The Party of Lincoln...

[Savago]

Has fallen a lot:

[Serk]

Indeed.

[Bret SD]

Indeed.

Hahaha 

Swing and a miss! 

[Savago]

@Serk: you mean as a joke that Lincoln wasn't a republican? Or something else?
 ???

Quote: "With the election of Abraham Lincoln (the first Republican president) in 1860, the Party's success in guiding the Union to victory in the American Civil War, and the Party's role in the abolition of slavery, the Republican Party largely dominated the national political scene until 1932. In 1912, former Republican president Theodore Roosevelt formed the Progressive ("Bull Moose") Party after being rejected by the GOP and ran unsuccessfully as a third-party presidential candidate calling for social reforms."

Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Republican_Party_(United_States)

[Serk]

I've said it before, I'll keep saying it until I'm blue in the face.

The left and the right in this country used to disagree on the best way to get to the same place.

They no longer want to go to the same place.

How much more blood, sweat, tears, anger and angst will it take until we sit down and have a calm, sober, non-violent divorce discussion?

This isn't working out.

It's time to split.

Staying to gether "for the kids" isn't helping the kids!

Time to discuss how to split things up. Us freedom minded folks are holding back the socialists, the socialists are holding back us who value freedom above all. Why keep faking it? It's just causing pain and suffering and isn't working any longer.

Not a Civil War 2, although if we DON'T do it calmly and peacefully I fear that's where we're headed.

[Serk]

@Serk: you mean as a joke that Lincoln wasn't a republican? Or something else?
 ???

That's a plaque on a building at the Northeastern Illinois University.... They claim he was a Democrat. The plaque remains on the building to this day.

[The emperor has no clothes]

I've said it before, I'll keep saying it until I'm blue in the face.

The left and the right in this country used to disagree on the best way to get to the same place.

They no longer want to go to the same place.

How much more blood, sweat, tears, anger and angst will it take until we sit down and have a calm, sober, non-violent divorce discussion?

This isn't working out.

It's time to split.

Staying to gether "for the kids" isn't helping the kids!

Time to discuss how to split things up. Us freedom minded folks are holding back the socialists, the socialists are holding back us who value freedom above all. Why keep faking it? It's just causing pain and suffering and isn't working any longer.

Not a Civil War 2, although if we DON'T do it calmly and peacefully I fear that's where we're headed.

You are wrong. We as a people, as a country, and as a society can and will get thru this and live together.

[Serk]

You are wrong. We as a people, as a country, and as a society can and will get thru this and live together.

Our side will NOT accept socialism or disarmament.

Your side will NOT accept liberty or freedom.

Why do we need to keep fighting this out when it's obvious we have irreconcilable differences?

Both sides would obviously be much happier without the others holding them back.

This doesn't mean we can't still be friends. We're just not willing to live with each other any longer.

[Bret SD]

I've said it before, I'll keep saying it until I'm blue in the face.

The left and the right in this country used to disagree on the best way to get to the same place.

They no longer want to go to the same place.

How much more blood, sweat, tears, anger and angst will it take until we sit down and have a calm, sober, non-violent divorce discussion?

This isn't working out.

It's time to split.

Staying to gether "for the kids" isn't helping the kids!

Time to discuss how to split things up. Us freedom minded folks are holding back the socialists, the socialists are holding back us who value freedom above all. Why keep faking it? It's just causing pain and suffering and isn't working any longer.

Not a Civil War 2, although if we DON'T do it calmly and peacefully I fear that's where we're headed.

You are wrong. We as a people, as a country, and as a society can and will get thru this and live together.

Really? The People now have no voice, votes mean nothing, thanks to those you support. Your comrades created this, and now you attempt to gaslight us?..  I don't think so.. The cheat is too huge and evidence is everywhere, a corrupt court system heard zero evidence, there was zero discovery.. and by extension, zero respect for voters.. so please, spare US the BS.

[The emperor has no clothes]

You are wrong. We as a people, as a country, and as a society can and will get thru this and live together.

Our side will NOT accept socialism or disarmament.

Your side will NOT accept liberty or freedom.

Why do we need to keep fighting this out when it's obvious we have irreconcilable differences?

Both sides would obviously be much happier without the others holding them back.

This doesn't mean we can't still be friends. We're just not willing to live with each other any longer.

Your analogies of marriage are not apt. In a marriage you get to choose your partner. We are a country. We HAVE to find a way to coexist. The first step in that might be you acknowledging that "my side" loves freedom and liberty just as much as you do.

[Serk]

Your analogies of marriage are not apt. In a marriage you get to choose your partner. We are a country. We HAVE to find a way to coexist. The first step in that might be you acknowledging that "my side" loves freedom and liberty just as much as you do.

If "your side" loved freedom and liberty as much as "my side" did, they'd be storming the capitol too...

It's over...

We just need to find a peaceful solution to split and still remain friends.

There's   no need for further animosity or bloodshed.

It's just not working. Let it go.

[The emperor has no clothes]

Your analogies of marriage are not apt. In a marriage you get to choose your partner. We are a country. We HAVE to find a way to coexist. The first step in that might be you acknowledging that "my side" loves freedom and liberty just as much as you do.

If "your side" loved freedom and liberty as much as "my side" did, they'd be storming the capitol too...

It's over...

We just need to find a peaceful solution to split and still remain friends.

There's   no need for further animosity or bloodshed.

It's just not working. Let it go.

If you want to go, then go. I took an oath. I'm standing by it.

[f6gal]

You are wrong. We as a people, as a country, and as a society can and will get thru this and live together.

Our side will NOT accept socialism or disarmament.

Your side will NOT accept liberty or freedom.

Why do we need to keep fighting this out when it's obvious we have irreconcilable differences?

Both sides would obviously be much happier without the others holding them back.

This doesn't mean we can't still be friends. We're just not willing to live with each other any longer.

Your analogies of marriage are not apt. In a marriage you get to choose your partner. We are a country. We HAVE to find a way to coexist. The first step in that might be you acknowledging that "my side" loves freedom and liberty just as much as you do.

And what will you acknowledge or concede?  It always cracks me up that when democrats talk about bipartisanship or working together, they mean for the other side to roll over and agree with them.  

Crap, 1/6/21... I broke the pledge.

[The emperor has no clothes]

You are wrong. We as a people, as a country, and as a society can and will get thru this and live together.

Our side will NOT accept socialism or disarmament.

Your side will NOT accept liberty or freedom.

Why do we need to keep fighting this out when it's obvious we have irreconcilable differences?

Both sides would obviously be much happier without the others holding them back.

This doesn't mean we can't still be friends. We're just not willing to live with each other any longer.

Your analogies of marriage are not apt. In a marriage you get to choose your partner. We are a country. We HAVE to find a way to coexist. The first step in that might be you acknowledging that "my side" loves freedom and liberty just as much as you do.

And what will you acknowledge or concede?  It always cracks me up that when democrats talk about bipartisanship or working together, they mean for the other side to roll over and agree with them.  

Crap, 1/6/21... I broke the pledge.

I never said the other side should roll over. I understand the process.

[Skinhead]

If you want to go, then go. I took an oath. I'm standing by it.

I'm sorry, but I don't believe you are.

[f6gal]

You are wrong. We as a people, as a country, and as a society can and will get thru this and live together.

Our side will NOT accept socialism or disarmament.

Your side will NOT accept liberty or freedom.

Why do we need to keep fighting this out when it's obvious we have irreconcilable differences?

Both sides would obviously be much happier without the others holding them back.

This doesn't mean we can't still be friends. We're just not willing to live with each other any longer.

Your analogies of marriage are not apt. In a marriage you get to choose your partner. We are a country. We HAVE to find a way to coexist. The first step in that might be you acknowledging that "my side" loves freedom and liberty just as much as you do.

And what will you acknowledge or concede?  It always cracks me up that when democrats talk about bipartisanship or working together, they mean for the other side to roll over and agree with them.  

Crap, 1/6/21... I broke the pledge.

I never said the other side should roll over. I understand the process.

Unfortunately, the process has changed for our politicians.  You haven't noticed that all congress/senate votes lately are almost strictly along party lines?  (Well, except for the occasional RINO rolling over).  One side doesn't want to give the other side a "win."  Obama was always spouting bipartisanship, by which he meant for the other side agree with his side.  

[The emperor has no clothes]

You are wrong. We as a people, as a country, and as a society can and will get thru this and live together.

Our side will NOT accept socialism or disarmament.

Your side will NOT accept liberty or freedom.

Why do we need to keep fighting this out when it's obvious we have irreconcilable differences?

Both sides would obviously be much happier without the others holding them back.

This doesn't mean we can't still be friends. We're just not willing to live with each other any longer.

Your analogies of marriage are not apt. In a marriage you get to choose your partner. We are a country. We HAVE to find a way to coexist. The first step in that might be you acknowledging that "my side" loves freedom and liberty just as much as you do.

And what will you acknowledge or concede?  It always cracks me up that when democrats talk about bipartisanship or working together, they mean for the other side to roll over and agree with them.  

Crap, 1/6/21... I broke the pledge.

I never said the other side should roll over. I understand the process.

Unfortunately, the process has changed for our politicians.  You haven't noticed that all congress/senate votes lately are almost strictly along party lines?  (Well, except for the occasional RINO rolling over).  One side doesn't want to give the other side a "win."  Obama was always spouting bipartisanship, by which he meant for the other side agree with his side.  

Maybe things will change now that McConnel will not be majority leader. We will see.

[The emperor has no clothes]

If you want to go, then go. I took an oath. I'm standing by it.

I'm sorry, but I don't believe you are.

Believe what you wish.

[Savago]

@Serk: Things look pretty bleak now, but I remain faithful of the American Democracy and the American people.

The United States of America is a beacon of freedom and justice to humankind, and I truly believe that this country can achieve anything (e.g. Apollo project, Project Manhattan, WWII) if we, the people, work together.

Go back a few years ago and Al Gore could have as VP created chaos and unrest. He gave up because that was best for the USA, even at loss of his own personal interest. He took one for the team America.

The current attacks against the democratic process are driven by fear of change, greed by politicians (e.g. Ted Cruz) and incapacity of the current POTUS to give up on his own personal interest and put the needs of the USA first before his own.

As soon 45th is gone, the healing process can start.

To quote Dr King: "The moral arc of the universe is long but it bends toward justice".

[Willow]

The problem with proposing an amicable division between the conservative and liberal portions of our country is that they're interspersed.  There are large portions of liberal states occupied by conservatives and portions of conservative states occupied by liberals.  Looking at a red and blue counties map of the country pretty well rules out an amicable separation.

[Jess from VA]

Things look pretty bleak now

I agree with this.  But that is all.

As soon 45th is gone, the healing process can start.

Nothing could be further from the truth.  Especially if they come out of the gate like a rabid dog trying to pass all manner of absolute diseased bullsh!t.  Which is exactly what they threaten.

[f6gal]

You are wrong. We as a people, as a country, and as a society can and will get thru this and live together.

Our side will NOT accept socialism or disarmament.

Your side will NOT accept liberty or freedom.

Why do we need to keep fighting this out when it's obvious we have irreconcilable differences?

Both sides would obviously be much happier without the others holding them back.

This doesn't mean we can't still be friends. We're just not willing to live with each other any longer.

Your analogies of marriage are not apt. In a marriage you get to choose your partner. We are a country. We HAVE to find a way to coexist. The first step in that might be you acknowledging that "my side" loves freedom and liberty just as much as you do.

And what will you acknowledge or concede?  It always cracks me up that when democrats talk about bipartisanship or working together, they mean for the other side to roll over and agree with them.  

Crap, 1/6/21... I broke the pledge.

I never said the other side should roll over. I understand the process.

Unfortunately, the process has changed for our politicians.  You haven't noticed that all congress/senate votes lately are almost strictly along party lines?  (Well, except for the occasional RINO rolling over).  One side doesn't want to give the other side a "win."  Obama was always spouting bipartisanship, by which he meant for the other side agree with his side.  

Maybe things will change now that McConnel will not be majority leader. We will see.

Oh, they'll change, no doubt.  I don't anticipate that being a good thing.  For instance, everyone wants to blame McConnell for blocking the $2000 stimulus payment.  But what he was actually blocking was all the pork packed into the bill.  If the house wanted to "work together" and pass a $2000 stimulus, why did they refuse to do a stand alone bill?  McConnell is not the problem.  

[Moonshot_1]

When the Government becomes tyrannical and hopelessly corrupt, the tea goes in the harbor.

An American Tradition.

There are claims of riots in DC today. What was burned? What was destroyed?

Peaceful protester shot and killed by police.

Had this been an actual riot the city would be burned to the ground.

We saw Patriots in DC today. Hundreds of thousands if not, millions facing down tyranny and corruption in what will be hailed as the modern day Boston Tea Party.

The fight for Freedom continues.



 

[Bret SD]

When the Government becomes tyrannical and hopelessly corrupt, the tea goes in the harbor.

An American Tradition.

There are claims of riots in DC today. What was burned? What was destroyed?

Peaceful protester shot and killed by police.

Had this been an actual riot the city would be burned to the ground.

We saw Patriots in DC today. Hundreds of thousands if not, millions facing down tyranny and corruption in what will be hailed as the modern day Boston Tea Party.

The fight for Freedom continues.



 

Very good post

[baldo]

You are wrong. We as a people, as a country, and as a society can and will get thru this and live together.

Our side will NOT accept socialism or disarmament.

Your side will NOT accept liberty or freedom.

Why do we need to keep fighting this out when it's obvious we have irreconcilable differences?

Both sides would obviously be much happier without the others holding them back.

This doesn't mean we can't still be friends. We're just not willing to live with each other any longer.

Your analogies of marriage are not apt. In a marriage you get to choose your partner. We are a country. We HAVE to find a way to coexist. The first step in that might be you acknowledging that "my side" loves freedom and liberty just as much as you do.

And what will you acknowledge or concede?  It always cracks me up that when democrats talk about bipartisanship or working together, they mean for the other side to roll over and agree with them.  

Crap, 1/6/21... I broke the pledge.

I never said the other side should roll over. I understand the process.

Unfortunately, the process has changed for our politicians.  You haven't noticed that all congress/senate votes lately are almost strictly along party lines?  (Well, except for the occasional RINO rolling over).  One side doesn't want to give the other side a "win."  Obama was always spouting bipartisanship, by which he meant for the other side agree with his side.  

Maybe things will change now that McConnel will not be majority leader. We will see.

Oh, they'll change, no doubt.  I don't anticipate that being a good thing.  For instance, everyone wants to blame McConnell for blocking the $2000 stimulus payment.  But what he was actually blocking was all the pork packed into the bill.  If the house wanted to "work together" and pass a $2000 stimulus, why did they refuse to do a stand alone bill?  McConnell is not the problem.  

Is this the bill you're talking about?

https://www.usnews.com/news/politics/articles/2020-12-31/lindsey-graham-calls-for-stand-alone-vote-on-2-000-stimulus-checks

[baldo]

When the Government becomes tyrannical and hopelessly corrupt, the tea goes in the harbor.

An American Tradition.

There are claims of riots in DC today. What was burned? What was destroyed?

Peaceful protester shot and killed by police.

Had this been an actual riot the city would be burned to the ground.

We saw Patriots in DC today. Hundreds of thousands if not, millions facing down tyranny and corruption in what will be hailed as the modern day Boston Tea Party.

The fight for Freedom continues.
 

Is this the peaceful protestor you speak of?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AWMpTHLJXbw

[Bret SD]

When the Government becomes tyrannical and hopelessly corrupt, the tea goes in the harbor.

An American Tradition.

There are claims of riots in DC today. What was burned? What was destroyed?

Peaceful protester shot and killed by police.

Had this been an actual riot the city would be burned to the ground.

We saw Patriots in DC today. Hundreds of thousands if not, millions facing down tyranny and corruption in what will be hailed as the modern day Boston Tea Party.

The fight for Freedom continues.
 

Is this the peaceful protestor you speak of?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AWMpTHLJXbw

Hypocrisy.. after BLM and Antifa burned cities and murdered at will for months..

Aside from that you can't be sure this was actually a Trump supporter now can you?

Do you want to talk numbers and compare videos? Hint.. you'll lose

[baldo]

When the Government becomes tyrannical and hopelessly corrupt, the tea goes in the harbor.

An American Tradition.

There are claims of riots in DC today. What was burned? What was destroyed?

Peaceful protester shot and killed by police.

Had this been an actual riot the city would be burned to the ground.

We saw Patriots in DC today. Hundreds of thousands if not, millions facing down tyranny and corruption in what will be hailed as the modern day Boston Tea Party.

The fight for Freedom continues.
 

Is this the peaceful protestor you speak of?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AWMpTHLJXbw

Hypocrisy.. after BLM and Antifa burned cities and murdered at will for months..

Aside from that you can't be sure this was actually a Trump supporter now can you?

Do you want to talk numbers and compare videos? Hint.. you'll lose

Yes, yes I can be sure she was a supporter.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2021/01/07/ashli-babbitt-dead-capitol-riot/

[Wizzard]

how can you deny when Oss was there and said it was peaceful till Antifa showed up disguised as Trump supporters?

[baldo]

how can you deny when Oss was there and said it was peaceful till Antifa showed up disguised as Trump supporters?

What I want to know is....how do they 'know' they were "antifa"? Did they have name badges or something? And how did any of them make it out alive with all that mayhem?

I'm getting a very strong whiff of bullshit.

[Trynt]

The problem with proposing an amicable division between the conservative and liberal portions of our country is that they're interspersed.  There are large portions of liberal states occupied by conservatives and portions of conservative states occupied by liberals.  Looking at a red and blue counties map of the country pretty well rules out an amicable separation.

Very true! As a "out state" Minnesotan, I'd hate to be lumped in with that s___hole Minneapolis.

[Wizzard]

how can you deny when Oss was there and said it was peaceful till Antifa showed up disguised as Trump supporters?

What I want to know is....how do they 'know' they were "antifa"? Did they have name badges or something? And how did any of them make it out alive with all that mayhem?

I'm getting a very strong whiff of bullshit.

Why don't you ask Oss?

[Robert]

Congress' Approval Drops to 16%, Trump's Steady at 51%

That should be enough that is said as Congress is supposed to be the voice of the people.
'
The video feed of the event shows armed capitol police with assault rifles pointed at the shooter and escorting the girl and those in that area.

If Trump is not in office and there is no investigation into the election fraud or Bidens corruption we have lost the US as we know it.

Staged event not the shooting
https://twitter.com/i/status/1346941327720796166

The actual shooting that shows police with assault rifles escorting her which is so much different than the news stories portray.

https://www.the-sun.com/news/2094547/shooting-capitol-woman-dies-shot-chaos-erupts/

I would say after that all bets are off.

[G-Man]

When the Government becomes tyrannical and hopelessly corrupt, the tea goes in the harbor.

An American Tradition.

There are claims of riots in DC today. What was burned? What was destroyed?

Peaceful protester shot and killed by police.

Had this been an actual riot the city would be burned to the ground.

We saw Patriots in DC today. Hundreds of thousands if not, millions facing down tyranny and corruption in what will be hailed as the modern day Boston Tea Party.

The fight for Freedom continues.
 

Is this the peaceful protestor you speak of?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AWMpTHLJXbw

Hypocrisy.. after BLM and Antifa burned cities and murdered at will for months..

Aside from that you can't be sure this was actually a Trump supporter now can you?

Do you want to talk numbers and compare videos? Hint.. you'll lose

Yes, yes I can be sure she was a supporter.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2021/01/07/ashli-babbitt-dead-capitol-riot/

Still getting your "news" from the the same places that said the previous rioters were white supremicists.

We've all learned that the truth is exactly the opposite and those doing the finger pointing are actually the perpertrators.  What's taking you so long to figure it out?

[Wizzard]

https://www.zerohedge.com/political/questions-about-chaos-capitol-desperately-need-be-answered

[scooperhsd]

If they want a revolution - let's give it to them - they will not like the result and aftermath.

[baldo]

When the Government becomes tyrannical and hopelessly corrupt, the tea goes in the harbor.

An American Tradition.

There are claims of riots in DC today. What was burned? What was destroyed?

Peaceful protester shot and killed by police.

Had this been an actual riot the city would be burned to the ground.

We saw Patriots in DC today. Hundreds of thousands if not, millions facing down tyranny and corruption in what will be hailed as the modern day Boston Tea Party.

The fight for Freedom continues.
 

Is this the peaceful protestor you speak of?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AWMpTHLJXbw

Hypocrisy.. after BLM and Antifa burned cities and murdered at will for months..

Aside from that you can't be sure this was actually a Trump supporter now can you?

Do you want to talk numbers and compare videos? Hint.. you'll lose

Yes, yes I can be sure she was a supporter.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2021/01/07/ashli-babbitt-dead-capitol-riot/

Still getting your "news" from the the same places that said the previous rioters were white supremicists.

We've all learned that the truth is exactly the opposite and those doing the finger pointing are actually the perpertrators.  What's taking you so long to figure it out?

Yeah, pretty sure.

https://twitter.com/VABVOX/status/1347077257303642113/photo/1

https://twitter.com/Ashli_Babbitt?s=09

[Robert]

Antifa being bused in video

https://halturnerradioshow.com/index.php/en/news-page/news-nation/video-antifa-hoodlums-being-bussed-in-against-maga-rally-with-police-escorts

[Serk]

The problem with proposing an amicable division between the conservative and liberal portions of our country is that they're interspersed.  There are large portions of liberal states occupied by conservatives and portions of conservative states occupied by liberals.  Looking at a red and blue counties map of the country pretty well rules out an amicable separation.

I agree it would be very difficult and painful. The real divide in this nation is more of an urban/rural one really.
But what we're doing now isn't working, it's turning brother against brother (Sorry, forgot my Newspeak, sibling against sibling.)
It wouldn't be a quick or painless process, I'm thinking 5 years to work out who gets what, and another 5 year deadline to allow people time to move to the "side" they're more comfortable with.

Not a perfect solution, but the path we're currently on isn't sustainable and is just going to cause more anger, angst, suffering, etc.

Another possibility, and one that I'd really prefer to see, is that we get back to the way the constitution originally set things up, where the very limited power of government was mostly at the state and local level, and the federal government's role was mostly involved in international affairs.

But frankly, I feel that's even less likely than a divorce at this point.

Not saying I have the answer, but something has to change or we're going to implode in a nasty fashion, and I'd much rather see something be done calmly and rationally. Open to ideas!

[The emperor has no clothes]

The problem with proposing an amicable division between the conservative and liberal portions of our country is that they're interspersed.  There are large portions of liberal states occupied by conservatives and portions of conservative states occupied by liberals.  Looking at a red and blue counties map of the country pretty well rules out an amicable separation.

I agree it would be very difficult and painful. The real divide in this nation is more of an urban/rural one really.
But what we're doing now isn't working, it's turning brother against brother (Sorry, forgot my Newspeak, sibling against sibling.)
It wouldn't be a quick or painless process, I'm thinking 5 years to work out who gets what, and another 5 year deadline to allow people time to move to the "side" they're more comfortable with.

Not a perfect solution, but the path we're currently on isn't sustainable and is just going to cause more anger, angst, suffering, etc.

Another possibility, and one that I'd really prefer to see, is that we get back to the way the constitution originally set things up, where the very limited power of government was mostly at the state and local level, and the federal government's role was mostly involved in international affairs.

But frankly, I feel that's even less likely than a divorce at this point.

Not saying I have the answer, but something has to change or we're going to implode in a nasty fashion, and I'd much rather see something be done calmly and rationally. Open to ideas!

There is no viable option for your wishes. If you are truly so dissatisfied with this country there is always the option of moving.