The Continuing saga of my valk not starting

[poman]

Ok guys , as you know my bike is VERY difficult to start after sitting over night. (starts fine otherwise durring the day while riding)  It still acts like it is flooded and wont take throttle at all untill it sits barely running for about ten minutes and it catches up with itsself. slight blue smoke also till caught up. I have to REALLY baby the throttle to help it get caught up. ( barely pumping it )

Well someone mentioned checking the plugs and see how they look especially #6. Im guessing number 6 is the rear left plug, but I pulled and checked all. They all look good, but will buy all new ones today as one of my last resorts. I dont think that is it because it only started acting like this first time I tried to crank it after sitting for about 2 months. Once its running its good to go.

SOmething else Im wondering about is ....I put some stabil and seafoam in it along with the Lucas upper end lube I mix with every tank.  does anyone think this may cause the fuel not to burn as readily until the motor gets warm?  CRAP! Im grasping for anything. Very frustrating and Thunder beach bike rally is this Thursday here in Panama city.  

Also what plugs should I buy?

How about a little help from the experts guys.      Po-man out

[eric in md]

well po man .. im far from a expert my guess is never let it cool down .. sorry had to say it . good luck really .

[hubcapsc]

When it starts seeming "magic" it might be electrical. I can't really help there, knowledge wise, but if you get
to shotgunning, I have a whole set of coils I got cheap from Pinwall, I'd send them to you to try...

-Mike

[Spirited-6]

I put some stabil and seafoam in it along with the Lucas upper end lube I mix with every tank. 

I would stay away from this and go GAS for a while. You are in a warm climate so using choke should not be needed I would think. In warm weather my Tourer will start W/O any gas on and idle smooth in a short time.  My .05 , 

[Valkflyer]

Curious, just a couple of questions:

How long have owned the bike?
 
Have you had much of an external temperature variation since putting it up for two months?  What's it look like now?


Have you checked your choke to see that it's functioning properly on both sides?

[R J]

1 question.

Are you sure you have the choke on ALL THE way?

Sounds to me like you pushed the lever to resistance and quit.

Push it somemore, leave your hands offf the throttle and hit the go button....

Let it idle till it has some extra RPM's, about 20 seconds or less, jump on a ride..

Let me know what or how you came out.

Cause I'm saying you DO NOT have the choke fully engaged, and, a Valk is almost impossible to flood.    It can be done, but it takes work..........

[hubcapsc]

Sounds to me like you pushed the lever to resistance and quit.

Push it somemore, leave your hands offf the throttle and hit the go button....

When you're pushing, you can look down there near the carb tops and see stuff happening... you'll
know visually if you've pushed past the point of mere resistance...

-Mike "good idea!"

[Chrisj CMA]

why are you putting that lucas lube stuff in your gas with every tank?

[TGViper]

As a new owner of a 2001 Valk - (thank you, thank you), I was searching for why this SOB was so hard to start and ran across this post and one other (search for "hard start").  The trick was to FULL choke, NO throttle.  And by FULL choke, I do mean FULL.  That last 1/4 to 1/2 inch is a bear cat.  Feels like the choke lever is going to break but man does it start nice that way.

I'll post some pics of my valk pretty soon.

TGViper

[RLD]

Check the carbs on both sides. There is a cable that runs across the back that connects them. Maybe your only getting choke on 3 carbs.

Is it advanced beyond stock. IE: Trigger wheel, or ECT mod? If so try a stock set-up as this can cause a "lazy" start that some people do not like.

[Kaiser]

Completely ignorant Valk owner here, but I was just wondering (and maybe my comment will prompt somebody with more know-how about these bikes to chime in)...

Is it possible that a pin-hole leak in a rubber vacuum line could be creating this issue?  It would have to be a small hole, but I was thinking that maybe it seals itself when engine heat is applied.  That would explain why you have troubles cold-cranking but not after the engine has been heated up.

Or maybe not a pin-hole, but a loose fitting somewhere?  Is the bike de-smogged?

Just trying to brainstorm why essentially heat would make a difference.  Only thought that came to mind is that typically things expand when hot and contract when cold.

Like I said - the disclaimer is that I am new to these wonderful machines and still in "learning" mode - not so much "advice-giving" mode.

Best of luck and keep us posted on any progress.

[JetDriver]

You mentioned your fuel additives.  It could be that with all three additives, you've got too high of an additive to fuel ratio.  As someone else said, try running just gas and see what happens.  Also, Stabil can go bad if it gets too old.  My hunch is though, as several others have said, you're not pushing the choke on all the way.  Very easy to do, because the choke moves a "believable" amount (meaning, it seems like enough to have activated) before it reaches its resistance point, then you've got another half inch to really move the choke.

[poman]

This is Po-Man again.  Well thanks for all the advice. still no luck.

My choke is working fine and I am fully engaging it as needed, however when I do it seems to be too much and I take it off and it will finally crank with no throttle or just barely giving a 1/16 inch of throttle. anything else seems to be too much.

Also I am going to syphon all the gas out of the tank tonight and replace with high octain no ethinol gas without additives. also going to drain the carbs by the bowl screw. Gosh I hate to do that and make a mess. my bike is squeeky clean. any suggestions?

Anyone got a easier way to get gas out of the tank.

Continuing thanks guys.    po-man out

[hubcapsc]

Also I am going to syphon all the gas out of the tank tonight and replace with high octain no ethinol gas without additives. also going to drain the carbs by the bowl screw. Gosh I hate to do that and make a mess. my bike is squeeky clean. any suggestions?

Anyone got a easier way to get gas out of the tank.

Once when I thought I had bad gas, I took the gas tank off... it won't all come out even if you hold the
tank upside down.

Perhaps you could just turn the petcock off and run the gas out of the carbs, and then siphon what you can get out of the tank
and then fill it with good gas. I think most of us just use regular, not hi-test...

Plus, if your bike won't run out of gas with the petcock off (I don't remember) you've got a big suspect right there...

-Mike

[Ratdog]

The Seafoam (01 can) will treat 20 gals for daily use.  If you're using that... trash can the Stabil.  The Seafoam will do what the Stabil does... and won't go bad like the Stabil will.  Although I like Lucas products... I'm not so sure you're helping with adding that in addition to your Seafoam.

Answer others' questions about any ignition mods that may've been done.  Some (not all) have had starting issues with the trigger wheel installed.  JeffK has info on his site about tweaking the pick-ups so that you get the right amount of voltage since some of the trigger wheels (aftermarket) had shorter/rounded tips, and hindered proper current pick up.

I'll second RJ's encouragement to be ABSOLUTELY CERTAIN you're pushing the choke lever down ALL the way... and seeing if the plungers for all the enrichment valves are accuating. 

If your battery is weak, it'll turn over... but won't have enough juice to light off the ignition system (see also the above about trigger wheels).

[R J]

 

If your battery is weak, it'll turn over... but won't have enough juice to light off the ignition system (see also the above about trigger wheels).

You say the choke is all the way on, right?

What angle does the black tip on the choke have?
45*
90*
180*
 

Since the battery is probably weak now, put the jumper cables on the bike and your car/truck (engine off on good battery vehicle),     Push the choke till it is looking directly at the right handgrip......      NO pointie in the air, FLAT, 90*.

Now, if you must, blip the throttle a couple of times.  That won't do a bit of good, but it might make you keep your fingers off the throttle while cranking.  So permission to blip throttle NOW, hands off except for the starter button.....  PUSH THE Button.

 1 thumb, press the starter button and touch nothing else, other hand in your pocket.........

What state do you live in?

[valkyriemc]

The Seafoam (01 can) will treat 20 gals for daily use.  If you're using that... trash can the Stabil.  The Seafoam will do what the Stabil does... and won't go bad like the Stabil will.  Although I like Lucas products... I'm not so sure you're helping with adding that in addition to your Seafoam.

Answer others' questions about any ignition mods that may've been done.  Some (not all) have had starting issues with the trigger wheel installed.  JeffK has info on his site about tweaking the pick-ups so that you get the right amount of voltage since some of the trigger wheels (aftermarket) had shorter/rounded tips, and hindered proper current pick up.

I'll second RJ's encouragement to be ABSOLUTELY CERTAIN you're pushing the choke lever down ALL the way... and seeing if the plungers for all the enrichment valves are accuating.  

If your battery is weak, it'll turn over... but won't have enough juice to light off the ignition system (see also the above about trigger wheels).

+1 I think like the above too. Put the bike on a battery charger_made for bikes. The next morning choke it all the way and give it a try. A bad battery, one that will spin the statrter but not start the bike will drive you crazy.  If that doesnt fly home in on the trigger wheel. G/L

[John Schmidt]

Yes, by all means.....forget the Lucas upper lube, just don't need it with these engines. Normal lubing that is built into the engine will have it running for 250k miles and more....all with no Lucas upper cylinder lube. And the battery, I agree with the others on a weak one. Often a battery, when getting old, will turn the engine over but not have enough left to fire the ignition. Sometimes, it will start at just the instant you release the start button. If that happens, it's time for a new battery. The fact that once started it will operate fine the rest of the day tells me the battery is starting to sulfate at the bottom internally. It will cause starting problems first thing in the day, but the current seems to break it up enough so you can go the rest of the day with no problem. Let it sit undisturbed overnight lets the sulfate process begin all over again, so the next morning you're out there fussing and cussing again. Sooner or later you're going to get stuck a long way from home with that battery if that's the problem. Get it checked.

[highcountry]

If you want an additive to clean your carbs, Chemtool B-12 is what I use in my vehicles.

[Gunslinger]

My money is on an after market trigger wheel...

[MP]

+1.  Take the inspection cover off on front, and see if it is stock or aftermarket wheel.

MP

[Ricky-D]

You have not indicated what changes have been made to the intake/carburetor system.

Trying to correct the problem is at best a stab in the dark.

There are many common sense things you could do to define better where the problem lies.

These motors are pretty fail safe so for you to have this kind of problem would indicate to me that there has been a lot of messing around with things.

***

[R J]

He found the problem....   It starts like clock work now....

He says thanks........

[Gunslinger]

Inquiring minds want to know?

What was the resolution?

[R J]

I'll let him tell ya if he wants to.......

[Bone]

Glad he got her running it's that time of the year.

[mikeb]

sounda lik no choke to me and maybe over full on oil?.. cheching oil while on side stand?

[Wago]

I'll let him tell ya if he wants to.......

Almost guarantee it was caused by not using full choke. Same story over and over - there oughta be a song about it.

[wi]

Is your ground wire tight on both ends? mine had a little curosin on the frame ground bolt that kept it from starting once.  Steve  ???