Sex slaves

[Oss]

one of my african clients sent me this video
He is a good man and totally frustrated with the world response to slavery and killing in his Nigeria

https://www.facebook.com/1193209580733660/videos/1398118140242802/

not surprising

WHat is surprising is the number of american women who are either blissfully ignorant or just dont give a damn.

Maybe they ought to publish this more often

[Gryphon Rider]

I wonder how widely accepted within Islam her attitude towards enslaving non-Muslim women is, whether it mostly within specific sects/branches, in which countries, etc.

Oss, why are you specifically wondering about American women's awareness of this, and not American society in general?

[sandy]

Evan: Is there a way to allow non FB members to see it?

[Gryphon Rider]

Evan: Is there a way to allow non FB members to see it?

This is the same video:
https://youtu.be/fU35ZoyVTis

[Oss]

GR, because I think that american, and for that matter canadian
women is what it will take to change things.

Women are a powerful force, you are married I dont have to tell you that !

If women, who are the majority, decide something is wrong, they will let us men know it but more important they can pressure other women

The idea that any woman in this millenium says, we need sex slaves so our men wont be adulterous is amazing to me.

There are close to a 1.8 billion followers of Islam in the world. That is a lot of sex slaves. Dont know about y'all but if I find a man kidnapping a child to be a slave I would not be civil in my reaction

[G-Man]

Sorry, very sorry, to say that the mistreatment of women in the Arab/Muslim world is NOTHING NEW.  However, it IS ignored.  You can Youtube, google, wiki, etc,  an infinite number of videos and articles written about this topic and you can go back to the beginning of last century to see that the rest of the world turns a blind eye.  As we here, go to the exact opposite extreme, mistreatment of women continues to thrive over there.

Why?  You will never get a straight answer.  When our previous Sec'y of State takes millions and millions in "donations" while in office from countries that willfully and lawfully promote the mistreatment women, you have to know the fix is in.  But remember, ladies, there's a special place in the afterlife for YOU, if you don't vote and go along with it.   

[Serk]

Not specifically sex slaves, but evidently full blown slave auctions are back on in Libya these days:

http://www.cnn.com/2017/11/14/africa/libya-migrant-auctions/index.html

[..]

Are we looking forward to the pink hatted protesters  marching in their millions through Washington, New York and Los Angeles in support of the women being foully abused?

[Serk]

Are we looking forward to the pink hatted protesters  marching in their millions through Washington, New York and Los Angeles in support of the women being foully abused?

[Robert]

If your religion says its ok then what do you think will change? If we cannot wipe out the problems with pedophilia, sexual abuse and the things that have come up in the news lately how much of a chance do the countries have that don't put a social stigma on it and actually endorse it. Heck there is quite a bit of sex slaves going on the the US, so we really should not be pointing a finger to much at anyone else. Bill Clinton and Jeffrey Epstein comes to mind, in the money circles its pretty accepted along with pedophilia. Justice Scalia was at a ranch that could be in question.

[¿spoom]

If your religion says its ok then what do you think will change? If we cannot wipe out the problems with pedophilia, sexual abuse and the things that have come up in the news lately how much of a chance do the countries have that don't put a social stigma on it and actually endorse it. Heck there is quite a bit of sex slaves going on the the US, so we really should not be pointing a finger to much at anyone else. Bill Clinton and Jeffrey Epstein comes to mind, in the money circles its pretty accepted along with pedophilia. Justice Scalia was at a ranch that could be in question.

Probably the best argument to not base laws on religion, since everyone throughout history either goes into angry pitbull mode when their particular faith is challenged, or simply uses it to justify practices no agnostic would ever accept. Probably the only way to fight this is to keep it in the headlines and on the desks of world leaders and population, except the UN seems more concerned with wealth distribution and appeasing our enemies. About the only US women who can really make a difference in the middle east would probably be the ones manning military planes over it 

[shortleg]

      Please don't take this wrong,the last job my Dad had before he retired was working as
a Customs Officer.
    He and I would talk sometimes about his job. He would talk about how much fraud and just
plain death came out of that country.l
   He always ended his conversations by just shaking his head.

[Robert]

Probably the best argument to not base laws on religion, since everyone throughout history either goes into angry pitbull mode when their particular faith is challenged, or simply uses it to justify practices no agnostic would ever accept. Probably the only way to fight this is to keep it in the headlines and on the desks of world leaders and population, except the UN seems more concerned with wealth distribution and appeasing our enemies. About the only US women who can really make a difference in the middle east would probably be the ones manning military planes over it 

While I do like your last statement the first part says not to base laws on religion. That is not really correct since in the US the laws and rules we have here although they have changed are based on Christianity. In fact this country had the Mayflower Compact that ruled for 150 years before the Constitution was in place. The other example is Israel, based on the Jewish religion. Both good examples of countries that help others.

The other thing is even if you do bomb the middle east you may slow the inevitable outcome but I doubt it would stop the Muslims from coming back as in the Tripoli Treaty.

It then becomes a question as to what is your religon all about and who or what is it based on. That would be the real problem.

[¿spoom]

Probably the best argument to not base laws on religion, since everyone throughout history either goes into angry pitbull mode when their particular faith is challenged, or simply uses it to justify practices no agnostic would ever accept. Probably the only way to fight this is to keep it in the headlines and on the desks of world leaders and population, except the UN seems more concerned with wealth distribution and appeasing our enemies. About the only US women who can really make a difference in the middle east would probably be the ones manning military planes over it  

While I do like your last statement the first part says not to base laws on religion. That is not really correct since in the US the laws and rules we have here although they have changed are based on Christianity. In fact this country had the Mayflower Compact that ruled for 150 years before the Constitution was in place. The other example is Israel, based on the Jewish religion. Both good examples of countries that help others.

The other thing is even if you do bomb the middle east you may slow the inevitable outcome but I doubt it would stop the Muslims from coming back as in the Tripoli Treaty.

It then becomes a question as to what is your religion all about and who or what is it based on. That would be the real problem.

Some things like not killing or stealing are basic to any sustainable society, whether a Commandment or not. Our laws are based on Christianity because they were primarily written by Christians, BUT they were selected, accepted, and voted into law by the majority of the voting population.As such, they are subject to change based on the social mores of the voting base, opposed to picking up a religious book and quoting it's rules. Heck, at one time that voting population was by law, white males only. The Constitution can be changed if there is enough support for it, while (supposedly) a congregation can't change the rules to suit them. Granted, some faiths seem to get a revelation to change the product when it's sales are low, but that's different subject. From what I've seen over the years, man creates a/the deity in THEIR image, picking and choosing what rules they will put up with when shopping for a religion. Don't want a female priest, cross off certain faiths. How about married "preachers" choose another, birth control, likewise. Don't approve of certain meats, choose from these ones. Multiple wives? Male "wives", whatever, there's the "Church of everything for everyone" out there for you. The problem is some of those who can't separate civil law from religion because their faith is the "real one" decide they need to force their beliefs on others, even if the others' beliefs or lack thereof aren't contrary to the ever changing law. The founding fathers, in their amazing combined mindset, knew citizens needed freedom FROM religion as much as freedom OF religion.      

[Robert]

The founding fathers, in their amazing combined mindset, knew citizens needed freedom FROM religion as much as freedom OF religion.      

Well thought out and said, on this last point we could have a discussion about but that is for another time. 

[¿spoom]

The founding fathers, in their amazing combined mindset, knew citizens needed freedom FROM religion as much as freedom OF religion.      

Well thought out and said, on this last point we could have a discussion about but that is for another time.  

Understood, and I appreciate the kind words. BTW, by  freedom FROM religion I meant an "official religion" i.e. Church of England or a Church of America.
A distant relative of mine would probably take exception with my statement, also, as John Adams was a great believer in rule according to a higher law. Rather than rehash it, I've taken pleasure on reading some of the different opinions in correspondence between him and his successor, Thomas Jefferson.

[Robert]

Understood, and I appreciate the kind words. BTW, by  freedom FROM religion I meant an "official religion" i.e. Church of England or a Church of America.

  Church of England just another form of control of the masses.

[¿spoom]

Understood, and I appreciate the kind words. BTW, by  freedom FROM religion I meant an "official religion" i.e. Church of England or a Church of America.

  Church of England just another form of control of the masses.

Very true, though I believe that to be true of organized religion in general. Guess I never should have read Benvenuto Cellini's autobiography as a 20-something

[Gryphon Rider]

Understood, and I appreciate the kind words. BTW, by  freedom FROM religion I meant an "official religion" i.e. Church of England or a Church of America.

  Church of England just another form of control of the masses.

There has been freedom of religion in England since 1829.  The current Church of England is quite diverse in its theology, and has less influence now than it has in several hundred years.  42% of Great Britain's 60 million people are baptised in the Church of England, and only about 10% of those attend regularly.  Hardly "control of the masses."  They don't even control from the top what theology is preached within their own churches.

[Robert]

There has been freedom of religion in England since 1829.  The current Church of England is quite diverse in its theology, and has less influence now than it has in several hundred years.  42% of Great Britain's 60 million people are baptised in the Church of England, and only about 10% of those attend regularly.  Hardly "control of the masses."  They don't even control from the top what theology is preached within their own churches.

   

Yup just like the Catholic church.

Church of England calls on Goverment to ban 'gay cure therapies'

Disgraced sex abuse bishop 'exploited ties to Prince Charles'

Church of England investment fund ranks as top global performer


Your statements about this are just as off as some of your other thoughts and statements.

The Church of England is the established church, meaning, amongst other things:

    the Monarch is the the Supreme Governor of the church (theologically Jesus is the head),
    the Church performs a number of official functions,
    Church and State are linked
 

This is for everyone:

Gee I wonder why the Separation of Church and state was mentioned by some Founding Fathers, could it be they were tired of the state run church in England and wanted not to have the state run or controlled church? That was the meaning, not that the church should not be in the government, this was the very reason the Pilgrims came the US they were actually a rebellious group since the church at that time didn't want you to have or read a bible. As it was then it is now.

Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other. John Adams

The Founding Fathers knew the importance of church in running the state but not the other way around. People left up to their own devices will destroy any situation or government eventually if Christ is not the head. This is what the true meaning of separation of church and state, not a state run institution but a church influenced state where Christ is the head of those in office as well as those being governed. Its an awesome thought and achievable in only one way all of one spirit. All in subjection to Christ and following the moral and ethical dictates of the Bible.

If you take the first lines

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. — That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed.

That is so awesome and that is faith, they stepped out made a country for themselves to practice the bible and allow God to rule and rein and treat each man as the bible says. That is why for 150 years it was the Bible and Gods laws that ruled in the US at the time under the Mayflower Compact.

This is for you Gryphon:

Back to England and the fact there are some charismatic churches that started in England that are not subject to the throne, I guess they got tired of the control also even today.

The theology practiced by the church of England is in line with your beliefs, follow the rules so maybe you will be accepted. Never quite there just do more or follow the rules a bit better then maybe you will be accepted. No power, no life, more rules, less freedom no gifts and the reason you can say that accepting Christ is not all joy. This is the reason the Church is loosing its people and is dead and does not follow the teachings of Christ nor train the people in the gifts.

This is not the God of the Christian or Jewish bible, and not the God I know. We have a better covenant than the Jews and one that has more freedom and we even have gifts and cleansing from our sins.

The theology that is practiced by some in the church is more in line with The Koran rather than the bible.

Here is some more interesting new on the Vatican

 According to EcumenicalNews.com, authors of a new book assert that Vatican astronomers are using both the VATT and the LBT’s LUCIFER instrument to watch for an alien savior.

Tom Horn and Chris Putnam, authors of Exo-Vaticana: Petrus Romanus, Project LUCIFER, and the Vatican’s astonishing plan for the arrival of an alien savior, visited with the Jesuit astronomers at the VATT, including Guy Consolmagno.

[Gryphon Rider]

There has been freedom of religion in England since 1829.  The current Church of England is quite diverse in its theology, and has less influence now than it has in several hundred years.  42% of Great Britain's 60 million people are baptised in the Church of England, and only about 10% of those attend regularly.  Hardly "control of the masses."  They don't even control from the top what theology is preached within their own churches.

 

Yup just like the Catholic church.

Church of England calls on Goverment to ban 'gay cure therapies'

Disgraced sex abuse bishop 'exploited ties to Prince Charles'

Church of England investment fund ranks as top global performer


Your statements about this are just as off as some of your other thoughts and statements.

The Church of England is the established church, meaning, amongst other things:

    the Monarch is the the Supreme Governor of the church (theologically Jesus is the head),
    the Church performs a number of official functions,
    Church and State are linked

Gee I wonder why the Separation of Church and state was mentioned by some Founding Fathers, could it be they were tired of the state run church in England and wanted not to have the state run or controlled church? That was the meaning, not that the church should not be in the government, this was the very reason the Pilgrims came the US they were actually a rebellious group since the church at that time didn't want you to have or read a bible. As it was then it is now.

In fact there are some charismatic churches that started in England that are not subject to the throne, I guess they got tired of the control also.

Robert,

You said:  the "Church of England just another form of control of the masses."
I said:  People in Great Britain (GB) have been free to join (or not join) the Church of England (CoE), or pretty much any other church, since 1829.
I said:  Only roughly 4.2% of people in GB attend the CoE, and the clergy preaching to them don't even agree on what must be preached, therefore the CoE couldn't possibly be used to "control the masses" when 95% of the masses don't even hear (the huge variety of) what the CoE is preaching.
You said:  Your statements are just as off as some of your other thoughts and statements.
You said:  The CoE has money, makes public statements about social policy, does some official stuff with the government, and a disgraced bishop made use of his friends in high places.

NONE of what you said supports your claim that the CoE controls the masses, and NONE of it disproves my claim that it no longer controls the masses.  I'm not saying that it has no influence at all, but that they aren't able to control anything using their influence with the general population.  It would seem that the American religious right and its followers have far more influence in US politics than the CoE and its followers have in English politics.

By the way, there are charismatics within the CoE as well, including Nicky Gumbel, developer of the Alpha course, and there are many non-charismatic evangelicals outside of the CoE, with examples going back to the Protestant Reformation.  There have also been examples of highly-respected, Godly men within the CoE, one example being J. C. Ryle, Bishop of Liverpool in the 19th century.

I suppose next you're going to say that I've made your point.

[Gryphon Rider]

I see you've been editing as I typed my last reply.

This is for you Gryphon:

Back to England and the fact there are some charismatic churches that started in England that are not subject to the throne, I guess they got tired of the control also even today.

The theology practiced by the church of England is in line with your beliefs, follow the rules so maybe you will be accepted. Never quite there just do more or follow the rules a bit better then maybe you will be accepted. No power, no life, more rules, less freedom no gifts and the reason you can say that accepting Christ is not all joy. This is the reason the Church is loosing its people and is dead and does not follow the teachings of Christ nor train the people in the gifts.

It seems you have been having conversations with me that I haven't actually been involved in, with the imaginary Gryphon Rider explaining his theology to you.  You've not only created a straw man, you've given him a straw mind and heart as well.

[Robert]

NONE of what you said supports your claim that the CoE controls the masses, and NONE of it disproves my claim that it no longer controls the masses.  I'm not saying that it has no influence at all, but that they aren't able to control anything using their influence with the general population.  It would seem that the American religious right and its followers have far more influence in US politics than the CoE and its followers have in English politics.

By the way, there are charismatics within the CoE as well, including Nicky Gumbel, developer of the Alpha course, and there are many non-charismatic evangelicals outside of the CoE, with examples going back to the Protestant Reformation.  There have also been examples of highly-respected, Godly men within the CoE, one example being J. C. Ryle, Bishop of Liverpool in the 19th century.

I suppose next you're going to say that I've made your point.

The Roman Catholic church has started a few new churches. They are new different and even move in the gifts but they are not named as Roman Catholic or do the people know that they are associated with the Catholic church. so it is with the Church of England, just because they slap a new face on something if they are getting the money from the church or employed by the church then they are church property.

As for influence, follow this,

 If you teach someone that you have to go to the Pope or to a member of clergy to ask forgiveness then you have adulterated the word of God and exercised control over the church. This is one example of the churches control that is not so obvious but very devious and deceptive. A new believer would think twice about leaving if he or she could not feel free of sin unless they found a member of clergy. So the tithe or money and control would not leave the church.

If I a new believer inspired by God to look for a church and happen to go into one of these churches dont you think that would be influence? As for the amount of churches and the control of the population

Now for the real influence

The parliament is bicameral, consisting of an upper house (the House of Lords) and a lower house (the House of Commons). The Sovereign forms the third component of the legislature (the Queen-in-Parliament). The House of Lords includes two different types of members: the Lords Spiritual, consisting of the most senior bishops of the Church of England, and the Lords Temporal, consisting mainly of life peers, appointed by the Sovereign on the advice of the Prime Minister, and of 92 hereditary peers, sitting either by virtue of holding a royal office, or by being elected by their fellow hereditary peers. Prior to the opening of the Supreme Court in October 2009, the House of Lords also performed a judicial role through the Law Lords.

Maybe you had better rethink what you said.

[Oss]

a man goes to rome, at the vatican he sees a phone booth

the cleric next to the booth says it is to call the Lord God

$100.00 a call,

a week later the man is in Jerusalem

Sees a phone booth next to the Western Wall

10cents a call to speak with the Lord God

Beside it is an old rabbi

He asks him, you know last week I was in Rome and the call to God was $100.00 why is this one 10 cents

Local call says the Rabbi

-----------------
and that says forest gump is all I have to say about that

[Willow]

...
Gee I wonder why the Separation of Church and state was mentioned by some Founding Fathers, ...  

Uh, they didn't.

[Robert]

...
Gee I wonder why the Separation of Church and state was mentioned by some Founding Fathers, ...   

Uh, they didn't.

Jefferson wrote a letter to the Danbury Baptist Association in 1802 to answer a letter from them written in October 1801. ... The letter contains the phrase "wall of separation between church and state," which led to the short-hand for the Establishment Clause that we use today: "Separation of church and state."

Believing with you that religion is a matter which lies solely between Man & his God, that he owes account to none other for his faith or his worship, that the legitimate powers of government reach actions only, & not opinions, I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should "make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof," thus building a wall of separation between Church & State. Adhering to this expression of the supreme will of the nation in behalf of the rights of conscience, I shall see with sincere satisfaction the progress of those sentiments which tend to restore to man all his natural rights, convinced he has no natural right in opposition to his social duties.

I reciprocate your kind prayers for the protection & blessing of the common father and creator of man, and tender you for yourselves & your religious association, assurances of my high respect & esteem.

Th Jefferson
Jan. 1. 1802.

[Robert]

I see you've been editing as I typed my last reply.

It seems you have been having conversations with me that I haven't actually been involved in, with the imaginary Gryphon Rider explaining his theology to you.  You've not only created a straw man, you've given him a straw mind and heart as well.

Well said But this straw man that calls out a fellow brother for supposed errors in what is said publicly. A straw man that compassion seems to be far off but corrections do not. Publicly criticizing a fellow christian for promoting Jesus to the world is the person that I know


Some of your responses:

 Meathead: I'm not sure whether this is supposed to mean that you are being defiled for suggesting Robert feels holier-than-thou, or that he's saying you're right, his words have defiled him, and here are the scriptures to back you up, or maybe simply that since you are talking about a sinful attitude, whether or not he's guilty of it, here is a passage about sinful attitudes

Telling anyone, in any situation, that "most" will be saved is a "morbid consolation".

You seem to be confused about what legalism is.  Legalism is placing excessive importance in following the external requirements of the law, even creating and following new rules that exceed the requirements of the law, all the while ignoring the spirit and intent of the law, which is to love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind, and to love your neighbor as yourself (Matthew 22:37-39).  What legalism is not is correcting a blatant and harmful error publicly asserted by someone claiming to be a follower of Christ.  It does not show compassion for the people reading this error to allow them to assume that it is the truth, especially when the issue concerns their eternal destiny.

Robert, this is regarding your reply in John Schmidt's thread, Difficult day at church yesterday.  I didn't want to distract from the thread supporting John in his grief, but I felt some parts of your message need to be addressed.

[¿spoom]

Understood, and I appreciate the kind words. BTW, by  freedom FROM religion I meant an "official religion" i.e. Church of England or a Church of America.

  Church of England just another form of control of the masses.

Very true, though I believe that to be true of organized religion in general. Guess I never should have read Benvenuto Cellini's autobiography as a 20-something

My apologies if I helped fan any flames, I was thinking of "Church of England just another form of control of the masses" as past tense, relating to the days of Henry the Eighth. In a more general sense, I still I believe it to be true that organized religion is a way to control the masses and believe it or not, I don't even see that as being negative. Being a descendent of Colonists, I often refer to "The King" meaning George III and how he relates to our breaking away from England to form a new nation.
Sadly, everything turns sooooo personal here, with people micro-everything to make mini-points. Boy, I hate it when Shia and Sunni Christians fight  

[Gryphon Rider]

NONE of what you said supports your claim that the CoE controls the masses, and NONE of it disproves my claim that it no longer controls the masses.  I'm not saying that it has no influence at all, but that they aren't able to control anything using their influence with the general population.  It would seem that the American religious right and its followers have far more influence in US politics than the CoE and its followers have in English politics.

By the way, there are charismatics within the CoE as well, including Nicky Gumbel, developer of the Alpha course, and there are many non-charismatic evangelicals outside of the CoE, with examples going back to the Protestant Reformation.  There have also been examples of highly-respected, Godly men within the CoE, one example being J. C. Ryle, Bishop of Liverpool in the 19th century.

I suppose next you're going to say that I've made your point.

The Roman Catholic church has started a few new churches. They are new different and even move in the gifts but they are not named as Roman Catholic or do the people know that they are associated with the Catholic church. so it is with the Church of England, just because they slap a new face on something if they are getting the money from the church or employed by the church then they are church property.

As for influence, follow this,

 If you teach someone that you have to go to the Pope or to a member of clergy to ask forgiveness then you have adulterated the word of God and exercised control over the church. This is one example of the churches control that is not so obvious but very devious and deceptive. A new believer would think twice about leaving if he or she could not feel free of sin unless they found a member of clergy. So the tithe or money and control would not leave the church.

If I a new believer inspired by God to look for a church and happen to go into one of these churches dont you think that would be influence? As for the amount of churches and the control of the population

Now for the real influence

The parliament is bicameral, consisting of an upper house (the House of Lords) and a lower house (the House of Commons). The Sovereign forms the third component of the legislature (the Queen-in-Parliament). The House of Lords includes two different types of members: the Lords Spiritual, consisting of the most senior bishops of the Church of England, and the Lords Temporal, consisting mainly of life peers, appointed by the Sovereign on the advice of the Prime Minister, and of 92 hereditary peers, sitting either by virtue of holding a royal office, or by being elected by their fellow hereditary peers. Prior to the opening of the Supreme Court in October 2009, the House of Lords also performed a judicial role through the Law Lords.

Maybe you had better rethink what you said.

Once again, I have no idea what specifically you think I should rethink, but I would be happy to hear specifics.

I'm getting the impression that you think that whatever you know about the Roman Catholic church also applies to the Church of England, and that they are pretty much one and the same.  Am I getting this right?

The Lords Spiritual (CoE bishops) currently hold 24 of 798 seats in the House of Lords, although they could be as many as 26.  The House of Lords doesn't actually run things, but serves as a check and balance to the House of Commons, much in the same way the Senate does in the Canadian Parliament.

I see you've been editing as I typed my last reply.

It seems you have been having conversations with me that I haven't actually been involved in, with the imaginary Gryphon Rider explaining his theology to you.  You've not only created a straw man, you've given him a straw mind and heart as well.

Well said But this straw man that calls out a fellow brother for supposed errors in what is said publicly. A straw man that compassion seems to be far off but corrections do not. Publicly criticizing a fellow christian for promoting Jesus to the world is the person that I know


Some of your responses:

 Meathead: I'm not sure whether this is supposed to mean that you are being defiled for suggesting Robert feels holier-than-thou, or that he's saying you're right, his words have defiled him, and here are the scriptures to back you up, or maybe simply that since you are talking about a sinful attitude, whether or not he's guilty of it, here is a passage about sinful attitudes

Telling anyone, in any situation, that "most" will be saved is a "morbid consolation".

You seem to be confused about what legalism is.  Legalism is placing excessive importance in following the external requirements of the law, even creating and following new rules that exceed the requirements of the law, all the while ignoring the spirit and intent of the law, which is to love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind, and to love your neighbor as yourself (Matthew 22:37-39).  What legalism is not is correcting a blatant and harmful error publicly asserted by someone claiming to be a follower of Christ.  It does not show compassion for the people reading this error to allow them to assume that it is the truth, especially when the issue concerns their eternal destiny.

Robert, this is regarding your reply in John Schmidt's thread, Difficult day at church yesterday.  I didn't want to distract from the thread supporting John in his grief, but I felt some parts of your message need to be addressed.

"Publicly criticizing a fellow christian for promoting Jesus to the world is the person that I know"

I haven't criticized you for promoting Jesus.  I've criticized your assertions that contradict what Jesus and his Apostles taught.  It's important that the Jesus being promoted is the immutable Son of God revealed, described, and quoted in the Bible, who showed compassion for those who were hurting and/or repentant, but unflinchingly confronted those who distorted God's truth.  Anything we learn through the living relationship we have with the true Son of God will not contradict what has already been revealed in the 66 books of the Bible.

[¿spoom]

a man goes to rome, at the vatican he sees a phone booth

the cleric next to the booth says it is to call the Lord God

$100.00 a call,

a week later the man is in Jerusalem

Sees a phone booth next to the Western Wall

10cents a call to speak with the Lord God

Beside it is an old rabbi

He asks him, you know last week I was in Rome and the call to God was $100.00 why is this one 10 cents

Local call says the Rabbi

-----------------
and that says forest gump is all I have to say about that

Good one  One of my favorite oldies but goodies;

A friend of mine named Larry once told me, around the time of Bill Clinton's 2nd inauguration, "You know, President Clinton and I are buddies."
      I said, "Sure you are."
      He said, "No, really! Just turn on your TV tonight to the Inaugural Ball. You'll see me."
      Sure enough, I turned on the TV that night, and there was Larry, talking to President Clinton with his arm around the guy.

     Not long after, I was talking to Larry about how much I admired Johnny Depp as an actor. Larry said, "Oh, he's a good friend."
      I said, "Noooo!"
      Larry said, "Let's hop in my car". He drove me to the bar Johnny Depp owns, and as we sipped drinks, Johnny happened to walk by, immediately exclaimed "Larry!" and fell into Larry's arms.

     This was getting spooky. Larry seemed to know everyone! I tested Larry with a few more people. We were back in the Bay Area. Larry was telling me he was buddy-buddy with Jerry Brown. We went to a Press Conference at Oakland City Hall, and just before Brown started answering questions, he said "I see my friend Larry out there."

     Same kind of thing happened when we went to Bob Dylan's house and rang the bell. Bob answered the door, said "Larry!" gave my friend a big hug, and invited us in for drinks.

     I was becoming a believer, but then one day we were having another conversation and Larry said something about "my friend the Pope."
      I said, "You can't know him, too!"
      Larry said, "Wanna bet?"
      Larry happens to be very well off, so he flew the both of us to Rome. We took a cab to St. Peters Square. We were standing in the big crowd below the balcony of the Pope's apartment. Larry said, "Excuse me for a little while" and disappeared into the crowd.
      A little while after that, John Paul appeared on the balcony and started blessing people. And who should be up there beside him but...you guessed it!
      I was utterly amazed! I nudged a fellow standing next to me, pointed to the balcony, and said, "Look!"
      The guy shaded his eyes with his palm, peered up at the balcony, turned back to me, and said, "Who's that guy up there with Larry?"

[Robert]

Understood, and I appreciate the kind words. BTW, by  freedom FROM religion I meant an "official religion" i.e. Church of England or a Church of America.

  Church of England just another form of control of the masses.

Very true, though I believe that to be true of organized religion in general. Guess I never should have read Benvenuto Cellini's autobiography as a 20-something

My apologies if I helped fan any flames, I was thinking of "Church of England just another form of control of the masses" as past tense, relating to the days of Henry the Eighth. In a more general sense, I still I believe it to be true that organized religion is a way to control the masses and believe it or not, I don't even see that as being negative. Being a descendent of Colonists, I often refer to "The King" meaning George III and how he relates to our breaking away from England to form a new nation.
Sadly, everything turns sooooo personal here, with people micro-everything to make mini-points. Boy, I hate it when Shia and Sunni Christians fight  

 

Dont worry its a typical day around here, you'll get used to it. Most have been here along time and just like family thats a bit off.

I agree with the church control though in times past but today also. If you start to look at the Vatican today you will see a major power player in world affairs. The ROMAN Catholic church ring a bell?

Hope you stay around, you ride?

[¿spoom]

Three Tibetan monks are meditating in a cave.
      After God Knows how long, one of them opens his eyes.
      "It's raining out there," he says, and he closes his eyes and goes back to his meditation.
      A year passes. A second monk opens his eyes.
      "It's a beautiful, sunny day!" he says, and returns to his closed-eye meditation.
      Another year passes. The third monk opens his eyes.
      "If you two can't stop arguing," he says, "I'm going to find another cave."

[¿spoom]

Understood, and I appreciate the kind words. BTW, by  freedom FROM religion I meant an "official religion" i.e. Church of England or a Church of America.

  Church of England just another form of control of the masses.

Very true, though I believe that to be true of organized religion in general. Guess I never should have read Benvenuto Cellini's autobiography as a 20-something

My apologies if I helped fan any flames, I was thinking of "Church of England just another form of control of the masses" as past tense, relating to the days of Henry the Eighth. In a more general sense, I still I believe it to be true that organized religion is a way to control the masses and believe it or not, I don't even see that as being negative. Being a descendent of Colonists, I often refer to "The King" meaning George III and how he relates to our breaking away from England to form a new nation.
Sadly, everything turns sooooo personal here, with people micro-everything to make mini-points. Boy, I hate it when Shia and Sunni Christians fight  

 

Dont worry its a typical day around here, you'll get used to it. Most have been here along time and just like family thats a bit off.

I agree with the church control though in times past but today also. If you start to look at the Vatican today you will see a major power player in world affairs. The ROMAN Catholic church ring a bell?

Hope you stay around, you ride?

Do I ride? Yeah,


'97 Std #1040. Ordered it in Jan of '96 when they first started letting dealers take deposits, and took delivery with everybody else Memorial Day. Been around since the start of the VOA with Gale & Lamont, Animal & Proctor, the first Inzane, etc. I was there when Moses cut the first piggies and gave us a tablet with the ph. number to order truck stacks Around a year ago, maybe a little more, I got so fed up with the bickering that after blocking a few peeps I gave up and just quit posting.
Figured I'd try again.
Maybe I'm no good at it  

[Robert]

Understood, and I appreciate the kind words. BTW, by  freedom FROM religion I meant an "official religion" i.e. Church of England or a Church of America.

  Church of England just another form of control of the masses.

Very true, though I believe that to be true of organized religion in general. Guess I never should have read Benvenuto Cellini's autobiography as a 20-something

My apologies if I helped fan any flames, I was thinking of "Church of England just another form of control of the masses" as past tense, relating to the days of Henry the Eighth. In a more general sense, I still I believe it to be true that organized religion is a way to control the masses and believe it or not, I don't even see that as being negative. Being a descendent of Colonists, I often refer to "The King" meaning George III and how he relates to our breaking away from England to form a new nation.
Sadly, everything turns sooooo personal here, with people micro-everything to make mini-points. Boy, I hate it when Shia and Sunni Christians fight 

 

Dont worry its a typical day around here, you'll get used to it. Most have been here along time and just like family thats a bit off.

I agree with the church control though in times past but today also. If you start to look at the Vatican today you will see a major power player in world affairs. The ROMAN Catholic church ring a bell?

Hope you stay around, you ride?

Do I ride? Yeah,

http://my.execpc.com/~gwoods/.photos/MiscStuff/spoomflyn3.jpg[/url]
'97 Std #1040. Ordered it Been around since the start of the VOA with Gale & Lamont, Animal & Proctor, the first Inzane, etc. Around a year ago, maybe a little more, I got so fed up with the bickering that after blocking a few peeps I gave up and just quit posting.
Figured I'd try again.
Maybe I'm no good at it 

Wow you need to post more I have been around for about since 05 or so. Love pic  Stay around and post please, dont just lurk.

Bought my first Valk in 03 and then bought the new Valk in 14 and still have both. The first was a 01 left over that was brand new on the floor. Went in 3 times to look at that thing and on the 3rd time it was mine.

[¿spoom]

1997, when my hair was still light brown and I weighed less. Pretty sure I was a lot smarter then, too.

[Robert]

1997, when my hair was still light brown and I weighed less. Pretty sure I was a lot smarter then, too.

Nice bike and actually your probably smarter now. You didn't realize then what you didnt know and now you know that you dont know everything thats wisdom.    Now dont you feel better, I tell myself that all the time 

[Robert]

Three Tibetan monks are meditating in a cave.
      After God Knows how long, one of them opens his eyes.
      "It's raining out there," he says, and he closes his eyes and goes back to his meditation.
      A year passes. A second monk opens his eyes.
      "It's a beautiful, sunny day!" he says, and returns to his closed-eye meditation.
      Another year passes. The third monk opens his eyes.
      "If you two can't stop arguing," he says, "I'm going to find another cave."

 A Priest, a Minister, and a Rabbi are on a fishing trip. The Rabbi says he wants a drink, so he walks off the boat, across the water, and grabs the drink. A few minutes later, the Minister wants a drink too, and also walks across the water. The priest thinks to himself 'If God lets them walk on water, he'll let me too, and leaves the boat. The priest sinks like a stone into the lake. The Rabbi turns to the Minister and says "guess he didn't know where the stepping stones were."

[¿spoom]

I like Oss' one about calling God for 10¢ or $10. I lived in NY as a boy, just outside the City from around 1959 to '66. Being brought up Methodist, I was a minority. Everybody's name ended in stein, son, man or a precious metal. My neighbor was Mr. Goldman, our landlady upstairs was Mrs. Katz. I knew a bagel from a hard roll and everybody knew somebody who had "such a deal" if only you'd asked them earlier. At least half my school chums had a Hanukkah Bush instead of a Christmas Tree, and we all got along. What I really miss is the Yiddish/jewish slang and humor. This one's for Oss;

Two Jewish fellows, Mo and Manny, are walking down the street. They pass a Baptist church. The sign in the glass marquee says:
                                           
                                    COME IN AND CONVERT!
                              WE'LL GIVE YOU $500, ON THE SPOT!

     Mo says to Manny, "Wait for me a minute, I'm gonna try that."
      Manny waits for about fifteen minutes out on the sidewalk, and then he sees Mo coming back out the church door.
      "Well?" says Manny. "Did you get the money?"
     "Is that all you people think about?" replies Mo.
 

[Oss]

there used to be a thread called the joke thread

Hey Serk  u know what 2 do

[¿spoom]

there used to be a thread called the joke thread

Such a deal!