About Those "High" Taxes

[x]

From a senior policy analyst under Ronald Reagan.

http://economix.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/05/31/are-taxes-in-the-u-s-high-or-low/

[PAVALKER]

That's actually not all inclusive as I'm sure you may be aware (even tho you live overseas)..... we have higher property taxes, sales taxes, fuel taxes, local municipal taxes, personal property taxes, school taxes, luxury taxes (if you can afford those luxuries) and many many more  taxes or fees, that we didn't have a hundred years ago or so.    So to say we have the lowest taxes in 60 years.... I would have to raise the BS flag (unless you are talking specifically income tax rates)....

http://www.godlikeproductions.com/forum1/message643887/pg1   

[Magellon]

When it comes to "tax rates" the only thing that is LOW is my take home pay after "taxes" are taken out of my check...

[alph]

Sure, the FEDERAL tax rate might be “low” but the local and state taxes along with the fee’s and registration of things keeps going up.  It’s one thing to say the federal government is not taxing the hell out of people, but when you add all the other taxes people pay, that amount adds up real fast.  Look at the 55 cents per gallon we pay in taxes here in Wisconsin, that’s $13 dollars in pure tax each time I fill up my truck.

[x]

Sure, the FEDERAL tax rate might be “low” but the local and state taxes along with the fee’s and registration of things keeps going up.  It’s one thing to say the federal government is not taxing the hell out of people, but when you add all the other taxes people pay, that amount adds up real fast.  Look at the 55 cents per gallon we pay in taxes here in Wisconsin, that’s $13 dollars in pure tax each time I fill up my truck.

And how are highways and bridges supposed to be paid for?  You might have a point about gasoline taxes if they are being used for non transportation uses but otherwise, who is supposed to pay for the roads you want to drive on?  You pay 32.1 cents state tax plus 18.4 cents federal tax, which is 50.5 cents per gallon.

[Jabba]

The bottom line here is that the gov't spends about 28%-30% of the GDP.  Many people do not pay income tax.  Only the rest of them.  The tax burden falls squarely on the middle class, which they say is disappearing.

All I know is... there is NO way to KNOW how much you pay in taxes in a year.  Not with all the hidden ones.  And the embedded taxes in the actual cost of the things we buy.

My guess is I pay over 50% when all is said and done.

Either that's OK or it's NOT ok.  I'd like to see legislation the prohibits the government in ALL its forms from spending over (Pick a number %) of the GDP.  They can't spend more this year than they collected LAST year.  And EVERY line item of expenditure should be voted on independently.

That'd be a GREAT start.

Jabba

[Roy]

My take on this as a BIG TAX PAYER..

State, County, and City taxes going through the roof while Federal Tax rate has been going down for years now.

Last month a fat slob of a State Parks Ranger gave me a $87 dollar ticket for having my dog off a leash on a State Parks Trail that had no other people on it, and no other cars in the parking lot. Because the State is Billions of dollars in the Red the STATE authorities are coming up with all kinds of ideas to reduce the massive debt.

By the way . . .  There are more people not working and collecting Tax dollars than people who work and support the Loafers.  Federal Disability, both Social Security and Military disability are full of fakers, some who have been collecting Disability for over 40 years.  It's time 60 minutes runs another program on the subject.



.

[Daniel Meyer]

And how are highways and bridges supposed to be paid for?  You might have a point about gasoline taxes if they are being used for non transportation uses but otherwise, who is supposed to pay for the roads you want to drive on?  You pay 32.1 cents state tax plus 18.4 cents federal tax, which is 50.5 cents per gallon.

In Texas, on the gas tax they send all the fed tax to the feds, and then they have to petition for the funds to do projects. The state estimates we get back from the feds 2% of what we pay in. The state part of the tax goes into the state "general fund" (there is no "dedicated" fund for any program in Texas) and is used for whatever the state legislator budgets it for, not usually the highways. I can't find the reference at the moment, but when I still believed speaking to my representatives could change things I had the numbers, and it was less than 45% collected that went to the highways.

If they'd use the taxes for what they were collected for, the roads would have no problems with funding at all. (neither would social security for that matter).

As far as taxes being "low"...can't figure that. "Low" compared to who? And why would we point at some place that has a crippling tax rate and justify ours being "low" compared to that?

If they'd quit pissing it away it could be "low".

But, low or not, both the dollar amount AND the percentage of income I pay in taxes has risen every year I've been working (all of 'em since I was 14) by at least twice the stated inflation rate.

It is my single largest expense, higher than my next three largest expenses combined. For 2010 direct (I pay, not hidden) taxes were 48% of my income (and I probably missed some).

Property, sales, income, gas, phone, utility (there's 30% worth of taxes on my phone bill alone!), vehicle taxes, and on and on and on and on...

Since I am apparently "rich" I don't qualify for many of the "services" I'm funding either.

Imagine selling prized possessions to finish college while all the students around you were going for free or substantially reduced rates. Imagine not being able to afford medical care even though you have insurance, while many without insurance get the same care for free.

Low, high. Relative terms. Value provided would be more important a measure. "Bang for buck".

Right now I just get banged. I know it's selfish of me because I'm a privileged class and all that...but sometimes I just wish they would use some lube.

[sugerbear]

Sure, the FEDERAL tax rate might be “low” but the local and state taxes along with the fee’s and registration of things keeps going up.  It’s one thing to say the federal government is not taxing the hell out of people, but when you add all the other taxes people pay, that amount adds up real fast.  Look at the 55 cents per gallon we pay in taxes here in Wisconsin, that’s $13 dollars in pure tax each time I fill up my truck.

And how are highways and bridges supposed to be paid for?  You might have a point about gasoline taxes if they are being used for non transportation uses but otherwise, who is supposed to pay for the roads you want to drive on?  You pay 32.1 cents state tax plus 18.4 cents federal tax, which is 50.5 cents per gallon.

from what i see. their not fixing the bridges and road we have just building new ones. gives me warm fuzzies driving over some of those road and bridges ???

[big d]

in years past it was the responsability of the individual states to maintain the roads. each state would charge a toll on certain roads or have a vote on a bond to raise the money to pay for road repairs that needed to be done. now fast forward to this administration and they decide unilaterally to make it the responsability of the federal government to pay for road repairs in the name of job creation. ( more like paybacks to the union). what actually happened was that certain states got a windfall of money and no or very few jobs were created. the size of government grew, as did the welfare recipients on food stamps. why does the federal government need to increase the limo ownership by a whopping 61%. this government is irresponsible in spending money, money that they do not have.  New York state is among the highest tax rates of the country. why, to pay for the welfare. can anyone explain how the fedaral government can decide to take over 2 car manufacturers and make all decisions reguarding them. last i kinew it was unconstitutional for the federal government to intervene on PRIVATE BUSINESS..... it is a beautiful day so i will cleaning the bikes this afternoon and go for a ride later. now it is motorcycle related. ride safe
    

[Jabba]

Our whole system is an inverted pyramid, and destined to topple.  We need to redistribute the wealth... ie, take it from the Fed, and give it to the states and the localities and allow them to be responsible for their own needs.  This would get the pyramid right side down. 

Sending so much money up to the Fed, and begging for it back makes NO sense.

Elect me benevolent dictator for life... and all OUR lives would be a lot better.   Not EVERYONE in the country would agree though.

Jabba

[valkmc]

Since I am apparently "rich" I don't qualify for many of the "services" I'm funding either.

I agree, to me it is not the taxes it is how they spend it. Since I am part of the "rich class" a public school teacher I have two sons in college and I pay for all of it except some private scholarships they won (non-government). That is ok with me except the guy down the street who owns a plumbing company and has 6 kids brags all the time about how he is on the fourth kid in college and the government has paid for all of their education. I remind him all the time that the government does not have any money of it's own just the money they take from us. He laughs.

I don't mind helping people who need it but so much of the help goes to people who could help themselves, so I end up resenting paying taxes and being attacked as a public employee who works my butt off.

[G-Man]

It is soooooo refreshing to see folks post what I have been complaining about for years.  Makes me see I am not the only person that sees the scam and unfairness.

Why should the guys getting into the cab on 34th street have to pay an added 50 cent "TAX", that goes to keep fares on the buses and trains lower?  Same for the guy driving across a bridge?  I guess only rich people take cabs and drive over bridges because the middle class wasn't supposed to have taxes raised.  They'll just raise tolls and fares instead   

What is the "USAGE FEE" of $60 that was all of a sudden tacked on to the two year car registration?  Again, only the rich own cars, right.

What about the added taxes on cell phones and utility bills that  go to provide free cell phones for people that collect social benefits?  Oh right, only rich folks have cell phones and utility bills.

Is $14,000 enough in property taxes for 1/3 acre and a 15k sq/ft house or do only rich folks live in small houses on small parcels of land?

So, great, my fed percentage matches the percentage of 25 years ago.  But I'm paying more for everything else because the fed is paying less for what my state spends....my liberal, demonstratively Democratic, never say no, legislatively corrupt state. 

[Bobbo]

Is $14,000 enough in property taxes for 1/3 acre and a 15k sq/ft house or do only rich folks live in small houses on small parcels of land?

15,000 square feet?  Wow, how many stories is it?!   

In my area only the VERY rich can have a house that big.  $14,000 would be cheap taxes, as my dinky 2300 square foot house costs about $7000 in property taxes...

[Serk]

Is $14,000 enough in property taxes for 1/3 acre and a 15k sq/ft house or do only rich folks live in small houses on small parcels of land?

15,000 square feet?  Wow, how many stories is it?!   

In my area only the VERY rich can have a house that big.  $14,000 would be cheap taxes, as my dinky 2300 square foot house costs about $7000 in property taxes...

I'm gonna go out on a limb here and propose that that was a typo, and he meant 1.5k sq/ft, since later in the same sentence he referenced "small house".....

[old2soon]

Just glad the feds ain't balancing my check book. Oh wait-they are. These are the same brain dead S O Bs that want to GIVE social security money to folks that have not contributed a penny to it. I posted about this before-cash for clunkers-my daughter and son in law(still love em both) bought a toyota. I just bought a sanyo t v. Couldn't find an american made one. If i find an item for lets say  $1500 the idiots in washington dc would be proud to pay ten or fifteen times more for the same item. They are insulated from the real world. Have em come to my house and cut my grass-wait til it gets really warm BEFORE you cut on the a/c. Why-this town i live in needed rate increases on all services the city provides. Every thing but natural gas-which went up and gonna get another rate increase before winter sets in. When i got to a store i pay mo sales tax and city sales tax. Some of the taxes i pay on my cell phone bill-think i need a high dollar lawyer to explain it so i can understand it. Why don't they just tell us the truth?? We uns gonna screw you uns really bad-and they is nuttin ya'll can do bout it. Sorry for the tirade. RIDE SAFE.

[Bobbo]

Is $14,000 enough in property taxes for 1/3 acre and a 15k sq/ft house or do only rich folks live in small houses on small parcels of land?

15,000 square feet?  Wow, how many stories is it?!   

In my area only the VERY rich can have a house that big.  $14,000 would be cheap taxes, as my dinky 2300 square foot house costs about $7000 in property taxes...

I'm gonna go out on a limb here and propose that that was a typo, and he meant 1.5k sq/ft, since later in the same sentence he referenced "small house".....

Probably, but it's all relative!     There are people in a nearby country club that live in $3M+ homes who consider that a "normal sized" house.

[G-Man]

Is $14,000 enough in property taxes for 1/3 acre and a 15k sq/ft house or do only rich folks live in small houses on small parcels of land?

15,000 square feet?  Wow, how many stories is it?!   

In my area only the VERY rich can have a house that big.  $14,000 would be cheap taxes, as my dinky 2300 square foot house costs about $7000 in property taxes...

I'm gonna go out on a limb here and propose that that was a typo, and he meant 1.5k sq/ft, since later in the same sentence he referenced "small house".....

Thanks for the help Serk.  Yes, I meant 1,500 sq/ft. 

[musclehead]

When it comes to "tax rates" the only thing that is LOW is my take home pay after "taxes" are taken out of my check...

under the fair tax, you get to keep ALL you make.
http://www.fairtax.org/site/PageServer

[musclehead]

The bottom line here is that the gov't spends about 28%-30% of the GDP.  Many people do not pay income tax.  Only the rest of them.  The tax burden falls squarely on the middle class, which they say is disappearing.

All I know is... there is NO way to KNOW how much you pay in taxes in a year.  Not with all the hidden ones.  And the embedded taxes in the actual cost of the things we buy.

My guess is I pay over 50% when all is said and done.

Either that's OK or it's NOT ok.  I'd like to see legislation the prohibits the government in ALL its forms from spending over (Pick a number %) of the GDP.  They can't spend more this year than they collected LAST year.  And EVERY line item of expenditure should be voted on independently.

That'd be a GREAT start.

Jabba

it might be more then 50%, all the taxes that are leveled on businesses are paid by by the customer/consumer.

I have a small business I get a P/L statement every month, taxes are not profit they are a loss.
its no different from my business of one employee to major corporations of thousands of employees. taxes are passed along as a cost of doing business.

[musclehead]

Is $14,000 enough in property taxes for 1/3 acre and a 15k sq/ft house or do only rich folks live in small houses on small parcels of land?

15,000 square feet?  Wow, how many stories is it?!   

In my area only the VERY rich can have a house that big.  $14,000 would be cheap taxes, as my dinky 2300 square foot house costs about $7000 in property taxes...

you both need to move, floridas nice  no state income tax

[musclehead]

you know if paying more taxes would fix the problem I'd be all for it. I am NOT for more taxes without drastic spending cuts, draconian, heck even brobdingnagian cuts.

[Jabba]

I preach FairTax ALL the time.  But it'll expose the corrupt politicians for what they are...

Business does not pay tax.  The pass it on.  PERIOD.

Jabba

[musclehead]

I preach FairTax ALL the time.  But it'll expose the corrupt politicians for what they are...

Business does not pay tax.  The pass it on.  PERIOD.

Jabba

I think we were seperated at birth, I even kinda look like you! 

the fair tax might have as much chance of passing as term limits but I'll keep plugging it too.

[RoadKill]

I preach FairTax ALL the time.  But it'll expose the corrupt politicians for what they are...

Business does not pay tax.  The pass it on.  PERIOD.

Jabba

The same will happen when the oil companies are taxed more

[Willow]

I preach FairTax ALL the time.  But it'll expose the corrupt politicians for what they are...

Business does not pay tax.  The pass it on.  PERIOD.

Jabba

The same will happen when the oil companies are taxed more

So true!  Don't you find it interesting when the same people who are complaining about high gas prices are demanding we tax the oil corporations more?  Who do they think will be paying those taxes?    

[RoadKill]

I preach FairTax ALL the time.  But it'll expose the corrupt politicians for what they are...

Business does not pay tax.  The pass it on.  PERIOD.

Jabba

The same will happen when the oil companies are taxed more

So true!  Don't you find it interesting when the same people who are complaining about high gas prices are demanding we tax the oil corporations more?  Who do they think will be paying those taxes?    

I usually only hear them complain while they are paying for fuel at the convenience store with a $1.50 worth of bottled tap water or  a $1.00 coffee refill in their hand. So I bring up the taxation of oil companies and usually end up asking them to finish scratching the lottery tickets so I can pay for my fuel.