Valve Adjustment - Honda shop rate

[YardBoy]

Does anyone know what the labor flat-rate is for adjusting the valves?  I had also thought about changing the belts while the front cover was off.  16,500 miles on a 98 standard.  Your thoughts about the belts. 

[Scott in FL]

At that low mileage, I wouldn't think your vavles or belts need any attention. 

[JoeValkIS]

You don't have to remove the front cover to adjust the valves.  You will have to check with your local Honda shop to find out their rates.  I believe the average rate is $35-37 an hr.  The job should take them 2-3 hrs to complete (I can do it in about 1-1 1/2 hrs).  There should be no gaskets or fluids required for the task. 

With the miles on your bike, I wouldn't worry with the timing belt.  I have 65k+ on my 99 IS and it is still on the stock belt.  I agree with Yardboy on the valves but if you are hearing ticking noises coming form the valve cover area, then i would check your exhaust bolts first.  They loosen with the heat/cool cycles.  If you still have the ticking after checking the bolts, then yeah, you probably need to have the valves adjusted. 

Make sure you have them sync the carbs after adjusting the valves.  That should take them 1-1 1/2 hrs to complete. 

Joe

[Patrick]

I don't know about flat-rate times for what your looking to do..But, I think belt change intervals are more of an age related issue than mileage.. The front cover doesn't have to be removed for a valve adjustment as stated, [just the center section has to come off]..A valve adjust should take an hour or two depending on how familiar/adept you are in doing that type of work.. Its a good idea to have a look at the valves every once in awhile even though these engines are not prone to going out of adjustment and the valves tend to get tighter[which means quieter] with age/wear rather than looser[ which is noisier]..So I'm always concerned about too little lash rather than too much.. Most noises that many feel/think are valve related I've found to be exhaust related,,the exhaust gaskets can be frustrating to get completely sealed[I prefer the Viking gaskets]..Be careful when tightening them[7#/ft], just snug them and go over them several times as they break very easily..Adjusting the carburetors[sync] would be a good thing to do after everything else is done and shouldn't take much than 1/2 to 1 hour with a plain old vacuum gauge, a lot of tubing and some forceps..You could check the setting of the pilots[2.25 turns],but, if the engine is running good, might as well leave that alone.. Geeezz, why am I in such a talkative mood this morning..

[Ricky-D]

patrick writes:

"these engines are not prone to going out of adjustment and the valves tend to get tighter[which means quieter] with age/wear rather than looser[ which is noisier]"

That is not correct! 

A valve train has no ability to tighten with wear, actually just the opposite is true.

And with an engine of such low mileage there should be absolutely no concern regarding this. 

 

***

[Madmike]

"these engines are not prone to going out of adjustment and the valves tend to get tighter[which means quieter] with age/wear rather than looser[ which is noisier]"

That is not correct!  

A valve train has no ability to tighten with wear, actually just the opposite is true.

And with an engine of such low mileage there should be absolutely no concern regarding this.  

 
***

......so valve face and seat wear causes wider clearances??

[Relax]

The miles on the belt is probably no problem at all,,,,,BUT what about age?
12 years?  Isn't at least smart with a good check on the belt  in that respect?

[Chrisj CMA CR3M]

You guys are all blessed.....Our Honda shop is now up to $130/hr therefore my bike never goes there.  

OK, bottom line, get a Honda shop book and learn how to do the basic maintenance yourself.  Valves are easy....Changing the TWO BELTS (some of you keep saying "the belt") Changing THEM isint hard but does take some pre knowledge of what can go wrong and how to avoid catastrophe, so read up or get someone that has done it before to show you.

Short of removing and tearing down the engine, theres really nothing that has to be done that a person with average mechanical skill cant do with the help of this board and the Honda Book IMHO

[Patrick]

I'm not correct in what I say??!!.. Huumm,, thats interesting ..  I've been involved in the repair business for too many years and lost count about 50 years ago on the number of valve adjustments I've performed.. I stand by what I've said, these engines do not have a valve adjustment problem but its nice to have a look at them every now and again..You never know what can happen or what has happened in the past..

[sheets]

  I believe the average rate is $35-37 an hr. 

For me, that was like ten years ago.  Last time I was at the shop a couple years ago it was $75. 
I suspect its closer to a hundred frog skins by now. 

[Redline :)]

patrick writes:

"these engines are not prone to going out of adjustment and the valves tend to get tighter[which means quieter] with age/wear rather than looser[ which is noisier]"

That is not correct! 

A valve train has no ability to tighten with wear, actually just the opposite is true.

 

***

That is not correct! 

For the past 40 years I've been getting paid to build engines...listen to Patrick.

Redline 

[Madmike]

patrick writes:

"these engines are not prone to going out of adjustment and the valves tend to get tighter[which means quieter] with age/wear rather than looser[ which is noisier]"

That is not correct!  

A valve train has no ability to tighten with wear, actually just the opposite is true.

 

***

That is not correct!  

For the past 40 years I've been getting paid to build engines...listen to Patrick.

Redline  

I agree with Patrick as well but realllly reallllly want to hear the explanation ...............

[Patrick]

Well, thanks for the back-up guys.. I appreciate it.. One question though,, who are you waiting for an explanation from?? What kind of explanation are you looking for??

[Rio Wil]

They are waiting for you to tell them how as the face of the valve wears and the valve seat wears, how this results in the valve stem sticking up through the head just a bit more causing the valve lash to grow smaller, ie, get tighter. Also, since the decreased clearance causes the valve to spend less time in contact with the seat, the increased heat in the valve face accelerates the wear on the face and seat thereby compounding the wear rate and further decreasing the clearance........so just go ahead and tell them.

 

[Blackduck]

Patrick and Will get my vote
Cheers

[1fastbob]

"these engines are not prone to going out of adjustment and the valves tend to get tighter[which means quieter] with age/wear rather than looser[ which is noisier]"

That is not correct!  

A valve train has no ability to tighten with wear, actually just the opposite is true.

And with an engine of such low mileage there should be absolutely no concern regarding this.  

 
***

......so valve face and seat wear causes wider clearances??

Just what I was thinking! A valve head (such as exhaust valve) receding into the seat will NOT loosen the clearences.  It would be just the opposite. Same result with valve seat wear.

[Patrick]

Rio Wil ,, LOL !!  Great post !! I'm still laughing !! I was thinking that maybe someone wanted Ricky to explain his comment.. I've not seen any of these engines develop any upper valve train component wear issues as these monsters have a heck of a lubrication system as anyone who has started one of these engines with a valve cover removed can attest to !! I have seen some valves that have been out of adjustment from what I believe is a problem of 'feel ' with feeler gauges and/or the possibility of not rechecking the adjustment after tightening the jamb nut.. That said, upon first/initial adjustments I've found far more valves tighter than they should be..

[Pete]

Great job Patrick and Rio-Wil.

Go ahead and finish it .

Looser   ---- usually means design  or wear issues with the cam, rocker or valve stem head.  Typically traced to heat treatment issues (to soft or not compatible) or oiling and/or or oil quality issues (infrequent changes, poor quality oil or filter).

No known design or quality issues with the Valkyrie valve train.

OK Patrick, Rio-Wil are you finished?   OK, thanks very much, SERIOUSLY VERY GOOD JOB guys.

Labor rates in my area are $75 per hour times 2 hours, so $150 valve adjustment.

[Madmike]

Rio Wil ,, LOL !!  Great post !! I'm still laughing !! I was thinking that maybe someone wanted Ricky to explain his comment.. I've not seen any of these engines develop any upper valve train component wear issues as these monsters have a heck of a lubrication system as anyone who has started one of these engines with a valve cover removed can attest to !! I have seen some valves that have been out of adjustment from what I believe is a problem of 'feel ' with feeler gauges and/or the possibility of not rechecking the adjustment after tightening the jamb nut.. That said, upon first/initial adjustments I've found far more valves tighter than they should be..

................I was waiting for an esplanashun from Ricky......

[Robert]

I agree with Patrick and have adjusted overhead cam engines for years. It really depends on the valve to cam arrangement weather it will have greater or lesser clearance. Just one small example my friend has a Toyota truck that was not running well and I checked all the variables and couldn't find anything really wrong so I gave it a compression test and of course one cylinder was way low and the others were acceptable. So off comes the valve cover and sure enough the clearance was about half of what it should have been in the one cylinder and  the rest were really tight too. After the adjustment the truck just purred and of course mileage went up too. I was a little embarrassed with myself to let the basics shoot me down on this one but it didn't take to much extra time.  
Older BMW s get tighter Mercedes tighter Jags tighter Chevy looser Toyota some tighter some looser like I said it all depends on the arrangement.