Tips, Please ...UPDATE....

[GiG]

My son, the motorcycle mechanic (see, its M/C related!), has been moonlighting in a brand new brew pub in Ypsilanti. He’s been helping in all aspects of the new venture, has known the owners since childhood.

I stopped in at the “Ypsi Lager House” the other day to check it out. The porter is probably the best ever. The brewmaster, Ted, dumps a lot of honey into the final brew to give it a very smooth finish. Delicious  

The policy there is: “No Tipping”. The manager states he pays the help enough that they do not require, and cannot accept, tips.

My experience is: “It don’t work!”.

The girl tending bar can’t pour a decent drink. At $6.50 a beer, she serves it with about half foam, and walks away. She has no incentive to do a decent job, she makes the same rate either way. Maybe if she made minimum wage, and accepted tips, customers could get their $6.50 worth, in stead of a half a beer.

It’s a good product, and I’d like to sample more of the varieties, but NOT at $13 a pint.

Thoughts, or similar experiences?

CHEERS

~GiG~

[czuch]

Kamerade, Socialism in a nutshell right there.
No incentive, no drive, no advancement, no need to perform, no professionalism.
No drinkin out,,,,,,,,no DUI.

[threevalks]

               She may not know how to pour beer, show her how, if that doesn't work, she just don't care, complain to the boss.  In my opinion, tip or no tip, lazy people don't care one way or the other.

[Hook#3287]

To Insure Promptness.

I agree, GOOD service staff will work harder, to make you happy, if they feel it will be profitable for them.

That's a system that works, for the most part.

[CajunRider]

She may not know how to pour beer, show her how, if that doesn't work, she just don't care, complain to the boss. 

That's it in a nutshell. 

Explain the mistake.  If things don't change, explain it to the boss.  If it still doesn't change, let the boss know you'll be drinking elsewhere from then on.

Capitalism at it's best. 

[The emperor has no clothes]

Kamerade, Socialism in a nutshell right there.
No incentive, no drive, no advancement, no need to perform, no professionalism.
No drinkin out,,,,,,,,no DUI.

So capitalism only works with tipping ?

[Willow]

It's a two edged sword.

Where my youngest works the help is paid well below minimum wage because the business is allowed to include the expected average tip income.  Some customers tip well but some think the help is fully paid and don't bother with a reasonable tip.

I think the business you shared about would deliver better service if they didn't stifle the tradition of tipping but I'd like to see businesses not pay their help so little that a server's income is almost entirely at the whim of customers.

[Serk]

Tips shouldn't be required to expect good service. I don't tip my mechanic but expect them to do their job properly, or my plumber, or.... well just about anything else really.

So if there's an issue with someone working there, I'd take it up with the manager/owner of the business.

[The emperor has no clothes]

It's a two edged sword.

Where my youngest works the help is paid well below minimum wage because the business is allowed to include the expected average tip income.  Some customers tip well but some think the help is fully paid and don't bother with a reasonable tip.

I think the business you shared about would deliver better service if they didn't stifle the tradition of tipping but I'd like to see businesses not pay their help so little that a server's income is almost entirely at the whim of customers.

That happens a lot here in the winter. For some reason Snowbirds think tipping should remain at 1952 levels. The summer tourism is much better at tipping I'm told. I personally would like to jobs paid at the correct rate to begin with. And if you want to tip for exceptional service great. I've never understood the thinking that to get good customer service they must be tips. There are plenty of businesses that provide good service without tipping.

[Chrisj CMA]

At that price, If you accepted a beer that was half foam, that's on you.  Maybe if she had to go back and redo enough of them, she would learn how to tip a glass (that's the real tip that was missing)

[Moonshot_1]

Problem is the tax law and minimum wage law.

If you are a restaurant owner, find the best servers and pay them accordingly and let them keep their tips. This should uphold the establishment's service reputation and provide the incentive for the servers to bring their "A" game all the time.

It should be so simple till the guvment gets in on it.

[msb]

While I am not overly affluent, I generally tip at restaraunts, pubs, etc reasonably well if the service merits it because I can afford to (except when I'm in the US, with the exchange rate these days  ). I do not think however, that these types of business should rely primarily on their customers' generosity to augment minimum or below minimum wages paid to servers who's jobs may entail a lot or work or some skill...if a worker's skills and scope of the job merits it, they should be paid accordingly (I don't think that is "socialism" ..it's the exact opposite actually). Same as in my business or any other...determine the worth of the job, train your employees properly, and if the employee doesn't perform to the standard you set for them, then either train them further if you see potential or replace them. I have two grown daughters that at one time or another in their younger years were servers...many servers work like dogs and put up with a lot of crap from both customers and owners/managers alike, and they have to try and maintain their composure in the hope of receiving enough tips to augment their paultry hourly wages.

[Oss]

I would agree with Chrisj  if you ever get ANY product that is not as it is supposed to be open your mouth and say so immediately, before you pay and take possession of the glass of spirits


Say something like " where is the rest of the beer, you dont expect me to pay for half a beer now so please give me the rest of that beer"

Let HER call the manager if she has a problem, if she complies I would tip her properly If she doesnt I am out the door not to return.

I make a habit of meeting the owner manager of all the local restaurants and shoot the breeze. Unless service sucks that night I will usually leave 20%.  Needless to say I get terrific service at the restaurants that I frequent and with allergies thats important

Today I went to the drive thru at BK for the first time in about a year, ordered two double burgers HOLD THE CHEESE (Allergic)  I opened the bag while still at the window.  DUMBASS gave me 2 cheeseburgers/ waited for the correct order, got a fresh order of HOT fries  and left.   You dont tip at BK and look what you get

[Robert]

There are many ways to give people incentives, tipping is ok but it takes some of the control out of your hands. If you pay well it may be higher pay and more consistent than tips and there are always bonuses or incentives paid on performance by management.

  So someone who doesn't like working for tips or gets shorted would like it and work harder for fear of loosing a good paying job. Never dismiss consistency of pay in a good paying job in an industry that unless you are at the top is spotty.

I would say something though about poor service like Oss.

[Romeo]

If the owners say no tipping, I pay the help well, then the owners need to make sure the help is performing their tasks properly, otherwise their business will suffer. If the owner waits for negative input from the customers, they really aren't doing their job.

[CajunRider]

So capitalism only works with tipping ?

Tipping isn't needed, but it helps.

I don't get tips (have more of an office job), but hard work and good ethics have paid me well in my 15 years on the job. 

The recent downturn has been hard.  1/2 of my company has been laid off.  Hard work and good ethics has allowed me to stay working thus far.  So, my "tip" has been gainful employment for the past 6 months while not-so-good attitudes toward an honest days work are no longer making a wage. 

Prove your worth and get paid for it.  Be lazy and get less (or zero) pay. 

[Jess from VA]

I remember getting my first draft in a German gasthouse.  No one makes a better quality beer.  Their purity laws are strict, and so is the law they must pour a perfect pint.  Each beer glass has a line on it, I asked about it.  

Herr Hauptmann, the clear beer must be exactly to the line, and the only foam must be above the line, that is the law, and we will get in trouble if we do not pour to the line.  It generally takes about 4 minutes to get your beer.... so there is not too much foam, they pour slowly.

The Germans are serious about their beer.  Go to Octoberfest, and you get a glass that holds a half gallon of beer.





 

[cookiedough]

there comes a point where too much money on food/drink is not worth it, especially at those prices you are talking about in beer, even good beer.

My 15 year old boy is applying for a job as a busboy/waiter at the local mom/pop Friday/Saturday night restaurant/bar in this town of only 1000 people, low to middle income families, with a few families well off.  Not so sure 5 bucks per hour with what that place does is split ALL the tips with ALL the other similar employees is worth it, but at 15 years old something is better than nothing not having to go far (1/2 mile from home) to earn some dough.  

My then 16 year old daughter last year and half ago (now near 2 years ago) got her first job making 7.25 minimum wage at a chain higher end retail clothing store NEVER missed a day of work and did a good job, although not as pushy as some salesladies am sure.  She was told right before she quit that she when hired missed the yearly cutoff by less than 1 month or so to get a yearly raise and was NO yearly review or EVER one performance review in well over 1 1/2 years  and was told it would be near 2 full years to get off mininum wage.  She quit after discussion with the boss on NO review, nothing, which was fine with us since the store mgr. did not follow corporate performance review procedures NOT once and daughter could have filed an employee complaint nationally on her boss for not follow protocol.  Also quit as well since the other 17 year old at the time hired 6 months AFTER she had started off there was 50 cents per hour starting off more than her since she had near 1 year experience at wal-mart across the street, and sales were more with my daughter over her weekly or very similar most weeks.

I got paid 30 years ago 3.00 per hour (I think, not sure mininum wage at that time was around 3.50 per hour) to bail hay/other farm work a few summers and some other 15-17 year olds around me were not going to work that hard for so little money trying to take the easy way out always looking for the quick buck is all at 5-6 dollar per hour jobs.    I didn't care as much since 15-20 bucks per day was better than nothing. 

Basically,  it is a 2-way street, but supervisors and companies need to WAKE UP and treat ALL employees fairly and reward those who go above and beyond, something definitely lacking in most of today's employers' way of thinking where they pile 2-5 jobs onto 1 person and more and more and more work making the same amount as the next 'iffy at best' employee in the office doing only 1 easy job anybody can do in 1/2 the time needed as well.

[Jess from VA]

I got $1.25 an hour to pump gas and change oil.  If I didn't want the job, there were 50 guys who did.

The only tip I can remember was.....hey kid, yer zipper's down.

[cookiedough]

I got $1.25 an hour to pump gas and change oil.  If I didn't want the job, there were 50 guys who did.

The only tip I can remember was.....hey kid, yer zipper's down.

I don't remember those days when there were actually gas station attendants who actually pump the gas for customers, must have been in the 70's on down?

[T.P.]

From a bottle

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b88pSBIpL-M


From the tap

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=npYiqJuqywA

Just some idea's

[MP]

I got $1.25 an hour to pump gas and change oil.  If I didn't want the job, there were 50 guys who did.

The only tip I can remember was.....hey kid, yer zipper's down.

I don't remember those days when there were actually gas station attendants who actually pump the gas for customers, must have been in the 70's on down?

You are really young!  LOL

In most states, it was illegal to pump your own gas!

[DirtyDan]

Oregon n NJ still is

dan

[Momz]

I've been seeing quite a few "Tip Jars" in fast food restaurants and other types of establishments for the past year (here) in metro Detroit.

Why would there be a need for a tip jar in a hardware store or even a gas station?

I'm not a cheapskate, but I won't put money in those tip jars.

[cookiedough]

I got $1.25 an hour to pump gas and change oil.  If I didn't want the job, there were 50 guys who did.

The only tip I can remember was.....hey kid, yer zipper's down.

I don't remember those days when there were actually gas station attendants who actually pump the gas for customers, must have been in the 70's on down?

You are really young!  LOL

In most states, it was illegal to pump your own gas!

Did not know that either, at age 45 must be still way to wet behind the ears?   

Heck, even if at McD's if the fries are too salty as they can be at times pouring 1/2 the shaker on them enough to make you gag (and I do like salt, just not the entire jar), I take them back requesting fries with NO salt having to do that a few times.  That is my tip of the day.

Same with in your example of too much foam on beer, refuse it and tell them to do it right.  If they don't like it, get your money back and leave.  I would.   

[Skinhead]

From a bottle

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b88pSBIpL-M


From the tap

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=npYiqJuqywA

Just some idea's

I learned that in high school!   (and have the belly to prove it)

[GiG]

UPDATE

WE went back the other night. Very busy, people standing in line 15 - 20 deep waiting at the bar. Ryan was working in the back, not tending. I watched the same blonde to see how the pours were coming. They looked ok so I ordered a couple porters. Guess how they came? Same as before. One was 1/2 full, the other a little  more... I asked blondie to please top them off, and she took them and topped them.  She informed me she wasn't supposed to top them off.
We sat and chatted up the patrons and I was watching the no tip operation. The help didn't care, moved VERY slow, seemed almost surly. After a while, Ryan came out and ran circles around his co-workers. Steppin and fetchin all over the place, moving 3x faster than the rest, pouring drafts and making sure everyone was happy. Told him my impressions, and he knew what I was talking about, said he had enough and was ready to walk because he was tired of carrying the slackers. Smart kid. He's got enough other things going on where he doesn't need to carry the deadbeats.

Hey, if you are getting a "living wage" to pour drafts, you should be able to pour drafts, and it aint MY job to teach you! 

[Mr Whiskey]

Smart kid. He's got enough other things going on where he doesn't need to carry the deadbeats.

Hey, if you are getting a "living wage" to pour drafts, you should be able to pour drafts, and it aint MY job to teach you! 

Yes he is!! Glad he's not gonna keep doin' everyone else's job!
& on that last..... if they're servin' foam, we're drinkin' somewhere else

[Mr Whiskey]

Ahhhhhh to be young again, & burnin' the candle at both ends
Glad he likes it though
Wool Griz for us, tell LuLu & Ryan we luv 'em, (you too Bro) & stay warm!
Ask Ryan if he's "strapped"?
Like you said, "it's bound to get exciting"

[cookiedough]

Smart kid. He's got enough other things going on where he doesn't need to carry the deadbeats.

Hey, if you are getting a "living wage" to pour drafts, you should be able to pour drafts, and it aint MY job to teach you! 

Yes he is!! Glad he's not gonna keep doin' everyone else's job!
& on that last..... if they're servin' foam, we're drinkin' somewhere else

Doing everyone else's job, or better yet,  2-3 full time jobs, seems to be the American way in most employers nowadays.   Mgmt., supervisors,  and HR do not care if doing 1 or 4 jobs, as long as it is getting done, they could care less who does it and how much one gets paid.   I completely agree with being cross-trained, but there comes a point if the other jobs one does are full time jobs,  then don't expect the same pay if one can squeak by getting 2-3 jobs done while the other person only does 1 job, if that.

[G-Man]

She may not know how to pour beer, show her how, if that doesn't work, she just don't care, complain to the boss. 

That's it in a nutshell. 

Explain the mistake.  If things don't change, explain it to the boss.  If it still doesn't change, let the boss know you'll be drinking elsewhere from then on.

Capitalism at it's best. 

By that time, he's $26 into 2 beers!   

[CajunRider]

By that time, he's $26 into 2 beers!   

Good point... guess my plan isn't perfect after all...   

[The emperor has no clothes]

You guys go to bars that charge $6.50 a beer ?

[Mr Whiskey]

You guys go to bars that charge $6.50 a beer ?

For good beer we do.......
the rest of the time we jus' drink PBR with Reb