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Author Topic: Help with hydrolock  (Read 1500 times)
redwing24
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Posts: 4


Raleigh NC


« on: August 21, 2020, 07:49:17 AM »

I have a 2000 interstate, she Will hydrolock when I put it on the side stand.  I have rebuilt the carbs three times, new tank gas switch and two different sets of float pins. I have verified the gas switch is not letting gas flow without a vacumm on the switch.  But I do keep the switch in off position when motor is not running. If I keep the bike on the lift it does not hydrolock. It also only fills the cylinders on the side stand side. The only thing I know to do now is to put New floats in the carbs on the side stand side. IT seems the pressure of the gas in the lines is pushing the floats up allowing gas to flow into the cylinders.  Any help would be great.

Steven Lewis
2000 Interstate
Garner NC
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Steve Lewis
Raleigh NC
2000 Valkyrie Interstate
2001 GL1800
Bighead
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Posts: 8654


Madison Alabama


« Reply #1 on: August 21, 2020, 08:25:40 AM »

Turn the petcock off and let it idle until it dies. If it doesn’t die there is a leak somewhere has the Hydrolock caused any damage? What is it doing as in Hydrolock? Do you have to remove the sparklers and purge fuel from the cylinders?
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1997 Bumble Bee
1999 Interstate (sold)
2016 Wing
The emperor has no clothes
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Posts: 29945


« Reply #2 on: August 21, 2020, 09:39:35 AM »

If you are having this problem after all you have done, I would definitely put in new floats and needles. I'd also spring for an electric fuel shutoff.
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recman25
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Posts: 58

Tucson, AZ


« Reply #3 on: August 21, 2020, 01:01:01 PM »

Turn the petcock off and let it idle until it dies. If it doesn’t die there is a leak somewhere has the Hydrolock caused any damage? What is it doing as in Hydrolock? Do you have to remove the sparklers and purge fuel from the cylinders?

For what its worth, it takes a loooong time at idle before it "runs out of gas". I'll usually close it off about a half mile before I pull into my garage
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Dan
  1999 Valkyrie Interstate
  Tucson, AZ  formerly Jersey Shore
Ricky-D
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Posts: 5031


South Carolina midlands


« Reply #4 on: August 21, 2020, 01:01:55 PM »

It could be that the technique you are employing to check these things is faulty.

And I would also say that the petcock you are using is most certainly suspect.

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2000_Valkyrie_Interstate
gordonv
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Posts: 5760


VRCC # 31419

Richmond BC


« Reply #5 on: August 21, 2020, 04:58:34 PM »

It is thought by some that there is enough fuel in the fuel line to cause a hydro lock alone.

If you are correct, and the petcock is turning off, and fuel is still making it into the cylinder, then yes, you need to replace your floats.
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1999 Black with custom paint IS

Madmike
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Posts: 837


Campbell River BC, Canada


« Reply #6 on: August 23, 2020, 09:23:16 AM »

I would think that you will get all the fuel in the line to the tank, the right bank fuel rail and most of the left bank fuel rail when you are sitting on the side stand. 

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Ricky-D
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Posts: 5031


South Carolina midlands


« Reply #7 on: August 23, 2020, 09:56:27 AM »

There is no one who has done a definitive study on this issue.

namely:

1.  Is there enough gasoline in the line to cause a hydrolock situation?

2.  With 6 fuel lines, how many lines would empty into one carburetor?

3.  If fuel would indeed empty into a carburetor, would it be different because of where the carburetor is located?

4.  Exactly how much fuel would be needed in the cylinder to cause a hydrolock situation?


There's been a lot of conjecture by so called "experts" in the forum but it's what it is.  conjecture

Myself, I believe there will never be a hydrolock situation if the fuel is blocked at the petcock.

And that too, is an exercise in futility, because no one has actually performed a properly based test to determine if the fuel is totally and completely blocked off.

It's the technique, and that's what is lacking in most all self constructed trials as to the testing of the functionality of the petcock.

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2000_Valkyrie_Interstate
clanky
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Posts: 70


« Reply #8 on: August 28, 2020, 01:24:27 PM »

In the end the carburetor allows fuel into the cylinder.  After 17 years my 98 standard suffered a hydrolock. (I was saved by this website discussions and recognized it for what it was)  I never used the manual shut off valve that whole time trusting the vacuum actuated valve.
I rebuilt the carbs installed all new floats, seals, needle valve ect ect and problem went away.
The head pressure from the tank is NOT high enough to force the needle valve open on a good float/needle valve set up.
The fuel shut off valve is just an insurance device in case one's carburetor floats and/or needle valves aren't functioning correctly.
Yes I was lucky to not have a problem in the first 17 years.  Now I'll probably just rebuild the carbs every ten years instead of every 17.
My two cents .
Clanky
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CoreyP
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Posts: 476


Bluffton, SC


« Reply #9 on: August 29, 2020, 08:33:04 PM »

There is a lot of fuel from the petcock to the actual cylinders. I know this because I read on here that hydro lock could be a problem so when I first got the bike I turned off the gas every time I shut off the bike.  I would forget and I was probably getting close to a mile away from house before the bike started running out of gas and I would turn the petcock on real fast. I'll go measure the distance just because I know exactly where I would start running out. Same spot every time. 

End result is, I don't turn the gas off any more because I think that I would have hydro lock if I was going to have it whether I turned the gas off or not. Seems to be enough gas in the lines to cause hydro lock but with out the gas tank involved you would have less pressure on the gas.

I would guess the floats are the problem. ????
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Chrisj CMA
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Crestview (Panhandle) Florida


« Reply #10 on: August 30, 2020, 07:28:18 AM »

In the end the carburetor allows fuel into the cylinder.  After 17 years my 98 standard suffered a hydrolock. (I was saved by this website discussions and recognized it for what it was)  I never used the manual shut off valve that whole time trusting the vacuum actuated valve.
I rebuilt the carbs installed all new floats, seals, needle valve ect ect and problem went away.
The head pressure from the tank is NOT high enough to force the needle valve open on a good float/needle valve set up.
The fuel shut off valve is just an insurance device in case one's carburetor floats and/or needle valves aren't functioning correctly.
Yes I was lucky to not have a problem in the first 17 years.  Now I'll probably just rebuild the carbs every ten years instead of every 17.
My two cents .
Clanky

You bring up a good point that I have pondered lately. My Valkyrie is a 97. I have had it for over 18 years. Never a problem with carbs or hydrolock. I did change to a Pingel years ago.

So I was wondering what the life of those plastic floats is. I really don’t want to take the carbs out for no reason but on the other hand I’m sure there would be the opportunity to clean something I can’t get to.

If I do take the carbs out I suppose I should change the fuel rail O-rings even though there’s never been a problem ???

Would it be wise to just do it soon or should I wait until there is a problem.  
« Last Edit: August 30, 2020, 07:29:50 AM by Chrisj CMA » Logged
gordonv
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Posts: 5760


VRCC # 31419

Richmond BC


« Reply #11 on: August 30, 2020, 07:51:15 AM »

Would it be wise to just do it soon or should I wait until there is a problem.  

For me, the problem is not knowing what a hydro lock is when it happens. When you get that clunk, and hit the starter a second time not knowing what that noise is. For me, THAT is the problem.

Since you know what a hydro lock is and the sound, there is no worry of damage. No one has reported damage yet from that initial clunk, only when they try a second time and shear the gears off.

So wait till it needs something, before going ahead with it. Remember that the earth moon sun and planets all need to be aligned before the cylinder fills with fuel, and it's all a crap shoot, along with the floats.
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1999 Black with custom paint IS

Madmike
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Posts: 837


Campbell River BC, Canada


« Reply #12 on: August 30, 2020, 11:06:25 AM »

There is a lot of fuel from the petcock to the actual cylinders. I know this because I read on here that hydro lock could be a problem so when I first got the bike I turned off the gas every time I shut off the bike.  I would forget and I was probably getting close to a mile away from house before the bike started running out of gas and I would turn the petcock on real fast. I'll go measure the distance just because I know exactly where I would start running out. Same spot every time. 

End result is, I don't turn the gas off any more because I think that I would have hydro lock if I was going to have it whether I turned the gas off or not. Seems to be enough gas in the lines to cause hydro lock but with out the gas tank involved you would have less pressure on the gas.

I would guess the floats are the problem. ????

Someone made a great point about fuel line leakage etc. just a while ago.  If the petcock is good (actually shuts off) and it is closed the fuelin the line should be held there  - remember when you were a kid an would suck on the straw and then put your tongue on the end and the liquid would hold in the straw??  As long as air can't get in the gas in the fuel line should hang there. 

Perhaps the "proverbial" side stand low side fill is created when you have two bad float valves one on the high side and one on the low side??  Air COULD get in via the high side from the bowl vent then past the float valve and allow the fuel to run out the low side.

Hydo= hydraulic = liquid, the "lock" is created because liquids for the most part will not compress under pressure - opposed to gases.  The "clunk is when the engine comes up against the liquid in the cylinder with both valves closed (compression stroke) following the intake stroke when the intake valve is opened and the will allow any fuel that has been dripping from the overfilled carb bowl into the cylinder.

Maximum cylinder volume is 253CC., compression ratio is 9.8:1 so it closes down to 25.8CC =1.74 US table spoons (1.45 Imperial tablespoons for the Canadians and Brits).  This is the amount of fuel it takes to fill the cylinder at TDC, so basically 2 tablespoons, less than an ounce (the small US ones) will lock the engine.

So "if" the stars line up.  AND you have a source of fuel when the engine is stopped - perhaps an unsealed petcock.  One or more float valves that for some reason are not sealing and stopping flow into the carb bowl - bad float, buildup on valve seat, worn seal, sticky needle or some other phenomenon.  You are a candidate for the expense of hydraulic lock.

Other factors such as use and whether the bike has been laid up for an extended period of time, storage practises, source of fuel and cleanliness, ethanol is a bitch, etc. can all come into play.

I personally have been lucky and caught it twice before causing any real damage.  This spring I started mybike after a 4 year layup and had poor float valve seating on 3 carbs intermittently.  I finally got them to seal after have one bowls off several times with the carbs out.  Cleaned the jets and float valves and then had a bowl leak.  Used an elevated full source to put more head pressure on the float valves and eventually got confidence in them.  Been running cleaner with my gas and it seems to be smoothing out.

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CoreyP
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Posts: 476


Bluffton, SC


« Reply #13 on: August 30, 2020, 08:59:35 PM »

You could have a small leak in the fuel lines somewhere that let air in the lines which then would allow the fuel to flow. I'm just surprised that hydro lock seemed to be a problem when these bikes were pretty new.  Once you hit 20 years or so rubber parts wear out. Doesn't surprise me people are getting various problems from age. 

I have never run into a hydro locked bike except for trail bikes that ended up in too much water. I have had it happen with a lawn tractor. Tractor simply needed a carb clean out and new gaskets. The trail bikes were hydro locked from water going in the intake, nothing to do with fuel.   
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