Jabba's Interstate Driveline Vibration Sweepstakes

[Jabba]

We have a winner folks!!




Dry pinion cup!

For those of you that come up with the correct answer... you win ...

the privilege of advising on how to proceed. The splines all look OK to me.  I'll clean them up good after work today... but they look like there has been little or no damage.

Ya'll think it'd be ok to clean it all up real good, get the weep holes open, moly them lightly (I have been reading the archives) and put her back together?

I think so... but I'll take advise from the sages on the VRCC Tech forum.  ya'll ROCK!!

Jabba

[98valk]

thin coat of cooper anti-seize first like it comes from the factory and then moly paste. I use TS-70
http://www.tsmoly.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=1_7&products_id=217

"TS-70 is a general purpose moly paste with many uses. It has proven to be an outstanding lubricant for a saltwater environment, above and below the surface"

still there on the splines at each tire change.


looks like the pinion cup splines are worn/pointed. Or is it shadows in the pic?

[Jabba]

I think it's the Pic. I cleaned it all up good tonight and they look new to me. I think I caught it early. When I reassemble it there is almost no lash at all. I am gonna clean it all up and lube it up and reassemble. If it is still there or comes back... I'll replace the pinion cup and or driveshaft. 

Thanks y'all!!

Jabba

[Valkpilot]

I think it's the Pic. I cleaned it all up good tonight and they look new to me. I think I caught it early. When I reassemble it there is almost no lash at all. I am gonna clean it all up and lube it up and reassemble. If it is still there or comes back... I'll replace the pinion cup and or driveshaft. 

Thanks y'all!!

Jabba

Jabba, they shouldn't be pointed at all.  If they are, they're worn. 

Also, there are two holes at the base of the pinion cup, half hidden by the retaining nut that need to be cleaned out before reassembling.

Here's a thread with some pics for comparison: http://www.valkyrieforum.com/bbs/index.php/topic,18257.0.html

[YoungPUP]

What the Hell causes that? It looks Bad enough that I'm worried about taking mine on a trip this weekend with out tearing it all apart to check it. I did a LOT of rain riding earlier this year.

[Valkpilot]

What the Hell causes that? It looks Bad enough that I'm worried about taking mine on a trip this weekend with out tearing it all apart to check it. I did a LOT of rain riding earlier this year.

Lack of maintenance, mostly. 

Many, dealers included, lube the splines in the hub but neglect the pinion cup.  Properly servicing the rear end includes a check, cleaning, and re-lube of the pinion and cup.

[Tropic traveler]

What the Hell causes that? It looks Bad enough that I'm worried about taking mine on a trip this weekend with out tearing it all apart to check it. I did a LOT of rain riding earlier this year.

Lack of maintenance, mostly. 

Many, dealers included, lube the splines in the hub but neglect the pinion cup.  Properly servicing the rear end includes a check, cleaning, and re-lube of the pinion and cup.

+1 
Do it yourself & you always know it was done right.

[Jabba]

The splines in the pinion cup are not pointy at all. In fact, they look NEW to me. You can still see some of the tool marks in them. The driveshaft splines look good too. Not as perfect as the pinion cup though.  

I got ALL the goop cleaned out of everything. Especially the holes.

Jabba

[tank_post142]

the krud buildup on the top of the pinion cup teeth made them look worn to the point of being 'pointy' rather than flat on top.

[Jabba]

the krud buildup on the top of the pinion cup teeth made them look worn to the point of being 'pointy' rather than flat on top.

I will take better pics tonight and post them here.

I forgot my camera at the office yesterday.

I'll post them up tonight for a "final approval" from the geniuses here.

Jabba

[Jabba]

OK... I am going to replace the pinion cup.  

I have finally seen what one is supposed to look like.

Mine has wear.

I can wait another day to put her back together.

At least I got another one to RIDE!!

 

Jabba

[hubcapsc]

I think this is how a good one should look:



Oh, btw, I share your pain 



Mine got that way because the seal came out of the cup, and was just floating around
on the driveshaft... found it when I went to put on a new tire...

-Mike

[Jabba]

That's funny.

I found THAT pic in the archives and is what I used as my basis of what one SHOULD look like!

I ordered one.  It should be here Friday.  $43 at the local Stealer.

Jabba

[Daniel Meyer]

That's funny.

I found THAT pic in the archives and is what I used as my basis of what one SHOULD look like!

I ordered one.  It should be here Friday.  $43 at the local Stealer.

Jabba

Replace the shaft too. Any wear it has will very rapidly transfer to the pinion cup.

[The Anvil]

Mr. Meyer is right, at least technically. Toothed members like that are always supposed to be replaced in pairs or "sets". If there's something idiosyncratic to the Valk (like for instance a pinion cup specifically designed to be softer than the shaft for that very reason) then perhaps that's different. I dunno.

[Daniel Meyer]

I dunno.

I do. Replace it. 

[Jabba]

OK OK OK.

I wish I had you guy's $$.  I'd throw mine out.

WTF don't they sell them as a set then?  Bastids!

Jabba

[doubletee]

the krud buildup on the top of the pinion cup teeth made them look worn to the point of being 'pointy' rather than flat on top.

I forgot my camera at the office yesterday.

You have a thing about leaving that camera behind, don't you?   

[RP#62]

Mr. Meyer is right, at least technically. Toothed members like that are always supposed to be replaced in pairs or "sets". If there's something idiosyncratic to the Valk (like for instance a pinion cup specifically designed to be softer than the shaft for that very reason) then perhaps that's different. I dunno.

There's a lot of aircraft engines flying around with mismatched splines.  Don't usually change the whole motor, just the generator.  Its too expensive to keep them matched up.
-RP

[The Anvil]

Mr. Meyer is right, at least technically. Toothed members like that are always supposed to be replaced in pairs or "sets". If there's something idiosyncratic to the Valk (like for instance a pinion cup specifically designed to be softer than the shaft for that very reason) then perhaps that's different. I dunno.

There's a lot of aircraft engines flying around with mismatched splines.  Don't usually change the whole motor, just the generator.  Its too expensive to keep them matched up.
-RP

Well I mean assuming the teeth are damaged. If you have perfectly good teeth on whichever accessory came out then that's fine. But if you've got a damaged gear then they're supposed to be changed.

Now I know that's not always how it actually happens... 

[RP#62]

Mr. Meyer is right, at least technically. Toothed members like that are always supposed to be replaced in pairs or "sets". If there's something idiosyncratic to the Valk (like for instance a pinion cup specifically designed to be softer than the shaft for that very reason) then perhaps that's different. I dunno.

There's a lot of aircraft engines flying around with mismatched splines.  Don't usually change the whole motor, just the generator.  Its too expensive to keep them matched up.
-RP

If you have perfectly good teeth on whichever accessory came out then that's fine. But if you've got a damaged gear then they're supposed to be changed. Well I mean assuming the teeth are damaged.

Now I know that's not always how it actually happens... 

I know.   Just pointing out that while its probably good practice, its not an absolute requirement.  There's lots of machines out there having spline-driven components where the set is not replaced just because one side requires replacement.
-RP

[Jabba]

You have a thing about leaving that camera behind, don't you?   

Nicely done!  That is an obscure reference, even if recent.   

I use the camera for work a lot more than anything else.  I usually toss it in my bag at the end of the day, but it got left behind on my desk in my hurry to get out the door and to the gym.

Jabba

[Daniel Meyer]

I know.   Just pointing out that while its probably good practice, its not an absolute requirement.  There's lots of machines out there having spline-driven components where the set is not replaced just because one side requires replacement.
-RP

Problem is, this is not a spline. It's a pinion joint.

[Ricky-D]

Would you believe a "splined" pinion joint?

And yes, my feeling is the two need to be changed at the same time.

I still don't think your problem is going to go away by changing out the pinion cup. It could however help a little in that regard.

***

[Jabba]

Here is what they look like cleaned up.



I thought those shoulders were machined into the spline.  They are all so consistent and sharp.

However, i know know the error of my ways.

I should be getting my new parts from the local dealer tomorrow.

I got about $120 in the cup, shaft, oil seal and clip.

Another $50 in brakes, moly paste, moly grease, and anti-sieze.

I need a raise...

DANGER DANGER POLITICS!!   

Jabba

[The Anvil]

Mr. Meyer is right, at least technically. Toothed members like that are always supposed to be replaced in pairs or "sets". If there's something idiosyncratic to the Valk (like for instance a pinion cup specifically designed to be softer than the shaft for that very reason) then perhaps that's different. I dunno.

There's a lot of aircraft engines flying around with mismatched splines.  Don't usually change the whole motor, just the generator.  Its too expensive to keep them matched up.
-RP

If you have perfectly good teeth on whichever accessory came out then that's fine. But if you've got a damaged gear then they're supposed to be changed. Well I mean assuming the teeth are damaged.

Now I know that's not always how it actually happens... 

I know.   Just pointing out that while its probably good practice, its not an absolute requirement.  There's lots of machines out there having spline-driven components where the set is not replaced just because one side requires replacement.
-RP

Yeah and depending on who manufactured the gear or spline shaft you could have two metals of varying hardness. It's rare but I've seen one gear be toast while the gear it was driving looked pretty much flawless.

I'd say that if it can be done easily and cheaply then replace at the same time. If not and you think one part might still be serviceable then it may just be okay to replace one and not the other. To some degree it's a judgment call.