I'm against Trump...but I have a problem with this

[Alien]

Catholics are being told that they cannot be true to their faith and support Trump.

https://networklobby.org/news/catholic-lobby-catholics-cannot-vote-for-donald-trump/

While I am not a Trump supporter, I have a serious problem with any religion holding people's faith hostage and dictating how they must vote.  Thoughts?

Ride Safe,

Alien

[Jersey mike]

Well from reading the article, it certainly doesn’t come from what I (as a Catholic) consider to be a Catholic point of view.

This excerpt from the article is particularly strange;

“ Pope Francis has been clear about the sacred issues that Catholics and all people of good will are called to prioritize. These include protecting people in poverty, the elderly, and migrants and rejecting racism. Donald Trump does not share these values or act on these principles. In a word, President Trump promotes racism. This evil cannot be ignored. Once again I hear Pope Francis’s words: “We cannot tolerate or turn a blind eye to racism and exclusion in any form and yet claim to defend the sacredness of every human life.” Dismantling racism in our country must be a foundational part of any pro-life agenda. President Trump’s attitudes and policies are contradictory to this holy effort.”

Donald Trump is against abortion, is for care of the elderly, is trying to help those in poverty by helping the business sector grow to create jobs and encourages immigration through the proper legal channels.

As far as racism goes, he’s constantly being labeled as a racist and accused of racism but there’s nothing to support those claims except what I consider to be distorted and sometimes fabricated accusations along with vivid imaginations.

Going back to “immigration” I’m assuming some of that may revolve around the wall being built but if memory serves correct, Vatican City (where The Pope lives) is a sovereign nation unto itself and is protected by a wall.

Basically I don’t put much credibility to this article.

Here’s an excerpt from an article with an example of The President being accused of racism but with no actual facts or specifics;

https://www.nj.com/opinion/2020/08/a-final-call-for-republicans-to-bail-on-trump-moran.html

“ But it’s gratifying to see that the resistance lives, that there is a line many Republicans will not cross, a standard of decency that is worth defending even if it puts a political career at risk. These Republicans want low taxes and conservative judges, but not if it means they have to embrace a man who has spent four years fanning hatred and racism, undermining the rule of law, endangering our election, ignoring the climate catastrophe, and answering the Covid crisis with quackery and willful negligence.”

[cookiedough]

does not surprise me one bit.  Some of the older folks much older than most of us who are devote old school Catholic are brainwashed.    For example,  my wife's grandma/pa who have long passed in the late 1990's who went to church every single day of their life told my wife's mom that we would burn in hell for not following so-called 'catholic' ways and I was not catholic either and my wife has not gone to church disgruntling being forced growing up brainwashed Catholic  until in her late teen years having a rough childhood raised by her grandparents for her mom had to work since her Dad passed age 5 or so due to a very rare disease no one knows about still today.  My wife told me her Dad had to become CAtholic to marry her mom since her mom is also devote Catholic.   

Not knocking any religion since religion is not in my thoughts much at all, but to say such a horrid thing due to what they as Catholics believe in is called brainwashing to me.   Believe what you want to believe in but do NOT try to convert others into their way of thinking.  I will leave it at that.

[Robert]

Trump must really be a threat to the one world order and they are trying everything they can to stop him.

If for no other reason this is why you should vote for Trump.

The Pope and the Catholic church, I feel do not represent Catholics as people. Its hard to say what is happening to the Church without offending Catholics but the top of the church is totally corrupted. Most will not look or question the authority at the top.

Common sense says if Catholics cannot vote for Trump, who is against abortion then the Dems are for full term  abortion along with infanticide so how does voting for them or not voting make sense.

Pope Paul VI's Audience Hall was built in 1971, If you look at the stage in the picture taken at the back you will notice a sculpture at the back of the stage the picture at the bottom is that picture. So the Pope speaks between to fangs of a snake in front of a sculpture that makes you sick to look at.

To many things going on to list but you can do your own research.  

POPE SUMMONS WORLD LEADERS TO SIGN GLOBAL PACT
https://www.facebook.com/dougbatchelor/videos/pope-summons-world-leaders-to-sign-global-pact/439124710282395/

 In his five-minute message he is calling world leaders to Rome May 14, 2020 to establish a "Global Pact" to reeducate the youth of the world regarding, among other things, how to save the planet. He references his 2015 encyclical on climate change that also addresses Sunday keeping.

[Valkorado]

Bizarre images!  Anyone know what that sculpture is supposed to represent?

[RDAbull]

although I still consider myself catholic, we left the formal church because of this kind of BS.

They can say and do anything they want, but not with my support and money.

[Robert]

The 66-foot by 23-foot sculpture looks scary because it’s meant to – it depicts Jesus rising out of a nuclear bomb crater in the Garden of Gethsemane.

The sculptor Fazzini, who died in 1987, explained his inspiration for the work:

”Suddenly there came to me the idea of Christ preaching peace for 2,000 years, and the place where He prayed for the last time: the olive grove of Gethsemane,” said Fazzini, as reported in his obituary in the New York Times.

”I had the idea of depicting Christ as if He were rising again from the explosion of this large olive grove, peaceful site of His last prayers. Christ rises from this crater torn open by a nuclear bomb; an atrocious explosion, a vortex of violence and energy.”

As a side note the Vatican owns the worlds largest telescope that is also another story on the land it was built on to the naming of it.


Hardly the scriptural or spiritual depiction of a victorious Christ that should be in any church. I find the depiction blasphemous.

[f6john]

Catholics are being told that they cannot be true to their faith and support Trump.

https://networklobby.org/news/catholic-lobby-catholics-cannot-vote-for-donald-trump/

While I am not a Trump supporter, I have a serious problem with any religion holding people's faith hostage and dictating how they must vote.  Thoughts?

Ride Safe,

Alien

So, you’re against Trump. My question is, what or who are you for???

[Serk]

It goes both ways.....

https://www.cnn.com/2019/10/29/politics/joe-biden-denied-communion-south-carolina-catholic-church/index.html

[Robert]

It goes both ways.....

https://www.cnn.com/2019/10/29/politics/joe-biden-denied-communion-south-carolina-catholic-church/index.html

They probably did him a huge favor in denying him communion. Many people take the elements to lightly. The Catholic church though as a rule will not serve communion to anyone outside their congregation.

1Co 11:26  For as often as you eat this bread and drink the cup, you proclaim the Lord's death until He comes.
1Co 11:27  Therefore whoever eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner, shall be guilty of the body and the blood of the Lord.
1Co 11:28  But a man must examine himself, and in so doing he is to eat of the bread and drink of the cup.
1Co 11:29  For he who eats and drinks, eats and drinks judgment to himself if he does not judge the body rightly.
1Co 11:30  For this reason many among you are weak and sick, and a number sleep.
1Co 11:31  But if we judged ourselves rightly, we would not be judged.
1Co 11:32  But when we are judged, we are disciplined by the Lord so that we will not be condemned along with the world.  

[3fan4life]

This has to be an extremely rogue faction of the Catholic church.

The Catholic church is very anti abortion.

Joe Biden and the Democratic party are very pro abortion.

Including supporting late term and partial birth abortion.

[Oss]

What planet are they from Alien  That was rhetorical by the way

I could have sworn the head cardinal in NY (that would be a catholic) came on tv and endorsed Trump last evening


It is difficult for me to imagine any devout catholic in favor of abortion at birth or being kept out of church

In fact the assault on all religions except Islam is the democratic platform

Wonder how many Biden supporters have actually R E A D the platform?

[Willow]

I personally believe a person's religion will and should speak to how he votes.  I'm amused somewhat by folks who claim they have no religion.  Your religion is the source of your values and your purpose.  We all have something that is that source.  Sometimes that is wealth; sometimes it is fame or acceptance; sometimes it is oneself.  We all have something that we worship.

That said, I don't think this particular lobbyist group speaks accurately for Catholic beliefs.  My understanding of all that Catholics stand for is that they could not be true to their faith while voting against the President of the United States.

I'm not a Catholic.  I attend worship services and serve with the Church of the Nazarene.  I am, however, a believer and a devoted follower of Jesus Christ.  Not earthly church or denomination owns my faith.  Their purpose is to assist in a Christian's devoted living but not to dictate or define.

I have checked with my Lord and I will be voting not for Joe Biden but for Donald Trump.

[Serk]

I was curious about this so dug a bit. The "Catholic" group denouncing President Trump, "NETWORK Lobby For Catholic Social Justice" is basically an extremist left wing socialist organization that just puts the word "Catholic" in its' name, not an actual part of the Catholic church.

"NETWORK has been highly critical of every Republican administration since its founding, most notably Presidents George W. Bush and President Donald Trump. The lobby called George W. Bush-era tax cuts “shameful” and “unconscionable,” [9] and opposed any military response to the September 11th attacks."

"The conflict reared to a head in 2012, when the Vatican accused NETWORK of having ““serious doctrinal problems.” It pointed out that it was “focusing its work too much on poverty and economic injustice, while keeping ‘silent’ on abortion and same-sex marriage.”"

https://www.influencewatch.org/non-profit/network-lobby-for-catholic-social-justice/

[Alien]

 Not earthly church or denomination owns my faith.  Their purpose is to assist in a Christian's devoted living but not to dictate or define.

I very much agree.  That is as it should be.  God, after all, gave us free will.  What gives any man the right to interfere with that?

Ride Safe,

Alien

[Sorcerer]

One has to remember that in the USA that there is a separation of church  and state. For good reason. Like it or not. Most every church/ religion in the USA is organized as a 503 (c) (3) and “are absolutely prohibited from directly, or indirectly participating in, or participating, or intervening in, any political campaign on behalf of ( or in opposition to) any candidate for elective public office. Contributions to political campaign funds or public statements of position (verbal or written) made on behalf of the organization in favor of or in opposition to any candidate for public office clearly violates the prohibition against political campaign activity. Violating this position may result in denial or revocation of tax-exempt status and the imposition of certain excise taxes”. There are also some prohibited things such as lobbying fo or against at city, state, or the federal level. Please don’t shoot the messenger.

[98valk]

One has to remember that in the USA that there is a separation of church  and state.

False. that statement is Not in the USC.

[Sorcerer]

One has to remember that in the USA that there is a separation of church  and state.

False. that statement is Not in the USC.
[/quote
Taken directly from the United States IRS web site.

[carolinarider09]

I don't normally quote anything in Wikipedia but I did a search and it was the first reference.  I read the reference and it agrees with my understand of the United States, its documents, founding.

From my early schooling and subsequent readings, it was defined that, unlike England, the newly formed United States would have not specific state established or supported religion. 

However, it was unanimously agreed to there was a Creator (God) and that this Creator endowed men with certain rights that were not to be taken away. Among those (as memory serves) were life and liberty and purist of happiness. 

The notion of separation of church and state was solely based on limiting the government's ability to establish a "state" religion.  Not to say the nation was not founded on the profound belief that there was a Creator (God) and all man who signed the documents creating the United States of America agreed to that concept.  There is a Creator. 

Here is what I found in Wikipedia. 

"Separation of church and state" is a legal principle in the United States, which is related to, but not found within, the First Amendment to the United States Constitution, in the Bill of Rights. The First Amendment reads: "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof..."

[Gryphon Rider]

I am, however, a believer and a devoted follower of Jesus Christ.  Not earthly church or denomination owns my faith.  Their purpose is to assist in a Christian's devoted living but not to dictate or define.

One of the local congregation's responsibilities is, however, to address the sin of their members, encouraging their repentance, and if that doesn't work, to declare them to be outside the fellowship of the congregation.  They are free to define the criteria for disfellowship and for reinstatement.

[markymark640]

This has to be an extremely rogue faction of the Catholic church.

The Catholic church is very anti abortion.

Joe Biden and the Democratic party are very pro abortion.

Including supporting late term and partial birth abortion.

I believe your statement are a bit misleading.

My research of the public record does not support your statement that Joe Biden supports late term and partial birth abortion. On the record, Joe Biden is pro choice and supports the rule of law in this country on this matter including Roe and Casey.

A few other DEMS like Sanders and Warren have made some statements that take a stronger position about abortion rights, but not Biden.

Some Democrats in the presidential race appeared to be somewhat divided on abortion regulations, with some saying they favored no restrictions and others saying they favored limits based on settled law and Supreme Court rulings. They were not all marching in lockstep, as Trump invariably claims. Biden never went that far.

Numerous source have stated that Joe Biden’s position on abortion—that he is personally opposed to abortion but believes it should be legal in most cases—has remained fairly consistent over several decades.

And fact-check the bs blabs of Mike Pence who is blindly repeating the trump lie that Biden supports late-term abortion and partial birth abortions.

And the exact statement made by trump :
“Virtually every Democrat candidate has declared their unlimited support for extreme late-term abortion, ripping babies straight from the mother’s womb, right up until the very moment of birth.”

Which he has repeated dozens of times !!! and has been proven to be total BS !

The truth - Joe Biden has NEVER taken that position. Check the facts !

Every organization that I've checked for fact checking says that is simply NOT a true statement and I see it as nothing more than more of the usual lies and hate spewed by right wing trump supporters that take after trump and lie their back side off based on their hate for Joe Biden and Democratic party.
 

[..]

https://www.npr.org/2020/06/15/876893948/planned-parenthood-backs-biden-seeing-a-life-or-death-election-ahead

[Robert]

The Mythical "Wall of Separation": How a Misused Metaphor Changed Church–State Law, Policy, and Discourse

https://www.heritage.org/political-process/report/the-mythical-wall-separation-how-misused-metaphor-changed-church-state-law


The "high and impregnable" wall central to the past 50 years of church-state jurisprudence is not Jefferson's wall; rather, it is the wall that Black--Justice Hugo Black--built in 1947 in Everson v. Board of Education.

The differences between the two walls are suggested by Jefferson's record as a public official in both Virginia and the nation, which shows that he initiated practices and implemented policies inconsistent with Justice Black's and the modern Supreme Court's "high and impregnable" wall of separation. Even among the metaphor's proponents, this has generated much debate concerning the proper dimensions of the wall. Whereas Jefferson's wall expressly separated the institutions of church and state, the Court's wall, more expansively, separates religion and all civil government.

Jefferson's wall separated church and the federal government only. By incorporating the First Amendment non-establishment provision into the due process clause of the Fourteenth Amendment, Black's wall separates religion and civil government at all levels--federal, state, and local.

By extending its prohibitions to state and local jurisdictions, Black turned the First Amendment, as ratified in 1791, on its head. A barrier originally designed, as a matter of federalism, to separate the national and state governments, and thereby to preserve state jurisdiction in matters pertaining to religion, was transformed into an instrument of the federal judiciary to invalidate policies and programs of state and local authorities. As the normative constitutional rule applicable to all relationships between religion and the civil state, the wall that Black built has become the defining structure of a putatively secular polity.

Hugo Black
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hugo_Black

[3fan4life]

This has to be an extremely rogue faction of the Catholic church.

The Catholic church is very anti abortion.

Joe Biden and the Democratic party are very pro abortion.

Including supporting late term and partial birth abortion.

I believe your statement are a bit misleading.

My research of the public record does not support your statement that Joe Biden supports late term and partial birth abortion. On the record, Joe Biden is pro choice and supports the rule of law in this country on this matter including Roe and Casey.

A few other DEMS like Sanders and Warren have made some statements that take a stronger position about abortion rights, but not Biden.

Some Democrats in the presidential race appeared to be somewhat divided on abortion regulations, with some saying they favored no restrictions and others saying they favored limits based on settled law and Supreme Court rulings. They were not all marching in lockstep, as Trump invariably claims. Biden never went that far.

Numerous source have stated that Joe Biden’s position on abortion—that he is personally opposed to abortion but believes it should be legal in most cases—has remained fairly consistent over several decades.

And fact-check the bs blabs of Mike Pence who is blindly repeating the trump lie that Biden supports late-term abortion and partial birth abortions.

And the exact statement made by trump :
“Virtually every Democrat candidate has declared their unlimited support for extreme late-term abortion, ripping babies straight from the mother’s womb, right up until the very moment of birth.”

Which he has repeated dozens of times !!! and has been proven to be total BS !

The truth - Joe Biden has NEVER taken that position. Check the facts !

Every organization that I've checked for fact checking says that is simply NOT a true statement and I see it as nothing more than more of the usual lies and hate spewed by right wing trump supporters that take after trump and lie their back side off based on their hate for Joe Biden and Democratic party.
 

He fully supported Obama when he was in favor of partial birth and late term abortions.

A man's actions always speak louder than his words.

[98valk]

Any American who thinks Biden is a “moderate” option on life is mistaken, Johnson makes clear. “When he left the Senate, Vice President Joe Biden had a 100-percent voting record from Planned Parenthood Action Fund and has been clear he is ‘100 percent for sexual and reproductive health.’ And we are going to hold him to that.”



According to Forbes, they’ll have plenty of money to try. Based on financial reports, Planned Parenthood’s action arm is determined to spend triple what it did on Hillary Clinton, putting an astonishing $45 million on the table for the 2020 election. Thanks to the forced contributions from taxpayers — more than a half-billion dollars’ worth — Johnson can invest more in the political process than ever. And while her PAC can’t technically use tax dollars to lobby for Biden, it certainly gives them more flexibility to try.

https://www.lifenews.com/2020/06/16/joe-biden-is-no-moderate-on-abortion-he-had-a-100-planned-parenthood-voting-record/

[markymark640]

This has to be an extremely rogue faction of the Catholic church.

The Catholic church is very anti abortion.

Joe Biden and the Democratic party are very pro abortion.

Including supporting late term and partial birth abortion.

I believe your statement are a bit misleading.

My research of the public record does not support your statement that Joe Biden supports late term and partial birth abortion. On the record, Joe Biden is pro choice and supports the rule of law in this country on this matter including Roe and Casey.

A few other DEMS like Sanders and Warren have made some statements that take a stronger position about abortion rights, but not Biden.

Some Democrats in the presidential race appeared to be somewhat divided on abortion regulations, with some saying they favored no restrictions and others saying they favored limits based on settled law and Supreme Court rulings. They were not all marching in lockstep, as Trump invariably claims. Biden never went that far.

Numerous source have stated that Joe Biden’s position on abortion—that he is personally opposed to abortion but believes it should be legal in most cases—has remained fairly consistent over several decades.

And fact-check the bs blabs of Mike Pence who is blindly repeating the trump lie that Biden supports late-term abortion and partial birth abortions.

And the exact statement made by trump :
“Virtually every Democrat candidate has declared their unlimited support for extreme late-term abortion, ripping babies straight from the mother’s womb, right up until the very moment of birth.”

Which he has repeated dozens of times !!! and has been proven to be total BS !

The truth - Joe Biden has NEVER taken that position. Check the facts !

Every organization that I've checked for fact checking says that is simply NOT a true statement and I see it as nothing more than more of the usual lies and hate spewed by right wing trump supporters that take after trump and lie their back side off based on their hate for Joe Biden and Democratic party.
 

He fully supported Obama when he was in favor of partial birth and late term abortions.

A man's actions always speak louder than his words.

Could you give me any reference I can check that he was in favor of partial birth and late term abortions. Also please tell me what "actions" he took that you are referring to

[Jersey mike]

This has to be an extremely rogue faction of the Catholic church.

The Catholic church is very anti abortion.

Joe Biden and the Democratic party are very pro abortion.

Including supporting late term and partial birth abortion.

I believe your statement are a bit misleading.

My research of the public record does not support your statement that Joe Biden supports late term and partial birth abortion. On the record, Joe Biden is pro choice and supports the rule of law in this country on this matter including Roe and Casey.

A few other DEMS like Sanders and Warren have made some statements that take a stronger position about abortion rights, but not Biden.

Some Democrats in the presidential race appeared to be somewhat divided on abortion regulations, with some saying they favored no restrictions and others saying they favored limits based on settled law and Supreme Court rulings. They were not all marching in lockstep, as Trump invariably claims. Biden never went that far.

Numerous source have stated that Joe Biden’s position on abortion—that he is personally opposed to abortion but believes it should be legal in most cases—has remained fairly consistent over several decades.

And fact-check the bs blabs of Mike Pence who is blindly repeating the trump lie that Biden supports late-term abortion and partial birth abortions.

And the exact statement made by trump :
“Virtually every Democrat candidate has declared their unlimited support for extreme late-term abortion, ripping babies straight from the mother’s womb, right up until the very moment of birth.”

Which he has repeated dozens of times !!! and has been proven to be total BS !

The truth - Joe Biden has NEVER taken that position. Check the facts !

Every organization that I've checked for fact checking says that is simply NOT a true statement and I see it as nothing more than more of the usual lies and hate spewed by right wing trump supporters that take after trump and lie their back side off based on their hate for Joe Biden and Democratic party.
 

He fully supported Obama when he was in favor of partial birth and late term abortions.

A man's actions always speak louder than his words.

Could you give me any reference I can check that he was in favor of partial birth and late term abortions. Also please tell me what "actions" he took that you are referring to

https://www.axios.com/biden-flips-support-hyde-amendment-b8ddcc63-0ec9-4140-81bf-06ede4558dc5.html

[markymark640]

This has to be an extremely rogue faction of the Catholic church.

The Catholic church is very anti abortion.

Joe Biden and the Democratic party are very pro abortion.

Including supporting late term and partial birth abortion.

I believe your statement are a bit misleading.

My research of the public record does not support your statement that Joe Biden supports late term and partial birth abortion. On the record, Joe Biden is pro choice and supports the rule of law in this country on this matter including Roe and Casey.

A few other DEMS like Sanders and Warren have made some statements that take a stronger position about abortion rights, but not Biden.

Some Democrats in the presidential race appeared to be somewhat divided on abortion regulations, with some saying they favored no restrictions and others saying they favored limits based on settled law and Supreme Court rulings. They were not all marching in lockstep, as Trump invariably claims. Biden never went that far.

Numerous source have stated that Joe Biden’s position on abortion—that he is personally opposed to abortion but believes it should be legal in most cases—has remained fairly consistent over several decades.

And fact-check the bs blabs of Mike Pence who is blindly repeating the trump lie that Biden supports late-term abortion and partial birth abortions.

And the exact statement made by trump :
“Virtually every Democrat candidate has declared their unlimited support for extreme late-term abortion, ripping babies straight from the mother’s womb, right up until the very moment of birth.”

Which he has repeated dozens of times !!! and has been proven to be total BS !

The truth - Joe Biden has NEVER taken that position. Check the facts !

Every organization that I've checked for fact checking says that is simply NOT a true statement and I see it as nothing more than more of the usual lies and hate spewed by right wing trump supporters that take after trump and lie their back side off based on their hate for Joe Biden and Democratic party.
 

He fully supported Obama when he was in favor of partial birth and late term abortions.

A man's actions always speak louder than his words.

Could you give me any reference I can check that he was in favor of partial birth and late term abortions. Also please tell me what "actions" he took that you are referring to

https://www.axios.com/biden-flips-support-hyde-amendment-b8ddcc63-0ec9-4140-81bf-06ede4558dc5.html

The Hyde Amendment is a legislative provision barring the use of federal funds to pay for abortion except to save the life of the woman, or if the pregnancy arises from incest or rape.

That has absolutely nothing to do with Biden supporting late term or partial birth abortions.

[Jersey mike]

This has to be an extremely rogue faction of the Catholic church.

The Catholic church is very anti abortion.

Joe Biden and the Democratic party are very pro abortion.

Including supporting late term and partial birth abortion.

I believe your statement are a bit misleading.

My research of the public record does not support your statement that Joe Biden supports late term and partial birth abortion. On the record, Joe Biden is pro choice and supports the rule of law in this country on this matter including Roe and Casey.

A few other DEMS like Sanders and Warren have made some statements that take a stronger position about abortion rights, but not Biden.

Some Democrats in the presidential race appeared to be somewhat divided on abortion regulations, with some saying they favored no restrictions and others saying they favored limits based on settled law and Supreme Court rulings. They were not all marching in lockstep, as Trump invariably claims. Biden never went that far.

Numerous source have stated that Joe Biden’s position on abortion—that he is personally opposed to abortion but believes it should be legal in most cases—has remained fairly consistent over several decades.

And fact-check the bs blabs of Mike Pence who is blindly repeating the trump lie that Biden supports late-term abortion and partial birth abortions.

And the exact statement made by trump :
“Virtually every Democrat candidate has declared their unlimited support for extreme late-term abortion, ripping babies straight from the mother’s womb, right up until the very moment of birth.”

Which he has repeated dozens of times !!! and has been proven to be total BS !

The truth - Joe Biden has NEVER taken that position. Check the facts !

Every organization that I've checked for fact checking says that is simply NOT a true statement and I see it as nothing more than more of the usual lies and hate spewed by right wing trump supporters that take after trump and lie their back side off based on their hate for Joe Biden and Democratic party.
 

He fully supported Obama when he was in favor of partial birth and late term abortions.

A man's actions always speak louder than his words.

Could you give me any reference I can check that he was in favor of partial birth and late term abortions. Also please tell me what "actions" he took that you are referring to

https://www.axios.com/biden-flips-support-hyde-amendment-b8ddcc63-0ec9-4140-81bf-06ede4558dc5.html

The Hyde Amendment is a legislative provision barring the use of federal funds to pay for abortion except to save the life of the woman, or if the pregnancy arises from incest or rape.

That has absolutely nothing to do with Biden supporting late term or partial birth abortions.

https://www.mic.com/p/what-exactly-is-bidens-view-on-abortion-a-look-at-his-less-than-consistent-record-22601986

“ Biden's camp pledges that he's up to the task. "Biden will repeal the Hyde Amendment and use executive action to on his first day in office withdraw the Mexico City 'global gag rule' and Donald Trump’s Title X restrictions. And, he will build on the Obama-Biden administration work to fund and protect Planned Parenthood from baseless attacks," Biel wrote in an email to Mic. The Mexico City policy blocks federal funding for non-governmental organizations who support or inform about abortion in any way, from offering referrals or counseling to actually providing the service. Title X restrictions function the same way in the United States, forcing health care clinics serving low-income people to close if they mention abortion.

Biel additionally expanded on the steps Biden plans to take if he wins the nomination, "As president, he will protect the progress we’ve made, codify Roe vs. Wade, and guarantee that access to quality affordable care — including reproductive health care — is a right, not a privilege for everyone no matter their race or zip code."


If you know ANYTHING about Planned Parenthood, you know their history of backroom deals and butchering of babies for the resale of body parts which can be harvested.

[Moonshot_1]

"That has absolutely nothing to do with Biden supporting late term or partial birth abortions."

But he has chosen to be on the team that does.

[Rams]

Topic: I'm against Trump...but I have a problem with this

So am I, I don't really like President Trump (personally speaking) but, my problem is that all the Dems have offered up is a Biden/Harris ticket.   Neither of which I trust any farther than I could throw them.

Rams

[Hook#3287]

Catholics are being told that they cannot be true to their faith and support Trump.

I'm a recovering Catholic, so this does not surprise me at all.

IMO,  hypocrisy and subservient control has always been the Catholic way .

[baldo]

If you know ANYTHING about Planned Parenthood, you know their history of backroom deals and butchering of babies for the resale of body parts which can be harvested.

This is total bullshit. I never get involved in these abortion threads, but this is too egregious to let pass without response.

https://oversight.house.gov/planned-parenthood-fact-v-fiction

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/11/15/us/planned-parenthood-lawsuit-secret-videos.html

https://www.factcheck.org/2015/07/unspinning-the-planned-parenthood-video/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Planned_Parenthood_2015_undercover_videos_controversy

[f6john]

If you know ANYTHING about Planned Parenthood, you know their history of backroom deals and butchering of babies for the resale of body parts which can be harvested.

This is total bullshit. I never get involved in these abortion threads, but this is too egregious to let pass without response.

https://oversight.house.gov/planned-parenthood-fact-v-fiction

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/11/15/us/planned-parenthood-lawsuit-secret-videos.html

https://www.factcheck.org/2015/07/unspinning-the-planned-parenthood-video/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Planned_Parenthood_2015_undercover_videos_controversy

Thanks, for really nothing.

[Robert]

Baldo you are wrong again and its not bs regardless of how the lawyers and media along with planned parenthood tried to spin it.

Planned Parenthood Testimony On Selling Baby Parts Unsealed, New Videos Released
https://www.centerformedicalprogress.org/2020/05/planned-parenthood-testimony-on-selling-baby-parts-unsealed-new-videos-released/

May 26, 2020

The new video release documents the Planned Parenthood officials’ admissions, which came in Planned Parenthood’s own retaliatory lawsuit over the undercover footage and contradict Planned Parenthood’s public claims about both the undercover videos and the abortion provider’s fetal tissue research programs. The testimony was unsealed this spring.

The video shows how Planned Parenthood Federation of America, while under investigation in 2015, told Congress that its Gulf Coast affiliate in Houston had “rebuffed” an undercover proposal to sell fetal livers for $750 per liver and $1600 for liver/thymus pairs. But Planned Parenthood Gulf Coast‘s Senior Director of Abortion Access, Tram Nguyen, testified that she “wanted to move forward with it,” as documented in contemporaneous emails between her and PPGC’s Regional Director Dyann Santos.

Fetal Trafficking Under Oath - Planned Parenthood's Admissions About Baby Parts Sales
https://youtu.be/PgUULMCzm8c

PLANNED PARENTHOOD TESTIMONY ON SELLING BABY PARTS UNSEALED, NEW VIDEOS RELEASED
Planned Parenthood Officials Testified Under Oath About Financial Incentives in Fetal Tissue Research Programs in Abortion Giant's Own Lawsuit

IRVINE, May 26--The Center for Medical Progress, whose undercover videos exposed Planned Parenthood leadership negotiating the harvesting and sale of aborted fetal body parts, released a new video today featuring Planned Parenthood officials' sworn videotaped testimony about the sales.

Video of admittance of their actions and willingness to sell body parts. Its not hearsay but was admitted in court and contradicts the narrative they gave to investigators and congress.

View the documents and testimony here: http://www.centerformedicalprogress.org/fetal-trafficking-under-oath/


This is only part of Planned Parenthood since the money they get from congress is given back to help the dems in elections. Another way to whitewash the money from congress and funnel it back to the dems.

[baldo]

Baldo you are wrong again and its not bs regardless of how the lawyers and media along with planned parenthood tried to spin it.

Planned Parenthood Testimony On Selling Baby Parts Unsealed, New Videos Released
https://www.centerformedicalprogress.org/2020/05/planned-parenthood-testimony-on-selling-baby-parts-unsealed-new-videos-released/

May 26, 2020

The new video release documents the Planned Parenthood officials’ admissions, which came in Planned Parenthood’s own retaliatory lawsuit over the undercover footage and contradict Planned Parenthood’s public claims about both the undercover videos and the abortion provider’s fetal tissue research programs. The testimony was unsealed this spring.

The video shows how Planned Parenthood Federation of America, while under investigation in 2015, told Congress that its Gulf Coast affiliate in Houston had “rebuffed” an undercover proposal to sell fetal livers for $750 per liver and $1600 for liver/thymus pairs. But Planned Parenthood Gulf Coast‘s Senior Director of Abortion Access, Tram Nguyen, testified that she “wanted to move forward with it,” as documented in contemporaneous emails between her and PPGC’s Regional Director Dyann Santos.

Fetal Trafficking Under Oath - Planned Parenthood's Admissions About Baby Parts Sales
https://youtu.be/PgUULMCzm8c

PLANNED PARENTHOOD TESTIMONY ON SELLING BABY PARTS UNSEALED, NEW VIDEOS RELEASED
Planned Parenthood Officials Testified Under Oath About Financial Incentives in Fetal Tissue Research Programs in Abortion Giant's Own Lawsuit

IRVINE, May 26--The Center for Medical Progress, whose undercover videos exposed Planned Parenthood leadership negotiating the harvesting and sale of aborted fetal body parts, released a new video today featuring Planned Parenthood officials' sworn videotaped testimony about the sales.

Video of admittance of their actions and willingness to sell body parts. Its not hearsay but was admitted in court and contradicts the narrative they gave to investigators and congress.

View the documents and testimony here: http://www.centerformedicalprogress.org/fetal-trafficking-under-oath/


This is only part of Planned Parenthood since the money they get from congress is given back to help the dems in elections. Another way to whitewash the money from congress and funnel it back to the dems.

LOL....you just don't get it. Are you really citing Center For Medical Progress ? They're the ones found to be using edited videos in the first place, found to be bullshit. And you're using some 'new' video from them? Did you bother reading the links?

You really can't make this crap up. Clueless.

[markymark640]

This has to be an extremely rogue faction of the Catholic church.

The Catholic church is very anti abortion.

Joe Biden and the Democratic party are very pro abortion.

Including supporting late term and partial birth abortion.

I believe your statement are a bit misleading.

My research of the public record does not support your statement that Joe Biden supports late term and partial birth abortion. On the record, Joe Biden is pro choice and supports the rule of law in this country on this matter including Roe and Casey.

A few other DEMS like Sanders and Warren have made some statements that take a stronger position about abortion rights, but not Biden.

Some Democrats in the presidential race appeared to be somewhat divided on abortion regulations, with some saying they favored no restrictions and others saying they favored limits based on settled law and Supreme Court rulings. They were not all marching in lockstep, as Trump invariably claims. Biden never went that far.

Numerous source have stated that Joe Biden’s position on abortion—that he is personally opposed to abortion but believes it should be legal in most cases—has remained fairly consistent over several decades.

And fact-check the bs blabs of Mike Pence who is blindly repeating the trump lie that Biden supports late-term abortion and partial birth abortions.

And the exact statement made by trump :
“Virtually every Democrat candidate has declared their unlimited support for extreme late-term abortion, ripping babies straight from the mother’s womb, right up until the very moment of birth.”

Which he has repeated dozens of times !!! and has been proven to be total BS !

The truth - Joe Biden has NEVER taken that position. Check the facts !

Every organization that I've checked for fact checking says that is simply NOT a true statement and I see it as nothing more than more of the usual lies and hate spewed by right wing trump supporters that take after trump and lie their back side off based on their hate for Joe Biden and Democratic party.
 

He fully supported Obama when he was in favor of partial birth and late term abortions.

A man's actions always speak louder than his words.

Could you give me any reference I can check that he was in favor of partial birth and late term abortions. Also please tell me what "actions" he took that you are referring to

https://www.axios.com/biden-flips-support-hyde-amendment-b8ddcc63-0ec9-4140-81bf-06ede4558dc5.html

The Hyde Amendment is a legislative provision barring the use of federal funds to pay for abortion except to save the life of the woman, or if the pregnancy arises from incest or rape.

That has absolutely nothing to do with Biden supporting late term or partial birth abortions.

https://www.mic.com/p/what-exactly-is-bidens-view-on-abortion-a-look-at-his-less-than-consistent-record-22601986

“ Biden's camp pledges that he's up to the task. "Biden will repeal the Hyde Amendment and use executive action to on his first day in office withdraw the Mexico City 'global gag rule' and Donald Trump’s Title X restrictions. And, he will build on the Obama-Biden administration work to fund and protect Planned Parenthood from baseless attacks," Biel wrote in an email to Mic. The Mexico City policy blocks federal funding for non-governmental organizations who support or inform about abortion in any way, from offering referrals or counseling to actually providing the service. Title X restrictions function the same way in the United States, forcing health care clinics serving low-income people to close if they mention abortion.

Biel additionally expanded on the steps Biden plans to take if he wins the nomination, "As president, he will protect the progress we’ve made, codify Roe vs. Wade, and guarantee that access to quality affordable care — including reproductive health care — is a right, not a privilege for everyone no matter their race or zip code."


If you know ANYTHING about Planned Parenthood, you know their history of backroom deals and butchering of babies for the resale of body parts which can be harvested.

So you are referring to a 1997 vote

Didn't his position on that change with his Yes vote in 2003 to Prohibit partial-birth.Late terms Abortions ?

[Jersey mike]

This has to be an extremely rogue faction of the Catholic church.

The Catholic church is very anti abortion.

Joe Biden and the Democratic party are very pro abortion.

Including supporting late term and partial birth abortion.

I believe your statement are a bit misleading.

My research of the public record does not support your statement that Joe Biden supports late term and partial birth abortion. On the record, Joe Biden is pro choice and supports the rule of law in this country on this matter including Roe and Casey.

A few other DEMS like Sanders and Warren have made some statements that take a stronger position about abortion rights, but not Biden.

Some Democrats in the presidential race appeared to be somewhat divided on abortion regulations, with some saying they favored no restrictions and others saying they favored limits based on settled law and Supreme Court rulings. They were not all marching in lockstep, as Trump invariably claims. Biden never went that far.

Numerous source have stated that Joe Biden’s position on abortion—that he is personally opposed to abortion but believes it should be legal in most cases—has remained fairly consistent over several decades.

And fact-check the bs blabs of Mike Pence who is blindly repeating the trump lie that Biden supports late-term abortion and partial birth abortions.

And the exact statement made by trump :
“Virtually every Democrat candidate has declared their unlimited support for extreme late-term abortion, ripping babies straight from the mother’s womb, right up until the very moment of birth.”

Which he has repeated dozens of times !!! and has been proven to be total BS !

The truth - Joe Biden has NEVER taken that position. Check the facts !

Every organization that I've checked for fact checking says that is simply NOT a true statement and I see it as nothing more than more of the usual lies and hate spewed by right wing trump supporters that take after trump and lie their back side off based on their hate for Joe Biden and Democratic party.
 

He fully supported Obama when he was in favor of partial birth and late term abortions.

A man's actions always speak louder than his words.

Could you give me any reference I can check that he was in favor of partial birth and late term abortions. Also please tell me what "actions" he took that you are referring to

https://www.axios.com/biden-flips-support-hyde-amendment-b8ddcc63-0ec9-4140-81bf-06ede4558dc5.html

The Hyde Amendment is a legislative provision barring the use of federal funds to pay for abortion except to save the life of the woman, or if the pregnancy arises from incest or rape.

That has absolutely nothing to do with Biden supporting late term or partial birth abortions.

https://www.mic.com/p/what-exactly-is-bidens-view-on-abortion-a-look-at-his-less-than-consistent-record-22601986

“ Biden's camp pledges that he's up to the task. "Biden will repeal the Hyde Amendment and use executive action to on his first day in office withdraw the Mexico City 'global gag rule' and Donald Trump’s Title X restrictions. And, he will build on the Obama-Biden administration work to fund and protect Planned Parenthood from baseless attacks," Biel wrote in an email to Mic. The Mexico City policy blocks federal funding for non-governmental organizations who support or inform about abortion in any way, from offering referrals or counseling to actually providing the service. Title X restrictions function the same way in the United States, forcing health care clinics serving low-income people to close if they mention abortion.

Biel additionally expanded on the steps Biden plans to take if he wins the nomination, "As president, he will protect the progress we’ve made, codify Roe vs. Wade, and guarantee that access to quality affordable care — including reproductive health care — is a right, not a privilege for everyone no matter their race or zip code."


If you know ANYTHING about Planned Parenthood, you know their history of backroom deals and butchering of babies for the resale of body parts which can be harvested.

So you are referring to a 1997 vote

Didn't his position on that change with his Yes vote in 2003 to Prohibit partial-birth.Late terms Abortions ?

His position changes as the political winds direct.

No Federal Funding should go any clinic that encourages and provide abortion. 

If women want to stand up and shout, scream, protest, proclaim how independent, free and have the right to decide for themselves what and when they can do with their bodies then they should live with and reap any rewards as well as suffer any consequences THEY CHOOSE with and for their bodies.

It 2020 I honestly believe society and the medical field has proven what causes pregnancies. 

If you think your cool enough or mature enough or grown up enough to screw, then be cool enough, mature enough and grown up enough to handle your own issues.

A pregnancy is not a mistake. A pregnancy is not an accident. No Federal funding for abortion clinics.


https://www.christianpost.com/news/planned-parenthood-doctors-admit-under-oath-to-altering-abortion-methods-for-intact-organs.html

“Dr. Mary Gatter, who was infamously captured in another 2015 undercover video speaking about needing a "less crunchy" technique to harvest intact organs during an abortion, distinguished in her April 2019 deposition the difference between the words “procedure,” “method,” and “technique.” “

[Robert]

Planned Parenthood Testimony On Selling Baby Parts Unsealed, New Videos Released

[markymark640]

This has to be an extremely rogue faction of the Catholic church.

The Catholic church is very anti abortion.

Joe Biden and the Democratic party are very pro abortion.

Including supporting late term and partial birth abortion.

I believe your statement are a bit misleading.

My research of the public record does not support your statement that Joe Biden supports late term and partial birth abortion. On the record, Joe Biden is pro choice and supports the rule of law in this country on this matter including Roe and Casey.

A few other DEMS like Sanders and Warren have made some statements that take a stronger position about abortion rights, but not Biden.

Some Democrats in the presidential race appeared to be somewhat divided on abortion regulations, with some saying they favored no restrictions and others saying they favored limits based on settled law and Supreme Court rulings. They were not all marching in lockstep, as Trump invariably claims. Biden never went that far.

Numerous source have stated that Joe Biden’s position on abortion—that he is personally opposed to abortion but believes it should be legal in most cases—has remained fairly consistent over several decades.

And fact-check the bs blabs of Mike Pence who is blindly repeating the trump lie that Biden supports late-term abortion and partial birth abortions.

And the exact statement made by trump :
“Virtually every Democrat candidate has declared their unlimited support for extreme late-term abortion, ripping babies straight from the mother’s womb, right up until the very moment of birth.”

Which he has repeated dozens of times !!! and has been proven to be total BS !

The truth - Joe Biden has NEVER taken that position. Check the facts !

Every organization that I've checked for fact checking says that is simply NOT a true statement and I see it as nothing more than more of the usual lies and hate spewed by right wing trump supporters that take after trump and lie their back side off based on their hate for Joe Biden and Democratic party.
 

He fully supported Obama when he was in favor of partial birth and late term abortions.

A man's actions always speak louder than his words.

Could you give me any reference I can check that he was in favor of partial birth and late term abortions. Also please tell me what "actions" he took that you are referring to

https://www.axios.com/biden-flips-support-hyde-amendment-b8ddcc63-0ec9-4140-81bf-06ede4558dc5.html

The Hyde Amendment is a legislative provision barring the use of federal funds to pay for abortion except to save the life of the woman, or if the pregnancy arises from incest or rape.

That has absolutely nothing to do with Biden supporting late term or partial birth abortions.

https://www.mic.com/p/what-exactly-is-bidens-view-on-abortion-a-look-at-his-less-than-consistent-record-22601986

“ Biden's camp pledges that he's up to the task. "Biden will repeal the Hyde Amendment and use executive action to on his first day in office withdraw the Mexico City 'global gag rule' and Donald Trump’s Title X restrictions. And, he will build on the Obama-Biden administration work to fund and protect Planned Parenthood from baseless attacks," Biel wrote in an email to Mic. The Mexico City policy blocks federal funding for non-governmental organizations who support or inform about abortion in any way, from offering referrals or counseling to actually providing the service. Title X restrictions function the same way in the United States, forcing health care clinics serving low-income people to close if they mention abortion.

Biel additionally expanded on the steps Biden plans to take if he wins the nomination, "As president, he will protect the progress we’ve made, codify Roe vs. Wade, and guarantee that access to quality affordable care — including reproductive health care — is a right, not a privilege for everyone no matter their race or zip code."


If you know ANYTHING about Planned Parenthood, you know their history of backroom deals and butchering of babies for the resale of body parts which can be harvested.

So you are referring to a 1997 vote

Didn't his position on that change with his Yes vote in 2003 to Prohibit partial-birth.Late terms Abortions ?

His position changes as the political winds direct.

No Federal Funding should go any clinic that encourages and provide abortion. 

If women want to stand up and shout, scream, protest, proclaim how independent, free and have the right to decide for themselves what and when they can do with their bodies then they should live with and reap any rewards as well as suffer any consequences THEY CHOOSE with and for their bodies.

It 2020 I honestly believe society and the medical field has proven what causes pregnancies. 

If you think your cool enough or mature enough or grown up enough to screw, then be cool enough, mature enough and grown up enough to handle your own issues.

A pregnancy is not a mistake. A pregnancy is not an accident. No Federal funding for abortion clinics.


https://www.christianpost.com/news/planned-parenthood-doctors-admit-under-oath-to-altering-abortion-methods-for-intact-organs.html

“Dr. Mary Gatter, who was infamously captured in another 2015 undercover video speaking about needing a "less crunchy" technique to harvest intact organs during an abortion, distinguished in her April 2019 deposition the difference between the words “procedure,” “method,” and “technique.” “

I just can't agree, or consider you statements on Biden.

He did in fact change his position. ONCE. in 2003. That's about 17 years ago and he has stayed with it.

I think it's wrong to state his position as supporting something he has voted against some time ago.

Alot of public folks have changed their position, based on new information, a deeper understanding, etc.

Even Trump has changed his position on :
- the minimum wage
- taxing hedge fund managers
- a national health care system similar to what Sanders came up with
- immigration, when it comes to H-1B visas
- abortion, Trump publically stated he supported a woman's right to a legal abortion !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
- pro-choice, in 1999 Trump stated to NBC News, "I'm very pro-choice"

I don't understand how you can criticize Biden and say he supports late term and partial birth abortion when he clearly voted against in back in 2003, and yet you don't even mention Trump, who has made who has clearly changed his position after making several very public statements supporting abortions and pro-choice.