Alternator fail

[burple05]

Well, got stranded this Sunday out in the middle of nowhere.  Alternator took a dump on my new to me 2001 Interstate.  Only 23,000 miles on the clock.  No warning except for speedo and tac quit working.  Luckily had 1 bar on the phone and got a text through to my buddy who dropped everything and came with his trailer to pick us up.  Anyway with advise from forum research I contacted the Dude at MARS INC. that rebuilds the alternators.  He informed me he can no longer get parts to fix these.  He explained that nobody can figure out how to keep them from failing.  Something about how fast they accelerate and decelerate twisting something in the alternator that causes it to fail.  Said he thinks it would take some kind of clutch mechanism to slow it down.  Anyway nobody is willing to make whatever part he was talking about so he has none for sale anymore.  I took alternator out last night, what a bitch.  Ended up having to remove the center cover and overflow tank to get it out, plus pull ground strap and hoses out of the way.  I don't know how I'm ever gonna get it all back together correctly.  Took alternator to local rebuild shop this morning they tested it, dead, no output.  Said couldn't fix.  Couldn't get parts for it.  So my question is... What now?  Order a factory orig. Goldwing and clock it $355.95, Valkyrie $527.95 or cheap Chinese nock-off about $150.  Does anybody know anyone else that is a rebuilder that still can repair it or exchange for rebuilt one?  I always follow the advise of this board, it's worked well for me so far.  Thanks for any help my fellow Valkers.

Peace, Ron.

[agrady1995]

Have a friend with a 99' Interstate, and has replaced his about 5 times in the last year because of this issue. Thinking about it, the sudden RPM changes could have been the reason it failed... He said he has been buying the ones that are for the goldwing (Will update specifics when I have it) but that they are made in China, so they keep failing.


My suggestion is to look at your owners manual for the gears/speeds (I think 5th gear is @ 40mph) and drive it like Honda says to. Might last a little longer if you baby it.

[luftkoph]

Seems odd,every part of the alternator is available from Honda,nut,bearings,seals,core(stator),r&r, every single part.

[Madmike]

https://www.dbelectrical.com/search-results/#?%3FMake=HONDA&Vtype=MOTORCYCLE&Year=1997&Enginetype=1520CC&search_return=all

These guys are in Tennessee, the link will get you to the page, there are two outputs available 40A or 90Amp., shown for GW so would need to be clocked I believe.  They show as a supplier on Amazon Canada so you may be able to order from Amazon US, Canadian site says 1 yr warranty.  Whether the rotors stand up or not no idea and reading the comments there seem to be some issues with warranty.

[Bagger John - #3785]

Have a friend with a 99' Interstate, and has replaced his about 5 times in the last year because of this issue.

Which parts are mechanically failing?

My suggestion is to look at your owners manual for the gears/speeds (I think 5th gear is @ 40mph) and drive it like Honda says to. Might last a little longer if you baby it.

Unless I have someone right on my arse who I need to get away from, my shift points are at ~2200RPM (Tourer) or ~2500RPM (I/S) regardless of gear. It's at these engine speeds where the transmission effortlessly and soundlessly moves to the next gear and both were determined empirically.

Low enough in the rev range that the alternator should be okay. But this raises an interesting question: In all the years I've been hanging out on the board, brush or commutator failure has been by far the most common ailment with the GL1500-series alternators. The bearings have been known to become noisy but this isn't a frequent occurrence. What's up with mechanical failures all of a sudden?

FWIW, I replaced the alternator in my '00 Tourer at 36K - more as a preventative measure than anything else and probably could have gotten another 20K out of its OEM brushes before a replacement was due. Haven't experienced a bearing issue with any of the alternators in the 5 Valks I've owned or own.

[The emperor has no clothes]

Well, got stranded this Sunday out in the middle of nowhere.  Alternator took a dump on my new to me 2001 Interstate.  Only 23,000 miles on the clock.  No warning except for speedo and tac quit working.  Luckily had 1 bar on the phone and got a text through to my buddy who dropped everything and came with his trailer to pick us up.  Anyway with advise from forum research I contacted the Dude at MARS INC. that rebuilds the alternators.  He informed me he can no longer get parts to fix these.  He explained that nobody can figure out how to keep them from failing.  Something about how fast they accelerate and decelerate twisting something in the alternator that causes it to fail.  Said he thinks it would take some kind of clutch mechanism to slow it down.  Anyway nobody is willing to make whatever part he was talking about so he has none for sale anymore.  I took alternator out last night, what a bitch.  Ended up having to remove the center cover and overflow tank to get it out, plus pull ground strap and hoses out of the way.  I don't know how I'm ever gonna get it all back together correctly.  Took alternator to local rebuild shop this morning they tested it, dead, no output.  Said couldn't fix.  Couldn't get parts for it.  So my question is... What now?  Order a factory orig. Goldwing and clock it $355.95, Valkyrie $527.95 or cheap Chinese nock-off about $150.  Does anybody know anyone else that is a rebuilder that still can repair it or exchange for rebuilt one?  I always follow the advise of this board, it's worked well for me so far.  Thanks for any help my fellow Valkers.

Peace, Ron.

Some alternator shops can do them, some say they can't. I'm not sure why. But, I know for sure that there is a shop in Amarillo that does. I think a complete rebuild cost me a little over $200. The cheap ones on the Internet are to be avoided in my opinion. Unless you can find a shop nearby that can or will do it, you are best off getting the GoldWing one and clocking it.

[Bagger John - #3785]

I know for sure that there is a shop in Amarillo that does. I think a complete rebuild cost me a little over $200.

Do they accept mail-order jobs? If so...post 'em up.

[The emperor has no clothes]

I know for sure that there is a shop in Amarillo that does. I think a complete rebuild cost me a little over $200.

Do they accept mail-order jobs? If so...post 'em up.

I don't know why they wouldn't. I've forgot their name. Let me look them up. 

[The emperor has no clothes]

B & W Battery Co. They don't have a website. But hopefully this link of them will work.

https://g.co/kgs/R4ad8w

I can't say enough good things of them. They rebuilt mine in about 4 hours, and got me back on my way to Roanoke.

[gordonv]

I think this is a good start.

http://www.valkyrieforum.com/bbs/index.php/topic,107156.0.html

Take the alt apart and check it out. There is a how-to test in the Service Manual. I suspect with that many low miles, it's dirty inside and the brushes aren't moving freely. You can check those too.

But I don't see how anyone could test it to tell you it's working or not, as these need special drives/couplers to turn them.

A set of brushes is only about $7.

[..]

Well poop.

A lot of my riding in north Georgia, western North Carolina and eastern Tennessee is from 2,500 rpm to 5,500 rpm in 3rd and 4th gears.

[Bighead]

Well poop.

A lot of my riding in north Georgia, western North Carolina and eastern Tennessee is from 2,500 rpm to 5,500 rpm in 3rd and 4th gears.

Dont sweat it Paul my ‘97 is still on original with over 120k. My IS alt went out at about 37k. I replaced it with a ‘99 goldwing alt and has been fine since. I don’t own it anymore but know the fella that does.

[..]

Well poop.

A lot of my riding in north Georgia, western North Carolina and eastern Tennessee is from 2,500 rpm to 5,500 rpm in 3rd and 4th gears.

Dont sweat it Paul my ‘97 is still on original with over 120k. My IS alt went out at about 37k. I replaced it with a ‘99 goldwing alt and has been fine since. I don’t own it anymore but know the fella that does.

 

[burple05]

I went ahead and purchased a genuine Honda alternator and new battery, should be here next week.  In answering posts from you guys...  No way I'm gonna ride either of my Valks at recommended "fuel mileage shift points all the time.  These babies were made as muscle cruisers, I"ll use all that power it has .  Alternator shop just put the belt around the drive like a normal pully and spun the crap out of it like they do every alternator for testing.  After getting finally getting alternator out I blew all through it with compressed air, minimal dust came out so I don't think the brushes are just stuck.  My other Valk has 68,000 miles on it with no failures or alternator maintenance what so ever.  Yes parts are showing still available for alternator from Honda.  Did you see the price of those parts?  Very expensive.  I'll probably attempt to pull it apart and see if I can see anything obviously wrong with it.  Maybe call the place in Amarillo suggested and maybe they can rebuild so I'll have a spare.  If anybody else knows of a place to send these alternators for a rebuild please let me know.  Hopefully It'll go back together easier than it came out.  First time is always the hardest for sure.  I'll let you guys know how it goes.  All advice is much appreciated.

Peace, Ron.

[rafalc]

I went ahead and purchased a genuine Honda alternator and new battery, should be here next week.  In answering posts from you guys...  No way I'm gonna ride either of my Valks at recommended "fuel mileage shift points all the time.  These babies were made as muscle cruisers, I"ll use all that power it has .  Alternator shop just put the belt around the drive like a normal pully and spun the poop out of it like they do every alternator for testing.  After getting finally getting alternator out I blew all through it with compressed air, minimal dust came out so I don't think the brushes are just stuck.  My other Valk has 68,000 miles on it with no failures or alternator maintenance what so ever.  Yes parts are showing still available for alternator from Honda.  Did you see the price of those parts?  Very expensive.  I'll probably attempt to pull it apart and see if I can see anything obviously wrong with it.  Maybe call the place in Amarillo suggested and maybe they can rebuild so I'll have a spare.  If anybody else knows of a place to send these alternators for a rebuild please let me know.  Hopefully It'll go back together easier than it came out.  First time is always the hardest for sure.  I'll let you guys know how it goes.  All advice is much appreciated.

Peace, Ron.

Take a look here:

http://www.valkyrieforum.com/bbs/index.php/topic,111239.0.html

Reply #13 shows what I found in my alternator...one of the 3 very brittle wires snapped off. Based on Reply #39 from another member, this seems like a common problem, maybe you will find something similar in your old alt.

[burple05]

A local guy hear has a used compufire 90 amp alternator that has new brushes in it and tested at alternator shop as good.  Are these any good?  Can you use them on our bikes, 90 amp?  It's for a gl1500 wing, can they still be clocked?  Was thinking of grabbing it for a spare.

Peace, Ron.

[Bighead]

Should be fine Ron.

[3W-lonerider]

A local guy hear has a used compufire 90 amp alternator that has new brushes in it and tested at alternator shop as good.  Are these any good?  Can you use them on our bikes, 90 amp?  It's for a gl1500 wing, can they still be clocked?  Was thinking of grabbing it for a spare.

Peace, Ron.

i think the compufire is too long. i remember someone installing one and they had to cut the frame to get it in.

[luftkoph]

A local guy hear has a used compufire 90 amp alternator that has new brushes in it and tested at alternator shop as good.  Are these any good?  Can you use them on our bikes, 90 amp?  It's for a gl1500 wing, can they still be clocked?  Was thinking of grabbing it for a spare.

Peace, Ron.

i think the compufire is too long. i remember someone installing one and they had to cut the frame to get it in.

Cut the frame and cut some of the engine case,or move the engine forward to fit the alternator in then slide the engine back.

[Bighead]

A local guy hear has a used compufire 90 amp alternator that has new brushes in it and tested at alternator shop as good.  Are these any good?  Can you use them on our bikes, 90 amp?  It's for a gl1500 wing, can they still be clocked?  Was thinking of grabbing it for a spare.

Peace, Ron.

i think the compufire is too long. i remember someone installing one and they had to cut the frame to get it in.

Cut the frame and cut some of the engine case,or move the engine forward to fit the alternator in then slide the engine back.

If this is the case it is not an alt made to work on the Valk.

[burple05]

So,

Has anybody hear actually installed a compufire Goldwing alternator in their Valk?  I know they are a popular brand out there, Even more expensive than the Honda ones.  Notch the frame, move the engine forward, Ha, Ha, Ha.  That's funny stuff right there.   Seriously guys, anybody?

Peace, Ron.

[vanagon40]

MarkT installed a compufire (not sure if it is the same alternator you are asking about) on a Valkyrie and provided a how-to on his website. He did cut away a small section of the bike frame.

[old2soon]

          Far as the compufire alt goes MarkT should respond near anytime. My replacement New alt came from LALectrical. VERY Happy with it and a bit less than O E M alt. Believe MarkT had the entire tutorial on that posted in the tech page. And as I recall he did indeed modify the frame. RIDE SAFE.

[Six-Cylinder Hooligan]

Hey Ron, I put a cheap aftermarket alternator in my Interstate over 4 years (and 70k miles) ago. Ordered it off Amazon. It was meant for a Goldwing so I had to "clock" it. It still put out 14.4 vdc. When the time comes, I'll most likely go this route again with an aftermarket unit.

Cheers!
-Art

[redgoldwing]

What is "clocking"?

[Bighead]

What is "clocking"?

If you buy a goldwing alt rather than a valkyrie alt. The GW is much cheaper and puts out more charge. But the face of the GW alt will not bolt up to a Valkyrie u til you remove the three bolts that hold the housing of the alt together and turn the face to match what a valkyrie alt is then it will bolt up correctly. Takes all of 5-10 minutes and saves you a couple hundred $$$.
Put a 1998 GW alt on my IS and it was about half the cost of a Valkyrie alt and the Honda dealer on the road (I was out of town) had one on the shelf but would have had to order one for a valkyrie at neay twicethe price. Easy descion.

[jnicks01]

What is "clocking"?

https://youtu.be/4F4_gh-sEF4

I had the same question until I watched this.  Helpful

[gordonv]

What is "clocking"?

If you buy a goldwing alt rather than a valkyrie alt. The GW is much cheaper and puts out more charge. But the face of the GW alt will not bolt up to a Valkyrie u til you remove the three bolts that hold the housing of the alt together and turn the face to match what a valkyrie alt is then it will bolt up correctly. Takes all of 5-10 minutes and saves you a couple hundred $$$.
Put a 1998 GW alt on my IS and it was about half the cost of a Valkyrie alt and the Honda dealer on the road (I was out of town) had one on the shelf but would have had to order one for a valkyrie at nearly twice the price. Easy decision.

It's those 2 bolts (3rd hidden on the other side) that we are talking about, and housing can rotate 1/3rd rotation. On a used alternator, corrosion/dirt will most likely hole it, but on a new clean alt it moves freely. One my new replacement alt, I separated the halves, and added a little antisieze to hopefully prevent issues in the future (still waiting to ride and get some miles on my cheap China alt).
Picture to go along with the reply,

[hubcapsc]

I bought a nice clean looking OEM alternator from a low
mileage Valkyrie from ebay. I used it to replace the
ratty old alternator on my bike last September, it was
almost at 100,000 miles. So far so good on my "new"
alternator. I've since ordered another "new" one from
ebay that's nice and clean looking.

-Mike

[RNFWP]

Mike,
Are you thinking about rebuilding the "ratty old" alternator?
-Ross (...just sounds like something you'd tackle)

[redgoldwing]

What is "clocking"?

If you buy a goldwing alt rather than a valkyrie alt. The GW is much cheaper and puts out more charge. But the face of the GW alt will not bolt up to a Valkyrie u til you remove the three bolts that hold the housing of the alt together and turn the face to match what a valkyrie alt is then it will bolt up correctly. Takes all of 5-10 minutes and saves you a couple hundred $$$.
Put a 1998 GW alt on my IS and it was about half the cost of a Valkyrie alt and the Honda dealer on the road (I was out of town) had one on the shelf but would have had to order one for a valkyrie at neay twicethe price. Easy descion.

Thanks! I'm familiar with doing this on General Motors car products; the same alternator fits many models but you have to rotate the face to get things like mounting bolts, etc. to line. up. I'd never heard the term clocking before but it's appropriate.

[hubcapsc]

Mike,
Are you thinking about rebuilding the "ratty old" alternator?
-Ross (...just sounds like something you'd tackle)

Haha... before I got it out I imagined I might send it
to be rebuilt. But it is nasty, it practically has barnacles...
With the one I just put on there and the one I have
as a spare (neither has barnacles), I hope not to even think
about alternators for years 

-Mike

[MarkT]

Yes I installed a Compufire 1.3kW (about 90A) alternator advertised as a hi-power replacement for 1500 Gold Wings, in the early 2000's.  Writeup at http://horseapple.com/Valkyrie/Tech_Tips/Compufire/compufire.html  

I was using a LOT of power with my hi-powered headlights I installed for safety, plus heated clothing, hi-powered stereo, air compressor for air shocks & fire truck airhorn, and lots of additional lights.  The OEM 546w wasn't enough power especially at idle, lights would dim.  It was necessary to increase the battery size too - after I boiled an OEM size battery with it.  It was a lot of trouble, not worth it I'm thinking.  Better to manage power use better.  Like go to all-LED lights as I did with Jade.  The big horn was fun and unique but it's overkill - there are other loud horns that don't use so much power, and air shocks are a hassle - frequent leaks & rebuilds needed - there are 444's that cost more but work well.  It's nice to be able to air up tires but there are other soln's to that as well (I have portable compressors now; easy to add a sufficient power socket) - and how often does that happen?  Generally, if I need heated clothing it's not a long time use - I don't take long road trips in cold weather.  All of my bikes are wired for that - as my chargers (and Kubota) are too, to make battery maintenance easy w/o pulling the seat. Basically, it's easier to baby the alternator, carry a spare, use a voltmeter to monitor it, expect it's life between repairs / replacements is around 50k miles.  Mine went out on the Roanoke trip return at about 50k miles but I kinew it as voltage was reducing.  I switched off the lights and music and made it home w/o a road fix.  Now I have several alternator spares and extra brushes.  And plenty of experience changing the alternator, as well as lots of tools on trips.  Anymore I always have a trailer on trips.  Even bring a lift - and of course my permanent installed lift adapter.