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upjeeper
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« on: June 24, 2010, 01:27:46 PM » |
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Is there a proper way to slow down? I would think using the brakes to stop would be the best way to do it, as those parts are meant to be replaced as opposed to engine braking while downshifting (which I still catch myself doing).
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hubcapsc
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Posts: 16785
upstate
South Carolina
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« Reply #1 on: June 24, 2010, 01:31:10 PM » |
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Is there a proper way to slow down? I would think using the brakes to stop would be the best way to do it, as those parts are meant to be replaced as opposed to engine braking while downshifting (which I still catch myself doing).
Use it all. You're downshifting too fast if it starts skidding  -Mike |
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Gryphon Rider
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Posts: 5227
2000 Tourer
Calgary, Alberta
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« Reply #2 on: June 24, 2010, 02:03:00 PM » |
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Nothing wrong with downshifting. In fact, you are safer if you are in the proper gear to accelerate if you need to. If, when you downshift, you bring up the engine revs to match the road speed at the lower gear, there will be virtually no wear on the clutch. If engine braking using this technique isn't enough to slow you down, use brakes as needed. Also, if there is otherwise no need to downshift, use your brakes instead. E.g. If you're in 5th at 65 MPH adn the posted limit reduces to 55 MPH (at which speed 5th gear is appropriate), don't downshift to slow down, but use your brakes if rolling off the gas doesn't slow you fast enough.
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98valk
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« Reply #3 on: June 24, 2010, 02:37:12 PM » |
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brake pads cheap to replace a clutch is not.
use downshift engine braking only in an emergency braking event to assist the brake pads.
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1998 Std/Tourer, 2007 DR200SE, 1981 CB900C 10speed
1973 Duster 340 4-speed rare A/C, 2001 F250 4x4 7.3L, 6sp
"Our Constitution was made only for a Moral and Religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the goverment of any other."
John Adams 10/11/1798
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Momz
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« Reply #4 on: June 24, 2010, 02:40:24 PM » |
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Personally, I prefer to use the Jake Brake along with my wheel brakes for extreme downhills. But if you don't run a Diesel, it doesn't much matter.  |
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 ALWAYS QUESTION AUTHORITY! 97 Valk bobber, 98 Valk Rat Rod, 2K SuperValk, plus several other classic bikes |
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Chrisj CMA
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« Reply #5 on: June 24, 2010, 02:47:31 PM » |
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brake pads cheap to replace a clutch is not.
use downshift engine braking only in an emergency braking event to assist the brake pads.
+1 on this technique........and you can stop very fast even without "downshift engine braking" Well put CA |
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Patrick
Member
Posts: 15433
VRCC 4474
Largo Florida
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« Reply #6 on: June 24, 2010, 03:06:22 PM » |
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Boy, am I glad gas engines don't have engine brakes!! I have a heck of a hatred for jake/engine brakes due to some people's miss-use of them..Have you ever heard one while some clown still has the switch 'on' and he is only backing into a loading dock or driving thru a parking lot? I'm not real crazy about working/fixing them either..OK, I feel better now, my rant is over..  |
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98valk
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« Reply #7 on: June 24, 2010, 04:50:11 PM » |
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brake pads cheap to replace a clutch is not.
use downshift engine braking only in an emergency braking event to assist the brake pads.
+1 on this technique........and you can stop very fast even without "downshift engine braking" Well put CA Thanks |
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1998 Std/Tourer, 2007 DR200SE, 1981 CB900C 10speed
1973 Duster 340 4-speed rare A/C, 2001 F250 4x4 7.3L, 6sp
"Our Constitution was made only for a Moral and Religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the goverment of any other."
John Adams 10/11/1798
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Daniel Meyer
Member
Posts: 5493
Author. Adventurer. Electrician.
The State of confusion.
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« Reply #8 on: June 24, 2010, 05:36:24 PM » |
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Use it all...that's what it's there for.
Ride 'em hard. Fix 'em when they break.
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CUAgain, Daniel Meyer  |
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fudgie
Member
Posts: 10613
Better to be judged by 12, then carried by 6.
Huntington Indiana
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« Reply #9 on: June 24, 2010, 06:13:21 PM » |
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I engine brake then use my brakes. No problem yet at 57k. I never down shift to hard unless the light changes real quick.
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 Now you're in the world of the wolves... And we welcome all you sheep... VRCC-#7196 VRCCDS-#0175 DTR PGR |
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Gryphon Rider
Member
Posts: 5227
2000 Tourer
Calgary, Alberta
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« Reply #10 on: June 24, 2010, 10:08:19 PM » |
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brake pads cheap to replace a clutch is not.
use downshift engine braking only in an emergency braking event to assist the brake pads.
I must disagree completely. The only true emergency braking situation for which engine braking is appropriate is brake failure. If you must stop very quickly in an emergency, the best way is to pull in (disengage) the clutch, and use your brakes to maximum effect 1. One cannot easily control the intensity of engine braking, but one can control the intensity of rear brake application. One possible cause of brake failure (admittedly in an extreme situation) is being in too high of a gear to allow engine braking to slow the bike on a long steep downhill, thus overheating the brakes by relying only on the brakes to control speed. 1Using brakes to maximum effect includes understanding weight transfer and its effects on front and rear traction, then proportioning the brakes appropriately. |
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GJS
Member
Posts: 424
Today is the tomorrow you worried about yesterday.
Vancouver Island, BC, Canada
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« Reply #11 on: June 24, 2010, 10:19:12 PM » |
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A good friend of mine commented the other day that she almost hit a motorcyclist that braked hard but had no brake light action. She caused me to think that whatever you do to slow your bike, brake lights work better lit up.
So, I always engage my front brake when I slow or stop, in or near traffic.
Glenn
99IS
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The tragedy of life is not that it ends so soon, but that we wait so long to begin it.
- W. M. Lewis
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Kymbo
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« Reply #12 on: June 25, 2010, 12:23:04 AM » |
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Always used both ,mainly to be in correct gear for corners and a carry over from riding a 32 year old harley that doesnt have good brakes any way
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RLD
Member
Posts: 318
'99 I/S Red/Black
Eden Prairie, MN
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« Reply #13 on: June 25, 2010, 10:06:16 AM » |
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Engine braking is a carryover from the old bikes that didn't have the brakes we have today. That said, I still use both to make sure I'm in the right gear and also to use the brake lights for which they are intended. In an emergency situation, the clutch lever is in and it's brakes all the way.
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Dress for the slide, not the ride. ATGATT
VRCC #2505
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ricoman
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« Reply #14 on: June 25, 2010, 12:04:13 PM » |
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from reading some of these ideas, it sounds like you shouldn't downshift in a car with a standard trans. either. Wonder about a truck? I can't imagine a big rig relying only on the brakes.
I use both, always have, always will.
Most wear on the clutch comes from the slipping used to get rolling-not from engaging gears-up or down.
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take personal responsibility and keep your word
98 Tourer, black and chrome, added 8/11/10
98 Std, yellow/cream, totaled 8/3/10
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Brad
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« Reply #15 on: June 25, 2010, 01:35:56 PM » |
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And don't forget the sweet sound of cobra pipes as you downshift to reduce speed |
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Wago
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« Reply #16 on: June 25, 2010, 02:05:29 PM » |
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For me downshift plus brakes as needed for normal stopping/slowing. Clutch in and brakes only for emergency stopping for the reasons previously cited.
Wago
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sheets
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« Reply #17 on: June 25, 2010, 04:15:00 PM » |
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Same as others have stated. Combination of both. Descending long grades... grab a gear to save your brakes. Same as you do with the manual tranny in your car/truck or a big rig. You're always in the right gear to accelerate from when it's time to go. At an intersection my plan is to have scrubbed off enough speed during short final that I grab the clutch and coast in on final approach... clicking through the the last three gears in downshift, so I'm ready to roll if I get the green before I come to a stop. Yrmv,
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Ricky-D
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« Reply #18 on: June 26, 2010, 11:44:05 AM » |
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Yep, it's all possible now with the advent of disc brakes.
It surely has to be easier on the transmission and related parts to not do that particular activity anymore, even though the they are designed to handle such things.
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2000_Valkyrie_Interstate
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Hoser
Member
Posts: 5844
child of the sixties VRCC 17899
Auburn, Kansas
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« Reply #19 on: June 26, 2010, 06:45:08 PM » |
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If you are in the rocky mtns on a long steep grade, you better use your gears or your brakes will go away before you get to the bottom! Don't ask me how I know. Hoser  |
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I don't want a pickle, just wanna ride my motor sickle  [img width=300 height=233]http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/ |
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keythumper
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« Reply #20 on: June 26, 2010, 09:24:45 PM » |
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When downshifting, be certain your engine revs match the gear your shifting into... doing this wrong would be the only nasty thing done to a clutch/drivetrain.
JMAO
... just my arrogant opinion, though
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fudgie
Member
Posts: 10613
Better to be judged by 12, then carried by 6.
Huntington Indiana
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« Reply #21 on: June 27, 2010, 07:40:58 AM » |
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We slam our ambulances into 1st all the time when we need to stop in a hurry. No problems yet!  |
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Now you're in the world of the wolves... And we welcome all you sheep... VRCC-#7196 VRCCDS-#0175 DTR PGR |
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hubcapsc
Member
Posts: 16785
upstate
South Carolina
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« Reply #22 on: June 27, 2010, 09:38:46 AM » |
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We slam our ambulances into 1st all the time when we need to stop in a hurry. No problems yet! Yeah, well, you're not rolling around in that gurney in the back -Mike |
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fudgie
Member
Posts: 10613
Better to be judged by 12, then carried by 6.
Huntington Indiana
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« Reply #23 on: June 27, 2010, 09:45:54 AM » |
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We slam our ambulances into 1st all the time when we need to stop in a hurry. No problems yet! Yeah, well, you're not rolling around in that gurney in the back -Mike Rarely happens when someone is back there. Usually we just turn off the OD and that will slow us enough. There have been a few times we think we have left a rear end laying in the streets.  |
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Now you're in the world of the wolves... And we welcome all you sheep... VRCC-#7196 VRCCDS-#0175 DTR PGR |
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bogator
Member
Posts: 663
IN GOD WE TRUST------KK4KSN-------
Valley,Al
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« Reply #24 on: June 28, 2010, 04:18:27 AM » |
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I put heel taps on my boots,and drag them,for braking,you ought to see the sparks fly....yoooohoooo |
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borat
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« Reply #25 on: June 28, 2010, 11:27:57 AM » |
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Experience riders use both engine braking and brakes for slowing down under normal riding conditions.
An emergency stop will not normally involve engine braking. At least any that I've done. In an emergency, pull in the clutch, apply both brakes as much as possible while maintaining control. I had to do an emergency stop from 65 mph down to almost stopped and in very short order. The bike was doing some serious side to side wobbling as it shook off the speed. Despite the wobbling, the machine, for it's size was remarkably easy to control. As the bike began to wobble under intense braking, reducing brake application slightly helped regain composure and by then, the bike was down to fifteen miles per hour or so.
People should, at the very least, do some panic stops just to see how they and the machine will handle the situation.
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Noise & chrome are no substitue for power, performance and reliability.
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hubcapsc
Member
Posts: 16785
upstate
South Carolina
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« Reply #26 on: June 28, 2010, 11:46:21 AM » |
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I had to do an emergency stop from 65 mph down to almost stopped and in very short order.
People should, at the very least, do some panic stops just to see how they and the machine will handle the situation.
I was in the left lane, passing one of these tractor-trailer trucks when all of a sudden everyone all the way out to the horizon was hard on the brakes... The Valk did well. I went to the left of the lane so that I could bail into the median if the guy behind me looked like he was going to cream me. He was paying attention (whew)...  After everyone got stopped, I moved over to the right lane and stood in the shade... I was glad I remembered to look for an escape route in the emergency...  -Mike |
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PhredValk
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« Reply #27 on: June 28, 2010, 08:23:27 PM » |
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Back in the 70's a mechanic told me to always downshift. Said it 'refreshed' the clutch and made it last longer. I use brakes and downshifting in all situations.
Fred.
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Growing old is mandatory, growing up is optional.
VRCCDS0237
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MP
Member
Posts: 5532
1997 Std Valkyrie and 2001 red/blk I/S w/sidecar
North Dakota
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« Reply #28 on: June 29, 2010, 04:10:05 AM » |
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MC cop trainer taught us to ALWAYS downshift when stopping, esp. in emergency situation. You want to be in first gear when you stop, in case you need to get going again asap.
ie because of a sudden traffic stop or accident. That semi coming behind you may not be able to stop, and if you are in a high gear, YOU will not be able to get out of his way. We had to emergency stop, while down shifting, AND looking in our mirrors, to be able to pass the course. We were not downshifting so much to stop the bike, but to be in 1st when we stopped. Do it all the time, so it becomes second nature to do so.
MP
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