Pulling off final drive and spline for lubing- any advice?

[Peter55]

I need to replace the rear tire on my Interstate and I want to take advantage to remove the final drive and pull out the spline for lubing. Although I would prefer the dealer doing it, but apart from their busy season, I don't think most of their young mechanics have much experience on Valkyries. A friend auto-mechanic is helping me, but I would like to know if I should order any parts that need to be replaced during this procedure. I saw a video on Youtube and I noticed the guy replacing few rings and rubber washers on the final drive itself. Anyone can tell me if there is a kit I can order for this procedure? I'm planning to order a set of Metzler ME-888 as well . Thank you for any advice.

[Pluggy]

I ordered O-rings from a Honda Dealer and they assemble without excessive force.  One tip.  When reinstalling the wheel, start by leaving the brake components off and out of the way.  Run the axle through the wheel and the drive,  like an alignment tool.  Then you can slowly rotate the wheel to get the splines lined up.  Then push the wheel in place.  You'll feel the O-rings compress as you slide the wheel fully in.

[Ken aka Oil Burner]

You can buy the O-rings from a dealer or parts warehouse, but you can also get an "upgrade" kit here: https://redeye.ecrater.com/p/18218041/final-drive-o-rings-for-valkyrie-polyurethane

A great resource for final drive maintenance is right here in the ShopTalk section: http://www.valkyrieriders.com/shoptalk/rear_end_service.pptx

If you choose to remove the final drive and drivesaft (you would be very wise to do so), at minimum, replace the seal on the driveshaft where it meets the pinion cup. That seal is crucial to keep the lube in and water/debris out. Seal part number is  91261-ME9-005   It can be ordered online in any number of places by searching the part number.

What lube(s) to use is the topic of many, many threads here, and opinions are varied.

[Tfrank59]

If you choose to remove the final drive and drivesaft (you would be very wise to do so), at minimum, replace the seal on the driveshaft where it meets the pinion cup. That seal is crucial to keep the lube in and water/debris out. Seal part number is  91261-ME9-005   It can be ordered online in any number of places by searching the part number.



This 

[Bighead]

Also follow the manual for reinstalling to a T or all that other stuff is useless.

[Peter55]

Thank you all for your reply. Ken, the first link with the information about the kit opened, but not the second link for some reason. I can at least order the kit. Thank you. I know it may be a rather complicated task for me. I lubed the splines on a couple of Beemer before, but on those bikes it is as easy as replacing stark plugs. Hopefully I don't need to come back here asking to be rescued, lol.

[The emperor has no clothes]

Thank you all for your reply. Ken, the first link with the information about the kit opened, but not the second link for some reason. I can at least order the kit. Thank you. I know it may be a rather complicated task for me. I lubed the splines on a couple of Beemer before, but on those bikes it is as easy as replacing stark plugs. Hopefully I don't need to come back here asking to be rescued, lol.

Try this, and click on view.

http://www.valkyrieriders.com/shoptalk/rear_end_service.pptx

[GWS]

 I just finished putting on 2 new tires and servicing the rear end on my standard. Once I had everything apart I discovered the thrust washer was missing. Not a bad idea to order one before you start. Even if you don't need to replace it, you'll have it on hand.

[GWS]

I also have a question - what kind of torque wrench or socket extensions do you guys use to tighten the 4 nuts connecting the driveshaft to the pumpkin? There's no room down there. I could only fit a combination wrench in there and guess at the right torque. I need to do it right.

[Grandpot]

I also have a question - what kind of torque wrench or socket extensions do you guys use to tighten the 4 nuts connecting the driveshaft to the pumpkin? There's no room down there. I could only fit a combination wrench in there and guess at the right torque. I need to do it right.

You are correct, there is no room.  I don't know of anyone that has been able to get a torque wrench in there.  Just tighten the nuts as best you can.

[Pluggy]

I also have a question - what kind of torque wrench or socket extensions do you guys use to tighten the 4 nuts connecting the driveshaft to the pumpkin? There's no room down there. I could only fit a combination wrench in there and guess at the right torque. I need to do it right.

A socket on an extension fits and works.  Then of course it is attached to the torque wrench.  It is 3/8 inch drive.

[Tfrank59]

I think I’ve done three out of four of them with a 3/8 ratchet a short extension and a socket. Maybe the fourth one I have to use a box wrench. I’ve never used a torque wrench on that, and that’s never been an issue, the issue is waiting until everything else is done before you tighten them.

[Chrisj CMA]

I also have a question - what kind of torque wrench or socket extensions do you guys use to tighten the 4 nuts connecting the driveshaft to the pumpkin? There's no room down there. I could only fit a combination wrench in there and guess at the right torque. I need to do it right.

You are correct, there is no room.  I don't know of anyone that has been able to get a torque wrench in there.  Just tighten the nuts as best you can.

No!  With the swingarm level and the shocks removed or at least the right shock removed I get a standard bar type torque wrench in there with a 1/2 to 3/8 adapter and a universal for the last nut.

It’s very important the axle is torqued with those four nuts loose, the wheel off the floor, the right shock removed and then immediately torque the four bolts. This insures a proper final drive to wheel alignment.

[Chrisj CMA]

I think I’ve done three out of four of them with a 3/8 ratchet a short extension and a socket. Maybe the fourth one I have to use a box wrench. I’ve never used a torque wrench on that, and that’s never been an issue, the issue is waiting until everything else is done before you tighten them.

Wrong. You don’t wait till EVERYTHING else is done. You torque those for bolts immediately after the axle nut and before the right shock goes on.

Learn the why not just the what and you will keep it straight.

[..]

https://www.facebook.com/groups/855896357793960/permalink/856098151107114/

[98valk]

http://www.valkyrieforum.com/bbs/index.php/topic,116696.msg1188141.html#msg1188141

So my conclusion is to make sure the U-Joint splines are correctly lubricated, to prevent the drive shaft to final drive splines aka spline coupling (SC) from wearing out. I also installed a new driveshaft to spline cup seal every other tire change.

The SC in a perfect application would have zero forward/rearward movement and would be submerged in oil which would result in zero wear and fretting. Fretting is a type of corrosion which gives that rust powder look. Is not from water intrusion. In some applications they actually glue the splines together to stop movement.

Honda provided the locking spring clip on the SC end of the drive shaft to help reduce movement of the SC, but it is still not a solid zero movement connection. So this is where the lubricated U-joint splines come into effect, thereby doing all of the movement, to reduce or actually eliminate any SC movement.

In a few of the links I provide it is stated that the SC splines should be hardened to greatly reduce wear.  Did Honda do this to the parts?, it doesn't seem like they did, since that would have been a much higher cost.

In my case I inadvertently mixed greases with different bases for the u-joint splines, by re-greasing and not cleaning off the old grease.
My fault, at the time, I didn't realize they had different bases. So what happened the greases started to dry out and not provide the easy sliding movement as needed and the SC failed in 17k miles.

For re-installing the U-Joint boot I coated the inside lips with silicone grease and it pops on with zero problems. suggest not to use a silicone spray which has petroleum products in it and other things which could degrade the boot material.

So to bring this all together, proper lubrication of the u-joint splines is extremely important and should be done every tire change to protect the SC. 
This time I used moly bearing chassis grease for the U-Joint for even more friction reduction and easier sliding.

For the SC I mixed TS-70 moly paste with some high temp grease so there would be about a 50/50 moly to grease ratio as recommended by the Dan Foss pdf which is a much higher percent of moly than the 3% moly grease the Honda manual calls for.

The following documents have some very good info about SCs and lubrication requirements.

https://www.machinerylubrication.com/Read/693/fretting-wear

https://www.powertransmission.com/issues/0214/spline-couplings.pdf

https://assets.danfoss.com/documents/76142/AI152986482538en-000304.pdf

https://www.eng-tips.com/viewthread.cfm?qid=423609

https://gearsolutions.com/departments/tooth-tips-a-brief-overview-of-splines/

https://www.eng-tips.com/viewthread.cfm?qid=383504

[Peter55]

I just finished putting on 2 new tires and servicing the rear end on my standard. Once I had everything apart I discovered the thrust washer was missing. Not a bad idea to order one before you start. Even if you don't need to replace it, you'll have it on hand.

Hi, I have been trying to find the thrust washer but I'm not sure which is the one to order. Would you happen to have a part number by any chance? Thank you.

[Ken aka Oil Burner]

I just finished putting on 2 new tires and servicing the rear end on my standard. Once I had everything apart I discovered the thrust washer was missing. Not a bad idea to order one before you start. Even if you don't need to replace it, you'll have it on hand.

Hi, I have been trying to find the thrust washer but I'm not sure which is the one to order. Would you happen to have a part number by any chance? Thank you.

42616-MAJ-G20 is the number for the thrust washer.

[Valker]

It is VERY common to miss the thrust washer being there. It can be stuck to either surface and covered in grease. It is VERY rare to not ruin the wheel if the thrust washer is left out. Check for it very carefully.

[BigBod]

I've got my rear wheel off now, I thought there was no thrust washer, as I was cleaning the splines there it was!! covered in grease and looked as though it was part of the unit... worth another look, it may just be there...

[Peter55]

I just finished putting on 2 new tires and servicing the rear end on my standard. Once I had everything apart I discovered the thrust washer was missing. Not a bad idea to order one before you start. Even if you don't need to replace it, you'll have it on hand.

Hi, I have been trying to find the thrust washer but I'm not sure which is the one to order. Would you happen to have a part number by any chance? Thank you.

42616-MAJ-G20 is the number for the thrust washer.

Ordered! Thank you for sharing the part number.

[ridingron]

Item number  4.


https://www.partsfish.com/oemparts/a/hon/506c2f70f870023420a31b57/rear-wheel