hydrolock scare

[Gavin_Sons]

So I rode my bike yesterday evening for about 5 miles. Got up this morning and drained all the old fuel out of the tank and put ethonal free back in it. Went to start it up and it cranked over a couple times then locked. I instantly knew what happened. I pulled the plugs and #2 cylinder shot gas across the garage. Put plugs back in and it fired right up. Im not turning the gas back on til I get my new needle valves and new float I just ordered. I got really lucky it did not break any gears.

[The emperor has no clothes]

I'm glad you got lucky 

[Gavin_Sons]

I'm glad you got lucky 

Yeah even though I have done 2 other hydrolocked bikes I did not want to do my own  the way it sounded when it locked I was sure the gear broke. It did start with the gas left in the bowls and started fine with no noise.

[The emperor has no clothes]

Do you think your petcock is leaking or just the fuel in the line caused it ?

[Gavin_Sons]

Do you think your petcock is leaking or just the fuel in the line caused it ?

I have a manual petcock. It locked on #2 cylinder so that tells me that carb is letting gas leak past and drain into the cylinder. Either the float is not floating right or the needle valve has gone bad. I ordered both. Got a whole set of needle valves to replace them all. It has been sitting since the first of october also.

[cookiedough]

Yikes,  that has me wanting to get my bike out of storage since late November VERY soon like next week for sure one day to get the old gas out and burning it up.

best of luck in the repairs, hope all goes well. 

[Patrick]

I think the key is to not touch that button again once you hear that CLANK until the cylinders are cleared.

[Gavin_Sons]

I think the key is to not touch that button again once you hear that CLANK until the cylinders are cleared.

 

[FryeVRCCDS0067]

Glad you got lucky. It happened to my son Andy's valk a few years ago. He was in a hardware store parking lot and called me after hitting the starter button and realizing there was a problem. I did the same thing with the plugs and one really spewed gas.

Float or valve was still stuck when he got it here but starter gear was OK. I drained the tank through that float bowl while periodically blowing a small amount of compressed air back up the drain to clear whatever was there. Filled it back up with fresh gas and and it's been OK ever since.

Replacing all the valves as you are doing is the better approach. I just didn't want to do that job if I could avoid it. You know how us maintenance guys can be. 

[baldo]

I have yet to pull the rack to change the valves. I've taken to carrying a ratchet setup at all times and pulling the left plugs when it locks up. It's a more than rare, but less than frequent occurrence.

[Dave Ritsema]

I never had that happen to me but as my Valkyrie approached 15 years old it was always on my mind the first few starts of the season. Too bad it isn't financially feasible to retrofit a fuel injection set up to these bikes and ditch the carbs and petcocks.

[Gavin_Sons]

I have yet to pull the rack to change the valves. I've taken to carrying a ratchet setup at all times and pulling the left plugs when it locks up. It's a more than rare, but less than frequent occurrence.

You have had it happen more than once? I'd be afraid if it happened again the gear would get broke and that means pulling the motor. It is not an easy job. I have all the custom tools I made for it but is still a bitch.

[Gavin_Sons]

I never had that happen to me but as my Valkyrie approached 15 years old it was always on my mind the first few starts of the season. Too bad it isn't financially feasible to retrofit a fuel injection set up to these bikes and ditch the carbs and petcocks.

The petcock is only a problem if you have a stock one and it drains down the vacuum line. I have had a manual one for several years. I bet the float in mine is stuck. I'm taking it all apart and cleaning them real good. From now on it will get stored with non ethanol gas.

[baldo]

I have yet to pull the rack to change the valves. I've taken to carrying a ratchet setup at all times and pulling the left plugs when it locks up. It's a more than rare, but less than frequent occurrence.

You have had it happen more than once? I'd be afraid if it happened again the gear would get broke and that means pulling the motor. It is not an easy job. I have all the custom tools I made for it but is still a bitch.

I just bump the starter button every time and listen. If it hesitates at all, I get the tools out....

Might not be the wisest method, but I have no space and time to do it right now.

[Patrick]

I think the key is to not touch that button again once you hear that CLANK until the cylinders are cleared.

 

Mine got persnickety a number of years back and fuel locked #2 a half dozen times. I installed a Pingle valve years before that. After the first lock I started to just bump the button. If it locks, out come the sparklers and the cylinders get cleared. Hasn't decided to lock itself in the past few years. I still shut off the fuel a couple miles before stopping for any length of time.
Since it didn't get ridden at all last summer, I'm thinking there may be a problem this season, time will tell.

[Dale_K]

I'm not the technical expert but I'm surprised that the bike could hydrolock with a closed petcock.  Is there enough fuel above carb but after the petcock to fill a cylinder?

[Gavin_Sons]

I'm not the technical expert but I'm surprised that the bike could hydrolock with a closed petcock.  Is there enough fuel above carb but after the petcock to fill a cylinder?

Yes more than enough. It only takes a few ML to lock a cylinder. My petcock was off when I went to start it. I assume the float was stuck open and let the gas past.

[Patrick]

I'm not the technical expert but I'm surprised that the bike could hydrolock with a closed petcock.  Is there enough fuel above carb but after the petcock to fill a cylinder?

The original petcocks are prone to leaking.  Many have switched to manual Pingle Valves which do not leak.  So if an original is leaking there is plenty of fuel to cause a lock.  As Gavin-Sons says,  there is also enough fuel in the supply line to also cause a lock if the needle/float valve is leaking. 

[Gavin_Sons]

I'm not the technical expert but I'm surprised that the bike could hydrolock with a closed petcock.  Is there enough fuel above carb but after the petcock to fill a cylinder?

The original petcocks are prone to leaking.  Many have switched to manual Pingle Valves which do not leak.  So if an original is leaking there is plenty of fuel to cause a lock.  As Gavin-Sons says,  there is also enough fuel in the supply line to also cause a lock if the needle/float valve is leaking. 

Or a stuck float 

[Cracker Jack]

I'm not the technical expert but I'm surprised that the bike could hydrolock with a closed petcock.  Is there enough fuel above carb but after the petcock to fill a cylinder?

The original petcocks are prone to leaking.  Many have switched to manual Pingle Valves which do not leak.  So if an original is leaking there is plenty of fuel to cause a lock.  As Gavin-Sons says,  there is also enough fuel in the supply line to also cause a lock if the needle/float valve is leaking.  

So you're saying that a Pingle is not a guarantee of preventing a hydrolock as has been touted on this board and generally accepted by most members.  

If that's the case, then I see two possible paths for hydrolock.

First, a needle valve needs to be leaking above any cylinder with a blocked carb vent on any piston stroke. This statement is based on the assumption that an open carb vent is lower that needed to overflow the carb into the cylinder. I'm not sure that is the case.

Second. The petcock provides what is considered a "double block and bleed" consisting of the two diaphragms and the vent between them. In order for the fuel to get into the vacuum hose, both diaphragms have to be leaking and the vent blocked. In this condition, fuel would go directly into the cylinder.

Hubcap has shown a picture in the past where his vent was blocked when he purchased his bike. Where is it Mike?

I'm not the technical expert but I'm surprised that the bike could hydrolock with a closed petcock.  Is there enough fuel above carb but after the petcock to fill a cylinder?

The original petcocks are prone to leaking.  Many have switched to manual Pingle Valves which do not leak.  So if an original is leaking there is plenty of fuel to cause a lock.  As Gavin-Sons says,  there is also enough fuel in the supply line to also cause a lock if the needle/float valve is leaking. 

Or a stuck float 

A stuck float causes the needle valve to leak.

[Gavin_Sons]

I'm not the technical expert but I'm surprised that the bike could hydrolock with a closed petcock.  Is there enough fuel above carb but after the petcock to fill a cylinder?

The original petcocks are prone to leaking.  Many have switched to manual Pingle Valves which do not leak.  So if an original is leaking there is plenty of fuel to cause a lock.  As Gavin-Sons says,  there is also enough fuel in the supply line to also cause a lock if the needle/float valve is leaking.  

So you're saying that a Pingle is not a guarantee of preventing a hydrolock as has been touted on this board and generally accepted by most members.  

If that's the case, then I see two possible paths for hydrolock.

First, a needle valve needs to be leaking above any cylinder with a blocked carb vent on any piston stroke. This statement is based on the assumption that an open carb vent is lower that needed to overflow the carb into the cylinder. I'm not sure that is the case.

Second. The petcock provides what is considered a "double block and bleed" consisting of the two diaphragms and the vent between them. In order for the fuel to get into the vacuum hose, both diaphragms have to be leaking and the vent blocked. In this condition, fuel would go directly into the cylinder.

Hubcap has shown a picture in the past where his vent was blocked when he purchased his bike. Where is it Mike?

I'm not the technical expert but I'm surprised that the bike could hydrolock with a closed petcock.  Is there enough fuel above carb but after the petcock to fill a cylinder?

The original petcocks are prone to leaking.  Many have switched to manual Pingle Valves which do not leak.  So if an original is leaking there is plenty of fuel to cause a lock.  As Gavin-Sons says,  there is also enough fuel in the supply line to also cause a lock if the needle/float valve is leaking. 

Or a stuck float 

A stuck float causes the needle valve to leak.

All true, I'm going to have to investigate that vent everyone is talking about. A faulty petcock is not the only concern for hydrolock.  I believed this several years ago but after doing my brothers locked bike is when I realized the only way the petcock could cause this is to leak directly into the #6 carb. If your petcock is letting fuel flow and you lock then you have a problem with your carbs that needs to be addressed. I would like to know more about this vent. I don't recall seeing one when I pulled my carbs 2 years ago to fix a plugged jet.

[cookiedough]

what does this hydroLOCK sound like when bumping the starter button just in case it happens to me or another one of us??   If it does lock,  then pull all 6 plugs and crank it over 1-2 times and let gas blow out the spark plug holes?

[hubcapsc]

It wasn't my bike, it was another fellow in town.

The petcock was bad because of the flap you can see.

The PO had put this rubber on the weep hole, I guess the
petcock was leaking for him, it sure was for Gary... the petcock
was wet to the touch with gas. When he started the bike, raw
gas shot out the muffler, and out of the weep hole in the bottom
center of the muffler, enough to kill a dead spot in the grass
wherever the bike was when he started it. The #6 plug was
black, cause when the rubber blocked the petcock weep hole
the gas had to go somewhere, and it went down the vacuum
line to #6. We fixed it with a cover set.



-Mike

[Gavin_Sons]

It wasn't my bike, it was another fellow in town.

The petcock was bad because of the flap you can see.

The PO had put this rubber on the weep hole, I guess the
petcock was leaking for him, it sure was for Gary... the petcock
was wet to the touch with gas. When he started the bike, raw
gas shot out the muffler, and out of the weep hole in the bottom
center of the muffler, enough to kill a dead spot in the grass
wherever the bike was when he started it. The #6 plug was
black, cause when the rubber blocked the petcock weep hole
the gas had to go somewhere, and it went down the vacuum
line to #6. We fixed it with a cover set.



-Mike

Thanks Mike. That does not concern my problem though. I have a Pingle manual petcock. The only possible way for mine to lock would be for a float to stick open which leaves the needle valve open. Or a bad needle valve that is not seating properly in its hole. I'll pull it apart this weekend if my parts come in and fiddle with it. Might even talk rainman into bring that digisync over to try out.

[Firefighter]

A little trash or water in the float valve will do the same thing, hold the needle away from its seat.

[Patrick]

A little trash or water in the float valve will do the same thing, hold the needle away from its seat.

And that is usually what happens. A chunk of varnish or a little rust that gets past the screen is all it takes.  There is enough fuel in the line to cause a lock.

[Dave Ritsema]

I must admit, while sometimes I miss my Valkyrie I NEVER miss carburetors, especially six of them! Or petcocks for that matter.

[Gavin_Sons]

I must admit, while sometimes I miss my Valkyrie I NEVER miss carburetors, especially six of them! Or petcocks for that matter.

I think I would miss tinkering with them 

[wiggydotcom]

I must admit, while sometimes I miss my Valkyrie I NEVER miss carburetors, especially six of them! Or petcocks for that matter.

I think I would miss tinkering with them 

I'm with Dave. Some people are glutens for punishment. Don't take that wrong, Gavin. I used to like wrenching also....but I AM glad I never had hydrolock in over a hunnert thousand miles with 2 Valks.

[Gavin_Sons]

I would also like to be part of the elite that has never had hydrolock, but I was not that fortunate.  I'm lucky it did no damage.

[Rocketman]

So I rode my bike yesterday evening for about 5 miles. Got up this morning and drained all the old fuel out of the tank and put ethonal free back in it. Went to start it up and it cranked over a couple times then locked. I instantly knew what happened. I pulled the plugs and #2 cylinder shot gas across the garage. Put plugs back in and it fired right up. Im not turning the gas back on til I get my new needle valves and new float I just ordered. I got really lucky it did not break any gears.

How did it turn over a few times and THEN lock?  If the crankshaft went through a full rotation (all six cylinders going through full stroke at least once), then it can't have had fuel still in it.

[gordonv]

Fuel was sitting outside the closed intake valve. When it opened, it suck a lunge full into the cylinder.

That would be my guess.

[Gavin_Sons]

Fuel was sitting outside the closed intake valve. When it opened, it suck a lunge full into the cylinder.

That would be my guess.

This is what I thought too. But thanks rocketman for informing me what my bike didn't do 

[Patrick]

One full revolution can seem/feel like a long time. These usually start sooner than that. Well, mine does anyway. I just bump the starter button and it's still usually off and running on the first bump.

[Gavin_Sons]

One full revolution can seem/feel like a long time. These usually start sooner than that. Well, mine does anyway. I just bump the starter button and it's still usually off and running on the first bump.

My dads IS is like that. I have always had to crank mine several revolutions to get it to start unless it is still warm.