bible I would not drive after drinking.  They were gone (in another car). 

So I left, but forgot something, and ran right back home.  In a hurry, I simply forgot to put it in park, jumped out and ran up the walk to the house.  In the meantime, the car rolled forward and smacked into a brick chimney on our outbuilding (that had once been a little home, but for 40 years had just been a storage building).

My dad was pretty pissed off about the repair necessary to that old chimney, and for 20 years, neither of them believed I wasn't driving drunk...... because only a drunk would forget to put a car in park before getting out and walking away.  They had a point.  (even sober people do stupid stuff)

[old2soon]

Let the brain dead sumbitches purchase ANY power tool they want. Prior to purchase you sign paperwork that makes it nigh on impossible to sue mfg for your own stupidity. Same thing from a rent outfit-no sign no equipment. Not only can you NOT make something idiot proof you can't fix stupid. RIDE SAFE.

[Bighead]

Mowers are deadly.......... not the one behind the controls ....... Ban all
Mowers now.

Seem familiar?   

[cookiedough]

I've often thought that perhaps the best way to fix this type of lawsuit abuse is to have some type of panel similar to a grand jury whereas you have to get permission to file a lawsuit. Have the panel made up from various backgrounds. A couple of everyday people, and a few that have some level of expertise in law such as retired judges or attorneys. The panel wouldn't decide right or wrong in the case, but rather if the plaintiff seems to have a legitimate argument or not, and if it does in fact seem that the plaintiff has a legitimate argument, let the lawsuit move forward. This way the frivolous lawsuits could be rejected. Being a dumbass, and too frigging stupid to operate a piece of equipment you purchased is NOT a valid reason to file a lawsuit. That would be like buying a new car, and then suing Ford after you had a wreck because you didn't know that if you set the "Cruise Control", the car wouldn't drive itself.

that adaptive cruise control feature is going to open up a whole can of lawsuits became fairly standardized eqmt. on most 2018 vehicles.   I attempted to try it on a loaner car recently and works well but if the car ahead of you comes to a quick stop, it brakes hard at first then SHUTS OFF AND FLASHES A BRAKE RED LIGHT ON THE DASH BEEPING AT YOU ALSO, does NOT keep braking to maintain a 2-3 second following distance like it did while the vehicle in front was moving.   BANG, CRASH = LAWSUIT AM SURE.. 

[cookiedough]

maybe stupid question, but why can't john deere with all their intelligence just automatically STOP the blades from spinning when pushing down on the reverse pedal WITHOUT having to push a button to keep the blades moving in reverse.  Just eliminate that button to push to keep blades spinning in reverse.  

I have driven my neighbors cheap L110 mower and totally HATE having to push that button to keep blades spinning in reverse.  I think without pushing that button if I push down on reverse pedal with foot, the engine kills which totally pisses me off and I would prefer OLD SCHOOL just keep the darn blades spinning ALL the time even in reverse, but I can look behind me easy enough to make sure nothing is behind me before going in reverse...

The RIO (Reverse Implement Option) button is actually a standard that is required for lawn tractors to have. A tractor cannot exceed a speed of 1ft/s in reverse without the safety features automatically cutting power to the engine. I'm not sure of the exact date it became a ANSI standard, but it is because of cases above that annoying feature is present on all riding tractors now. I do not believe Zero turn mowers are required to have one. Cub Cadet Z-turns are the only ones I know off that utilize the safety feature.

Reb,  why not like I said when on john deere riding mower when push down on the reverse pedal instead of killing the engine if not pushing in that stupid RIO button instead STOP the blades from spinning while going in reverse?    Is that too hard mechanically to do?  I know my neighbor whom I borrowed his john deere 2-3 times turns off the lever by hand that disengages the mower deck from spinning before going in reverse, also a pain in the butt just like the RIO button having to push in EVERY single time before going in reverse.   Why not just make it automatic?  Yah, I am lazy, but really HATE all these safety features for IDIOTS!!  I only back up 2-4 feet usually if borrowing his riding mower so the chances of someone behind me or an object is slim to none.  What I do instead is just keep the riding mower in forward gear making several U-turns since find it a pain in the butt to either disengage the blades by that hand lever or pushing the RIO button every single time going in reverse for 2-4 feet or so.

[Serk]

Mowers are deadly.......... not the one behind the controls ....... Ban all
Mowers now.

Seem familiar?   

No one wants to ban all mowers, sheesh... We just want common sense mower reform, no one needs a high capacity assault mower, you can mow your yard just fine with one of these:

[scooperhsd]

Mowers are deadly.......... not the one behind the controls ....... Ban all
Mowers now.

Seem familiar?   

No one wants to ban all mowers, sheesh... We just want common sense mower reform, no one needs a high capacity assault mower, you can mow your yard just fine with one of these:

I had one similar to that when we first moved into this house - it cut grass just fine - as long as you were regular (like - weekly) in using it. Next I moved to a 120V electric and in the last 4-5 years - a gas powered one from Lowes depot.

[old2soon]

Mowers are deadly.......... not the one behind the controls ....... Ban all
Mowers now.

Seem familiar?   

No one wants to ban all mowers, sheesh... We just want common sense mower reform, no one needs a high capacity assault mower, you can mow your yard just fine with one of these:

                    TRY finding a reel type mower with a gasoline engine on it that the price tag do NOT look like a chunk of the national debt.  I have NO need of a heavy assault mower-quite happy with me light assault mower.  My Brother on the other hand has a serious assault snoblower!  RIDE SAFE.

[Bighead]

maybe stupid question, but why can't john deere with all their intelligence just automatically STOP the blades from spinning when pushing down on the reverse pedal WITHOUT having to push a button to keep the blades moving in reverse.  Just eliminate that button to push to keep blades spinning in reverse.  

I have driven my neighbors cheap L110 mower and totally HATE having to push that button to keep blades spinning in reverse.  I think without pushing that button if I push down on reverse pedal with foot, the engine kills which totally pisses me off and I would prefer OLD SCHOOL just keep the darn blades spinning ALL the time even in reverse, but I can look behind me easy enough to make sure nothing is behind me before going in reverse...

Wow tough to push a button! No other comment.