spark plug replacement on SUV

[cookiedough]

WOW,  spark plugs went up as well as labor since last time I had to replace plugs on a vehicle.  18 bucks per NGK iridium plug as OEM (dealer wants 25 each) and 2 hours or tad bit more in labor at 100 on up per hour labor rate.  I can easily do the front 3 myself all in the open,  but the other 3 plugs in back are under the top intake manifold requiring about 10 bolts removed, throttle body, air filter, and about 3-6 hoses and wiring plug ins just to get the intake manifold off to get at the 3 back spark plugs.  I decided to NOT screw it up taking am sure 5 hours or more and take it to local repair shop for 2 hours labor at 90 bucks per hour in hopes they do not mess it up for me.   

So, about 100 bucks on 6 spark plugs and 180 to 200 in labor (2 hours) to get at just the 3 back spark plugs  is easily a 300 dollar job. 

Lucky for me the plugs only need replacing every 100K miles so probably last time needed.  I have noticed at start up cold engine runs a tad bit rough (not smooth) and thinking is the plugs need changing.  Once engine warms up runs smooth like new though.   

I pulled one of the easy front plugs out and can tell is time to change been in there 7 years and 100K miles.   Am hoping this cold start running just a tad bit off (rough) and smooths out after 2-3 minutes of running warming up goes away then.

Dealer wants an unheard of 500 bucks total in labor/plugs to change 6 plugs.  WOW.    So I guess 300 with 100 being plugs alone is not too bad every 100K miles?   I can probably take off the intake manifold seems fairly straight forward if I get all the connectors/bolts off, but the key is putting EVERYTHING back in place as it once was after changing back 3 plugs.  Plus, would take me an entire day am sure knowing my mechanical skills (or lack thereof) and limited hand tools and with my luck breaking something off.

[Robert]

Not a hard job and i would recommend changing the ignition coils on the 3 rear cylinders also. You would hate to do the job twice just because of the coils.

[Rams]

If, the skills, knowledge, talent, tools and experience are even slightly questionable on today's newer vehicles, take it to someone with all the aforementioned requirements.   Some folks are natural techs and can pull off even more tasks without anything going wrong.   Me, I seem to always have parts left over or, it doesn't look quite the same when I'm finished.

Rams  

[Patrick]

After being in for 100K and 7 years the sparklers may not want to come out very easily.

[Robert]

I seem to always have parts left over or, it doesn't look quite the same when I'm finished.
Rams  

Oh you are so wrong everyone has parts left over its just a professional hides them. 

[Rams]

I seem to always have parts left over or, it doesn't look quite the same when I'm finished.
Rams  

Oh you are so wrong everyone has parts left over its just a professional hides them. 

Yep, guilty as charged.   I'm a rookie.

Used to turn wrenches all the time.   No more.   Spent way to much time and money fixing things I broke.

Rams

[cookiedough]

If, the skills, knowledge, talent, tools and experience are even slightly questionable on today's newer vehicles, take it to someone with all the aforementioned requirements.   Some folks are natural techs and can pull off even more tasks without anything going wrong.   Me, I seem to always have parts left over or, it doesn't look quite the same when I'm finished.

Rams  

yah, I figure 200 bucks labor for the 3 hard plugs under manifold is ONCE every 100K miles scheduled maintenance so probably last time needed being done.  Is my SUV but is kid's to drive and once she gets MORE money saved up starting her full time teaching job after graduation college recently,  she can get what she wants on her own dime in few more years.    As far as getting that one front plug out came out very easy not stuck in there at all came right out when I needed to find the NGK laser iridium plug number to order thru autoparts store vs. stealership pricing.    Kids nowadays though need to SAVE their pennies not going out to eat every week and spending money foolishly. 

I am hoping the shop I called ordered the intake manifold gasket as they said they would just in case when pulling it off it is not in tact all the way needing replacing.  50/50 chance on that I said if looks good no rips or worn off any, just leave old one on but probably should just replace the gasket to be safe anyways. 

that is what I am afraid of either having spare parts leftover or more like me breaking something off trying to undo all the hoses and wiring connectors on top of the engine/manifold.   All hand tools as well will take LOTS longer than the 2 hours more like 6 hours for me.

I am always LEERY though of any shop doing repairs on my vehicles have not had good luck at all on past 3 attempts taking vehicles in for service at 3 different shops, one even being a simple oil change got a FREE coupon at HYUNDAI dealer and the tech forgot to put the snap on cover over the oil drain pan back on noticed it that night went back in the next morning asking where cover was.. Other shop never tightened the sway bar links 2 bolts leaving them VERY loose rattling horribly over every bump in the road, chewed their butt out as well.   

[cookiedough]

got it back and seems like the air filter box is loose.  Plus, I looked at the engine air filter and did NOT ask for it to be replaced just checked it could go longer for sure not white but was NOT dirty just off colored.  I just pulled the engine air filter last weekend and the entire box was super tight and very hard to get out the air filter.extremely tight to pull out the engine air filter.    Now,  after unsnapping the top 2 clips, the top/bottom separates very easily and filter comes out way too easy.  It takes 10 seconds to change it out they better ONLY have charged me for the air filter not 10 bucks in labor to install and the carquest air filter part is 16 bucks better not have jacked it up in price to over 20 bucks, especially since did not ask for a new engine air filter replacement nor did they call to tell me it needed one I would have said NO.

Why do shops do MORE than what I tell them to do just change spark plugs and if need be the gasket?  

I should have asked for my old spark plugs back just in case they did not change them?  But, pretty sure they had it off since one hose was kinked under the oil filter canister on top of the engine and I just changed the oil last weekend and that hose was not like that bunched up under the oil filter canister on top of the engine.  The rest seems to be put back together as it should I hope?  

Now watch the bill be for a cabin air filter as well inside under the glove box also a simple change doing it myself?  

I almost forgot,  I better go check to make sure the negative terminal is tight for they had to have the battery disconnected while changing spark plugs since all my pre-set radio stations and interior lighting and door chime and locks had to be reprogrammed all over again thru the steering wheel.

[franco6]

Just get a manual and some tools and just DO IT. lol

[cookiedough]

Just get a manual and some tools and just DO IT. lol

is good enough. I loosened the bottom 2 air box bolts in front and tried moving forward the entire box that 1cm and NO go.  Am sure there is a back bolt or two way in back holding air box in place as well.  When I removed the air inlet in front sliding into the air box there is a triple rubber seal inside so am sure that is plenty good enough sticking out 1cm in front of the air box unlike originally flush.  That air inlet on bottom the outer rubber seal  (1 of 3 ribs) was partially ripped off am sure due to it prior from factory being SO tight inward against plastic air box.  

I called the shop this morning to pay for it was 2 hours labor but did admit they spent at least another 30 to 40 minutes since they forgot to hookup a hose and threw an ERROR code on my dash (service engine soon light am sure came on).   They did not overcharge on the air filter either 14 bucks same price I can get at Carquest.    300 bucks total including plugs is sure better than 500 at a dealer.  

Last week I did 4x's a radiator flush with distilled water running it 15 minutes each and draining/refilling to get over 1/2 of the old 100K antifreeze out of it.  Suppose to be done at 120K but close enough at 105K.  I also did way way overdue to be done at 60K miles  change 4.5 qts. of the 8 qts. tranny fluid with Hyundai factory tranny fluid  $17.50 qt. not wanting to take a chance of using aftermarket Valvoline at 5 bucks qt.  mixing in with the remaining factory 3.5qt. tranny fluid.   They say to give it 20-30K more miles and drain again (another 100 bucks in factory tranny fluid) if not sooner to get some of the older OEM 3.5qts. left in the housing mixed in with the new fluids.   Now that I know how to do it,  the hardest part is removing the entire plastic skid plate which was needed to be removed anyways to also drain the petcock of the radiator.  Dealer wanted 290 bucks to do the tranny fluid which ONLY 4.5qts. can be removed by draining it out as they told me they do with the drain bolt.  100 bucks in tranny fluid and another 190 bucks in labor for removing 2 bolts letting it drain out for 20 minutes or so at a dealer?   However,  MOST all the time for me was removing the 8 bolts holding on the darn skid plate at least for me having to jack  up the car on one side to get underneath at the 3 rear bolts way in back.  The shifting is slightly better but still ONLY when 1st starting up cold out shifting from 2nd to 3rd gear if drive it very slowly speeding up will jerk the tranny shift a smidge enough to notice but has done this for a very long time even when newer.   It only has done it that one 2nd shift when 1st firing up in the morning from 2nd to 3rd gear.  I was hoping the tranny flush would cure that but did not but seemed to help a smidge not as jerky but still not a smooth shift.  Was shocked to find sludge/very fine metal shavings all over the metallic tranny bolt probably should have done it at 60K vs. 104K but that 1st 60K was after only 4 years of driving all hwy miles.

Getting new Cooper Discovery SRX SUV tires going on it tomorrow and my kid should hopefully be all set for another 100K miles or until she gets paid teaching finally after graduating college to get something else she wants.  I swap to snow tires on separate rims from November to mid March on 3 of my vehicles which works out well keeping the OEM nicer rims/new all season tires last a full 7 years useful life as the OEM one's have done since 2014 now down to wear bars.

going to get the extra lifetime warranty on repairs  and lifetime mounting/balancing/rotation of the tires only another 40 bucks total since I just got NEW snow tires this past winter on her same vehicle and 2 to 3 weeks ago the day prior to removing the new snow tires  my daughter got a 1/4" drill bit all the way thru the tread and got lucky was able to patch/plug for 20 bucks.  Next time on these new Coopers the repair will be FREE unless tire needs replacing.  Have had 4 patch/plugs put in 3 vehicles the past 3 years none while I was driving.  3 from both kids and one the wife all 4 lucky enough to be able to patch/plug the hole holding up well.

[Robert]

Just get a manual and some tools and just DO IT. lol

I called the shop this morning to pay for it was 2 hours labor but did admit they spent at least another 30 to 40 minutes since they forgot to hookup a hose and threw an ERROR code on my dash (service engine soon light am sure came on).   They did not overcharge on the air filter either 14 bucks same price I can get at Carquest.    300 bucks total including plugs is sure better than 500 at a dealer.  

I was hoping the tranny flush would cure that but did not but seemed to help a smidge not as jerky but still not a smooth shift.  Was shocked to find sludge/very fine metal shavings all over the metallic tranny bolt probably should have done it at 60K vs. 104K but that 1st 60K was after only 4 years of driving all hwy miles.

Dont go back to that shop, that is normal stuff to be found on the magnet in the trans, and in general a trans flush replaces all the fluid in the trans while a trans service only is a filter and fluid change in the amount you stated. A coolant flush is not really necessary or a good idea given some antifreeze uses calcium as their additive and that falls out and clogs the cooling system. Just add a product such as water wetter and your good to go.

Ethylene Glycol, or any glycol NEVER goes bad its the additives that go bad. Add the additive and your good to go. Unless of course there is rust or visible contaminants in the cooling then you need to find out why.

I think I found a new mechanic for you   

[cookiedough]

weird though,  why then does the OEM Hyundai owners manual state 7 years or 120K for changing antifreeze?  I figured it was time?

Also, even the Hyundai dealers for tranny fluid drain the bottom bolt is all letting out 4.5 qts. about of the 8 or so qts. of tranny fluid at 60K suppose to do it.  There is no way of getting out 8 full qts. all at once unless the Hyundai dealers themselves do not know a thing?  I called 2 dealers and both said the same thing on tranny fluid change.  I looked underneath the Hyundai and is a sealed unit not sure can or should be taken apart.  I did the tranny fluid change myself pretty easy to do after skid plate off should've done it sooner than 104K miles probably more like 60 to 70K?   Is weird though leaving about 3.5 qts. of OLD OIL inside to mix with 4.5 qts. of new oil NEVER getting out all OLD tranny fluid.  I guess that is why they suggest changing 2nd tranny fluid much sooner than another 60K miles.??

[Robert]

Nope not weird at all, most shops do an trans service that is basically a tran filter, clean the pan, new gasket and reassemble and refill. Most trans take 13 qts of oil and that only drains about 3 to 3.5 qts, that is typical.

 Some places do a complete change by a flush, which is basically hook the trans up to a machine that removes All the old oil and refills it. The torque converter takes most of the rest of the oil so its not easy to change and most auto mfgs do not put drain plugs on their converters. Mercedes is one that occasionally does and then you can drain the full 13 qts out.

Trans services on cars with over 40k sometimes is kind of dangerous. Since I have seen trans drained and refilled and have problems afterward. The new fluids are fully synthetic and not so prone to breaking down like the old fluids were. So many manufactures say never change the oil or filter. Life long fill basically. Dexron V is synthetic as an example and so much superior to Dexrons in the past.

If your trans did not have a synthetic in it then I would recommend the synthetic since most make a better fluid that is designed for the car. Mobil One makes synthetic ATF that covers a wide variety of vehicles.  

As for antifreeze i covered that in the last post, ethylene glycol never goes bad, only the additives loose their ability to protect. Put in an additive package that does not contain calcium and your good to go or abrasive in the form of silica and your good to go.

To further make things difficult many cars do not have dipsticks for both the trans and the engine.

[cookiedough]

Robert,  I think I will take you up on that pic of the lady mechanic.  She seems to have a good rear end to take care of difficult situations i would encounter while changing fluids, etc........

I measured what I took out of the tranny bottom plug and put in near exact same amount being 4.5 qts.   The book states put in an extra 700cc's (about 24 ounces) , warm up engine 15 minutes, shift to park/reverse 3x's, then open side plug and if tranny fluid drains out in a steady small stream, good to go.  Does not seem to accurate to me since as you say most vehicles like my 2014 hyundai santa fe has NO tranny dipstick. 

I did by swapping out the radiator fluid with distilled water mostly 4x's some gunky debris  small chunks thru the system not horrible or anything but the PEAK antifreeze is cheap to mix 50/50 afterwards for the 5th swap out.  I wanted to remove the 2 in/out hoses replacing with 2 clear PVC hoses way in back way down low unable to reach in back and flush out the heater core with distilled water but since was not able to reach them (my hands would not clear the engine to firewall area to even get in there), I skipped it.   

NEWER vehicles suck on working on them nowadays NO room and everything so complicated vs. decades ago.