"Loud" Pipes

[Hooter]

   Wind noise protection with ear plugs, you bet!     But, if your own bike is so loud that you have to wear ear plugs just to ride in some kind of comfort, IS IT TOO LOUD?

[TallRider]

Tolerence and respect for others should be the norm. I had a 1800 VTX with Bub Jug Huggers on it. 1800 CC thumping through straight pipes definitly loud. I knew it and always made sure I was on the right side of any rider I rode with. I try and read the temperment of everyone I ride with and if necessary asked if the noise is an issue and adjusted my place accordingly.  Personaly I prefer riding in the rear. The current group I ride with primarily BMW rides do not like noise. I figured that out after several rides with them. Furtunately I was now riding my new Valk when I joined the group. So never an issue. Personaly I like robust sounding pipes and not a problem with me. So be pleasant ride safe everyone.

[henry 008]

I've often wondered if the VRCC could use a sound meter at a rally, such as inzane. the AMA used to give one away to clubs that would contact them in the spring.

[Gryphon Rider]

Nothing Willow said made me mad.  If I got mad every time someone said something I disagreed with, I'd have had an ulcer years ago.

My opinions for everyone to get mad, or sanguine, about (it's up to you):

1.  I'd rather not ride behind any vehicle with straight pipes.  In a group ride I'll try not to be behind it.
2.  I'd especially not ride behind a dual crank pin V-twin with straight pipes.  I think they sound awful on top of being loud.
3.  The sound that most irritates me when riding is diesel pickups, especially the older ones with very loud clatter when I'm stopped beside them at lights.
4.  When I lead a ride I like to put the newest / most timid rider second in line; that way I can alter the pace to accommodate him or give him instruction with hand signals.  Other than that, between me and the sweep, I don't care how the riders order themselves.
5.  I don't believe that loud pipes save lives in the balance.  I think any extra awareness other drivers have of you is negated by the distraction and ill-temper that the annoyance produces.  I'm pretty sure loud horns are more effective than loud pipes in saving lives.
6.  Loud pipes produce noise bylaws and extra police attention for all motorcyclists.

[Willow]

Okay, I guess maybe my point was too subtle for some, maybe most.  I'd like to tell you how unusual that is.

It's not really about loud pipes, is it?  Truthfully it hardly could be because what is loud to me and what is loud to someone else are not always, or even often, the same.  I really don't consider my TBR 6X6s loud, but then a lot of people do.

What it seems to be about, to me at least, is someone or someones putting together a ride and inviting a group ao participate, but deciding that there is something they don't like and "asking" people who do like that something to ride in the rear.  It's really not about whether or not I ride in the rear.  Sometimes I choose to do so.  It's about whether someone else decides, based upon what they do or don't like, who will be preferred and who will be disrespected.

Truly, we all do that to some degree, don't we?  That's sort of why we put together a motorcycle ride but don't invite cages to be included.  Having done that we sometimes make the exception when one or more of our friends needs to be in a cage.

Honestly I ride mostly alone.  I ride enough that even mostly riding alone I have a fair amount of history riding in both small and larger groups.  I don't sound off my exhaust when I'm in a group.  Well, not often, at least.  There have been a few times when exuberance overtook a few of us or maybe a lot of us.  I do think being considerate is a good thing.  I think demanding consideration can get out of hand and end up being very inconsiderate.

I don't like the sound of unmuffled twins.  I honestly am not overly pleased with the sound of wide open six cylinder engines with no resistance.  I don't find my ears hurt by either of those sounds but then I am a bit tougher than some.

I think everyone who organizes a ride should be free to determine the parameters of who can participate and how.  I also think that in setting those parameters no one should be surprised when someone they thought would accept them says, "No, thanks.  I'll go ride elsewhere.  You little girls have a nice time."  That's just the nature of being human, isn't it?

I'm not seething anymore.  I really haven't been for quite some time.  I honestly find most of humanity moderately amusing.  I've come to a rather solid decision that I have no inclination to change my pipes, my bars, or my wheels.  If you don't like them you're free to not ride near me.  It'll be your choice.  If you insist on making it my choice you probably won't like the result.

I don't like tricycles but I am extremely fond of some of the packages that travel on them.

I generally don't like women drivers (excepting Karen) until I get to know them.  Then I tend to find their incapabilities endearing.

Sometimes I do work at pissing people off.  It enhances my amusement with humanity in general.

You all be safe.  I'll hope to see you when days get longer.            

[John Schmidt]

Sometimes I do work at pissing people off.  It enhances my amusement with humanity in general.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
See, I told you we think a lot alike!     

[Danny McMillin]

You da' man, Willow!! I think you have allowed us to express our different views, and possibly have sparked our thought process. You might be a "Partial Lone Wolf", and don't realize it. Thanks for your honest thoughts, and the opportunity to "spur" with you. Keep an eye on yur riding buddies; I would imagine their riding techniques are speaking to you, just not verbally!

BTW...Everyone please think about putting the Newbies up towards the front, but not the front. You don't want Newbies running faster than the group speed, trying to keep up. The Military March Accordian Effect. That's why I love to ride Drag; I like runnin' faster than normal!

Ride Safe!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[sutterhome]

my ears would vote you to the back of the pack. could care less if you want to cry about it.

[Willow]

You da' man, Willow!!  

Thank you for the kind words, Danny.  I never hear that phrase but that I think of a friend who was with another friend and his very young son.  Gabe, the young lad, did something and my friend told him, "You da man!"  Gabe broke into tears and after much inquisition he related through his distress, "I not the man.  I'm the little boy."  Sometimes I'm the little boy.  That's not all bad.

If you have any interest into what goes on between my ears from time to time you can find it here:  Willow in the Wind

[Willow]

my ears would vote you to the back of the pack. could care less if you want to cry about it.

LOL!  You don't know me.  You've not heard my bike.  I don't normally cry.  Well not over rejection at least.  Remind me who you are if we see one another sometime.  I won't bother riding with you.   

[The emperor has no clothes]

my ears would vote you to the back of the pack. could care less if you want to cry about it.

LOL!  You don't know me.  You've not heard my bike.  I don't normally cry.  Well not over rejection at least.  Remind me who you are if we see one another sometime.  I won't bother riding with you.   

Willow, you were right. Many don't seem to understand it's not about loud pipes.
Damn people, we are all motorcycle riders. Can't we even show courtesy to our fellow riders ? I would have never believed this topic would have brought up such animosity among us riders.  ???

[BradValk48237]

I am in on the "loud' pipes... loud for a Valk...... My piggies are cut and at last one set of baffles drilled, but it is just a nice roar that i don't mind for long periods.... not full open cobra loud, but much louder than stock, even the loudest Valk I've heard is still not bad in the wind riding staggered.

The problem is there are "loud' pipes and then there are "LOOOOUUUD" pipes.....

Even the most open pipes on a Valk aren't as loud as open pipes some V twins..... I feel its the amount of exhaust pushed by 2 big cylinders vs. 6 smaller ones. When it hurts, it's too loud....

The kind of loud that is annoying 2 blocks away.... and a guy who is in the throttle at 7 AM on a Saturday... let alone riding right next to ya. (yeah,  I have one of "those" guys around me.)

So there is a point where is goes from being heard in traffic to "assh%#$" loud.....

My 2 cents

B

[Wizzard]

I could care less what anyone thinks of my pipes. I put them on to make me happy, not them.

[msb]

 Sometimes I'm the little boy.  That's not all bad.

As my lovely bride has so often and affectionatley reminded me over the 35 years we've been together, the 5 stages of a man's life are: infant...little boy...little boy...little boy...little boy

[Bighead]

Personally I could care less what pipes ( loud or quiet ) people run, if they bother me I will simply change my position......easy Peasy.

[Gryphon Rider]

Personally I could care less what pipes ( loud or quiet ) people run, if they bother me I will simply change my position......easy Peasy.

I could care less what anyone thinks of my pipes. I put them on to make me happy, not them.

I am glad the two of you at least care a little bit, because you could care less. 

[fudgie]

I don't run loud pipes, just modified stock. Can you hear me a mile or 2 down the road? Yes. There is nothing better then the sound of straight pipes thru the mountains at rally time. Those that were at the last IZ could prob imagine hearing a nice rumble in the Hills. Rather soothing. 

[sandy]

" There have occasionally been posts made in which someone will ridicule the concept that loud pipes save lives.  I've got some information for those folks.  They do. " (Willow Quote)

Willow: Motorcycle Cruiser Magazine did an article called the twelve myths of MC riding. One myth was that loud pipes save lives. Their investigation showed that loud pipe riders got into more accidents than riders with stock pipes. These are statistics, not "bar stories".

My speculation/observation tells me this is true because the loud guys in general are type A aggressive personalities. They ride fast, tailgate and weave in and out in traffic. BTW: 50 years of riding and no accidents. No loud pipes either. Rather I wear very bright colors, a white helmet with reflective tape.

[Gryphon Rider]

Motorcycle Cruiser Magazine did an article called the twelve myths of MC riding. One myth was that loud pipes save lives. Their investigation showed that loud pipe riders got into more accidents than riders with stock pipes. These are statistics, not "bar stories".

My speculation/observation tells me this is true because the loud guys in general are type A aggressive personalities. They ride fast, tailgate and weave in and out in traffic. BTW: 50 years of riding and no accidents. No loud pipes either. Rather I wear very bright colors, a white helmet with reflective tape.

Maybe if "type A" people were forced to run stock pipes, they would get into even more accidents than they do now?  Nah... they'd make up for it by installing lift kits and deep-lugged tires so they could still be heard coming.

[Willow]

" There have occasionally been posts made in which someone will ridicule the concept that loud pipes save lives.  I've got some information for those folks.  They do. " (Willow Quote)

Willow: Motorcycle Cruiser Magazine did an article called the twelve myths of MC riding. One myth was that loud pipes save lives. Their investigation showed that loud pipe riders got into more accidents than riders with stock pipes. These are statistics, not "bar stories".

My speculation/observation tells me this is true because the loud guys in general are type A aggressive personalities. They ride fast, tailgate and weave in and out in traffic. BTW: 50 years of riding and no accidents. No loud pipes either. Rather I wear very bright colors, a white helmet with reflective tape.

Sandy, I appreciate your input.

Two things I would point out.  One is that I tend to disbelieve what magazines present as results of their investigations.  They generally have their own agenda to serve and are probably not qualified to do more than attempt to support that agenda.

The second is that your own assessment of the supposed results explains that it really isn't a valid study at all of whether the loud pipes resulted in more recognition but that the higher accident rates were the result of the riding style of those who tended to choose loud pipes.  That is unless you are arguing that the pipes themselves somehow mysteriously dictated the riding style of those who have them.  

I would easily confess that folks with louder vehicles are not guarded against all accidents.  I only argue that from my experience, and I do a lot of riding with both, others in traffic are more likely to be aware of motorcycles that have a noticeable exhaust sound.

I do acknowledge that the use of a loud horn will also make others aware of your presence.  Honestly I should have used mine when my collision occurred but by the time I realized it was imminent it was too late for horn or brake.  As an aside it's good that it was as if I'd had the nose of the bike down I probably would have gone into the side of the cage rather than being ejected primarily over it.  I assume that is what happened to Steve a few months before my incident.

I'm good with I won't convince you and you won't convince me.  I do question the logical skills of anyone who disagrees with me.    

        

[DarkSideR]

Let's be careful gentlemen. I wouldn't want new riders to get a false sense of security using loud pipes.  With our without loud pipes defensive riding must always be practiced.  Point in case;  I was driving behind a bike with loud pipes, but he placed himself in the blind spot of a car in the left lane in front of him.  Of course the car switched lanes and cut the bike off, to which the biker became very upset,  but I saw the biker was in the wrong. His loud pipes did nothing for him.

A word to the wise.  Loud pipes may help save lives,  but there is no guarantee they will save your life. Ride safe my friends.

[Willow]

...
A word to the wise.  Loud pipes may help save lives,  but there is no guarantee they will save your life. Ride safe my friends.

I agree wholeheartedly.   

[crow]

Used to think loud pipes were the greatest,  but I was a teen-ager.  If you feel loud noise will save your life, I suggest riding with your horn always on!   

Loud     Pipes      Risk     Rights

[Robert]

Loud pipes project the sound rearward, so its anyone behind gets the full noise. Anyone to the side or front gets muted sound. Kind of like standing in front of a trumpet or speaker or to the side or front which will be less.

 It seems logical to accommodate those who don't want a loud ride to be in the front. I choose to ride in front or way behind when riding with my son and son in law on their Harleys for that very reason. Now occasionally they will full throttle it on either side of me and try to pass me so I can testify of the noise in different positions. If they can catch me since I can accelerate faster than them they laugh their fool heads off.

Lately with the new Valk 1800 I have enjoyed the quiet of my 5am rides to the gym and when out late my rides back home. I'm sure my neighbors are happier since the bike is quiet while they are sleeping. There is also something relaxing about hearing the wind and sounds as I go along. I have never felt comfortable relying on loud pipes to alert people of my presence since I have seen people oblivious to a fire truck bearing down on them.

For these reasons I don't see a problem being asked to ride in the rear. Heck some of the most important positions and safest are in the rear.

I also have ridden with ear plugs and Personally am not comfortable with it. I can hear cars coming up on me and noises as I go that alert me to traffic near me. I also hear emergency vehicles at a distance or just another layer of alertness to what is around me. I have grappled with the ear plug issue and agree with the wind noise but on this new bike its no where near as bad. Its also illegal in a cage to have head phones or ear plugs while driving. 

[Rams]

Really don't care what the "other" guy rides or what his pipes are.   If they are too loud for me, I'll find a different riding position in the pack or break off from the group.    I don't like loud pipes but, I readily admit "loud" has not had a decibel level attached to it in the thread so, loud is what ever bothers the individual rider (I guess).   

I used to like "Loud" anything but, then I served in the Marines as Infantry, the Army as an Artillery Officer and as a Helicopter Pilot/Test Pilot.   Have lost about half my upper hearing range, I don't wish to lose any more so, I avoid excessively loud machinery, music and women.    Again, loud is not defined but, if the noise maker is above about 85 decibels, I try to keep my distance.   If it's over 100 decibels, I won't go near it.   No, I don't carry a meter around with me but, if it hurts my ears, then it's too frigg'n loud.   As a reference, the average lawn mower is about 100 decibels. 

As to being asked to ride in the rear of the group, sounds to me like that request was taken as a sign of disrespect.    Maybe I'm wrong.   I'd ride with Willow any day and any where but, if his pipes are loud, it might be at a distance. 

[Disco]

Do they help with........?  Probably not, because exhaust noise goes out the back......

You are kidding, right?
You can hear me half mile out......& I'm ridin' a Wing
(With unbaffled Cobras.)

Oh, so you have the ultra-rare unbaffled Cobras that point forward and sideways.  My bad.   

[fudgie]

Do they help with........?  Probably not, because exhaust noise goes out the back......

You are kidding, right?
You can hear me half mile out......& I'm ridin' a Wing
(With unbaffled Cobras.)

Oh, so you have the ultra-rare unbaffled Cobras that point forward and sideways.  My bad.   

So you've never heard a HD off in the distance?  ???

[fudgie]

A word to the wise.  Loud pipes may help save lives,  but there is no guarantee they will save your life. Ride safe my friends.

Like helmets. 

[Rams]

Do they help with........?  Probably not, because exhaust noise goes out the back......

You are kidding, right?
You can hear me half mile out......& I'm ridin' a Wing
(With unbaffled Cobras.)

Oh, so you have the ultra-rare unbaffled Cobras that point forward and sideways.  My bad.   

So you've never heard a HD off in the distance?  ???

My perspective on loud pipes making cager's aware of our presence is similar to that of operator's of vehicles that stop at intersections and look directly at me and then pull out in front of me trying to occupy the same space I'm in.    Yes they see or hear me but, because I'm insignificant in their minds, they continue and don't notice me.   I've had loud pipes and added additional lighting to no avail.    I won't say loud pipes don't save lives but, I don't believe they have a dramatic effect.   

Combine that opinion with my (already) significant hearing loss and it just ain't worth it to ride with higher decibel exhaust.   Don't get me wrong, I love a rumble in exhaust.   Loud just isn't worth it to me regardless of where I ride in the pack.    I'm also not a fan of large numbers on a ride and will frequently follow at a distance.

[Mr Whiskey]

Oh, so you have the ultra-rare unbaffled Cobras that point forward and sideways.  My bad.   

Yeppers, pretty rar'!

[GiG]

Do they help with........?  Probably not, because exhaust noise goes out the back......

You are kidding, right?
You can hear me half mile out......& I'm ridin' a Wing
(With unbaffled Cobras.)
...........  
https://youtu.be/COJkmWY5EgE
"Can you hear me now?"
BaWaaHaHaHaHa [/size]

Yeah, I hear ya!


Did the debate ever get settled about who was louder, you or Ryan? 

[Mr Whiskey]

Pretty sure Ryan won that one "goin' away"! HaHa

[Oss]

I thank you for the post Carl, glad you feel better now.  Maybe you needed some of those fried oreos today

On group rides I dont mind to be the caboose, did it last on Highbinder's ride in Kentucky, And a joe ride in Ashville on the BRP to the waterfalls.  

With my CB and stock pipes, I can look around and enjoy the scenery I may have missed trying to keep up with some of the more spirited riders and rescue anyone in trouble or lost.   Besides, despite the rep, Joe really does have the group wait at different spots and leads a great ride

That said, I like Hubcap's answer, I will also pull over and wait for the really really loud rider to get further down the one lane road. If possible I will just pass loud pipe bikes around here and problem solved

We are all having fun, why crap in someone's cornflakes?

[cookiedough]

loud pipes are only horrible if they shake inside our house the picture frames on the walls when someone like my a-hole HD neighbor revs his pipes at 2 a.m. in the morning and lets the darn thing idle for 20 minutes before taking off.   

I think if someone tells me where to ride in a group,  I'll take it as a suggestion but if I don't like it,  will go my own way riding alone.  I'm not the fastest, nor the slowest, so usually end up in the middle of the pack towards the end since I prefer to enjoy the views vs. being first on race day.  If I am in a small group and now the riders are faster than me,  I'll gladly ride in the far back no problems since don't want to hold someone up. 

[t-man403]

I must be deaf ......... I have never heard a set of loud pipes coming ....... but I sure have heard them going and by that time, it was way to late for me to cut them off and silence them forever!  

[Black Pearl's Captain]

I'll give the rant a 7+. needs more t***waffle and short on wine. + because you did cover a lot of bases on pissing various groups off.

On the other hand, dang it Mr. Willow we need to ride together sometime soon. Have your people get with my people and lets meet up somewhere this year a couple times at least. I'm pretty sure if we average out my George Jetson Jetmobile pipes with your LOUD PIPES we will still get somewhere sooner or sooner.

http://www.forgottenfantasy.com/jetcar.wav

I'll bring the backup gas can.

[Fla. Jim]

I don't care for loud pipes myself. And I see nothing wrong in putting them together behind everyone else in a group ride. But then I'm more a lone wolf rider so it is really not a problem for me. I did have a set of two bros cans on my now dead 98 and after a month swapped out for a stock set with a loud noise lover. It did sound "very bad ass" but my ears just can't take it. And I wanted at 40-45 mph to be able to talk with the wife on our favorite two lane scenic road . Loud high revving straight pipes around town! I put the irritant level right next to the guys whose sound system BLM message rattling my closed windows and making it impossible to hear my own radio. Also while I am doing a mini rant I can't stand inconsiderate cell phone users, that loudly, in inappropriate public places, let everyone know exactly what they are talking about. It's 99 X out of 100  not something I want to hear either. You want noise, enjoy, just not with me. Consideration of others rights to peace should play in the mix somewhere.

[Binkie]

My only *itch about loud pipes are the straight pipes without baffles. I just don't understand how those are legal. If I uncork my 55 Chevy and go roaring around I end up with a ticket. Yet bikes do it all the time. I live out in the country which also happens to be a great motorcycle road which leads to either the Dragon or the Skyway. It gets a little annoying when hundreds of loud piped bikes pass by in any given day. They seem to think it's fun to scare the horses and donkey's . I wanted to put up a sign that said " loud pipes don't save life's.....they just piss off the locals". Or " keep revving.... I'm still loading". My wife...the sane one... Said no.

[therapist]

 I've found wind noise is a bigger problem but I can't get ear plugs in my tiny ear holes.  Have to wear muffs at the range.

My wife had the same issue, we found that they make earplugs for kids that fit fine.

[t-man403]

 I've found wind noise is a bigger problem but I can't get ear plugs in my tiny ear holes.  Have to wear muffs at the range.

My wife had the same issue, we found that they make earplugs for kids that fit fine.

Get custom ones made ...... worth every penny!