Spline health

[SunshineNomad]

I am changing the rear tire and am wondering about my drive splines.  Here's what they look like.  When I got the bike, it had only 12k miles and I cleaned and lubed them I now have 24k miles. The drive shaft and flange look good. Can I get an opinion on the drive?
Thanks

[Skinhead]

Worn, but serviceable.  I would go one more service interval on them, but look for a replacement in the mean time.

[SunshineNomad]

I thought so.  Is the final drive Valk specific or can one from a GL1500 be used?

[hubcapsc]

Only a Valkyrie final drive will do.

There's parts inside of a 1500 wing final drive you can use
to rebuild a Valkyrie final drive, so if you found a real good
1500 wing final drive you could replace your Valkyrie's
splines. A bunch of rigmarole including a shop press,
but I did it... I got the machine shop guy down at NAPA
to press out the wing splines and press them into my
Valkyrie ring gear.

You could just buy a new Valkyrie ring gear, but there's
shims and stuff you'd have to set right... refurbishing
the existing ring gear skips that step.

Decent final drives pass by on ebay and this board's
classifieds.

Usually the flange is replaced with the final/splines.
The 1500 wing flange (all but the first year or two of
1500 wings) is the same part number as the Valkyrie
flange, so maybe whatever good 1500 wing final you find
will have a good flange with matching wear to go with it.

I've mixed used flanges/finals, but only if both look really good...



-Mike

[SunshineNomad]

I’m replacing the dampers which are worn and start looking for a good final drive The dampers probably contributed to the wear. Thanks for the 2nd opinion.

[sandy]

Your splines went from 12 to 24K and wore out. As was said, yours is serviceable but very worn. Two considerations.
 Did you reassemble the wheel correctly? Loosen the 4 drive unit nuts and torque the axle before retightening the 4 nuts. A small misalignment can wear out splines.
Next; What grease did you use? Your splines show corrosion which means moisture got in there. Replace the 3 O rings. Most “professional service shops” do not use Hondas moly paste. I’ve asked a bunch with 100% saying they use Bel Ray Waterproof grease. My last Valk was sold with 155K and had perfect splines and it never saw Honda paste after the first tire change.

[SunshineNomad]

I slathered on Locktite 65% moly and loosened the 4 bolts before torquing the axle. eBay has a few Valk pumpkins but either they look worse than mine or no there’s close up of the splines.  Good used are scarce. Hopefully I can get a matching hub. Or I might just order a new hub and ring gear which will be cheaper than a used unit and borrow a press.

[hubcapsc]

I slathered on Locktite 65% moly and loosened the 4 bolts before torquing the axle.

As many "right" things as you did, it seems weird you didn't have good results.

Did you replace/check the "three elusive O-rings"?

It won't help anything to put way too much moly paste in there, but
I make sure I get both the splines down in the final gooped up and also
the splines on the flange.

Good luck  ...

-Mike

[F6Dave]

Isn't that the pinon cup? The usual reason they get rusty is when the driveshaft seal fails and lets water in. A bad or loose U-Joint boot can make it worse.

[Chrisj CMA]

Isn't that the pinon cup? The usual reason they get rusty is when the driveshaft seal fails and lets water in. A bad or loose U-Joint boot can make it worse.

No, not pinion cup. Drive splines.

[SunshineNomad]

I know I loosened the 4 bolts before tightening the axle but somewhere along the way they were obviously not aligned. Most eBay drives don’t have a matching hub.  With the cost about the same as a used drive, I think I’m going to go with an new ring set and hub to match and press fit. That way I won’t worry about a used spline. Oh, and new o-rings.

[indybobm]

Before you re-lube that final drive, be sure to clean the spines as good as you can. Any crud, rust, dirt or anything else left in there can act like an abrasive and cause more wear. It should be as clean as you can get it. I usually go through a couple of dozens of q-tips and carb cleaner when I clean mine.

[Speedy Coop]

What year 1500 wing do you need to get the right internals from?

[F6Dave]

Isn't that the pinon cup? The usual reason they get rusty is when the driveshaft seal fails and lets water in. A bad or loose U-Joint boot can make it worse.

No, not pinion cup. Drive splines.

Thanks. I was looking from a phone and wasn't sure.

Those look pretty bad. It would be difficult for rust to cause all of that, so there must have been some misalignment.

[F6Dave]

This raises an interesting question. If the main advantages of shaft drive are reliability and low maintenance, why do Valkyrie owners spend so much time maintaining the driveshaft and final drive, and why are there so many failures?

Before I bought my Valkyries I owned three other shaft drive bikes, and rode them about 150,000 total miles. When I replaced a rear tire I changed the final drive oil because it was convenient, but otherwise never touched another part of the driveshaft or final drive. After buying my first Valk I continued this routine. I dabbed some grease on the drive splines and axle before reinstalling the wheel, and that was that. I never loosened those four bolts or anything that wasn't needed to remove the tire.

Then at about 40,000 miles I read about all the driveshaft maintenance I'd been ignoring. I pulled the wheel, final drive, and shaft, expecting the worst. But everything looked like new. Now I occasionally pull and lube the driveshaft, but not at every tire change.

I also own an F6B. While GL1800s have single sided swingarms, if you look at the diagrams the internal parts look a lot like a Valkyrie. So I posted a question on an F6B tech board asking members how often they pull the final drive and lube the driveshaft. Nobody ever did. Maybe we over-maintain these parts.

[RonW]

"So I posted a question on an F6B tech board asking members how often they pull the final drive and lube the driveshaft. Nobody ever did."


That's seems the case with all other shaft driven bikes regardless of the brand. I guess the Valk is an exception??

[Jess from VA]

I think in the sea of valk riders, there's not that many failures.  Most all the ones that happen here are likely talked about here.  And it's an important maintenance item, so that's talked about too.

But there's no sea of failures.  Though it does happen.  Once water gets in, it's going to happen unless it's discovered soon enough.  Or you get a tire put on at a shop, and they do nothing for clean and lube.

I do a good job, when I do it, and it's usually over 10K.  But I slap so much Belray in there, it squirts out going back together, and flies out for about a month after.  Too much has never caused a problem except the mess.  But I've never had a slippery rear tire.

[F6Dave]

"So I posted a question on an F6B tech board asking members how often they pull the final drive and lube the driveshaft. Nobody ever did."


That's seems the case with all other shaft driven bikes regardless of the brand. I guess the Valk is an exception??

Maybe the Valk isn't an exception and has a very durable drive train. But removing the final drive and shaft every 10,000 miles can damage seals and o-rings, which lets water into places like the pinon cup. And reinstallation increases the chance of final drive misalignment, which devastates drive splines. All this maintenance might cause more damage than leaving everything alone, like owners of other shaft driven bikes apparently do.

[Valker]

"So I posted a question on an F6B tech board asking members how often they pull the final drive and lube the driveshaft. Nobody ever did."


That's seems the case with all other shaft driven bikes regardless of the brand. I guess the Valk is an exception??

Maybe the Valk isn't an exception and has a very durable drive train. But removing the final drive and shaft every 10,000 miles can damage seals and o-rings, which lets water into places like the pinon cup. And reinstallation increases the chance of final drive misalignment, which devastates drive splines. All this maintenance might cause more damage than leaving everything alone, like owners of other shaft driven bikes apparently do.

I had a dealer replace the rear tire once on my Valk. Less than 6,000 miles later, the drive splines were toast and left me stuck beside the road. When I asked how they serviced it when changing the tire, they hadn't removed nor even loosened the final drive from the swingarm. I do my own now. 200K miles.