The gun that got me in the doghouse

[Chrisj CMA]

Usually we don’t get a tax refund. This year we are getting a small return. Apparently I didn’t really need a new shotgun.



But it is sweet. A Remington 870 super mag 3.5” chamber and 28” barrel. Tried and true simplicity but a beast that can eat any 12 ga ammo there is. I’ll be adding a magazine extension to up it to 10rd capacity

[h13man]

I've got the 90's vintage 870 Express combo both are smooth bore barrels with interchangeable choke tubes. Love all accessories available for these old beast. Love to have a older 1100 auto but... On a note, I seen a $180 .22 revolver "belly gun" that caught my eye. 

[Jess from VA]

Nice.    

Wilson Combat makes very nice 870 mag extensions, but I dunno about +5s.  Brownell's has them.

I have two 870s (one old, one new), but in 18.5" bbls.  They only take +2s.

I hope the doghouse is air conditioned.  

[hubcapsc]

Nice.    I've always imagined getting an 870. I seem to find
guns more of a right that needs protected than fun, though, so...



-Mike "I don't have many guns..."

[Grandpot]

I'm not allowed (by my wife) to go to gun stores because something always follows me home.

[Jess from VA]

This is why I always followed the two incomes, two bank accounts (two credit cards) philosophy.

You get what you want.... I'll get what I want.

And I paid most of the bills.

And occasionally, after rational discussion, we split costs on some things.

Democracy in action.  

What do you need with all those guns?  What do you need with all those shoes? 

[Serk]

I always arrange trips to the gun show/store around a trip to my land to do some plinking (I mean, gonna wanna try out the new toy anyway, right?)

Load up a few gun cases, leaving some space in a few of them, head out.

If I leave with 9 guns and come home with 11, well....

(And yeah, if she asks I'll tell her, but it does keep things more peaceful...)

[Patrick]

Nice gun. The 870 is a good gun, been around forever.

I'm just an old 1100 guy. The only pump guns I have now are the Winchester Model 12s.

[MarkT]

This is why I always followed the two incomes, two bank accounts (two credit cards) philosophy.

You get what you want.... I'll get what I want.

And I paid most of the bills.

And occasionally, after rational discussion, we split costs on some things.

Democracy in action.  

What do you need with all those guns?  What do you need with all those shoes? 

+1 Jess.  Separate accounts & I don't get permission to buy anything.  Trained her on that point right away.  Besides guns can be an investment, if I did need to justify them.  Generally they hold value very well, even appreciate.
I put a 10 rnd tube on my 870.  It's really too long to be a practical home defense gun though - so the big mag is kind of contrary to best purpose for it.  I actually did that because the left was talking about mag limits so the big mag was installed as a middle finger to Obama, Feinstein, Biden, Pelosi & Schumer.  I have other shottys anyway - fav for defense is a Rock Island Armory tactical pump.

[Jess from VA]

Mark, for a long time, most gun costs were not usually a great investment.  I didn't buy the real spendy things that went up in value most.  You didn't lose anything, but didn't make much appreciation either.  Course that was never the purpose. 

However, in the last few years all bets are off, and if it was a stock portfolio, holy crap would I be happy.

Everything is way up, and demand is way up.

Mundane SKS, M1 carbines, milsurp rifles, revolvers and others are now all multiples of what I paid.  So is the ammo for them.

But I'm not selling.  There are (just) a couple things I would part with if trusted friends or family wanted or needed them.  But they don't.

I long for the days of the Great Western Gun Shows at the LA County Fairgrounds, with 6-7 airplane hanger size buildings full of every kind of collection, new, used, Jeeps in crates, mountains of ammo.  And a fella could come home with three nice rifles and a bag of stuff for under $500 (all minty used, which is mostly what I was after).

I knew a couple small time one table sellers (ex military and cops), and I would man their tables when they went looking for certain things.  Or, I could tell them what I was looking for, and next show, they'd have one for me.  Good times.

[Serk]

But I'm not selling.

Whenever I point out my 401-G is an investment, that's the spousal unit's counter... "It doesn't count as an investment if you're never willing to sell it!"

[Chrisj CMA]

But I'm not selling.

Whenever I point out my 401-G is an investment, that's the spousal unit's counter... "It doesn't count as an investment if you're never willing to sell it!"

Being willing to and REALLY needing to are two totally different concepts

[Jess from VA]

Well, I'm not selling my IRAs either.... yet.  I took some out to pay off the house, but that's it.

I'm nearing mandatory minimum distributions though, otherwise I don't need it.

I'm too old for hookers and blow.     Well, maybe not too old quite yet, but I don't think my heart could survive it.  Not much of an investment either.

I gonna remember the 401G.      

[cookiedough]

hard to go wrong with Remington of anything including shotguns.  I have 2 mossberg 500 pumps (20 and 12 gauge) and about 20 years ago picked up at an auction sale yet another not really needing it but the price was right around 275 for a remington 1100 semi-auto.     After the auction, a guy must have not been paying attention while bidding and offered me 350 bucks, was so tempted to make 75 bucks profit but decided to keep it, not like 3 shotguns is really needed right?   

A few .22's and BB guns,  30.06 ruger, and shotguns are enough for me, but a 9mm pistol would be nice as well right???

[Chrisj CMA]

This full size shotgun completes my idea of being ready. I have all sizes of revolvers depending on the purpose. The Marlin.357 although real fun is a great campsite or property gun. The shotgun is so versatile it can be a large short range high power rifle with big slugs, put a hurtin on anything gun with 00 buck or a varmint gun with bird shot. I Also have a Marlin 60 .22 semi automatic for smaller varmints so the bases are all covered. I enjoy shooting all of them. None are safe queens.

[MarkT]

hard to go wrong with Remington of anything including shotguns.  I have 2 mossberg 500 pumps (20 and 12 gauge) and about 20 years ago picked up at an auction sale yet another not really needing it but the price was right around 275 for a remington 1100 semi-auto.     After the auction, a guy must have not been paying attention while bidding and offered me 350 bucks, was so tempted to make 75 bucks profit but decided to keep it, not like 3 shotguns is really needed right?  

A few .22's and BB guns,  30.06 ruger, and shotguns are enough for me, but a 9mm pistol would be nice as well right???

Remington & Marlin are now owned and operated by Ruger.  Big report in American Rifleman, March issue.  Detailed report on the transition.

I picked up a Ruger .44mag carbine around 1980 when they were still in production.  The one the iconic 10-22 was modeled on.  Looks the same in fact.  I put a 1.5X Weaver scope on it.  Before they had reflex sights. Simple duplex reticle and fast target acquisition.  Great swamp deer rifle, that's where I used it. Or defense if you like - though .44mag from a carbine might be overkill.  But tuff, break in here you get what you get.  However it's in the safe, I have others in play for defense - like my .45-70 Henry, God help anyone hit center mass with that, has energy like a .30-06 with a BIG hole.

[Jess from VA]

Jeff, that shotgun is a great all purpose weapon.   

I like shotguns.

But with the 28" barrel, there will be no running in the house.   


This is for running in the house.  (pops right in)   
https://www.opticsplanet.com/mossberg-90335-extra-barrels-12-gauge-18-1-2-blue-front-bead.html
   

[Chrisj CMA]

Jeff, that shotgun is a great all purpose weapon.  

I like shotguns.

But with the 28" barrel, there will be no running in the house.  


This is for running in the house.  (pops right in)  
https://www.opticsplanet.com/mossberg-90335-extra-barrels-12-gauge-18-1-2-blue-front-bead.html
    

Jess. I have running in the house covered.

Springfield 67F 20 ga 18” barrel

[Patrick]

hard to go wrong with Remington of anything including shotguns.  I have 2 mossberg 500 pumps (20 and 12 gauge) and about 20 years ago picked up at an auction sale yet another not really needing it but the price was right around 275 for a remington 1100 semi-auto.     After the auction, a guy must have not been paying attention while bidding and offered me 350 bucks, was so tempted to make 75 bucks profit but decided to keep it, not like 3 shotguns is really needed right?   

A few .22's and BB guns,  30.06 ruger, and shotguns are enough for me, but a 9mm pistol would be nice as well right???

$275 for an 1100, can't get hurt doing that. They are good guns, got several of them. I didn't like them when they first came out. Those rattling clanky things, but, they work. There is a little bit of a learning curve in what needs to be kept clean, but then they'll run forever without an issue.

As far as the 9mm, not a fan. Many folks do like them though and ammo is usually plentiful [ or used to be].

[MotoRod]

 bought a Ruger 9mm carbine yesterday.  been looking for a while and found one at bass pro at $610.  It was marked wrong and they sold it to me anyway.

[Chrisj CMA]

bought a Ruger 9mm carbine yesterday.  been looking for a while and found one at bass pro at $610.  It was marked wrong and they sold it to me anyway.

Very cool. 9mm will do better in a carbine than a pistol

[Jess from VA]

Jess. I have running in the house covered.

Springfield 67F 20 ga 18” barrel

Excellent.  

You know, after I already had my 12 gauge shotguns, I discovered that for home defense, 20 gauge is really the better choice.  Plenty of stopping power and significant recoil reduction, esp in a shorter lighter gun.  

If I ever get one of those not a shotgun, not a pistol Shockwaves, it would be in 20, not 12.  And I like the old school wood furniture.  


Also a good truck gun, although the peculiarities of the gun and variabilities of state carry laws/permits make that a problem many places (loaded... which if it's not, no reason to have it in the truck).  Carjack this.. buddy!!

[pais]

bought a Ruger 9mm carbine yesterday.  been looking for a while and found one at bass pro at $610.  It was marked wrong and they sold it to me anyway.

Picked one of these up in the Fall, yet to shoot it.

I have an old Savage 12ga pump. I've always wanted to shorten both the barrel and stock to make it "house" friendly.

[Jess from VA]

Be careful shortening your own shotgun Pais.

The barrel must be 18" (and not a hair under, which is why all factory riot guns are 18.5" for decades).

And (for the butt stock) it must have an overall length of at least 26 inches (add at least a quarter or half inch there too).

And you cannot make a shotgun into a Shockwave on your own.  It was sold as a shotgun new, and all shotguns are held to shotgun rules.  A new Shockwave was never a pistol or a shotgun... per the ATF syndicate.

Unless you feel the urge to apply to the syndicate for permission to own a Short Barrel Shotgun (SBS) with registration and $200 tax stamp.  And when you die, there's a transfer problem without an NFA trust. 

[Patrick]

Home defense ? Under the bed is a sawed off double and the .45 on the night stand. My home has been broken into twice.

In the door side pocket of the truck. A 12ga flare gun, Byrna and a .45

[Chrisj CMA]

Be careful shortening your own shotgun Pais.

The barrel must be 18" (and not a hair under, which is why all factory riot guns are 18.5" for decades).

And (for the butt stock) it must have an overall length of at least 26 inches (add at least a quarter or half inch there too).

And you cannot make a shotgun into a Shockwave on your own.  It was sold as a shotgun new, and all shotguns are held to shotgun rules.  A new Shockwave was never a pistol or a shotgun... per the ATF syndicate.

Unless you feel the urge to apply to the syndicate for permission to own a Short Barrel Shotgun (SBS) with registration and $200 tax stamp.  And when you die, there's a transfer problem without an NFA trust. 

Ok so, Jess, after reading your wise warning. I got the 67 down and measured it again. The barrel (measured as if it was removed from the gun) is 18 1/8”. Overall length is like 27”. Hopefully I wont go to jail if I shoot someone with it. 

[Jess from VA]

Ok so, Jess, after reading your wise warning. I got the 67 down and measured it again. The barrel (measured as if it was removed from the gun) is 18 1/8”. Overall length is like 27”. Hopefully I wont go to jail if I shoot someone with it.

Well it's good to check (and know it's legal), especially if you might use it in self defense.  If the cops come, they're going to want the weapon, and may take it with them too (for evidence or close inspection, or both).  If that shotgun was sold the way it is now, it was likely legal.  

Of course this presumes a shooting itself is lawful self defense.  If you use it on an irritating neighbor, that's another problem.  

People that use personally customized weapons (in violation of ATF rules) (or buy them used that way) for home defense are not thinking ahead.  The shooting may well be justified, but don't expect them to look the other way on an illegal firearm (they might, but you can never count on it).  

Moreover, if a shooting in self defense is not easily clear cut as justifiable, the fact you used an unlawful ATF weapon could be just enough weight in the balance to decide to charge you with an unlawful shooting.  The faulty reasoning goes.... he is an outlaw for making that gun unlawful, he has an outlaw mentality, he was predisposed to use weapons on people, ergo the shooting was not justified.  Don't be that guy (never assist the G in prosecuting you).  

Remember when Kyle Rittenhouse (the Hero of Kenosha) was crucified in the media, the AR he used was itself a lawful firearm, but they went out of their way to demonize him for being underage, crossing state lines, straw purchaser, and anything else they could think up.  None of that stuck.  Thanks to go fund me and good lawyers and a pile of money, and a fair jury.  

[pais]

Be careful shortening your own shotgun Pais.

The barrel must be 18" (and not a hair under, which is why all factory riot guns are 18.5" for decades).

And (for the butt stock) it must have an overall length of at least 26 inches (add at least a quarter or half inch there too).

And you cannot make a shotgun into a Shockwave on your own.  It was sold as a shotgun new, and all shotguns are held to shotgun rules.  A new Shockwave was never a pistol or a shotgun... per the ATF syndicate.

Unless you feel the urge to apply to the syndicate for permission to own a Short Barrel Shotgun (SBS) with registration and $200 tax stamp.  And when you die, there's a transfer problem without an NFA trust. 

Jess thanx for the info!
I did not know the law verbatim but, i did know "sawed off" SG's are illegal.

[Jess from VA]

Well, following the law, they can be sawed off some, just not too much. 

And then the question:  Do I chop up this old one, or just get a decent used riot gun?

Course prices on everything new and used are way up now.

The chopping would be a decent (and fun) project, but I have never made a nice straight cut with a hacksaw in my whole life.      (HACKsaw is a well named tool)   I'm not much better with hand saws on wood either. 

And I would absolutely leave enough butt to get it on my shoulder, esp in 12 gauge.

[3W-lonerider]

i had an 870 express 12 guage quite a few years ago. sold it because i got tired of it killing on both ends. but it was the best shotgun i ever owned.

[MarkT]

Well, following the law, they can be sawed off some, just not too much. 

And then the question:  Do I chop up this old one, or just get a decent used riot gun?

Course prices on everything new and used are way up now.

The chopping would be a decent (and fun) project, but I have never made a nice straight cut with a hacksaw in my whole life.      (HACKsaw is a well named tool)   I'm not much better with hand saws on wood either. 

And I would absolutely leave enough butt to get it on my shoulder, esp in 12 gauge.

Yeah, if I was to cut off any barrel myself (actually, cutting anything) I would (do) use a blade saw with a fence accurately set at 90°, watch the angle is 90° in the vertical as well.  Not an abrasive saw, that burns it's way through leaving a big burr and changing the temper, but a bandsaw.  What little burr left can be carefully removed by hand with a small jeweler's round or curved file.  Don't foul the crown if it has one (rifle).

[Savago]

@Chris: you can't go wrong with the Remington 870 (I have a Magnum Marine model and love it).

Simple, reliable, proven design.

I wonder what is going to happen with Remington going out of business (would prices go up? Who knows...).

[Chrisj CMA]

@Chris: you can't go wrong with the Remington 870 (I have a Magnum Marine model and love it).

Simple, reliable, proven design.

I wonder what is going to happen with Remington going out of business (would prices go up? Who knows...).

Exactly Savago. No one knows if a Remington shotgun will be available or affordable that's why I bought while it was in my hand. She doesn’t understand but now is over it. I’m out of the dog house. Still totally worth it.

[Jess from VA]

What happened to the rest of Remington Arms?  (the Marlin part of Remington was bought by Ruger)

https://nptelegraph.com/opinion/columnists/windham-what-happened-to-the-rest-of-remington-arms/article_48d7e69c-fd4e-11eb-a527-3f003484aca7.html

An investment company called The Roundhill Group LLC purchased the Remington firearms factories last fall for $13 million. The deal included Remington’s main factory in Ilion, New York, and its handgun barrel factory in Lenoir City, Tennessee. The sale included all the firearms side of the business except Marlin.

We are actively pursuing an aggressive timeline to get production started and intend to have our core legacy products, the Model 870 shotgun and Model 700 rifle on the shelf well ahead of hunting season,” Ballard told Field & Stream.

....most consumers will still link RemArms and Remington Ammunition, even though they are now two separate companies.

[Savago]

@Jess: it is pretty neat someone bought what is left of Remington, I hope they don't screw up something that is good and proven (i.e. maybe by cheapening Q&A and materials?).

Until this new Roundhill's guns are available in the market, the jury is still out.

 @Chris: if is any indication, the same Marlin 1894 CSBL that I paid $1150 bucks new in 2020, can only be found now for $2200 to $2300 on gunbroker after Remington went out of business.

But I hope that the new Ruger-lins becoming available may push the prices down for the Remin-lins.

[Chrisj CMA]

@Jess: it is pretty neat someone bought what is left of Remington, I hope they don't screw up something that is good and proven (i.e. maybe by cheapening Q&A and materials?).

Until this new Roundhill's guns are available in the market, the jury is still out.

 @Chris: if is any indication, the same Marlin 1894 CSBL that I paid $1150 bucks new in 2020, can only be found now for $2200 to $2300 on gunbroker after Remington went out of business.

But I hope that the new Ruger-lins becoming available may push the prices down for the Remin-lins.

Ya I’ve seen pre lock 1894 .357 levers going well north of two grand as well. It’s just nuts

[Chrisj CMA]

So I just got done installing the magazine tube extender. Went well. Now it will hold nine 2 3/4” or seven 3 1/2” shells. It’s a bit heavier loaded but not bad.